sheikra_rocks

AKA "pilot coach" All B&M's have them. They serve the same purpose, steering the train around the track. Also Vekoma SLC's and junior inverteds have a pilot coach, but they are located in the rear of the train. Check out Flying Ace and Invertigo next time you are at the park. The pilot coach on Invertigo is toward the parking lot when the train is loading and unloading. On Raptor, Dominator, Superman, and Montu for example, row 1 and 2 are the pilot coach. This is the reason for the zero car on Alpie! Montu has a spare zero car that they throw on in place of row 1 during film shoots.

I have ridden 3 Superman flyers this season, and Firesuck. Also, have ridden Manta in the past. Firebird does not hold a candle to the B&M flyers. The loop on Firecrotch is good, but the pretzel loops on B&M flyers are epic. Also, in my travels, I have noticed B&M flyers have much better capacity than Vekoma Flying Trash cans. Manta>Superman>Fireball

Inverted or flyer track!

I tried not to reply, but had to... Your post attacking someone AND calling them names is completly unacceptable. I would love to see your engineering degree that says this is without a doubt 100% inverted. This topic is for speculation and everyone should be entitled to their opinion without being called an idiot, which shows how mature you are. Umm, okay. You can come see my degree, I have taken classes on analyzing structures, metals, forces, stresses, materials, whatnot. But more importantly than that, the one Engineering thing you may need to know to "prove" it's an invert is to be able to interpret a simple drawing or schematic. Which in this case, is pretty easy. The codes on the drawing exactly match the Invert supports. So on top of seeing a clearly inverted layout, you also see support drawings and codes matching the "theory." Now with literally NO evidence to support this being any other type if design, how could your claim be anything without it being considered a pipe dream. I didn't mean to be attacking, but I tend to curb people from be unrealistically hopeful of something that we already know they won't get. Now maybe it's different cause I don't live out in Ohio, I am no fanboy by any means, I'm just purely interested in coasters. Nothing I said was "calling names" but rather stating fact, albeit in a blunt way. Ban me, I don't know who's a mod or what, so if I see a stupid post, I may call it out. Anyway, the next week can be cool, I mean, the most interesting part about the plans is analyzing the layout, You can generally tell how high the track is at a certain element by how far the supports reach from it. It's easier to see the supports in the second half of the video where it only shows Banshee and not the rest of the park. That's the type of speculating that isn't counter productive. *coughassumingitsadivemachinecough* Carry on... Then use your degree and decode why the entrance and exit of the loop are so far from each other. I have given a well thought out explanation, and posted photos to back up my thoughts. I also do not think the loop goes around the lift, I think the loop will be beneath it. Everything is speculation until the announcement. Remember when everyone thought Diamondback was going to be a dive machine because of the water brake? I an running out to CSF in a few moments. I will report what I see.

Please look at this post real good. http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27275-starting-to-decode-2014/?p=540105 I see that. I also see an extra wide base at the bottom of that loop. Raptor and Montu's loop is not that wide. And don't say it is like that because it goes around the lift... I cam calling it.... DIVE MACHINE First off that photo of Kumba's supports from the ground can't prove anything, it looks like a mess of steel. You need to look at the satellite images like on here. It looks as if Kumba's vertical loop support footings are 2 on each side of the track. Floorless, sit-downs, and stand-ups have this layout of footings as well. I think dive coasters will have the same. On inverted coasters the footings for the vertical loop supports are on each side of the track. Look at the blue print again and you can see that the footings are on each side. Secondly, I was on the dive machine band wagon for a while until more decoding was being done by other members besides me. We ALL do agree on one thing, that Kings Island is getting a B&M roller coaster of some sort, but by the evidence that has been posted by other members, it looks as if it MIGHT be an invert. Who knows, maybe the park will throw everyone off and go with a totally different B&M model that no one expected. But in the end everyone on this board is going to ride it either on opening day or throughout the 2014 season. I don't care what model it is, I'm just happy it's another B&M and with inversions. I was not showing the supports.... I was showing the entrance and exit of the loops. On the 3 coasters I linked photos to, the TRACK is close together and not further apart as it appears in the blue prints. I also gave excellent reasons for the possibility of a dive machine. However, that was shot down.

Usually in morning test runs, they perform a block check. They stop train 1 on the MCBR, and dispatch train 2 up the lift. Train 2 will stop when it reaches the top of the lift. I have been on Diamondback when it has stopped for several moments a couple times. Not once have I felt like we were going to valley. Also, Montu after the MCBR is epic! Dive into the ground. Loop half in the ground Helix up then drop. queue flyby drop into ground corkscrew half in the ground.

If you were to draw an overhead layout of a coaster, what would the loop look like? Here's a picture of the loops on Vortex. Notice the "Z" shape. Okay, Glenda. "It's Galinda, with a Ga." Actually, we're both wrong. It's Glinda, spelled with an "i", but no "Ga". From Wiki's page on 'Wicked' : "In an attempt to impress Fiyero, Galinda announces that she will change her name to "Glinda" in honor of Doctor Dillamond's persistent mispronunciation. Fiyero fails to notice and leaves." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicked_%28musical%29 ACT 1, paragraph 6 I'm talking about Glinda the Good Witch from "The Wizard of Oz". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wizard_of_Oz_(1939_film) Anything else? Technically, Wizard of Oz happened after events of Wicked. I was making a joke with my statement by quoting the show: "It's Galinda, with a Ga." Start at 24 seconds... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64_zksSkZrg

You're 5 word sentences bashing every other coaster designer other than Intamin is not trolling? Okay.

Please look at this post real good. http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27275-starting-to-decode-2014/?p=540105 I see that. I also see an extra wide base at the bottom of that loop. Raptor and Montu's loop is not that wide. And don't say it is like that because it goes around the lift... I cam calling it.... DIVE MACHINE Then explain Dragon Challenge. Clearance for if 2 trains were to pass each other at this point. You do not want people to hi 5 the other people at a compbined speed of 100 + mph. Dragons was designed as a dueling coaster, however, the red track is longer. Thus was more prone to block a the top of the lift hill when running a 3 train op on each track. The blue side would continue, then the red side would start back up once the block was clear. Thus passing here was possible. (Experienced several times) The red side would have to be early at this section, but on the other side of the loops it would have to be late. They don't run them simultaneously anymore though.

Okay, Glenda. "It's Galinda, with a Ga." Actually, we're both wrong. It's Glinda, spelled with an "i", but no "Ga". From Wiki's page on 'Wicked' : "In an attempt to impress Fiyero, Galinda announces that she will change her name to "Glinda" in honor of Doctor Dillamond's persistent mispronunciation. Fiyero fails to notice and leaves." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicked_%28musical%29 ACT 1, paragraph 6

Please look at this post real good. http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27275-starting-to-decode-2014/?p=540105 I see that. I also see an extra wide base at the bottom of that loop. Raptor and Montu's loop is not that wide. And don't say it is like that because it goes around the lift... I cam calling it.... DIVE MACHINE

IT IS A INVERT. IT IS NOT CONFIRMED.

Okay, Glenda. "It's Galinda, with a Ga."

More speculation: I was actually thinking dive machine the other day after looking at the blue prints. 1. We do not know the height of the ride. 2. The turn at the top of the lift could just be a turn, ala SheiKra and Griffon. 3. Dive machines use big swooping valleys at the bottom of their first drop. That would account for the distance between the turn and first inversion. 4. The loop on the blue print that circles the lift looks a bit wide at the base, possibly to allow for a wide train. 5. Depending on how the Maintenance barn is built, 4 dive trains could possibly fit in there. SheiKra for example has 2 maintenance bays that hold 5 trains. 6. A dive machine of this size would hold every world record for dive machines to date. Height, length, number of inversions. 7. Isn't a multi looping dive machine the logical next step? Considering wing trains are almost as wide as the 8 across dive machine trains. Laterals would be similar. I can not find a Sheikra blue print, but i sure it would look somewhat similar to this new KI blue print. A direct overhead view, without reference to height and such.

I will be getting my 29th and 30th B&M this month! Behemoth and Leviathan. Leviathan will be my 30th B&M! I love B&M coasters! My home state has 8!!!! (Florida)

I'm not sure why they'd build another sitdown looper when we already have Vortex and FoF. Besides, in reference to KI, I read something a few weeks ago on another coaster enthusiast forum which said "in 2014 a mountain spirit will be dethroned". Alpengeist is currently the "king of the mountain" when it comes to inverts, and the name Alpengeist literally means "Alpine spirit". Why wouldn't they? Why would they build "another" wooden roller coaster since they have Beast, Racer, and Woodstock? Why build Millennium Force if they already have Magnum? Why build Maverick if they have Corkscrew? Why build another hotel if they already have one? Why WindSeeker if they already had Zephyr? Why build another bathroom if they already have one? What ever your answer is to any of the questions I asked, will be the answer to why they WOULD build a sitdown style looping coaster even though they already have Vortex and FOF. Also... WHAT IF... "mountain spirit" is being referred to a SFMM? Tatsu is on top of the mountain, right? I know it is less likely due to Firehawk, but still, WHAT IF?

Speed? possibly. Inversions? doubt it. I only seen 6 inversions on the blueprints. I'm definitely seeing 7 on the blueprints. In order: Dive Loop Loop around lift Zero G Dive Loop Immelman Loop and another zero G between the two "helixes" Its possible that one or both of those helixes would be an inclined loop, but its really too hard to tell from the plans. So 7 for sure, possibly 9. For some reason, I think it'll be 8 since its a world record "breaking" and not just a world record. I do not believe it is a zero g roll between the 2 helixes. I believe that will be a corkscrew.

Speed? possibly. Inversions? doubt it. I only seen 6 inversions on the blueprints. That NoLimits rendering is wrong. You will not go that fast through that last inversion which is most likely a wing over / corkscrew.. Example: Edit: Oh my, triangle footer!

Don has said that the park will not stream the announcement live.

I think it fell out of place.

^About Intamin restraints... Cheetah Hunt's restraints are the same as Maverick, but are different material. They are much better IMO. They are more flexible, and seem to be of the same material that B&M is using as well, and for the same reason.... vandal proof. I have ridden quite a few B&M's this season, and they seem to be switching to the new restraints. The few that I can think of right off the top of my head are: Montu - 2 trains new, 1 train old (nor sure of the 4th train) Kumba - same SheiKra - possibly has new restraints. (Only rode twice last year out of my 3 visits. Was down for annual maintenance one time, and had an hour wait the other times.) Scorcher - both trains and is an improvement for stand up coasters Chang-O-Lantern - Same as Scorcher.. So much better than Mantis. The new restraints seem to minimize head banding. I have noticed that the newer B&M restraints are slightly smaller as well. For example: Kumba has 1 train with the original restraints, and I had about an inch of slack in the belt with wiggle room between my chest and the restraint. The next train, same seat, black restraint. No slack, and no wiggle room. I didn't feel stapled, and it was surprisingly comfortable with less head banging, but I prefer a little wiggle room in the chest area. It makes sense because people pick at the restraints and deface them. KI has even taken all of the decals off Diamondback except for the pilot coach because people peel them off.

You do know Stengle designed Alpengiest, the one you said had a forceless drop. It was b&M not mr. stengel that slapped the trim onto the drop. That was nearly 20 years ago. Mr. Stengel was ahead of his time. Mr. Stengel designed the Supes, maverick, MF, TTD, El Toro, KA, volcano, expedition ge force, etc. Intamin was not afraid to leave his rides as is. Yep, and between Alpie and the coasters you mentioned, we know which one's are down more due to mechanical.

Do you mean in general, or right now? Designers build what the parks want. If a park calls B&M up and says, "We want this, this, and this, in an inverted coaster and only have X amount of room, can you do it?" B&M's response would likely be, "Our Batman model fits that description." If a park calls B&M and asks for a stand up, they will build it. Inverts are terrible..they are a 90's ride...only a moron in charge would spend $30 mil on one...if the lift hill goes through the loop, that is the definition of a gimmick... every Intamin is better than this ride they are building and it is not even debatable for a park that doesn't have a full circuit invert, and is looking to replace a record breaking coaster, with another record breaking coaster, its a no brainer... And your right there are plenty of intanims that will probably give a better thrill than this coaster, but that's only when Those intanim coasters are operating. I highlighted parts of these two statements that I wanted to comment on. "Only when those Intamin coasters are operating." - Exactly. I agree 100% This is exactly why Kings Island SHOULD NOT build an Intamin. They experience a significant amount of downtime, compare to B&M. When Diamondback was closed for 2 weeks last season, it wasn't mechanical, it was structural. It was also the longest time since Diamondback has been installed that it had significant downtime, that I recall. It comes down to reliability. King's Island is going to build a reliable coaster. B&M's are proven more reliable than Intamin. "They are a 90's ride" - Saying inverted coasters are a 90's ride or is outdated would be like saying wooden coasters are old and outdated, so parks should not build them. "Definition of gimmick" - 300+ ft or 400+ plus ft is not a gimmick? "every Intamin is better than this ride they are building and it is not even debatable." - Have you ridden EVERY intamin? I personally have not, and out of 170 coasters that I have ridden, only 28 are B&M. (Raptor is my least favorite out of all of them.) You need to back up your statement here with facts. I can back up that I have ridden enough Intamins to know the reliability sucks. "only a moron in charge would spend $30 mil on one" - I am just going to withdraw my next statement..... took me 37 posts to write this! Time to read backwards!

Based on the blue prints, it does not look longer than Montu. The record they may indeed be going for here is height.

Okay, my prediction was 6 inversions. From the blue print, if it is real, I only see 6. Immelman / dive loop Loop zero-g batwing thing Loop If there is 7, then the last one will be a wing over / corkscrew. THANK GOD there is not a cobra roll! The only cobra roll I liked on an inverted was on Alpie.