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KI Guy

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Everything posted by KI Guy

  1. A good point BoddaH. Since Herschend now operates Kentucky Kingdom, we'll see if they can do both. While I obviously love and enjoy KI, I acknowledge that Dollywood offers a premium experience over KI in nearly all aspects except number of thrill rides-- and Dollywood continues to grow on that front. For the additional $80-95 dollars, Dollywood has better passholder discounts, more live entertainment, and more special events. I've always found the landscaping, staff friendliness, and cleanliness phenomenal. KI has some very talented staff as well, but as a group, they just don't seem to have reached the Dollywood level. They can only do with the resources and leadership they are given and I believe Dollywood allocates more funds to staffing and landscaping or they may just budget it better. If CF were ever to be bought out, or KI sold off, I would want it to go to Herschend. I think they could put KI in a slot between KK and Dollywood in terms of pricing and experience.
  2. In the short term, yes. In the long-term, there's no way, at least under any seasonal amusement park business model we've seen. The overhead with running an amusement park is huge. Lots of labor, lots of utilities, high maintenance /upkeep costs etc and the revenue is seasonal. That means that unless amusement parks are to become something much less accessible to the average person labor costs will have to go down from these high rates in the long-term. What we're seeing now is a a frenzy to get workers just to ensure the business stays alive. $18-20 for seasonal amusement park work would have been absolutely bonkers two years ago. CF knows they NEED their parks to have some semblance of a normal year this year or they could REALLY be in trouble. Once a guest breaks the habit/cycle of being a passholder or making a yearly trip, they very well could stay away. The usual HS and college students will probably happily line up for jobs at something like the old pay rates once the job market (and unemployment) changes, but KI has to pay up now to avoid some seriously bad consequences.
  3. They are testing the customers' patience at this point. They cut hours when they have a full green light from the state and said they were fully staffed. If this is going on at other CF parks, they are not acting like a company that has to pay back a billion dollar loan in four years. Herschend- if you want to be a big player, start planning your move.
  4. A Fast Lane system does devalue a season pass or a daily ticket since it will take more time to do the same level of stuff at the park if a Fast Lane exists rather than not. Alternatively guests could do the same amount of stuff, but only if they go on less crowded days. This would devalue the pass/ticket as the passholder wouldn't have as much flexibility on when he or she would want to go to the park. You are correct that the season pass/ticket prices may be higher if FL did not exist, but this also would hurt the daily experience as more people would be buying passes and tickets making waits and crowds larger. Of course more customers may exist because they might not be able to afford the park at a higher price point. As long as they don't lose sight of guest experience in the name of short term revenue, they will probably be okay. They likely are being smart about this, but as I said before, there's always a temptation to act in the short term when it comes to publicly traded companies. Reply to quick edit: I agree that they have decided to keep the low price point on the passes. That calculation is quantity (number of passes) vs. quality (how exclusive a pass is which heavily affects daily attendance). That may sound bad, but deciding to offer a season pass in the early 80s was a similar calculation.
  5. The calculation has been made that the extra revenue from the Fast Lane is worth devaluing the season pass and standard daily ticket. I just hope for their sake that the calculation includes long term potential effects and opportunity costs. How many people are not getting season passes or daily tickets because of the reduced daily experience? If they leave, do they come back? How much more would guests be willing to pay for season passes if the experience were better, (lines went faster without Fast Lane)? Would these guests stay longer and spend more money? Although they likely know what they're doing in the long term, it's always a possibility with public corporations that they are pumping attendance and revenue in the short term for stock price reasons rather than doing what is best in the long term interest of the business. Making more money now is not always a good thing unless you're a short term CEO after a bonus or a frequent stock trader.
  6. Yes, my mistake. I accidently edited out some of my original wording trying to shorten the post. I meant to say I don't believe anyone working minimum wage ever made it as a sole breadwinner working 40 hours a week (**Edited to correct). A possible difference between you and me is I would be more inclined to say that this person should get a second job, or take on more hours, or at least take on a roommate or two to pool resources and bring down living costs. And this would only be until this person develops more skills or education. Also I used inflation because I was following on what matt 112986 said. Lastly, I don't know how you've come to the determination that a minimum wage hike (especially to $15) benefits everyone. All increased wage costs will be passed on to the customer and will nullify themselves in short time as costs increase prices which customers pay. Seeing the higher prices, they themselves demand a higher wage, and some, a wage increase parallel to the minimum wage increase. Automation and outsourcing are always getting rid of low paying "unskilled" labor. A hike in the minimum wage provides an incentive to get rid of the position entirely speeding up automation and job losses. This is my last post of this nature as we are getting away from KI in the conversation.
  7. I believe this comes from a good place. I don't want to see people out on the street either. However, here are some points to consider in addition to the one I raised earlier. 1. How do you arrive at $15? Why not $20 or $25? If it's the arbitrary living wage, how do you determine that amount? Different people and households have different needs and spending habits. 2. Realize that whatever increase in low end pay will undoubtedly result in more expensive labor at middle and high income positions. If I'm working a somewhat "skilled" job at $16 an hour and minimum wage shoots up to $15 will I still be happy at $16? Of course not! I would expect my wage to increase relative to minimum wage. I would need to make $21 or so to maintain my relative level of pay. To pay for all of this the value of the dollar is cheapened through inflation. Any wage bump for the minimum wage worker (assuming his job is not eliminated) is just a shell game that will only raise his real pay (buying power) in the very short term. After that, it is an increase in name only because his buying power is the same relativeto others and the new value of the dollar. It holds true whether the minimum wage is raised or not that your work value whether $10 an hour or $100 is directly tied to what someone is willing to pay me which is itself determined by the value I bring to the business. 3. Regarding your point about minimum wage not keeping up with inflation. Minimum wage has kept somewhat close to inflation since 1960. Although the wages have not kept up completely this holds true for wages in general outside of top earners. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/items/1960-united-states-minimum-wage I don't believe anyone ever made it as a sole breadwinner working a minimum wage job 40 hours a week without assistance. I believe this is a fairly new belief that's caught on in recent years. 4. For heads of household who's only income is through a minimum wage job, taxpayers pick up the slack. Medicaid, Food Stamps, the Earned Income tax credit, and other programs provide resources to people who earn below a certain level. These programs together increase (in free resources, reduced costs, and in tax breaks) what a minimum wage worker receives day to day far beyond the dollar amount on their paycheck.
  8. ^The issue with this is some jobs do not return 15 dollars an hour in value. If $15 is mandated you will simply see less employees to make up the difference. The game will be changed to keep the doors open on a given business. This is part of the reason I don't like u-scan at Kroger or touchscreen ordering at McDonald's. I think that a job to get started is better than no job at all.
  9. Given how tight the margins are in the amusement park business I wonder if this is sustainable. Could this be a temporary measure to get employees during the pandemic? Good for the employees though. I'm sure they're stoked.
  10. That's truly amazing you had that on hand. Do you collect papers on amusement parks?
  11. My overarching point was that if Cedar Fair and (sometimes Paramount) chose to theme less than possible because they were trying to cater to their particular demographic while keeping to a budget. I agree Paramount definitely had some misses, some of which were not with the theming, but the physical rides themselves. Cedar Fair has been more conservative overall, going with more proven ride concepts. The payoff on this is evident by the fact that there have been no major failures rides-wise (SOB, TR:TR). I would also say Cedar Fair's theming has been more conservative as well. Think of the theming in an Outer Limits FOF vs a Mystic Timbers or an IJST vs Banshee. I think the lighter, less expensive theming more dependent on a story, rather than physical theming is a pretty smart move and plays to the demographic well.
  12. In theory you are correct. The theming outside of Tomb Raider: The Ride (and (almost Outer Limits: Flight of Fear) never approached Disney or Universal level. I think what every KI operator outside of Paramount has known is that the Disney model was not fitting for a regional seasonal amusement park. Sometimes Paramount even seemed to understand that. That's why they would spend so much money on a big thriller like Son of Beast vs something like Splash Mountain. Given the choice between thrills and immersive theming their customer largely leans toward immersive theming. I have a couple ideas why. 1. Our theming will never top Disney/Universal with their sky high budget. 2. Theming can be a lot like a movie. Even a great movie gets old to people after a few times. Thrill rides keep their appeal longer. Disney and Universal are less concerned about people tiring of their rides because most of their customers are not returning to the park often enough to get tired of the rides. 3. This one is entirely a theory. I think there may be more people who are into high thrill rides than highly themed rides. Disney and Universal are incredibly popular but they also draw people from all over the country and the world. There is only a market for so many players in the Disney/Universal segment parks. This is definitely in part because not even considering how much a trip to Disney/Universal can cost. For some it's like the idea of getting a Ferrari. Fun, but not even on the radar.
  13. I don't think it matters much. It was a bigger deal for Holiday World when Kentucky Kingdom re-opened vs just changing operators. Most of the people who go to Kentucky Kingdom or Holiday World do so because of proximity. Unless there is a clearly better park that is around the same distance the vast majority of people will go to the one that's closer.
  14. Someone needs to save the Kangaroo. It's the last Flying Coaster (model of flat ride) in the world. Kennywood is a fine park. Over the years they've been able to find a good balance between a classic amusement park of years gone by and modern one. I hope they do not go to far towards the modern and lose what makes them special.
  15. At least from an aesthetics standpoint, The Racer is and was far better. Look up the pictures from when it first opened. Before the Action FX Theater, Flight of Fear, and the loss of the original color scheme, The Racer combined with the grounds around it were unmatched. I think the thrill of the layout was balanced with looks. Old Coney was especially beautiful when it was brand new in 1972.
  16. Unfortunately though they had a lot of old, steel coasters. They all have to come down at some point. I agree with you though that it would be pretty excessive to see three go in three years (with one replacement). Since steel coasters have a limited life and wood coasters have an indefinite life, I'm curious about the lifespan of RMC hybrids. I think that might depend on how much the i-beam track costs to replace. @BeastForever Thank you for your factoid on The Beast and Racer supports. Few would ever guess that.
  17. I don't think expansion should be a focus right now. There are way too many things on developed land that need to be addressed first. If an "expansion " happens it will probably be just a better utilization of the land they've used. Ki has been in a tough position as of late with a lot of their rides getting up there in age and cost. Potential short term Chopping Block: Invertigo Bat Congo Falls Timberwolf Other areas for improvement include a 17 year-old dark ride, an ugly, empty tan box, empty action theater, empty Vortex plot, eyesore of coaster in Backlot, (Shades of Disaster Transport). All this is pretty understandable. There's only so much money to invest per year. They've just come up on a changing of the guard so to speak starting in 2018. For those wanting an expansion the next best thing is a full re-do of everything in Action Zone except Banshee, Drop Tower, and Delirium. How likely that is is hard to say.
  18. I understand what you're saying, but this would just make a lot of people angry. Remember when they tried to make Haunt not included with the Gold Pass? How about the time they wanted to take free parking off the Gold Pass? You can't give someone something for "free" and then start charging for it. If they want additional revenue to invest in the water park, it's best to just raise the season pass and ticket price. I think it's understood that for most people, the park is the draw and Soak City is a nice bonus.
  19. I think park goers both enthusiast and normal, more than anything want something: 1. Enjoyable- This is important because why else would you ride it? 2. Different- This is important because why would you need to go to ride coaster x if it's very similar to coaster y? Orion is a good coaster, probably better than Firehawk or Vortex. However, I don't think Orion is that different than Diamondback in terms of ride experience. I don't think it will be just enthusiasts that say that either. Sometimes casual park fans lump rides together more than enthusiasts. They don't care if B&M or Premier made a coaster, but I'm sure they can notice differences in how they feel just like we can. DB and Orion are the two most similar coasters in terms of ride experience I can think of at KI at a single time. Over it's history, KI has done a great job at making their coasters distinct from the existing ones. Even the three wooden coasters are remarkably different. Over the last few seasons, whether you like Orion or not, it's hard to argue that KI's coasters are more distinct than in 2018. One park that has done an even better job at keeping all their coasters different tmis Cedar Point. All 14 adult coasters are quite different from each other.
  20. Do you say that because of how the new Antique Cars cut into the Coney midway?
  21. I was surprised by how fun the Swing Around at Darien Lake (Corn Popper) was. It doesn't look like anything special just looking at it. @wabashcr, if you loved Skylab, I'd bet you'd love an Endeavor. It's essentially a Skylab with a great view and dangling feet. The open design limits the risk of nausea common on Skylab type rides. If you make a trip to KK sometime, It's definitely worth a try. I'd put the barrels where the ladder game is in Oktoberfest as I think someone suggested. The Trabant, (or the "face-off" like replacement the Wipe-out) would be a good nod to the old Wheel of Fortune if they could find a place in Coney Mall.
  22. I think three giant flat rides is enough for the time being. it would be nice to have more of the traditional sized flats such as an Endeavor, Air Race, Swing Around, spinning barrels, Trabant, etc.
  23. With an uncertain economy for Cedar Fair and KI just having gotten an expensive coaster it's likely the odds of getting one or more flat rides within the next several years is high. What would you guys like to see?
  24. Kings Island has seen an especially dynamic past three seasons for coasters. Which option is most true for you? This is a fun, hypothetical scenario.
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