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2011 what should KI get

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And notice that Walt Disney Parks & Resorts works almost exclusively with Vekoma when they need roller coasters... Space Mountain, Everest, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster... Take that for what it's worth to you.

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And notice that Walt Disney Parks & Resorts works almost exclusively with Vekoma when they need roller coasters... Space Mountain, Everest, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster... Take that for what it's worth to you.

And honestly I am surprised they do. I am shocked that B&M and Disney don't pair up, given B&M's outstanding track record.

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Has anyone considered adding a wild mouse to the park? I've never been on one, but they seem fun. It would be a nice family addition to the park. Or, if you've ever been to Disney World, there's Primeval Whirl which is a spinning wild mouse...I haven't ridden it, but it looks fun!

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Primeval Whirl is VERY fun. Very nice laterals on that ride. You just better ride with 3 or more people or else you get tossed around a ton.

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... I Can't believe an awesome Arrow mega looper at SFGA got torn down for a flying coaster! They already had Batman, why did they need a flying coaster? I say a good B&M invert is the "True" flying coaster!...

The awesome Arrow mega looper at SFGA is being removed for Chang. The flying coaster went into what was parking lot.

And Chang was surrounded (?) by good and one great coasters. Thunder Run was one of the best wooden coasters in the country. Twisted Sisters, when new, was incredible...so much so that I visited that park 33 times that year and rode them nearly exclusively each time...

And you don't like Firehawk because it feels like you may fall out? How odd...that's one of many reasons I love it.

SFGA = Six Flags Great America, not Six Flags Great Adventure

I was referring to "shockwave", which was torn down in 2002 to make room for Superman: Ultimate Flight, though yes Great Adventure has one too....

Internally at Six Flags, SFGA is always, always, always Six Flags Great Adventure. To enthusiasts, it's SFGAd, SFGAm and SFOG. SFGA has often been confused for Six Flags Great America or even Six Flags Over Georgia (Six Flags, GA=Georgia).

You may be the only person I have ever heard refer to Shockwave as an "an awesome Arrow mega looper." More like awful, I'd say. I got hurt on that thing, not once but twice. Always in the front car, always on the stupid hole in the front nose cone on the front car. That coaster was rough, and was leaving the park regardless. It had reached the end of its service life. At first it was announced that Whizzer was leaving, but after enough hoopla by the public, the park 'relented' to what was almost certainly its original planning, removing Shockwave.

And, as others have pointed out, it was Vekoma that originated the concept of the Flying Coaster. B and M did what it often does, and perfected the concept...with Tatsu and then Montu. As for me, at least, I much prefer the original three Vekoma Flying Dutchmen to the Superman B&M flyers...By the way, those Supermen B&M flyers have often been down for maintenance as well...the one at Six Flags Great Adventure is down even as I write this, as it has been for some time.

EDIT: Twenty minutes after this was written, Superman: Ultimate Flight at SFGAd re-opened.

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I think I'm starting to change my mind on Arrow Mega Loopers. I think I've been kinda in denial about them. They were great in their time, and I have sentimental value in Vortex because it was my first major coaster. But I'm realizing after riding The Vortex today, they are just old, outdated, and too rough for being made of steel. And the trains are just the most gawd awful pieces of crap ever. You can't fit correctly in any seat. In the back of the car your knees are touching your head. In the front your legs are at a 45 degree angle. In the very front of the train your knees will constantly bump the little lip and cause pain while you ride. The seats have virtually no cushion and the OTSR's are too close to your head. combine that with poor transitions and you got yourself some headbanging. Its just the 22 million dollar steel coaster across from it provides just as many thrills and is more fun to ride because it doesn't beat the crap out of you while you ride it. I hate to admit it but when I was at Cedar Point and I rode the corkscrew, I actually enjoyed it more. The Trains for some reason seemed nicer and more comfy, and the ride, while less intense, didn't beat the crap at you. Maybe Arrow loopers were never meant to be "mega loopers". Maybe Vortex, GASM, Shockwave, and Viper were just all apart of ****ing contest between the parks in the 80's.

Its just recently I've noticed, 5 times USED to be standard on Vortex, now Diamondback gets that kinda love from me, and Vortex gets one ride from me. As for Six Flags Great Adventure I kinda understand a bit about getting rid of GASM. I mean they have Bizzaro, basically a more modern B&M looper with floorless trains. But I don't understand why they are removing it for a B&M fail coaster. Chang I think I liked it honestly because of where it was, because other than Chang all of SFKK's coaster's sucked. But great adventure has some of the greatest coasters in the world. I honestly think in that environment it'll be kinda regarded about as highly as Mantis at Cedar Point :P

Anyway I really can't bash a B&M flayer till I ride one, who knows when that'l be, but I stand by my comments on Firehawk. It's a piece of crap, and it takes too long to load. Why do they load it that way? Can somebody tell me? IT drives me nuts. I honestly think they should kill the dual loading system, and just load it like any other coaster. Load one train, send it off, off load the next train, re-load send it off, when the first rain comes back, off load it...etc. I hoenstly think the dual loading system that is supposedly "revolutionary" is actually the coaster's downfall. Like I said after 3 years of being at the park and being "1UP'd" by a B&M hypercoaster, theres NO REASON IT SHOULD TAKE A FRIGGEN HOUR TO GET ON ON A DEAD DAY! But its like that, and the ride isn't even that good at the end. And its not popularity, its a crappy inefficient loading system!

BTW I am aware Vekoma made the first flyer. I was more refferring to the B&M invert vs. the Crappy Vekoma "hang and bang" SLC

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If they only used one side of the station (and Six Flags did that a lot...) your wait would be even longer, and there would be, at minimum, three fewer people working in the park. Be careful what you wish for, by the way. Originally, that coaster had three trains (not two). The trains have many, many sensors and are extremely expensive. As they began to need parts, Six Flags retired one of the three trains and scavenged it for parts. (See the last paragraph on this page, where this is also told: http://rcdb.com/3793.htm )

The day will probably come that Kings Island will retire one of the two remaining trains to use it for parts....

Given the long time it takes to load a train, the blocking system and typical guest conduct during loading, you will then find the line, and your wait time, to be even longer than it is now.

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Weird, cause I have yet to bang my head on Vortex and enjoy the ride a lot. I suppose the roughness adds to the ride for me and I just ignore it. Diamondback is a blast to ride but I more enjoy the loops and such as opposed to my stomach feeling funny.

Next year we plan to hit up more parks, so I will be able to experience more rides and such. I'm fairly new at coasters so the variety my better help me understand peoples likes/dislikes better. At the moment, I love them all, lol.

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Great post Billy. People tend to get hung up on ride manufactures and the like. Who cares who makes something, if you like it you like it.

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Guest Millennium

You can't make assumptions about a ride you haven't rode. Cormaster, it doesn't make sense for you to say you understand GASM's removal when you haven't ridden it. Believe it or not I liked it more than several of the parks coasters. Arrow was a great company and a lot of their rides are still fun. When compared to modern companies like B&M or Intamin, it might look outdated and rough, but I wouldn't have my #1 Steel without Arrow :wub:

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Don't get me wrong I love Arrow. I think they are one of the best companies of all time, and they have an impressive resume. I'm just saying that I kind of understand the removal of the old Mega loopers for more modern coasters. I never have rode GASM and I never will, but I did ride Shockwave in '93, which is very close to the same thing. I loved it in '93, though if it was still standing I'd doubt I would enjoy it as much. BTW I don't have a headbanging issue on Vortex either mainly because I've rode the ride a million times, and I know how to tilt my head so that the transitions don't cause me to bang my head against the harness. Its second nature to me.

I'm usually one of the biggest defenders of Arrow mega loopers, but sadly I'm starting to see why parks are tearing them down. They are just old, rough, and have terrible trains, but I still don't see Vortex going anywhere anytime soon. Its still one of the most popular rides in the park, and obviously KI doesn't need the space. Just wish I could find a comfortable seat on it.

Anyway back to the topic at hand, I really love Diamondback and I do wanna see more modern day coasters at KI. It doesn't have to be the biggest or the baddest, just something cool. I wouldn't mind seeing Intamin coming to the park, they really do make some of the more unique coasters. I mean maybe a maverick type coaster that speeds through the woods, that would be really cool.

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And notice that Walt Disney Parks & Resorts works almost exclusively with Vekoma when they need roller coasters... Space Mountain, Everest, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster... Take that for what it's worth to you.

I may be, and probably am wrong, correct me if I am, but wasn't Space Mountain built by Arrow? Sorry I'm so off topic, lol.

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So I've been thinking about this topic more, and the more i think about it, a B&M dive machine makes sense. Why not? Yeah its a 200+ feet coaster, and Diamondback is too...so what? Busch Gardens in Virgina has Apollo's Chariot and Griffin... How would it be any different for us to have a B&M hyper and a Dive? Also Griffen And Sheikra are the only 2 dives in the United States and anyone in the Midwest can't get close to one without traveling so why not have Kings Island be the first park in the midwest to have such a coaster? Also with it being 200+ feet it would be a great SOB replacement!

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... I Can't believe an awesome Arrow mega looper at SFGA got torn down for a flying coaster! They already had Batman, why did they need a flying coaster? I say a good B&M invert is the "True" flying coaster!...

The awesome Arrow mega looper at SFGA is being removed for Chang. The flying coaster went into what was parking lot.

And Chang was surrounded (?) by good and one great coasters. Thunder Run was one of the best wooden coasters in the country. Twisted Sisters, when new, was incredible...so much so that I visited that park 33 times that year and rode them nearly exclusively each time...

And you don't like Firehawk because it feels like you may fall out? How odd...that's one of many reasons I love it.

SFGA = Six Flags Great America, not Six Flags Great Adventure

I was referring to "shockwave", which was torn down in 2002 to make room for Superman: Ultimate Flight, though yes Great Adventure has one too....

Internally at Six Flags, SFGA is always, always, always Six Flags Great Adventure. To enthusiasts, it's SFGAd, SFGAm and SFOG. SFGA has often been confused for Six Flags Great America or even Six Flags Over Georgia (Six Flags, GA=Georgia).

You may be the only person I have ever heard refer to Shockwave as an "an awesome Arrow mega looper." More like awful, I'd say. I got hurt on that thing, not once but twice. Always in the front car, always on the stupid hole in the front nose cone on the front car. That coaster was rough, and was leaving the park regardless. It had reached the end of its service life. At first it was announced that Whizzer was leaving, but after enough hoopla by the public, the park 'relented' to what was almost certainly its original planning, removing Shockwave.

And, as others have pointed out, it was Vekoma that originated the concept of the Flying Coaster. B and M did what it often does, and perfected the concept...with Tatsu and then Montu. As for me, at least, I much prefer the original three Vekoma Flying Dutchmen to the Superman B&M flyers...By the way, those Supermen B&M flyers have often been down for maintenance as well...the one at Six Flags Great Adventure is down even as I write this, as it has been for some time.

EDIT: Twenty minutes after this was written, Superman: Ultimate Flight at SFGAd re-opened.

I agree with what you said about B&M/Vekoma flyers. The B&M flyers (the two I've ridden) generally have a boring layout, and when your at the brake run it's torture having to face down in that position! Vekoma flyers (well the two I've ridden)have much more exciting fast paced layouts with great forces and are much more comfortable! And by the way, since when is Montu a B&M flyer..? :lol:

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Arrow

http://www.rcdb.com/2491.htm

Disney's partnership with Arrow obviously re-defined the industry - together they developed the first roller coaster to use tubular steel track. But Arrow has had little to do with the company as of late consider that they, you know, exist in a much different form than they did in the 1950's.

In fact, the Space Mountain in Walt Disney World is the only Arrow one left. It's also the slowest and shortest. When Disney redid Disneyland's, and built Paris' and Hong Kong's, they used Vekoma. Vekoma has also made for them one Big Thunder Mountain, two Rockin' Roller Coasters, Expedition: Everest, Barnstormer & Gadget's Go Coaster, and Casey Jr. Circus Train in Paris. That's 10 Vekomas! In relation, the Disney parks have three coasters made by Intamin and 1 Maurer Söhne (in Paris).

Why they don't use B&M, I do not know. I imagine it's because, like Paramount & Universal's recent infatuation with Premier, Vekoma has a certain ability to keep a roller coaster contained in a small, discreet area; to keep a roller coaster quiet; to propel it via LSM and LIM for something "new." I can't imagine a B&M doing what Revenge of the Mummy does, or what Flight of Fear does, or even what Expedition Everest does. B&M has, as we've discussed, aimed to make designs that are bigger, faster, and taller than other manufacturer's counterparts. They take a simple innovation and make it complex and marketable. What they do not advertise their rides as is compact, easy-theme-able family rides...

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probably disney stays away from B&M because when you think about it, all their coasters are thrill rides. Thrill ride + Disney doesn't mix, which is why I have no interest in the gigantic over-rated park. I went in 1999 to Disney world with my family...boooorrriiing! Universal was more entertaining. And the best park in Florida IMO is probably the one in Tamapa with an African theme.

Personally I think Disney is for small, small, children. I was 18 years old when I went, way to old to really enjoy it. I was actually kind of irritated because we went on spring break, and my friends were at home partying it up while I was stuck in Florida with my family the whole time.

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And I was in my mid-forties before I got there....determined not to like it....and now am one of the biggest Disney fans in North America.

California....please! :)

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I understand why people like it. Its the live entertainment, the food, the overall disney experience. But a Thrill park it is not, and that's what I am into. I don't go to theme park or amusment park's for "shows". I go for thrills, and thus I could not get into Disney world.

And god is it overpriced!

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I've had more than one thrilling experience at Disney. My favorite flat ride in all the world is at California Adventure, and a near copy is at Walt Disney World's Studio Park (or whatever they call it, it's MGM to me, tee hee).

I adore the steel coaster at California Adventure. I love the rocket flying ships there, too...

Then there's Mission Space, as it first ran...a ride for wimps? Not.

A flume that goes down a hill backwards at Epcot...

A turnpike ride that goes over 60!

Expedition Everest...Rock N Roller Coaster...

Space Mountain, more thrilling than many bigger, faster rides.

Splash Mountain at both US parks, very different but fun experiences.

No thrills?

I see your point.

Not.

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Disney is near and dear to my heart. I understand your point Cormaster... But I'm just like you. I would rather go to CP than anywhere else(minus WDW). But there are lots of thrills at Disney World. It's the whole experience that makes it magical. :)

Speaking of which. I will be at Disney a week from today :)

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The older I get the better Disney looks. I used to think I would take a day at Universal over Disney any day. I am starting like the thought of Disney a little more but still plan to go to HHN.

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To each his own. I'm sure I'll be going back at some point in the future, since we plan on having kids within the next year. Maybe I'll get a better impression of it. But I am a thrill seeker, and shows don't do it for me, and if they do have some awesome rides, we didn't hit them up much. I remember riding space mountain and I remember it sucked. Is there really a better indoor coaster than Flight of Fear?

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Well, it's a little late in the season to expect a new ride or anything that we can brag about. I think the best we can hope for is something like a parade, similar to CP's.

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Well, like others have said, a coaster is probably out of the question, however a flat ride could still be a possibility

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