KILateNighter Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 I was wanting to create a topic to discuss some of the things Paramount did better in the park and some of the things Cedar Fair does better now. Here's mine Cedar Fair: Cleanliness Attendance Paramount: Theming Rides Botanicals/Gardens/Ecology Haunt (then Fear Fest) Please act mature and don't insult anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLiveTheSmurfRide Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 As far as rides, I think Diamondback blows away anything that Paramount had built during their time with the park. And while Paramount was big on making rides with well designed themes; they also let those themes deteriorate and die like a year or two after the ride had been in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delirium13 Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Cedar Fair: -Cleanliness -Thrills -Shows, which seems ironic since Paramount is a movie studio... (Except for maybe the shows at Winterfest 2005 which I heard were very top notch.) -Landscaping -Replacing blacktop with pavers Paramount: -Atmosphere - whether it be area specific music or their attention to little things, I think maintaining the park's atmosphere is where Paramount holds the biggest advantage thus far over Cedar Fair. Under Cedar Fair we have seen the clock on the Festhaus break and go unrepaired, the fountains in the Tower Gardens (which is now a smoking area) stay dry, and the floral clock go a season unoperational (although this was due to a very cool light show in the area, it still didn't look good during the day). I know some will disagree as Paramount did do a lot of things which also hurt the atmosphere such as commercializing the park installing Italian Job in an area of the park which used to be very beautifully landscaped and putting other rides in areas that didn't match their theme :cough:Tomb Raider in Rivertown:cough:. -Initial theming of rides - we all know that for the most part, the theming didn't last long but it was still nice. -Nights of Fire As I've said the atmosphere (mostly attention to the little things) has been a big problem of mine with Cedar Fair, that I hope they improve upon this year. I think both Cedar Fair and Paramount have done their fair share of good and bad things for the park, neither is perfect. I was not a huge fan of Cedar Fair initially but I believe they are improving each year. That's all I've got right now, all I really know at this point is that I want April 30th to be here soon! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Cedar Fair: Early ride times on their best coasters!!!..... oh wait.....never mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_humor Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Having rides that are both record-approaching thrills and theming is a tough bag. With Cedar Fair and Six Flags parks, you get amazing rides, but relatively little/no theming...although SF probably gets the nod here even though it is relatively low-key. With Disneyland, you get insane theming on relatively mediocre rides. Dollywood and the Busch parks combine both in a way that is unmatched, IMO. That said, those parks are small in comparison, with smaller coaster counts. I would recommend taking a mental picture of the parks today, and again when we are 5 years or so removed from Kinzel being in charge. Things will hopefully get shaken up a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 By far, the best addition Paramount made was Flight of Fear. However that came at the cost of horrific commercialization of the park. Shaggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoor Man Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Paramount did a much better job in the last 3 years of their ownership than they did years 3-10. In the first few I think they did pretty well in making it a "Paramount Studios" park. after a while new attractions were given top billing while other areas were flat our neglected. I could be wrong, but in the last year or two they started to get much better and seemed to let the local management experiment with ideas (ie- WinterFest). For what its worth, and I've said this before- Kings Islands days of being the "favored" child and recipient of record-breaking / innovative rides as the company's flagship park are over. I think if CF had owned the park all along, The Beast doesn't happen, Vortex doesn't happen, The Bat doesn't happen, King Cobra, Son of Beast, Flight of Fear, etc... While I have no specific rub against CF's Management, Cedar Point is the flagship park, and Kings Island is now just in the pool with everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjkjkj Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Cedar Fair: Cleanliness Employee Friendliness New Rides Shows Bringing new life into forgotten parts of the parks Non Thrill Ride Entertainment (Such as Starlight Spectacular) Paramount: I have mixed feelings about Paramount. They did a great job initially theming rides, but then just after a few short years they would let the theming deteriorate. (Tomb Raider, Top Gun, they turned off fog in the line for FoF, etc.) They also destroyed the atmosphere of the park. They got rid of the Antique Cars and the trees and flowers and small ponds that went along with them, ruining the atmosphere of that part of the park. They put a space, UFO themed ride right in the middle of what was supposed to be a "classic amusement park themed section", they put a themed shrimp shack in Oktoberfest, they took out the flying eagles, they turned Action Zone into a concrete poorly themed area, when it used to be a lush jungle theme. So overall, now that I look back, Paramount did not do a very good job with the parks at all. I would take Cedar Fair over Paramount any day. As Elmer Fudd stated, we are in the pool with all the other parks now, but that doesn't mean we won't get good rides. Cedar Fair gave us Diamondback, and has yet to remove any rides. Where as paramount took out well loved rides, and didn't put very many good ones in to replace them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdawg1998 Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 All I have to say is Cedar Fair brought the thrills, Paramount brought the family fun. Cedar Fair claims Kings Island is "family fun" but if you think about it, there could be a LOT more rides for families. I can tell that the park is leaning towards thrill now. When was the latest family ride built? Backlot Stunt Coaster, 2005 - Paramount. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjkjkj Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 Cedar Fair just redid the entire children's area, and you could almost consider Boo Blaster's a new ride since new effects were installed and a lot of the theming was redone. Not to mention, Cedar Fair has really amped up the live entertainment at Kings Island, which is something a family can do together Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rotag Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 All I have to say is Cedar Fair brought the thrills, Paramount brought the family fun. Cedar Fair claims Kings Island is "family fun" but if you think about it, there could be a LOT more rides for families. I can tell that the park is leaning towards thrill now. When was the latest family ride built? Backlot Stunt Coaster, 2005 - Paramount. doesnt the revamp of the kiddy area & the starlight spectacular count??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingsIslandReviews Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 here here how i see it Cedar Fair clean thrill rides (if CF did not come along Diamondback would not be here) Paramounts themeing Rides WinterFest Octoberfest The Beast As you can see i am more of a Paramounts fan more then anything from the tv studio that made it (IDR what it's called) to Cedar Fair I've been with paramounts my whole life at kings usland so sad they they singed it over to CF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillsberry123 Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 In my opinion, you can keep the excess theme, the movie attractions, and the Nickelodeon Characters. Ever since Cedar Fair took over, the park's much better about maintaining itself on a day to day basis. The park is a lot cleaner and the staff is more efficient. Cedar Fair isn't afraid to invest and improve, either. We've had 2 (soon to be 3) areas of the park improved and brought back to new, and Kings Island has gotten several new rides that wouldn't have happened if Paramount was still in charge. I'd rather have a good amusement park than a mediocre theme park. That's just me. Edit: Yes, you could argue that they've built nothing but thrill rides, but is adding anymore kiddie rides really that important? We've got one of the best kid's areas in the word with three roller coasters and several world class flat rides for kids, water rides outside of the kid's area that the whole family can enjoy, Adventure Express, Back Lot Stunt Coaster, and plenty of traditional flat rides that everyone in the family can enjoy. Not to mention The Racer and other mid sized rides found all over the park that satisfies everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIanatic1975 Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 I seem to enjoy the park under Cedar Fair's control a lot better. I don't know if it's because they themed an area to my favorite childhood show, or if it's because the park is cleaner. But I feel that Cedar Fair is more family friendly. And it sort of reminds me of Kings Island in the 80's. So for me I'd say Cedar Fair has done a better job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TombraiderTy Posted February 28, 2011 Share Posted February 28, 2011 here here how i see it Paramounts ... The Beast All Paramount did to The Beast was toss some lame sound effects and lighting onto the lift and into the station... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE_BEASTmaster Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 here here how i see it Cedar Fair clean thrill rides (if CF did not come along Diamondback would not be here) Paramounts themeing Rides WinterFest Octoberfest The Beast As you can see i am more of a Paramounts fan more then anything from the tv studio that made it (IDR what it's called) to Cedar Fair I've been with paramounts my whole life at kings usland so sad they they singed it over to CF What has Paramount done with Octoberfest? They pretty much killed the German theme even more with a Bayou themed shrimp restaurant. Don't forget Cedar Fair also gave us Firehawk after they purchased the park (yes I know it used to be called X-Flight from Geauga Lake). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIanatic1975 Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 They repaved it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browntggrr Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Some other threads with similar discussion: http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22719&st=0&p=403184 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=20222&st=0&p=346124 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18737&st=0&p=315960 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18762&st=0&p=316460 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18159&st=0&p=305540 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18287&st=0&p=308019 http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14932&st=0&p=243674 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillsberry123 Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 here here how i see it Paramounts ... The Beast All Paramount did to The Beast was toss some lame sound effects and lighting onto the lift and into the station... Not to mention removed the original skid brakes and replaced them with much more noticeable magnetic brakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browntggrr Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Not to mention removed the original skid brakes and replaced them with much more noticeable magnetic brakes. In the spirit of safety, this was a move that was necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillsberry123 Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Not to mention removed the original skid brakes and replaced them with much more noticeable magnetic brakes. In the spirit of safety, this was a move that was necessary. Not necessarily. Big Dipper kept skid brakes up until it closed. It was more for the spirit of maintenance than safety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browntggrr Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Not to mention removed the original skid brakes and replaced them with much more noticeable magnetic brakes. In the spirit of safety, this was a move that was necessary. Not necessarily. Big Dipper kept skid brakes up until it closed. It was more for the spirit of maintenance than safety. It was absolutely necessary. The current magentic brakes were a direct result of an accident on Beast. Although not a fan favorite, the magnets are able to still be effective in wet conditions. Also, comparing two entirely different coasters is apples and oranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIanatic1975 Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 Not to mention removed the original skid brakes and replaced them with much more noticeable magnetic brakes. In the spirit of safety, this was a move that was necessary. Not necessarily. Big Dipper kept skid brakes up until it closed. It was more for the spirit of maintenance than safety. It was absolutely necessary. The current magentic brakes were a direct result of an accident on Beast. Although not a fan favorite, the magnets are able to still be effective in wet conditions. Also, comparing two entirely different coasters is apples and oranges. I do remember at one time hearing about one the trains coming into the station and bumping into another. But I don't think that had anything to do with what we're talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TombRaiderFTW Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 ^ "But I don't think that had anything to do with what we're talking about." Every source I've ever read says exactly the opposite: the magnetic brakes replaced the old skids after the (2001?) incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIfan1980 Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 As Terpy likes to point out, because B happened after A doesn't mean A caused B. I can't speak to this case. Also don't confuse trims designed to reduce the speed of a coaster with brakes designed to stop a coaster. Someone probably has a lot more data on what was where on Beast before and after the accident, but I would guess the change to magnetic trims was maintenance based. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upstop Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 I liked how Paramount included the general public in some of it's decision making. It made me feel like I had some part in the entertainment somehow. Because the theme park division was being pushed from one one business division to another they never were able to create the park to it's full potential. What I never understood was after the American parks were sold, they pursued to build a new park outside of the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted March 2, 2011 Share Posted March 2, 2011 That's explainable....Paramount has NOT pursued building a park internationally, but to license their intellectual properties in exchange for money....see also Blackpool, where Nick is going in...(and of course Mall of America in the USA, for that matter). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkMake Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 I can't say much, not having been to the PKI (not KI) version since '03/'04, but from what I can tell; Cedar Fair: -Cleaner -Nicer -Upkeep Paramount -(Initial) Theming -Rides -Ideas I can boil this down to one thing each; Cedar Fair is better at managing the park, but Paramount had better style. Yes both of those are flawed, what with a Tower gardens smoking area and a Tomb Raider in Rivertown, but I still hold to my statements. Paramount has had some great ideas for rides and in some ways actually realized them, but they were put in the wrong place and weren't kept up. If they had thought through these things and put their budget more towards upkeep, then they would have had a great park. I personally wouldn't have minded having corporate theming if correctly applied. Cedar Fair has had better management. They are redoing at least 3 different areas at the park and are trying to bring KI to the olden time with more charm and more entertainment, but they just can't run a theme park. Diamondback is just as wrongfully placed as Bubba Gumps Shrimp Shack was, w/o all the corporate theming. Let's say that Paramount added Diamondback just as it is, maybe with a different name. Would we as easily have taken to it? They drained the beautiful Swan Lake, removed other buildings that could have been reused, and but a metal monster in the scenic Rivertown. I feel that Tomb Raider fit more than Diamondback did. (If I have begun ranting against Cedar Fair, I apologize in advance. I have a personal grudge against the Fair) They replaced a more easily recognized kid's theme with one that you only ever hear about. I would rather they made it all their own or used something like Scooby Doo, granted it's at about the same state and I just personally hate the Peanuts decision. Action Zone is deteriorating fhaster than any other area I can think of and they repainted Top Gun but didn't give it a better color. They renamed rides unnecessarily and in some places gave them bad rethemes, such as not changing Tomb Rider to something like the Shaft. To me Paramount Parks would have done better to split off from Paramount and merged with Cedar Fair. You would have had the style and the management, then they just would have had to learn about placement and they would have been golden. To my knowledge the only parks they would need to keep should be Knotts, Cedar Point, Kings Island, Carowinds, CW, and maybe KD, though I really don't care for it, thinking it to be a wannabe KI. Then they'd have a wide audience, more focused attention, and possibly more money they sold the excess off. They would have...eh...could someone help? I'm having trouble finishing this off. And if there are any flaws let me please know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 a. Paramount Parks did split off from Paramount (into CBS) then merged with Cedar Fair. Honest. b. I can completely assure you the ride renaming was absolutely, totally necessary. c. Many of Cedar Fair's problems today would not exist had not the operations guy--not a finance guy--had a bug up his nose to buy Kings Island, regardless of price, and paid dearly for the entire chain, as Paramount Parks would not sell KI separately (Mr. Kinzel even TALKED of his intense desire for Kings Island DURING the bidding process...a move as dunderheaded as discussing the acquisition of a publicly traded limited partnership in the corner of a very busy TGIFridays...not that that would ever happen). d. Welcome aboard, it's gonna be a fun ride! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkMake Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 a. Didn't know. b. I meant things like Drop Zone, which make sense all by themselves, not like Top Gun. c. I didn't know to the first, already heard about to the second. d. And thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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