Outdoor Man

you're missing the point.

I don't know that I'm glad they got pulled; quite honestly they should have never been up in the first place. If that's the kind of creativity that is being swelled around- the labor market must not be as tight as what I'm reading. If nothing is truly off limits why not place a pair of white towers side by side with skeletons falling next to them and a skeleton of a plane about to plow in to them. no, that's not funny- or even amusing for that matter. Life goes on for most of the country on that- but if someone you knew died on the 105th floor it's still pretty personal to you (i didn't by the way). For people who knew, loved, and were family members of these "objects" that some group of grown adult decided was a good idea to make light of- it's personal. When I die- i could care less if the whole world makes light of my name; i wouldn't care, I'd be dead. But those I leave behind might.... and may not be "offended" by it- but just plain hurt. And that's what I think this argument is about- its not about needing thicker skin or offending people- those people can go somewhere else if they're offended. It's the person 500 miles away from the park that has no attachment or ever visited but has to know that they're loved one's death (lets use Farah Faucett- someone's child, spouse, mother, friend, etc...) is an object of amusement. They're loved one has been reduced to a marketing stunt (gone terribly bad). That's not offensive, that's just plain hurtful.... and the staff of Kings Island should have known better.

Adventure Express. Going up the lift tunnel.... getting prepared for a big "something"- crest the hill, come outside and...................... STATION! .........oh wait. never mind.

i happen to catch that the Boomerang Bay souvenirs were dirt cheap... are they retheming the water park as well? Also, good trip report.

I've awakened from the crypt of two years in this thread to read my post above. Much has changed since then. Most of that was back in the days when Cedar Fair was trying to deconstruct Paramount Parks, and though I have little to no dealing with management on any level at Kings Island anymore- I do still with GWL. It is interesting how in Sandusky GWL and CP lock horns with regularity- but in Cincinnati it has become a easy two-way street. On Ryan's Post: 1) Guest experience has improved greatly since the initial purchase. Though there are a good number of "indifferent" employees... there are some smiling faces out there. My wife and I ALWAYS go to Guest Relations after a visit to tell of the Great Job someone (usually in Nick U) does (I hope the message is passed on). I'm a little amiss at the music that they play in the Kids area.... and the music tends to be loud- but doesn't detract from experience. Landscaping and cleanliness have taken an uptick. Though they don't seem to be into guest opinions like Paramount was. 2) don't know anything about that. 3) entertainment. Is OK... aren't a few of the shows reruns from last year though? Saw Marty's Party with my little one today.... that was 20 minutes of my life I won't get back. 4) Security. good, in my opinion... actually never felt unsafe in the park. 5) Quality.... eh.... it's an amusement park. I think they would get people to spend more money if they weren't trying to score a winning lottery ticket with each food purchase. I think Paramount figured out early that if they didn't price the t-shirts and other clothing items too high, they'd sell more. Same with the food. The prices they charge literally force people to pack and eat in the parking lot. My family and I were there today for 7 hours.... money spent: $0. Not that they have to price the same as McDonald's down the street but if it wasn't double the price people would spend more there. I think the CF ownership of KI is, has been, and will continue to be beneficial. I think the construction of Diamondback states a commitment to building. Unfortunately, though- KI is no longer the flagship park in a chain. As far as competition goes- this will be tough. Competition between Kings Island, Cedar Point, and Six Flags WoA- produced some good strategic moves by all three parks. One is literally gone and the other is owned by the other. It's no longer competition; CP is a sibling (the first born and favorite child).

back in November last year one of the Mods almost bumped me off because they thougt I had a ""political" avatar.... which is taboo on this board.... and I completely agree with that.... but then they noticed it said "Dwight Schrute for President."

though not as long as some... i've been on here longer than the lot of you. if you're going to argue... PM each other, get each others phone numbers and talk it out... or IM the argument with each other. text message, whatever. This is a thread about GL... not about the grievance some comment has caused this person and now this other person is involved. I have a long term interest in GL from years and years ago- so this reading this thread gives some interest to me.... then I have to read 30 posts of how this person offended this person and this person is immature, etc.... The kindergarten class is down the hall.

oh, why not add my $0.02. i agree with several posts that Six Flags caused the park to expand faster and more than the market would provide. BUT- you're sandwiched between Cleveland, Arkon, Canton, Youngstown, and not real far from columbus and Pittsburgh. The drawing area was huge. Six flags probably sold it because it was the park that they could get the most for at the time. I think CF had intentions to modify the park back into something that would be profitable... i mean- you don't spend $140 million on a vendetta. They tried to keep the park going with few changes to the Ride line up between 2004-2006. They didn't remove a ride until 2007. So, you're CF and you realized that you probably made a bad move by buying a park investment. Removing the Wildlife side killed the very thing that set you apart. Any amusement park has roller coasters (and their flats were pretty substandard) and most now have waterparks. $25 admission wasn't exactly bringing the patrons in like prarie fire. You have already abandoned those that came for the low-key family atmosphere with adding thrill rides and rollercoasters..... so now you run the risk of alienating those that came for the thrill rides. Attendance is way down, and you don't see anything changing that in the next 5 years..... OH- and all economic indicators say that we're about to enter a pretty harsh recession. Meanwhile, you have a stockpile of parks you just bought that have a following that demands a new ride experiences with regularity.... and you have an underperforming park..... with a whole property of rides that you could parcel out for pennies on the investment over the next 3-5 years and rebrand them as "new" experiences. Firehawk was a GREAT add to the park, and while it wasn't new it WAS new to the Kings Island crowd. it did cost money to transport, but not nearly what a new coaster desgined from scratch would have been. So, maybe you're out $140 for the purchase of GL... but re-branding 7 of your coasters as new to other parks may have almost made that loss a "wash." I think the CF had intentions to make GL successful, but in the end had the thought of "if we can't make it successful under our terms.... no one is." Why on earth would you sell it to another entity that would try to make it compete with CP and cut into your bottom line... again? It sucks if you're a "history" person.. but lets keep it in perspective also... it's a business designed to make money- and when its not you have to make decisions despite the popular opinion. The ONLY mistake I see from the last year was that they should have just been honest with the public and had a "farewell" month... they could have had a HUGE turnout with one last large pay out from the park before shuttering it.

hey Ryan... change the "Words" to "Worlds"... I was afraid this would happen. Hanna Barbera was contemporary and very up to date for the time. Nick Universe (even though they are necessarily my favorite) are very up to date for today. Peanuts........ maybe in the 1960's or 1970's.... There aren't a lot of options out there I guess- would hate to see an entire area dedicated to "the Wiggles"- Bugs Bunny would have been great (not necessarily up to date, but a favorite of mine)- but that is already taken. Is SDATHC changing right away? and can we lobby for Fairly Odd Coaster to go back to "The Beastie" and not something like "Snoopy's Barnstorming Adventure...." I guess "Snoopy" is who Cedar Fair has the license to and yes, it does reflect "wholesome famiy entertainment"... with usually 3 cartoons aired per year. It is the rides and not the graphics as I think i read someone writing from somewhere.... but as a parent of a die hard Nick U fan.... I can't really get excited about this.

well, as the 75% off signs would indicate- Nick Universe is going to go through a self-destructive period after the last "boo" is yelled at the Haunt. It would make sense that if you are going to retheme an area, to punch forward on all of it. I wonder if the name "The Beastie" will be coming back......... or maybe the Son of Beast name will be saved, yet "neutered" and moved to retheme the Fairly Odd Coaster. it will be interesting to see what happens in that area over the off-season. I have spent a great deal of my season passes there over the last three years. and as much as I really don't care for many of the Nick characters I will miss it.

innovative at Kings Island used to happen. Cedar Point is the "franchise player" now. Don't get me wrong, KI will get good coasters, but the ultra-innovative, record breakers will debut about 4 hours north from now on.

i disagree a bit on the whole SBNO for a season. Cedar Fair tends to be pretty decisive when a decision is made. Examples from Geauga Lake: Close on Sunday, coasters begin remove following week Villian not sold at auction, demolished within a month. It's not like someone is going to buy Son of Beast and move it to another park. if they make the decision that it isn't in their best interest to keep, i bet its down by February. The decision to operate again isn't necessarily all in their hands; if i were to guess they probably are having difficult discussions with their insurance carrier. not to mention 9 years of bad press... and how old is it? 10?

Klockster. Awesome post. Picture's worth a thousand words. and KI Finatic.... it doesn't matter the likability fo the coaster. Cost/investment will reign. It's all about dollars and cents. The Villain, Big Dipper, and the entire Geauga Lake park were loved by many; but the cost exceeded the investment. The Bat had TONS of fans when it was able to operate. Just because a coaster is liked doesn't keep the wrecking ball from knocking on the door. SOB had problems from day one that never improved... and in the end it's name was attached to accident reports all through it's 9-year history. And if they continue to operate, with all of the bad press an injury may not even have been caused by SOB, but if someone has a headache after riding.... it could cost CF and the adjacent insurance company thousands to prove otherwise.

plus they'd probably have some die-hard SOB fans chain themselves to the physical structure.

kjkjkjkj- See "Geauga Lake's Closing" for the answer to that question.

well put Thrill_Biscuit! I'll just ditto those remarks.

i would seriously be shocked if the coaster ever re-opened. It really doesn't matter if the state cleared it or not, it has 9 years of bad publicity. I'm certain that Cedar Fair's liability insurance carrier will have a MAJOR say in whether it hosts another park patron again... And don't hold out for "one last ride." if it is determined that it is in the parks best interests to part ways with the troubled past of the coaster the last thing they're going to do is give park patrons one last opportunity to claim injury and sue the park.

actually dalefan, CF officials/employees do read the Geagua Lake Today site... and their subsequent forums. There was a guy named "Dave" who posted pictures of the park demolition, who didn't work direclty for CF, but for the contractor- who, as best I can tell, was released from his employment and the pictures on the site removed. unfortunately for this site, the days of Twitter, FaceBook, etc... and the relentless blogging of individuals leaves many to think that people care about EVERY opinion they have on any topic. I have someone on my facebook network that posted 5 times about laying his kitchen floor, and that he hopes he has enough time to finish it. I DON'T CARE... seems a simple solution to the time would be to STOP POSTING. so, if there is a thread about Firehawk... well I must have an opinion so why not post. and unfortunately for the Moderators there are more people and more threads to moderate than they have time to read after. There are a few newbies on here that have over 1000 posts in their first 6 months. I've been on here four years and I don't have 700 (i think).... i can't see my numbers. Granted, if I see someone is getting spirited I will be the first to try and push a button or come up with an obviously preposterous "factoid." Most will see right through it and "get" it- and I do it in good nature. This is still a great site. for the most part moderated pretty well (I about got "moderated" for a political avatar.... before (and I can't think of his name... Ronny maybe)- realized it was a Dwight Schrute mock up). The site is very respectable in that childish comments are tough to cut out, but it always seems that the heated debate topics are kept to a minimum. Go to the cincinnati.com or any news outlet "comment" threads from their stories. This site is Pulitzer-caliber compared to some of the dolts that post on those sites.

OK, I'll think about what I say before I type it................ When I'm about to do something, I think, "would an idiot do this?" and if they would I do not do that thing!

two observations. #1- an obvious case where the cost has exceeded the benefit of the investment. So, yes an amusement park is there to actually turn a profit, and once an attraction begins costing more than it's percieved benefit to said park. Removal. (sans Son of Beast- may be popular (to some)- but there will be a day in the not too distant future that it is no longer profitable to have operate. #2- Cedar Fair could take a lesson from Busch Gardens playbook. Announcing something closing 45 days out to allow guests to enjoy "one last time." ala Geauga Lake.

OK "Top Gun"- I'm going to have to ask the judges on this one. 7709 in 2008 just at KI???? assuming you went everyday in an estimated 110 day operating season (public days- it may be more/less)... that's 70 pictures per day. Really; are there that many things there to take a picture of at KI. let alone 18000 in 4 years. I hope that perhaps you are one of the "Keyhole Photo" individuals that snaps pics all day.

Two Words: TRIM BREAKS

I'll give you a dollar if they rollback the admission price when the license expires. But I do think that 50% off Nick merchandise in May probably means that the Nick Universe is in its farewell season.

was at the park tonight (monday) and I'm sure someone else has already picked up on this and probably has posted- but it doesn't look good for Nick Universe in a post 2009 world. It is only May and the Nick items are already 50% off. I can only hpoe they do a MUCH better job retheming than they have with TR:TR / Crypt.

Holy McCrap. i think there would be many sick individuals getting off that top spin. They should call that one "vertigo."