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Decoding 2020

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1 hour ago, bjcolglazier said:

I wholeheartedly agree with this statement, but wonder if others agree? I'm shocked---no, dumbfounded---there have not been many more TTD/Kingda Ka rides built.

I do not agree, and I am confident that executives at Six Flags and Cedar Fair would also disagree that they are the biggest draws at the parks in which they are located.  When they were built, sure, but today?  No, both parks have moved on.

Richard Kinzel the CEO of Cedar Fair when TTD was built has publicly called the ride his biggest mistake.  I have seen quotes from executives who have stated that due to the extreme maintenance costs it is the most expensive ride ever operated at a park in the chain.  More then twice as expensive as other coasters per a passenger.

At its core the problem with the rides is the hydraulic engine, the catch car, and the steel cable.  There is just too much which can and does go wrong.  This is why no one builds these rides any longer.

But it’s not to say there will not be newer and better designs.  LSM launches have a hard time accelerating trains to the speeds of TTD and KK but it might be possible.  Red Force built in 2017 is capable of getting close at 111.9 MPH which gets it over a 367.3 foot top hat.  But I have heard the launch track is longer then TTD.  

Will there be another 400+ foot coaster built?  I think so, but we need more research and technology first.

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32 minutes ago, Shaggy said:

You know, the more I think about it, the more I wonder if “Project X” is actually the name & theme.  Seriously- everyone could be overlooking the obvious.  

Perhaps its themed after the obscure, 1987 Matthew Broderick and Helen Hunt film of the same name.

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I posted this on another forum where the discussion isn't nearly as in depth, but I still want to give my postmortem on the 286' fiasco. I think this decision is subject to any and all criticisms, and I can appreciate that the world is getting a new giga and lament the motivations and shortcomings of the project all at once:

After having followed the industry for 20 years, being familiar with Kings Island's history of pushing the envelope, the rumors that have swirled for decades, and their express interest in a giga...this is unequivocally a slap in the face. I'm really curious whether this bid was revised to hit a certain budget, or if Cedar Fair just didn't care to spend serious giga money/outshine Millennium in any way given its proximity. It doesn't make sense, the precedent was set for something great, and for Carowinds to be given the 'crown jewel' B&M giga whilst Kings Island gets a coaster that doesn't even technically qualify as a giga by lift height...it's a racket, fully and truly.


That being said, this coaster looks to have the most extreme banking and tightest pacing of any giga excepting I305. It could end up being the best of the B&M bunch, and the location is definitely the best of the three. And as some have speculated, it does appear there's potential for a near inversion element, perhaps during the turnaround at the far end of the course. 

What really irks me is that not *that much* more expenditure could have resulted in a record breaker that would be on the national and international spotlight and actually pull in new guests to Kings Island, many of whom I'm sure would be interested in hitting up Cedar Point for the first time while in the area. It seems shortsighted to be so stingy with an investment of this magnitude, it's not going to happen again. I'd have much preferred the park to take 2020 as an off year and come back in 2021 with a 308' giga featuring a 323' 86° drop...it could have been advertised as the world's longest and steepest drop on a giga (Red Force is a launched anomaly) and even have the same number of elements for what...$2-3M more, maybe? Maybe steepest drop on a giga will still be the angle here...lol, but for real, the side profile does make it look like the drop will be B&M's steepest.

 

3f9lAxd.jpg

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52 minutes ago, Kenban said:

LSM launches have a hard time accelerating trains to the speeds of TTD and KK but it might be possible.  Red Force built in 2017 is capable of getting close at 111.9 MPH which gets it over a 367.3 foot top hat.  But I have heard the launch track is longer then TTD. 

You are right on with this assessment.  Monty Jasper did an interview in 2005 where he talked about how they considered using linear motors for the launch, but that it would have required moving 2 additional rides.  I've always assumed the rides would have been Witch's Wheel and Gemini. 

You can still read the article here: https://www.hydraulicspneumatics.com/200/TechZone/Accumulators/Article/False/9810/TechZone-Accumulators

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7 hours ago, DiamondBanshee said:

Imo there’s no way this coaster won’t be better than Millennium Force and Leviathan. I understand the love behind MF is like that behind The Beast, so I get people still liking that more, but with the mix of elements on this ride compared to those two, I think this will be miles better. I305 and Fury on the other hand... I guess we’ll have to wait and see, but if this coaster has to be absolutely flying and really surprise me to have a chance being better than those imo. Just my take on the matter.

I’ll just sit here waiting to get stoned to death by the Mille/Levi lovers and the KI giga haters.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah I think this coaster will develop a cult-like following similar to that of I305 due to its intensity and brevity.

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On 5/22/2019 at 1:19 PM, LovinMeSomeBanshee said:

Just be happy that we’re getting a giga, ladies and gentlemen.  I’m happy for any new ride, especially one that only 4 other parks in North America have.

After catching up from page 121, some people are disappointed about the height. Let me just point out one thing here. Kennywood has a coaster known as Steel Phantom/Phantom's revenge. They're coaster has a shorter drop on the main lift hill while the biggest drop is the second hill that goes into the ravine. Maybe Kings Island took note of that but put it on the first hill. I don't think this will be 285 like some of you guys are calculating. I'm thinking it will be 305 feet with a 310 drop like that Polaris video suggests. That's just my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

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^I mean the blueprints filed with the city say 286’ so either there’s a clerical error, which is unlikely at this stage imo, or it’s 286’. I suppose these plans could be fake or intentionally off, but as many have pointed out, this would seem to be way over the top to mess with a small group of enthusiasts and would almost definitely not be worth everything they’d have to go through to do so.


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4 hours ago, bjcolglazier said:

But why? Money? That's the only reason I can think---anything that big certainly sets itself apart. But yeah, somebody has to pay for it at considerable risk.

They are supremely expensive to operate and break down much more than any other coaster. Not to mention they come with a higher initial price tag as well, especially in now with the rising steel prices. Dick Kinzel said that building TTD was his biggest regret.

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4 hours ago, collin.klopfstein said:

Could Don  Helbig be hinting or teasing for the giga? Described as unexplainable could be referencing to the land cleared or something with the theme of the ride like Area 51?

ECDB86CC-E7FB-4157-95EE-50F62CF85A2E.png

I saw this tweet earlier and didn't think anything of it at all. I'm curious, what is making people think this is a teaser for the new ride? Just the fact that it seems kind of random?

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3 hours ago, Logan said:

If I'm reading things correctly there is only 1 drop over 200 feet.

This is correct. The main drop is the only drop over 200', at 301'. The reverse treble clef is next highest drop at 194'. 

Now, depending on where KI measures their zero height from, the first turn hill and reverse treble clef may be over 200' tall, but they're not dropping more than 200'. 

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20 hours ago, Codyfryguy said:

Was scrolling through Facebook and saw this on Kings Island season pass holders page...

https://www.facebook.com/groups/KISeasonPassholders/permalink/867786506887801/0fc15012d60c6d849b36cf7a8a7e4cd8.jpgddab15e3d454c570ec6488f243c23124.jpg

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

So I live very close to here posted about this in my instagram and had a response by one of my close friends who said that she saw it headed twords Wright Patterson air force base. So it is somewhere down there most likely. No clue what is doing near there but I'll let yall know if I see anything. 

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7 hours ago, BoddaH1994 said:

53B43A06-7172-4E36-AABE-240DE49BD963.png

To all you naysayers out there: worst case scenario we get a new prop building...?

I do find it interesting that both the regular and Fast Lane queues are hard-routed to go through said "New Prop Building"; all riders must enter the assumed Quonset hut even at the queue's shortest length.

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8 minutes ago, RingMaster said:

I do find it interesting that both the regular and Fast Lane queues are hard-routed to go through said "New Prop Building"; all riders must enter the assumed Quonset hut even at the queue's shortest length.

36548A55-9788-48A0-B984-C0FFEE8A5F30.jpeg

Guys, I think we are on to something. This is a Quonset Hut. It also happens to be integral to the ride experience as riders must go through here regardless. I do feel like it’s a show building. Instead of What’s in the shed, it’s “What’s in the HUT?!” This will be epic. 

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^^ His girlfriend in that picture probably wants to smack the crap out him for looking at another girl. I know that's off-topic, but that meme makes it look obvious.  Anyhow back on topic here. I don't understand blueprints that well, so could someone point out where you guys are getting 286' from?

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13 hours ago, DustinTheNow said:

Quick question?! What color should the supports, track and bottom accent be? Also what color should the train, and seats be? I need your help! I want this to be a prediction this community can be proud of!

Can you make it with Green Intamin track?

I think I'm showing my age here.

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11 minutes ago, Shawn Meyer said:

^^ His girlfriend in that picture probably wants to smack the crap out him for looking at another girl. I know that's off-topic, but that meme makes it look obvious.  Anyhow back on topic here. I don't understand blueprints that well, so could someone point out where you guys are getting 286' from?

The 286' comes from the crest height (per the latest blueprints) and subtracting the footing height from the ground directly below the crest (from the first set of blueprints). If you measure from the ground at the station instead of directly below the crest, you get more like 296'. 

This is all subjective though. It's up to KI to determine where they measure the drop height from (heck, if you measure from the Little Miami River, you get something like 436'!). I'm betting they'll  play some smoke and mirrors on us and say it's 300' tall. It definitely has a 301' drop, but from station track up to crest track, you're only going up 276'. 

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