homestar92
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Posts posted by homestar92
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2 hours ago, veritas said:
http://www.ellocoaster.com/2018-wood-coaster-poll-results
If the manufacturer believes they are wood. And there wood coasters are ranked as wood coasters what more do you want. RMC broke the paradigm of what a wood coaster does, looks and feels. Granted I can understand the doubt. But if RMC's in your opinion doesn't make wood coasters, couldn't the same argument be made with the Intamin prefabs?
Also I will be getting my last rides on Vortex on the 11th. This maybe the only time I am not looking forward to going to Kings Island.
If no wood whatsoever exists between the drive wheels and the upstop wheels at any point on the ride cycle, I have a hard time calling the coaster "wooden".
Intamin prefabs, while certainly not traditional wooden coasters, are wooden coasters because the wheels ride on wood. It's not about "feel", it's about what the wheels are actually riding on. If we're going by "feel", then Adventure Express is a wooden coaster and El Toro is steel and both of those are obviously not true.
30 minutes ago, SonofBaconator said:Because the 6 boards that make up the trackbed are wood where as i-box is all metal.
So technically speaking, the majority of the ride is wood. Mystic Timbers has some metal supports but its still a wooden coaster.
The majority of Adventure Express is also wood, as are the majority of all RMC Iron Horse coasters (except Storm Chaser). Not a single person is calling those wooden coasters. A few wooden boards that sit under the actual track rails on a coaster where no wood exists between the wheels doesn't make a meaningful differentiation with something like a mine train coaster. RMCs are steel coasters that the manufacturer has decided to claim as wooden so that they can claim records.
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1 hour ago, silver2005 said:
So what would a 'good' Vortex removal announcement look like to those of you not satisfied with it (including the context given that Firehawk was just demolished and Orion's announcement)?
Wait, are you implying that you think their announcement was fine?
I'm not sure what would be a "good" announcement other than giving us a farewell season. What I can say, however, is that a 6AM push notification is the second-worst way this could possibly be handled. The only worse option would be to announce it after the park has already closed for the year.
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On 9/28/2019 at 12:45 PM, BoddaH1994 said:
The Mosier tower was never used? Is that true? And why? @CoastersRZ
To be honest, I just assumed that was where Stricker's got their Mosier tower. I guess not.
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28 minutes ago, silver2005 said:
I think its safe to say that most people guessing on how GP reacts to the ride only really have anecdotal evidence. Unless this info is coming from a dedicated sociologist, most people are going to take these estimated GP reactions with a grain of salt.
All we have to go off of are the published ridership numbers, which we haven't had in several years, but we do at least have a few years after Banshee, which means the numbers should still be fairly accurate relative to each other (I don't imagine Mystic would take riders away from Vortex in the same way that Banshee might). The most recent years when those numbers were published still placed Vortex's ridership solidly above average for coasters at KI. That's the only empirical data we really have, and that data pointed to it being reasonably popular.
KI is a local park that caters primarily to season passholders (AKA, repeat visitors). If Vortex is pulling numbers, that means people enjoyed the ride. There aren't a ton of people at KI on a typical day who are ignorant to what the ride experience is like and will ride it without knowing what to expect and hate it.
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5 hours ago, kirbias1 said:
Seems like channel 5 disagrees with Vortex's removal, too.
This is generally why I believe the reason *must* be structural.
People can claim nobody liked Vortex, but they'd be wrong. It may not often have a line, but it still sends trains that are usually mostly full, which means it still operates at close to capacity. The ride is still popular and KI acknowledged that in the blog post. I imagine the park knew that the news wouldn't go over well, which is also why I don't think they would remove it if it was within the realm of reason to keep it going. Anything other than a structural problem would be relatively inexpensive to fix, and I imagine that's the route they would go if they felt it was possible.
I just wish it got a proper send off. The biggest hurt in all this is that the news was broken by a 6AM push notification from the app. That's like getting broken up with via a text message, and that aspect of the removal, I think we can all agree, is not cool. It feels wrong that freaking Mantis got a better send off than Vortex (and Mantis didn't even really go anywhere!)
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28 minutes ago, LondonFreak said:
Arrow has been out of business for close to 20 years. That makes this hard to find parts for. Cedar Fair is taking out their Arrow suspended coasters as well, so this is not too much of a stretch or a shock.
*sigh*
Again, parts availability for Arrows was not a problem and never has been, and won't be for the foreseeable future. Metal fatigue is what will be the undoing of the Arrows. Parts are readily available and still in production. We've beaten this horse time and time again, please let it be dead. The "aftermarket" parts you referenced are only "aftermarket" in the same way that parts for a pre-2010 GM vehicle aren't technically being made by the same company as when the cars were new (since the GM of today is technically a different company than the pre-2010 GM). Take the VIP coaster tour at Busch Gardens Williamsburg and they will let you see and handle some of Loch Ness Monster's wheels. "Arrow" is still stamped on the metal on those parts to this day.
And Cedar Fair is most certainly not removing their Arrow Suspended coasters. Every single Arrow suspended coaster that has ever been under Cedar Fair's ownership is still operating, and none of them have had a closure announced at this time.
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If the ride is going to be gone, I want it to be gone.
Sitting SBNO for years is not the treatment that Vortex deserves. An empty field right off the midway next to your big new attraction is kind of a bad look, but an abandoned old steel coaster being left to rust away right next to your big new ride is a very bad look.
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8 minutes ago, collin.klopfstein said:
Could this mean that the theory that Vortex is sinking was true?
No.
Not meaning to do a one word post, but that myth has always been absurd. People have been saying that for decades. If it was sinking that long, it would be about 30 feet tall by now.
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3 minutes ago, DeltaFlyer said:
I am trying (very hard) to not get my hopes up that this isn’t [truly] the end of Vortex, but another part of me would like to know if a Chance retracking (a la Phantom’s Revenge) would be possible.
I can dream, right?
-DeltaFlyer, who is heartbroken.
If we are talking about possible situations like Mantis where they announce it's being retired but it actually isn't, I think the most likely situation would be a Blue Hawk conversion with new trains, paint, and a new name. If there are structural problems, though, that would do nothing to address the issue. If it's a popularity problem and the ride is otherwise fine, then it might.
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1 minute ago, bschwegman said:
i don't buy for a second that it had reached its end of service.
"Reached the end of its service life" seems to me that it's industry speak for "we're removing this attraction and we don't want to share the exact reasons"
Which, honestly, is fair. We don't need to know why and very little good would likely come from the general public knowing the park's M.O. in situations like this.
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2 minutes ago, ki95 said:
Well... that announcement came out of nowhere lol I'm surprised they didn't tease it like Firehawk!
Honestly, I'm glad Vortex is leaving. Like Firehawk, it was down more than it was open. Plus, it gave so many injuries. I quit ridding it after I blacked out on it a few years ago. I hope they work on the land and put a new attraction (a flat or a coaster) in its place.
You must have had supremely bad luck on days you visited, because Vortex had extremely little downtime compared to most of the other coasters, and I'd challenge you to find me even one reputable report of an actual injury on the ride (no, a headache is not an injury).
Also, hate to double post, but I don't know how to edit a quote into an old post...
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Just now, Sebastien6221 said:
And my reply was more towards cdub about wooden coasters lasting longer. Not necessarily parts. But if a board is bad on a wood coaster, replace it. Steel coasters are in huge sections.
You are right on that one. Especially older Arrows. While modern steel coasters are bolted together, which makes replacing a small section of track a little more feasable, old Arrows were welded in many cases, so the only way to remove a section of track is to cut it off. If there are structural problems (which seems the most reasonable explanation to me given how sudden the announcement was, but I certainly don't know for sure) then it would be an incredible pain to fix them.
I know that the park is willing to go through those efforts if they deem it worth the cost, as a few small sections of track got replaced when Flight Deck became The Bat. I guess this time, they needed some extensive work and deemed it not worthwhile.
While I have no idea what the reasons for the removal are, I'm confident that it's not parts (as in the normal wear and tear parts that need replaced regularly on any coaster) and I'm fairly confident it's not that they want that land for some plans in the immediate future. Which is why a stucture problem seems more likely, but heck, it could be a matter of not feeling it's worth paying 4 ride ops to run that one whenever the park is open anymore.
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I don't disagree with you on that. I knew this day was coming one day, and in the not-too-distant future (though the timing feels like a gut punch from left field). I was responding in particular to the supposition that parts are no longer available and that being the reason for the ride's closure, which is definitely not true. Maybe we're splitting hairs, but I don't consider structure or track to fall under the same umbrella as "parts"
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22 minutes ago, cdubbs727 said:
They said in the release it had reached the end of its service life. It's likely as simple as that. No more parts available for a 33-year-old ride. There could have been inspections or maintenance that revealed it was not going to be feasible to run it another season.
Parts availability is not and has never been a problem. I don't know why the ride is being removed, but I do know that's not the reason. S&S still produces replacement parts for all Arrow coaster models.
Heck, they actually still produce actual 4D coasters, which were an Arrow creation.
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1 minute ago, b.k35 said:
Sorry if someone already posted this, but on the website the 2020 gold passes have Vortex on them. Is this further evidence this was a spur of the moment decision?
The actual card doesn't have a coaster on it at all and hasn't for years. They haven't changed their stock pass image in years. It's the same at every park except Knotts and Cedar Point which both are using different artwork due to their major anniversaries.
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4 minutes ago, coasterbill said:
It's being replaced by nothing right now. I don't think anyone expects that plot of land to remain empty forever.
OK, sure. But if they aren't using that land for five years, then there is no land-related reason for the ride currently sitting there to be removed for at least 4.
The people who are celebrating its removal aren't getting excited over the nebulous attraction that may or may not come at some undefined point in the future. They're celebrating that a ride they didn't like and were never forced to ride is going away, despite the fact that many people loved it. That's pretty childish.
If the land was to be used in 2020 or 2021, I get being happy that Vortex is being removed to make way for the future. But we just got the most expensive announcement in park history. I can safely wager that we are not getting anything there in 2020 or 2021. If the future plan is a coaster, I'd guess not even 2022.
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25 minutes ago, KIghostguy said:
People at my school were celebrating the news today. It’s easy for older members to get nostalgic, but I don’t think people on here understand that the general public largely has a profound hatred for Vortex.
And with all due respect, the general public are dead wrong on this one. A ride getting removed and being replaced by *nothing* is a bad, or at best, neutral thing for every guest in the park. Unless someone was literally forcing them to ride Vortex, there is no logical reason for anyone to celebrate its removal.
I despise Invertigo as much as it is possible for someone to hate an inanimate object, but I would be a little bit miffed if they announced it was being removed and nothing would be taking its place at all. There are people out there who do like it and celebrating their disappointment is a bit petty and shallow.
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Memes are my favorite coping mechanism.
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My disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined.
Have fun on Orion next year guys. I think I'm gonna sit 2020 out. I'm not going to be dramatic and act like KI has lost me forever (they haven't; I'll be back) but it's going to be very difficult emotionally for me to go to Coney Mall for a while and I'm not ready to put myself through that right away.
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3 minutes ago, BeeastFarmer said:
I feel so sorry for people who have a Six Flags as a home park. The cringe is, indeed, terrible.
Some good additions for them, but I do like letting the parks make their own announcements like Cedar Fair does.
Pretty much the only Six Flags park that consistently gets good new additions is Great America. Coincidentally, Six Flags Great America is my all-time favorite park, but it's also the only Six Flags park that even cracks my top ten...
Because of that, though, I think announcing everything together is probably best for the way they do things. The announcement video for the Catwoman Whip which will likely be an upcharge would be about 20 seconds with no fanfare. Very different than, say, the Orion announcement which absolutely deserved to be raised on a pedestal by itself.
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On 8/26/2019 at 1:36 PM, BoddaH1994 said:
I want to say each ride has its own. I'm not the expert, so if anyone has more info feel free to chime in.
On a side note, the Larson Looper at KK (and maybe all of them for all I know) has a setup in which the operator has to physically put an air hose onto the train to release the restraints. Seems very carnival-ish.
I feel like I saw the same at Six Flags St. Louis as well on their Larson Loop.
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3 hours ago, Magenta Lizard said:
Unless there’s an accident. Then they’re risking what value their name has, on a installation they have little to no actual control over.
“Did you hear about that roller coaster crashing at Six Flags?!” and nobody is going to bother to specify which one, and everyone who hears it will assume the closest one to them.
Six Flags already runs this risk by putting "Six Flags" in the name of (almost) every park they operate and also reusing ride names. Sure, they do have control over their parks in North America, but incidents do occasionally happen and I can only assume that guests at other parks get confused as to where the incidents occurred. I never quite understood that marketing tactic, honestly. The number of people who visit theme parks other than their "home" park or the major national destination parks is so minuscule that I'm not sure where the value is in having that kind of cohesive branding. I can see a whole lot of downsides (for example, an incident happens at "Six Flags" and everyone thinks it was their local park) with not too many upsides (since the only people who would ever appreciate the branding consistency are the sorts of people who will probably know that they are part of the same chain without them sharing a name).
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I just hope someone else is funding this. If Six Flags is footing the bill, I fear this could be a blunder of pre-2009 Six Flags proportions.
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1 minute ago, BoddaH1994 said:
Also, why would you invest in the biggest, tallest, fastest anything in a country that doesn't have an amusement park yet? Would that even be a draw?
Especially when considering that the parks in the UAE (which is a much friendlier destination for foreign tourists than Saudi Arabia) have consistently failed to pull the kinds of attendance numbers you'd like to see from a park with that much money being invested into it.
It doesn't really make sense to build any record-smashing attractions in a park that will likely see fewer visitors than "nearby" year-round parks that pull a third to a quarter of the guests that the larger seasonal American parks pull.
Vortex Is Leaving After This Fall Season
in Kings Island
Posted
Note that I didn't say I categorize by what the wheels are sitting on, I categorize by what material is the predominant one between the upstop wheels and the drive wheels.
Yes, all wooden coasters' wheels are directly contacting a series of thin steel strips. But between those thin steel strips? Wood. That's the key. RMC topper track wheels ride on a steel box with no wood in its construction whatsoever. It's no different than the construction of a mine train coaster, which are universally regarded as steel. The differentiation between topper track and I-box track is just enthusiasts and manufacturers being pedantic to claim records. The fact is, in either case, No wood exists between the wheels whatsoever.