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King Bowser

New Concept Survey for 2006 & 2007

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Well from what I hear, the height requirement for IJST may be the same as Runaway Reptar, The Racer and Adventure Express, at 44". While not the same family friendly ride that Tiques or Eagles were, it is still more family friendly and more geared to non-thrill seekers than most of the Action Zone thrillers.

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I wasn't really refering to height requirments, and while kids may be able to ride it it still doesn't have that antique feel that most of RT has. Even TR:TR has a forest/jungle look that goes great with RT, this deos not. I just wish PKI would even consider some good ole' classic flats instead of just new type rides.

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Yes, it does not have a Rivertown feel. But the ride is not located in the heart of Rivertown, (The Beast, Tomb Raider, The Train and White Water Canyon). Yes, it is sad to see the classics leave the park. I think a classic flats package could do quite well, install one next to Island Treats, one on the previous Flight Commander site and one between Flight of Fear, Racer and Adventure Express. I don`t see the park adding classic flat rides in the near future though. Their recent flat additions have been major, multimillion installations.

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Yea I never really rode the classic flats rides but they are a must for any park. Some people just go to theme parks for a little family fun and if your child isn't tall enought to ride the bigger family rides like IJST or Adeventure Express you could always count on taking them on some of the small classic flat rides.

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I really want to see that spongebob squarepants boating school in PKI do you think they would take out taxi jam and house the spongebob coaster in that side of the building?or would they remove the Nick theater?

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Scooby Doo takes up pretty much the entire space that is used by that building. However, there is the old enchanted theater, which is now used for storage. I do not think that PKI will remove Taxi Jam anytime in the near future. That is one ride that I can see staying at PKI for years to come, because it is the first coaster most kids can ride, and the fact that the drop is only 8 feet doesn`t scare them too much.

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I don't know if others on here agree with this, I'll let them speak for themselves, but I don't enjoy going to PKI just because it's fun to ride the rides. I enjoy it because I've been going there most of my life, and all this time, while new rides have been added, they have kept the old rides that are more than just high tech scream machines with lots of theming, but now some of these rides are being removed. They are more than just "old rides", they are PKI's history, they are what we've been riding at PKI most of our lives. It's just really sad to sit here as I type this and think that I will never get to ride the Tiques or Flyers again, and that now when I walk to The Beast instead of seeing that white station for the Tiques, and father leting their kids have fun driving, I will be looking at a high tech AZ type of ride in RT. sad.gif

I totally agree with you. Unfortunately, the park must progress into the future and unfortunately that does sometimes result in ride removal.

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The tilt coaster looks like they trying to find a cheap way out of a lift system. This looks like it would cost less than a chain lift and have less maintenance.

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I don`t know how much lift systems cost or how much maintenance is required, but I would imagine their would be more maintenance witht the lifting mechanism and holding mechanism than with chain lifts. Not to mention that I would assume it costs more than traditional lifts.

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I don`t know how much lift systems cost or how much maintenance is required, but I would imagine their would be more maintenance witht the lifting mechanism and holding mechanism than with chain lifts. Not to mention that I would assume it costs more than traditional lifts.

The maintance I am sure would cost alot more but it would be cheaper than a normal lift cause less supports would be needed and plus it would take up alot less land.

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I can see PKI getting the tilt coaster, after all they are not afraid to try rides that differ from the norm. But I can't see it happening for several years. Yeah I know they have to progress and all, I just hate seeing the things I grew up with there go away.

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I would bet a hydraulic system to tilt that would cost less than the chain in a traditional lift. Plus you could run the pump on a 220 volt single phase motor and that cost less to install, run and replace. less moving parts equals less maintenance.

If cost wasn't a part of it wouldn't a launch type make better sense on Top Gun.

At least the Top Gun at PKI takes off on a Aircraft Carrier.

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^Technically it probably would be cheaper but remember these coasters are built by Vekoma. They have problems building giant invert boomerang coasters, I wouldn't trust them building something like this. I imagine it would be down more than TR:TR, I wonder how consistently the one in Japan operates.

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I think PKI will get the tilt coaster but have a different theme with it Kings Island has ton of land to expand on plus I think we will see Flight of Fear rethemed to that Soundwave concept I also think we will see Spongebob Squarepants Crash Course Boating School & The Nick Carwash an expansion to Nick Central will happen soon and I think these two attractions are ones that the kiddies will love and it will help PKI keep that golden ticket.

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I just don't see how people think that keeping a chain and lift hill maintained could possibly be cheaper than that lifting mechanism. I'm no expert, but I have to say, no way.

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Personally, I found it interesting that Soundwave is similar to Rockin Roller Coaster at Disney Studios....and the survey did ask if we ever visited Disney World and Disneyland.

Rather than trying to compete with CP, PKI is trying to model itself after Disney - the world theme park leader. I think that is a brilliant strategy.

Have a great weekend!

Italian Chef

chef.gif

You know, I find this kind of a double-edged sword...

First of all, I think it's very smart for Paramount Parks to position themselves differently than the Six Flag and Cedar Fair parks they generally compete with regionally, especially in the Ohio market. PKI has positioned itself differently enough from CP, that I would imagine there are families who go to both parks each season, just because the experience differs (or is promised to differ) so much.

However, they need to be very careful how this "Disney-like" experience is presented. If visitors come to the Paramount Parks expecting a duplicate of a Disney (or Universal) park they'll be extremely disappointed. I thought the hype for CDBB way exceeded what was delivered. After hearing months and months of promotion about the "lush tropical vegetation" and unbelievable themeing, I begun to picture a waterpark that would look a lot like Typhoon Lagoon. Unfortunately, CDBB didn't even come close to that kind quality. To me, it's really an improved, themed Waterworks. Which, is fine...but certainly not what the marketing promised.

I don't fault Paramount Parks at all for NOT delivering a Disney-like experience. While Disney & Viacom are very similar in size (both do around $30B a year in revenue), theme parks & resorts are a lot more important to the Disney business model than they are to Viacom's. In 2004, Disney's parks & resorts contributed 25% of total revenue, as opposed to Paramount Parks which contributed in the neighborhood of just 2-4% of Viacom's revenue. Two of the Disney parks (MK and DL) each had higher individual attendance in 2004 than ALL of the Paramount Parks combined. So, of course they can't compete on the same level.

Disney parks and Paramount Parks are very different animals... Personally, I think Paramount does a really nice job with what they do. My only problem is when they hype it into being a lot more than it really is...

Joel

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Yes, Paramount does seem to hype rides into being more intensively themed than what they really are. But the bottom line is it brings in guests to the park, with a majority of them probably not having been to Disney or Universal for comparison. Compared to Six Flags or Cedar Fair, TR:TR and the soon to be Italian Job are more heavily themed than anything found in those chains. But if you have been to a Disney or Universal park, PKI and other Paramount Parks pale in comparison to the level of detail in the theming for the reasons described above. Owe it to the great marketing team for pulling in people to the park with these rides, which are unique to the region, but no where near the level of detail as what they claim it to be.

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Yep, I agree. I don't really think of PKI or CP as being better than the other any more...I think of them as offering very different experiences. That repositioning of PKI is very smart business, and has really only occurred within the last 8-10 years. (Prior to that, KI competed directly with CP as being the same "type" of park.) That is 100% the effort of the marketing staff. Unfortunately, from time to time, they've also embellished a few things to the point where they really didn't meet reality...CDBB being the prime example.

What's more, is I'm sure that given the budget, Paramount Parks COULD create attractions that would rival Disney quality. Unfortunately, they make up too small a piece of the "pie" for that to be realistic.

I do think PKI's quality has improved overall. Personally, I put Paramount Parks on the mid-tier along with Busch when it comes to things like themeing and quality of "story."

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The problem is and the problem will always be that PKI does not have a special, top of the line design team like Disney does, Imagineers.

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But given a larger budget, I`m sure that Paramount Parks Design and Entertainment could come up with rides on the same caliber as Disney. But, because PKI and Cincinnati are not destination locations, they are not going to sink the same type of capital into new themed attractions, simply because they won`t receive a return on their investment.

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I don't fault Paramount Parks at all for NOT delivering a Disney-like experience. While Disney & Viacom are very similar in size (both do around $30B a year in revenue), theme parks & resorts are a lot more important to the Disney business model than they are to Viacom's. In 2004, Disney's parks & resorts contributed 25% of total revenue, as opposed to Paramount Parks which contributed in the neighborhood of just 2-4% of Viacom's revenue. Two of the Disney parks (MK and DL) each had higher individual attendance in 2004 than ALL of the Paramount Parks combined. So, of course they can't compete on the same level.

Disney parks and Paramount Parks are very different animals... Personally, I think Paramount does a really nice job with what they do. My only problem is when they hype it into being a lot more than it really is...

Joel

Another part of the problem with Paramount Parks vs. Disney is that all the Paramount Parks are seasonal. This means a few things:

1. The have only half as much time each year to generate revenue

2. They have to be very conscious about how the winter weather is going to effect theming.

I just don't think a seasonal park will ever be able to come close to a Disney type experience because of these two problems. I think even Disney itself would have trouble equaling it's other theme parks if they owned a seasonal park.

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Think of it this way. Disney does not add new rides every year. PKI does, which would you prefer? I think the guests that visit yearly (which I'm assuming most are within a 200 mile radious) come yearly and want to ride the new ride(s) every year. Disney, however, is a place you don't go to as much. It's just a different type of marketing for a different destination.

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Another part of the problem with Paramount Parks vs. Disney is that all the Paramount Parks are seasonal. This means a few things:

1. The have only half as much time each year to generate revenue

2. They have to be very conscious about how the winter weather is going to effect theming.

I just don't think a seasonal park will ever be able to come close to a Disney type experience because of these two problems. I think even Disney itself would have trouble equaling it's other theme parks if they owned a seasonal park.

Yep, that's just all part of the same reasoning for exactly why theme parks aren't as prominent in Viacom's business model as they are in Disney's. That's neither good or bad...they're just different. They fulfill two very important segments of the theme park industry.

I agree with you 100% about what Disney seasonal parks might be like... In fact, I'm reading "Disney War" right now, and one of the biggest concerns about "Disney's America" (other than all the PR problems) was that they'd only be able to have an eight month operating calender in Virginia. That realization completely changed (for the negative) all the business assumptions they'd made about attendance and revenue, to the point where they doubted they could build the park to the scale orginally planned.

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I just took the survey myself.. my 2 cent's.. I think we'll see spongebob while the money's good... i hate spongebob myself.. I think it's kinda stupid even from a kid's point of view.. sooner or later SPongebob's marketing is going to go flop.. just like Pokemon, and any of these other fads.. Star Trek was a multi-million dollar franchise but what have you seen lately.. ENterrpise?? come on it was canceled.. all things end in time.. SO i see SPongebob while they can take advantage of it..

next possibility.. the rock rollercoaster.. perfect for retheming to FOF.. so i see that as a very good possibility.

thought's on Top Gun.. both of these would be awesome but like others ahve said i see this as 2007, I think they will try to go cheap in 2006, saving the construction money for something bigger in 2007..

Both of the ideas they had are awesome.. I'd make a special trip to KI just for those two.. I also see them removing TOp gun and redoing it. the themeing there is too perfect of an opportunity. although the see-saw coaster would be great.. i personally think a launch coaster would be better for top gun since it is supposed to be a aircraft carrier take off.. chain lifts just don't cut it.

brings up an interesting question.. has there ever been a suspended coaster with a luanch?

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Seems like I've seen one somewhere, but that could have just been a concept. Even though I enjoy the theming very much of FoF, the retheme idea does sound cool, especially since it would have music in the cars. The short lines it has had lately are nice, but it hurts the park, so I guess it's in need of something.

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