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Everything posted by McSalsa

  1. To be fair, NTG and Iron Rattler also didn't add 40 extra feet of height (and thus much more speed). OG Texas Giant went 62mph, NTG goes 65- a increase of 3mph. OG Rattler went 65mph, Iron Rattler 70mph. It probably has had some effect but Steel Vengeance went crazy when adding extra height and speed, not to mention the new "2nd-Gen" RMC trains are also claimed to be a source of issues, as they apparently are also heavier than the 1st gen trains. For the record from what I know, only Steel Vengeance and Twisted Timbers have the 2nd gen trains but I could be wrong (I dunno if Zadra for example has them). Twisted Cyclone- which also opened in 2018- still had the old trains and it didn't seem to have any problems. I would find it a bit funny if Kings Island got a RMC, and then it had the old 1st gen trains because Cedar Fair realized the 2nd gen ones stunk (or just had RMC remake the trains again, creating a Gen 3 train). Kings Island would also want something that could run 3 trains: I don't know if New Texas Giant has the same issues in terms of capacity Steel Vengeance has or not, but a park pulling 3,000,000 guests per year is gonna want at least around 1,000pph for a major attraction (all of the big popular coasters currently at KI- Orion, Banshee, Diamondback, The Beast and Mystic Timbers are at or above this level). Finding a solution to the loose articles/metal detectors issue would also something to overcome. If they wanted to keep Steel Vengeance's "mystique" I would also imagine KI may wait until 2028-ish (when SV is 10+ and some of the hype has died down) and/or build a Topper Track coaster that isn't as large (to be fair a topper track woodie that is "only" 185 feet tall would be able to claim it is the current world's tallest wooden coaster, though then you get the whole is topper track wood can' o worms). Plus this would give RMC more time to improve their coasters reliability and capacity. PS: I would also be all for a ground-up RMC (I can wait if it means fixing the Steel Vengeance issues though) not only because it would likely become my new #1 at KI, but because their custom structures look epic. This appears to be a drawing (maybe? Could be a photo, it blurs that line...) but it looks cool (from Energylandia.pl- the park's official site):
  2. They did. Here is a video filmed a few days before the accident I like to watch from time to time, it is a "music video" made by CoasterImage.com (anyone here remember them)? Son of Beast can be seen running 5-car trains. Note: It is from 2007 so hope you don't mind good old 240p!
  3. Using the webcams last year, on a day I was bored, I actually was estimating each coaster's capacity I could see. Vortex was pulling around 1000pph which was pretty good capacity. Here were my results. I watched each coaster run at least 5 cycles, and then used the best 3 cycles as an average (giving mulligans for walks of shame and stuff), and I got these numbers. Vortex: 1,029pph Diamondback: 1,314pph BLSC: 712pph Mystic Timbers: 949pph The Racer: 800pph per side (1,600pph both sides) These were estimated using the Mystic Timbers, Diamondback, and Orion Construction cams. I also looked at some Cedar Point cams to see how they compared: Valravn: 1,037pph Millennium Force: 935pph (oof- a bit bad for such a popular ride, Orion will smash this) Maverick: 858pph Iron Dragon: 933pph Steel Vengeance: 642pph (Worse than BLSC- no wonder it always has 2+ hour waits!) Gemini: 848pph per side (1,696pph if both sides running) I also could have done Rougarou but I got tired before I got to it and forgot. I no longer have exact numbers but remember doing this once for The Beast too, it got about 900-1000pph and Banshee pulled 1400-1500 (I expect Orion will be about the same as Banshee given the 4-across seating and train sizes are the same).
  4. Update: I just re-checked GP to Enthusiast's video, and turns out my OG thoughts on what happened in 2006 were in fact true: here is what actually happened based on the video and what I have learned via the comments. Son of Beast was running 2 trains in 2006. 1- Train #1 (could have been SOB's #2 but I'll just say it was #1 for simplicity) departs, climbs the lift hill, drops and hits the rose bowl. The ride goes fine however the forces cause a support to crack/break and a small dip to occur in the track. 2- Train #2 is dispatched, and when it hits the rose bowl section that was damaged, riders feel a jolt but are not injured. The damaged area breaks even more and the dip becomes larger. 3- Train #1 is sent out again, and hits the now large dip. Riders sustain injuries and some have bloody noses. The ride manages to complete the rest of the circuit and returns to the station. 4- Train #2 is climbing the 218 foot lift, when ride ops see the injured riders of Train #1 and E-Stop the ride. Train #2 is stuck there, and remains there for days. News chopper footage of Son of Beast from around the time of the accident show Train #2 on the lift hill. Who knows what would have happened if the ride ops had been faster and Train #2 had cleared the lift before the ride was E-Stopped!
  5. ^ It was removed a few weeks ago, Don Helbig even gave us a heads-up. It should return by late March/early April.
  6. Well, seeing Orion test for the first time, I have 2 observations: #1- Orion seems to have a variable speed lift hill, but for the 1st test they seem to have used the lowest speed setting. (A variable speed lift hill is one that goes slower until the train ahead has cleared the upcoming block. In the case of Orion this would be a train hitting the final brake run) #2- The helix looks to be taken at pretty high speeds and with good g-forces. Yes, the trims were probably off, but this was also the very first test run (so the ride was not even broken in at all yet) and in much cooler temperatures than what the ride will run at in summer. So I expect the helix will be taken pretty fast and forcefully when the ride is open, save maybe on cooler mornings when the ride has just been woken up and runs slower (though in those cases, will the trim even kick on?).
  7. Oof. More problems for Steel Vengeance. The ride is amazing when open (it is my current favorite ride based on ride experience) but it has issues: from what I have heard, and these are just rumors, is that Mean Streak's old structure is not handling the new RMC trains and increased speed very well. They are heavier than the old PTCs Mean Streak was using, and going nearly 10mph faster at maximum speed. This is apparently forcing Cedar Point's maintenance team to have to repair the structure fairly often, thus why the ride was usually not open for ERT in 2019 and now won't even attempt to operate during ERT on weekdays in 2020. The metal detectors also being needed on this ride also kills the capacity: dispatches are pretty slow because of this, so in spite of 3 trains, Steel Vengeance is likely getting 550pph on good hours, which even Mystic Timbers smashes (I have estimated MT to get 900-1000pph by watching the webcams before). Which is why you see 2 hour waits on even not-so-busy days when Millennium Force is only 20 minutes. As much as I would love a RMC I-Box or Topper Track coaster at Kings Island, these issues make me doubt one will come (same deal as with Intamin coasters) until these issues have been solved. Kings Island has been on a streak of adding tried-and-tested models with good reliability and capacity, and they have had lots of success so far with this.
  8. GO FUN SPOT GO! I really hope this deal goes through: also, if it does, ironically I feel like Indiana Beach kinda matches up with the Fun Spot parks in Florida. They are very small parks and also have some solid wooden coasters, from what I hear. So it would IMO fit in their lineup.
  9. Holy crud- this was the first amusement park I had ever been to back in 1999. I had not been back since, but I was hoping to get back there soon to re-ride some old rides as well as the new ones they have added in the last 20 years. This news sucks: Hoosier Hurricane, my first true roller coaster I ever rode, is probably going to be demolished as relocation for a wooden coaster would be very rare in this day and age. Cornball Express is probably also gonna go, and I have read nothing but good reviews for that ride, and while reviews were mixed Lost Coaster of Superstition Mountain seems like a ride that can't be moved easily. Tig'rr is also unlikely to find a new home due to its age, which also means a classic Schwarkopf may also bite the dust. The only major coaster I think that has a chance of finding a new home is the S&S El Loco, Steel Hawg, as it is fairly new having been opened in 2008. I don't know about the flat rides, some of those will probably find new homes I would imagine. TBH this is even worse than Vortex IMO. At least with Vortex's closure, the entire park around it isn't going and you know Kings Island will eventually replace it with something. Indiana Beach is likely going to be replaced by Condos or something.
  10. I have decided to add a 2nd pic to this: this one is from my September 2019 visit to Cedar Point. The Gemini Midway is very nice. If my phone took better night pictures, this would look even more epic at night.
  11. I dunno if this was anyone here on KIC, but Amusement Insiders on Youtube has made a what-if RMC Son of Beast: Also, I found the video by GP to Enthusiast a few posts ago very informative. I knew there was a bump in the double helix (aka the Rose Bowl) but I thought it was near the bottom of the helix, not the top, and didn't realize that a train actually came to a dead stop- I thought it still completed the rest of the course, but injured people and then the ride was e-stopped in the station. (Granted Train #2 actually DID do this according to the same video- sadly if the ride was E-Stopped Train #1 was back on the track and past the lift already...)
  12. Hmm. $10 million budget? Well, I think I have a few options: (I have ridden models of these) My Pick: GCI or Gravity Group Wooden Coaster: While the ones I have ridden are on a bigger scale (especially from GG as I have only ridden Voyage which is massive) even the smaller wooden coasters by these companies look great, and you could probably fit a lot of coaster under $10,000,000. Heck, Voyage adjusted for inflation JUST breaks the limit at about $11 million! Thus a wooden coaster by one of these companies would likely be my pick. I would go for something about the size of say, Legend at Holiday World (Around 100 feet tall, decent length, etc.) Still, other options are tempting...though I have not ridden them save ONE: (Have never ridden but am tempted by...) RMC Raptor: I don't see a listing for price, but given Six Flags is buying these and they are less than 2000 feet long, these are very likely under $10m and reviews for these seem amazing. Not to mention from the POVs, the pacing looks insane. Chance Rides Hyper GTX: These things look like miniature hypercoasters with great airtime. I still need to get to Kentucky Kingdom to ride Lightning Run, to see if it really is the baby Magnum XL-200 I think it looks like. (And then these ideas I looked up but are over $10m sadly) Intamin Impulse (only other model here I have ridden): Wicked Twister was $9 million in 2002, which sadly translates to about $13 million in 2020 so it breaks the limit, and I cannot find how much the smaller models cost. I did enjoy Wicked Twister though. Vekoma Bermuda Blitz or Shockwave: These look like awesome coasters, and the reviews for Lech Coaster have been very good. These also just break the $10m limit, and would be under $15m most likely. (Based on their prices in Euros, converted to USD)
  13. For the record- I never did get to ride King Cobra- when I visited Kings Island for the first time in 2000 (not sure what day or even month, I think it was August but not sure) I was scared of roller coasters, especially ones that go upside down. But I VIVIDLY remember standing on the midway near what is now Sling Shot and watching King Cobra go over its turn, down the first drop, and into what seemed live a massive loop to a 10-year-old me, with the even more massive Son of Beast looming behind it with a even bigger loop (which I could only spot from the Eiffel Tower)! I would not return to Kings Island until 2009, but by then, King Cobra was scrap metal. And Son of Beast went SBNO about a month later (and I never got to ride that either because on my 1 trip in 2009 it was open, it broke down. I saw it do a few test runs afterward but it never re-opened). Also on Shaggy's pic: that looks more like CONSTRUCTION than destruction, but you can tell it was the demolition because Son of Beast (opened 16 years after King Cobra) is standing in the background. They really were just taking the coaster apart to possibly sell it, rather than just rip it down for scrap. Awesome picture BTW.
  14. Also, on the subject of King Cobra pictures, I found this web site a few years ago and bookmarked it because it because the guy has some nice pictures from the years 2000 & 2001 at Kings Island. Now-defunct rides included in these images include King Cobra, Son of Beast, Vortex (with horrible paint in 2000 and half-painted in 2001: this was a interesting time for the ride, at least in terms of how it looked), and Kenton's Cove Keelboat Canal. The OG Antique Cars and Flying Eagles are not included directly but can be seen in some of the shots focusing on other rides. And while not a ride, there are also some good shots of International Street with the OG Pedestals still in place. 2001 has more photos than 2000 does though. 2000 http://www.casabrian.com/parks/pki2000.html 2001 (Includes KCKC Demolished pics as TR:TR was about to be built, and half-painted Vortex) http://www.casabrian.com/parks/pki2001.html I also found this video on Youtube, it is by PsycloneSteve and posted in 2014 and it has some great footage of King Cobra in action.
  15. This is cool, but I spotted some errors (the first 2 rides quoted, with Mystic Timbers being used just as a reference). First up, Xtreme Skyflyer opened in 1995 (as Drop Zone- the name was later changed so it could be used for the 1999 Drop Tower), not 2000 (Son of Beast was the only new ride added in 2000), so this would make it 25 according to the Mystic Timbers age. Also if Mystic Timbers, which opened in 2017, is 3 then KMAA would only be 1 according to the same scale as it opened in 2019. Orion would technically be Year 0 since it is in its very first season in 2020.
  16. Oh dear- IMO, it is kinda obvious what is gone. TIP: Look above Boo Blasters in both pictures. With the 2 Corkscrews not visible from here in either picture, it is possible that 2nd loop is the last remaining inversion of Vortex still standing.
  17. As for why the Firehawk que is being used for Flight of Fear, from what I have heard (via various websites and stuff), the old outdoor FOF que is being torn apart and they are going to expand it into a locker area- there were already some lockers there but with how popular Orion should be, they are thus going to turn the entire FOF outdoor section into lockers and Firehawk's old que will be the new Flight of Fear overflow que. There is also some evidence for this: back in December, people visiting for ACE's Orion Construction Tour saw FOF's que was being torn up. It can be seen around a minute and 30 seconds into this video:
  18. I will throw my hat into the ring I guess. Here is one of my favorite photos- from 2019... Diamondback towers over the trees. (Taken from White Water Canyon entrance/exit area)
  19. I don't remember if the cameras went down during Mystic Timbers testing, but I do remember vividly watching it do test runs before the ride opened as I remember seeing how fast the ride was going over the 2nd hill and being impressed at the speed. So the cameras did come back up for Mystic Timbers before opening day, if they did go down. The park also put this video out after the 1st test run was done for Mystic Timbers, and I imagine Orion will get a similar video:
  20. Oh dang- I was hoping the station might get to stay, as it was used originally for the famous and now-defunct OG Bat, not to mention it was really nice architecture- it looked a heck of a lot better than most modern coaster stations do and new rides re-using old stations isn't 100% new as both Vortex and Maverick have done this to name a few. Alas, clearly that was not the case. Also the demolition of the brake run, helix, and station pretty much confirm it: Vortex isn't getting "Rougarou'd" or RMC'd or whatever crazy theories some posters may have had. It's gone, and likely all of it. Whatever replaces it in the coming years (I still think 2023/2024, they are gonna give Orion a few years to breathe) is gonna be 100% new, even including a new station if it's a new coaster- they could even put another coaster in Rivertown technically using the old Vortex spot. Heck, you could even have a 2nd coaster entrance in the same plaza where right now there is just Beast (and a Haunt building). Also, going from front-to-back (starting with the brake run, helix, batwing, etc.) and working back to the lift hill makes sense: this way they won't need to chop down any trees when the lift comes down, and can pull it down from that side. Thus Beast should still have plenty of trees to the left (from a rider's POV on Beast) at least after you exit the first tunnel. Granted I am gonna guess you will be able to see Orion's 200 foot turnaround up ahead come 2020 anyway, so that section of Beast will still be "different" this year.
  21. It kinda does suck for Kings Dominion- they added all these fancy advanced prototype rides in the late 90s and early 2000s, and it is kinda biting them in rear end now since these rides just didn't last as long as expected, save for Flight of Fear. They also had a TOGO Standup- Cedar Fair's getting rid of them across the board it seems, and a wooden coaster in Hurler that was considered one of the world's worst, which did get replaced as it was RMC'd into Twisted Timbers- probably the best addition to Kings Dominion since 2010 easily. Thankfully looking at the rest of the lineup at Kings Dominion, save Anaconda which is probably also coming down in a few years, not too much seems in danger now. But then Cedar Fair is gonna wanna replace all the stuff they had to remove. We know a B&M Wing is probably coming, but Kings Dominion is still gonna want a lot more if they wanna stay competitive with BGW who are doing crazy things like adding back-to-back Intamins. TBH this is one of the reasons I have liked the new major additions Kings Island has gotten since Cedar Fair added Diamondback in 2009: most of it seems like stuff that is gonna last, and 20 years from now the park isn't suddenly gonna need to abruptly remove a bunch of rides added in this period. Diamondback, Banshee, Mystic Timbers (especially since woodies can last 100+ years), and Orion will likely all last 30+ years, probably even more, like Vortex did. None of these rides are crazy "first of their kind" prototypes, which may draw some enthusiast scoff upon opening, but the trade-off will be a long lifespan for all of them and less headaches for the park.
  22. Their Crypt was close to Volcano (same park area) but I'd imagine the reason for this removal would be the fact Top Spins in general are vanishing from parks as they get older and their reliability decreases. The fact these rides likely have tons of moving parts that needed maintained/replaced cannot help. The rumored (and probably leaked) B&M Wing Coaster wouldn't need more space than what Volcano gave it, so space isn't really a issue. I would imagine in the coming years Cedar Fair will likely do a whole refresh of this entire section of the park, especially if Anaconda is also removed in a few years (given what happened to Vortex I imagine Anaconda will eventually meet the same fate).
  23. Having gone to Banshee's opening day in 2014, as well as Passholder Preview in 2018 & 2019, I think I can give a decent estimate on crowd levels: -Orion will have a 4 to 5 hour wait regardless of weather, unless it is truly pouring rain all day or something (in which case it may just be closed). Flight of Fear, being right next to Orion, will also likely have a huge wait too. -The rest of the rides will depend on how the weather is, most likely. In 2014 and 2018, the weather was very nice when I was there on Banshee Opening Day and Passholder Preview and everything had pretty long lines- on Banshee opening day, I only rode 3 rides all day, though that was mainly because I actually stood in the 4 1/2 hour Banshee line. But I also had to wait 45 minutes for Backlot Stunt Coaster and about a hour for The Beast at Night. On PPN 2018, I didn't wait nearly as long for anything but that was because we rode mainly less popular rides (my first ride of the day was Adventure Express) and we bought a few spins at the "Wheel O' Fast Lane" near Diamondback and got lucky to get Diamondback and Banshee on 2 of the spins. However at PPN 2019 (and Opening Day 2019), it was cold and rainy and there were very light crowds- most rides had next to no wait, save the brand new Kings Mills Antique Autos and Beast during the T-Shirt giveaway which reached 2 hours...I waited in that line too BTW. Got my shirt. -As King Ding Dong said, people are gonna be getting their season-long drink vouchers processed, which is gonna make drink lines long. Food lines are also gonna be long, and ride operations won't be as good as later in the year for one main reason: a bunch of the employees are gonna be brand new, and this is gonna be their very first day at work. -Also: almost all the rides will be "waking up" from at least 4 months of "slumber", even moreso for the ones that didn't run during Winterfest and closed in November. There will likely be some breakdowns- even Orion will likely go down a few times, since this will be the first day it is going to have actual people on it. Banshee was shut down a few times on its opening day due to breakdowns as well as...uhh...vomit trains. Standing in a 4+ hour line and then riding a roller coaster will make some people barf.
  24. Well, the Ellocoaster Poll results are in! Here is a link to the results page- there is a full top 25 for both wood and steel, as well as downloadable Excel files for the full results: http://www.ellocoaster.com/poll-results Now, to answer the questions I asked above first... #1- The best new ride of 2019 is...Untamed at Walibi Holland (it ranked 22nd overall of 921 ranked steel coasters)! Wow, I forgot that one. Zadra @ Energylandia didn't get enough votes, but would have beaten Untamed if it did. Best new in North America is...Hagrid @ Universal Orlando! Wow, I forgot that one too. I guess being more of a family coaster didn't hurt it all, it placed 71st out of 921 steel coasters. Of the coasters I did list above, Yukon Striker ranked highest at 79th with Copperhead Strike right behind it in 82nd. The only new for 2019 wooden coaster that got enough votes this year was Kentucky Flyer, so it was the year's best new woodie by default. #2- Vortex placed 422nd out of 921 coasters, so a little above mid pack- it mainly beat a lot of wild mice, kiddie coasters, and Vekoma Boomerangs and SLCs as well as a bunch of smaller Arrow Loopers and Corkscrews. It was the lowest rated non-kids coaster on the steel poll at Kings Island. #3- Could Wildfire @Kolmarden Zoo defend its title...NO! Wildfire actually drops to 5th! The coasters that beat it were...#4 Outlaw Run...#3 The Voyage...#2 El Toro (SFGadv)... and the new #1 is...Lightning Rod at Dollywood! LR has been getting rave reviews since it opened in 2016, so it will probably win more polls like this in the future, but the other coasters in the Top 5 could make a charge in the next few years. #4- The winner of the all-new steel poll is...STEEL VENGEANCE. (My prediction was spot on, but I imagine no one is suprised) Taron, Helix, Hyperion, and Fury 325 round out a elite Top 5 of the first Ellocoaster steel poll. #5- Fury 325 was ranked #5, as said right above. Leviathan was a bit further back, at #27- which is still great considering there were 921 coasters on the steel list that had enough votes to get ranked. As for other gigas: Intimidator 305 was #21 (2nd only to Fury 325 among the Gigas), Millennium Force was #35, Steel Dragon 2000 was #51, and Red Force was #158 (if you count that among the Gigas, it is more of a Mini TTD). I would say Orion has a great shot at at least being Top 50 in the world when it opens in 2020. #6- The MOST SUCK (ranked 921/921) steel coaster is... Grand Exposition Coaster at Silver Dollar City, apparently. It's a kiddie coaster. Viking Coaster at Energylandia is a Wild Mouse that was ranked very low as well. Of the "large" coasters, T3 at Kentucky Kingdom appears to take the cake ranking at 906th and still being clobbered by numerous kiddie coasters, wild mice, other SLCs, Boomerangs, etc. As for "most suck", on the wooden side we have a ride related to a defunct one at KI...RCCA's (the makers of Son of Beast) Coaster Express at Parque Warner Madrid has the disgrace of finishing 174th out of 174 wooden coasters ranked. And finally, here is how all the coasters at Kings Island did: STEEL (of 921 Ranked) ***** Diamondback- 52nd, 94.74 win % (#4 B&M Hyper, #6 if you count the 2 B&M Gigas) Banshee- 72nd, 93.12 Flight of Fear- 214th, 79.99 The Bat- 235th, 77.45 Backlot Stunt Coaster- 361st, 64.65 Invertigo- 400th, 60.85 Adventure Express- 404th, 60.49 Vortex- 422nd, 58.25 Flying Ace Aerial Chase- 771st, 26.78 Great Pumpkin Coaster- 858th, 16.54 WOOD (of 174 Ranked) ***** Mystic Timbers- 13th, 90.27 win % (Top Rated GCI!) Beast- 48th, 69.25 (Good but controversial- it ranked about the same in the old Mitch Hawker polls too) Blue Racer- 120th, 29.94 Red Racer- 122nd, 29.41 Woodstock Express- 165th, 6.14 Note: The wooden coasters tend to have much lower win% because there are a lot more kiddie steel coasters for those to "beat up on", versus kiddie wooden coasters. For the full results, I would suggest downloading the excel files. You can even sort them this year- look up what the best rides by each manufacturer were, by year, etc. that way.
  25. I do expect a full ride on Orion will end up taking about 3 minutes: -About 1 minute just to climb the lift hill: Orion DOES just have a chain lift and not a super fast cable lift like Millennium Force does. You will actually have some time to think "Oh crud this is actually really tall" during the ascent. -1 minute of actual ride section -1 minute of brake run until you return to the station Granted this was likely by design, as it also gives the ride crews about 60 seconds per cycle to dispatch trains without too much stacking. With the fact Orion is likely not gonna have loose articles (will probably use lockers) this thing is gonna have awesome capacity (probably similar to Banshee's), which it will probably need on opening weekend as well as on busier days like July Saturdays and Haunt.
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