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Posts posted by Benjamin22
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4 minutes ago, silver2005 said:
Low ridership by itself isn't enough to remove a coaster. There has to be a number of other factors.
I’d say the main reason for their removal is high maintenance cost.
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Well I’m going to say the obvious answer and say Night Hawk, with the addition of copper head strike the ride isn’t as important to its line up and the removal of the ride won’t be that big of a deal. Are there any enterprises left in the chain? If so those are also goners.
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2 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
Steel Vengeance --- didn't operate as designed for most of the season as the accident, which led to one train op for a while, then 2 train and eventually 3 train (toward the end of the season) which led to long waits which also led to folks not going until all 3 trains were on the tracks. I had several folks share with me and publicly that they wouldn't visit until the ride was in full operation.
Twisted Timbers --- also plagued by train issues which also led to long lines and not many folks coming until it was a consistent operation....this is also the park that their general area of folks don't show up with a massive new ride anyway.Do other RMC’s typically have a similar amount of problems?
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42 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
Awesome report!
I would hardly expect more than 1% attendance growth with 2 of the rides plagued with issues, one being at a park where the locals hardly come out for a new ride anyway.Out of curiosity which two rides are you referring two? I’d assume one of them would be rail blazer considering it’s a new model.
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8 minutes ago, CoastersRZ said:
Record full year net revenues and record attendance in 2018.
Operating income was down 2% when compared to 2017 due to higher operating costs related to increased wages due to minimum wages increases.
Glad to see attendance went up considering they were having trouble at the start of the year. But if you installed 4 rollercoasters across the chain you’d probably expect more then 1% attendance growth.
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2 hours ago, Maverick44 said:
If we have to settle for a B&M I hope it has the roar of Raptor.
I wouldn’t say getting a 30+ million dollar B&M is settling. At least we’d know the ride would be reliable & have high capacity.
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4 minutes ago, Bansheeback said:
I doubt that the sound the track makes when tapped on would be considered proprietary. Regardless, I’m not trying to break any rules. Just sharing what I know.
They likely only may have done the drop of the first hill. Could the trains be quieter then the raptor trains? I’m not sure how much is different between the two.
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13 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
Again, just because one park gets a massive amount of money doesn't mean that other parks don't get money. KD has been invested in, just because they haven't gotten any new major roller coasters doesn't mean that Cedar Fair is investing in it. Same with Dorney....the may not be getting new coasters, but money is being put into the park.
I know this may be a surprise but Cedar Fair doesn't have anything out there that says their capital improvement budgets must include coasters because enthusiasts think that they know how to run their business better than they can.I didn’t say I could run it better then they could I’m just saying Cedar Fair is neglecting some of their parks, Dorney has gotten 4 small rides over the course of 5 years while parks like Cedar Point in that span of time got 3 major rollercoasters + a major water park investment.
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59 minutes ago, CoastersRZ said:
There is a reason that a park like Michigan`s Adventure hasn`t seen any flashy big new B&M coasters installed. It is because with relatively little investment, people (especially the locals), keep coming to this park and spending money there. Why spend $5 million to make $10 million, when you can spend $100,000 to make $10 million? I know those are generalized numbers, but that is the philosophy that Cedar Fair has used with Michigan`s Adventure. The former scenario makes $2 for every $1 invested, while the latter makes $10 for every $1 invested. If I was investing money, I would certainly want the one that nets me $10 for every dollar I invest.
Yeah, that’s why I made the argument CedarFair would maybe want to invest 30 million dollars at another park rather then Kings Island.
54 minutes ago, chugh43 said:Just because one park gets a big sum of money for a new ride, doesn't mean other parks don't get money.
Yeah but parks like KD & Dorney really don’t receive any major new rollercoasters while parks like CP get multimillion dollar investments year of year, of course they get more return on investment at Cedar Point but it’s some what sad they let some of their parks become stagnant.
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6 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
Yet you didn’t answer my question of where they should spend the $ and kept insisting they’d only invest in those parks.
I haven’t insisted anything I’ve just stated the fact that Zimmerman previously stated the company looked to make larger investments into 4 particular parks. If it were up to me I’d spend invest the money into Kings Island and a few other parks in the chain that continue to be neglected.
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1 minute ago, CoastersRZ said:
But looking into growth opportunities at those parks does not mean that they will not be investing in the other parks in the chain. Carowinds, as can be seen with all the investment of late, and the new hotel they are building will bring in more revenue, especially with Winterfest. Keep in mind that a hotel allows Cedar Fair to capture money that they consider to be "out of park revenue". That can help fuel growth. Not everything has to be park related to fuel growth. Look at the sports park they built in Sandusky.
Of course they’d keep investing in their main parks but my whole point is that the 30 million dollars it takes to build a giga coaster could be better spent else were.
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https://www.toledoblade.com/business/2018/05/06/Dealing-in-the-thrill-Cedar-Fair-CEO-excited-about-Point-s-future.html toward the bottom it states they plan to look into growth opportunities at the 4 previously mentioned parks.
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31 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
Where would you suggest they spend $30 mil in one year to boost attendance and that would sustain attendance for that year and beyond?
I'm sure that if $30 mil was given for a project, the contract has already been signed and the $ has already been allocated....it's not as if they would cancel a project at this time because attendance is dipping. They would be doing everything they could to market the project to ensure folks come out to experience it.
From what I understand CedarFair previously stated they planned on investing a large portion of money into Cedar Point, Carowinds, Knotts & CGA. I still think it’s likely KI will get a giga in 2020, guess we’ll be able to make a better judgment on how likely it is based off of Wednesday earning report
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56 minutes ago, chugh43 said:
A way to boost attendance would be to add a $30 mil coaster. Opting to not do anything big wouldn't draw folks in to boost the attendance.
True but if They were to spend that 30 million dollars else where it could result in a larger return on investment compared to investing that at Kings Island. There’s no denying a new giga would increase the attendance but the question CedarFair is asking is if that 30 million dollars will be better spent else where
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I’d say 2020 but considering CedarFairs recent attendance decline a 30 million dollar roller coaster might not be something they opt for.
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10 minutes ago, Kenban said:
I cannot say I am surprised, the ride has had significant downtime and been a maintenance nightmare. Whatever failed last year is obviously significant enough that it’s not worth fixing.
This is one of the highest profile rides at the park and makes me wonder what other rides are no longer safe. Cedar Fair still has several other very expensive to operate coasters, how many other coasters are a significant failure away from being removed? How many other rides are being examined for removal due to maintenance costs?
I’d say nighthawk at carowinds might go considering they’re getting copperhead strike the ride won’t be that important to their lineup. I hope this years bad earnings / attendance is a one off occurrence or else I could see a lot more being removed.
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48 minutes ago, SonofBaconator said:
With the speculation of a giga going to the north side of the park, I wonder if adding sand is something the park would consider doing. Sand was added to Leviathan to reduce the noise during the first drop.
I hope not, nothing better then a B&M roar. Do Diamondback or Banshee have sand in them?
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I mean that commercial is decent but the original Bat commercial & Beast commercial put it to shame in my opinion. But still better then the annoyingly chatchy fun & only commercial.
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6 minutes ago, Maverick44 said:
I like how he talked about CP's 150th spanning 2 years and he said attractions (plural)!!!! 2020 and 2021 I am guessing are going to be huge?
I thought someone already confirmed the celebration was going to be only one year?
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I never got to ride this ride sadly but it definitely seemed beloved. It’s was where Boo Blasters currently is right?
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Really interesting that’s how they chose their names, I had just assumed Rob picked them.
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49 minutes ago, Maverick44 said:
Office??? The park already has offices in the park. Multipurpose space? What would they need that for?
Construction companies often have mobile offices used for projects.
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17 minutes ago, Maverick44 said:
is it just me or in that video does The Bat look way closer then it actually is? haha
Yeah it looks pretty close from that angle, granted you never get to see due to FOF building.
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2 minutes ago, retrofan1980 said:
ive got a question please dont make fun. i know its to early to tell or ask but is Kings Island going to be having winter fest this year i saw the the calendar only going up to oct.
I mean considering CedarFairs attendance is down id seriously doubt they’d chose to shorten the season. Furthermore I’d assume Kings Island has invested a lot of money into buying the winter fest equipment and choosing to end it after just 2 years would be an incredibly foolish investment. Winter fest is almost certainly profitable for the park so I’d say there’s a 99% it’s coming back this year.
Future Cedar Fair Coaster Removals?
in Other Amusement Parks & Industry News
Posted
I’ve also been curious about this myself. Does anyone know how much it cost to maintain Arrow coasters? The rides are so some common and the trains are so similar I’ve always assumed it’s not that expensive.