No More $20 Million Coasters, Saith Shapiro At IAAPA

[The Interpreter]

November 22, 2006

Six Flags' Shapiro Wants Families Not Roller Coasters

Michael Willis

Reporting from IAAPA

Atlanta, GA -- Mark Shapiro, the CEO and President of Six Flags delivered his keys for success at the owners and general managers breakfast at the International Association of Amusement Parks and Attractions (IAAPA) expo in Atlanta last week. It's not about new rides or new technology, "at the end of the day it's about great service". Great service is one of the many ways Shapiro hopes to improve the world's largest theme park chain. Other strategies for success include providing a welcoming environment for families and finding new ways of generating income.

Mark Shapiro, CEO and President of Six Flags spoke to amusement park owners and general managers at IAAPA. Shapiro describes the role of Six Flags as storytellers providing "emotional transportation" to their guests. Shapiro hopes that this philosophy, along with a focus on providing a family-friendly environment will be instrumental for the success of Six Flags.

He will create this environment by putting a stop to line cutting, enforcing a no smoking policy and ensuring all park guests wear shirts. Shapiro also hopes to improve customer service by hiring motivating managers and increasing employee incentives and bonus programs.

Shapiro recognizes that Six Flags must continually evolve and stay current with technology to find new sources of revenue. Technology-based revenue generating possibilities include utilizing the time while customers wait in long lines, tapping into the "third screen" of cell phones, and providing ride DVDs instead of still pictures.

There are five points that Shapiro feels are important for the success of any business in the amusement industry: Don't get complacent; Be prepared to market yourself differently; Surround yourself with smart people; Develop strong leaders and don't think of the amusement industry as a mature industry.

Shapiro closed his speech by answering questions from the audience which consisted of amusement park owners and general managers. The audience learned that there will be no admission price increase next season, there are not any decisions regarding the sale of any of the Six Flags theme parks, and that we can expect a "massive presence" from Six Flags at the IAAPA expo next year.

Shapiro also made it clear that his focus for Six Flags is to reduce debt, increase family friendly attractions and to not build any more $20 million roller coasters. Instead of expensive roller coasters, he wants to appeal to thrill-seekers through less expensive rides, citing S&S Power's new Xtreme Swing at Valley Fair.

Shapiro indicated that Six Flags has a tough road ahead as they try to appeal to families, without losing the thrill-seekers along the way.

http://www.ultimaterollercoaster.com/news/...061122_01.shtml

[KIBeast]

No more $20 million coasters? You think? Wow, this is a revelation that every enthusiast has been saying for years now. About time management caught up with the rest of the world.

[Discodude3737]

Well this is all good in thought, but lets see how well they put it into action. Hopefully they do actually try to stop line jumping, as it seems to be horrible at some of their parks.

[RailRider]

I heard a rumor that Mr. Shapiro is the new host of the Mr. Obvious show.

No wonder this guy got a bonus this year, he is a freaking genius.

Good job on getting out of the way of the train barreling down on you and your company. I think he is really going to turn it around for Six Flags with great decisions like this one.

Mr. Shapiro I hope you like sarcasim because thats all you will get from me.

So far he has managed to sell some parks and make some rah rah speechs. Other than that he hasnt accomplished anything and I cant wait to see him and this company try and change their daily opperations. Good Luck...

[The Interpreter]

...Apparently you didn't go Six Flags Over Georgia (or DID go to Six Flags Great Adventure) this year. Sigh.

[Discodude3737]

Didn't he make a list of parks a while back that he said were "model parks" or something like that? I seem to remember him saying that certain Six Flags parks were intended to be kept up, and the others had an unsure future.

[KIBeast]

Yes, that is correct. Magic Mountain is one of the ones that are possibly on the chopping block.

[RailRider]

^

Which has a lot of $20 million coasters.

[TheKlockster]

Figures - they add a couple high price good rides to their new flagship (since they abandoned SFMM) and then decide no more. Takes money to make money. Only time will tell if they're going the right course. It didn't seem to work too well for Paramount did it?

[Gordon Bombay]

^Are you talking about adding a more family friend atmosphere not doing well for paramount? It did really well for the parks especially Kings Island for the past few years that even CP is starting to follow that trend of marketing towards famiies. Your right in saying that it takes money to make money, it depends on where your spending that money though. Yeah SFMM got huge coasters just about every year but they didnt invest their money into making the park a good experience and look where it is now. Building for enthusiasts is not building for everyone, especially when enthusiasts are not your target audience.

[TheKlockster]

Maverick is done the right way. They put alot of money and time into making a good ride that is good for families and enthusiasts. Same goes for Voyage at Holiday World. But crap like Italian Job is just wasting money. You won't get anywhere filling your amusment parks with stuff like that.

[Gordon Bombay]

^Sure they can say Maverick is family friendly but a ride with two 70mph launches and 4 inversions is obviously geared towards enthusiasts. Not that I'm not excited to ride it next season, but its in no way geared towards families despite what their marketing says.

[RailRider]

Agreed about Maverick, it is going to be intense with the head choppers, inversions, over 90 degree drop, and the speed. My nephew road IJ:ST and loved it but I gurantee he will not ride Maverick next year. No chance.

Back to the SixFlags fiasco. It is possible to add a $20 million coaster and still attract the familes. Look at the Cedar Point model, they have been adding enormous attractions for thrill seekers, but at the same time have been adding attractions for the family and non diehard coaster fans. Resturants, new shows, indoor water park resort, new flat rides and still they have managed to add some major non family friendly coasters during this time frame. Given it takes a lot of money to accomplish what Cedar Point has with additions of rides and attractions, but it is possible. My whole point just goes back to the fact that SFMM wanted to keep up with Jones, but completely neglected the infastructure of the park. SFMM is a very similar situation for SF as is Geauga Lake for CF. Instead of scaling SFMM back SF has decided just to kill the cancer off while CF has decided to salvage their park. Then again SFMM is just a bit more of a problem than GL.

Time for Shapiro to actually earn that bonus.

[ragerunner]

Agreed about Maverick, it is going to be intense with the head choppers, inversions, over 90 degree drop, and the speed. My nephew road IJ:ST and loved it but I gurantee he will not ride Maverick next year. No chance.

Back to the SixFlags fiasco. It is possible to add a $20 million coaster and still attract the familes. Look at the Cedar Point model, they have been adding enormous attractions for thrill seekers, but at the same time have been adding attractions for the family and non diehard coaster fans. Resturants, new shows, indoor water park resort, new flat rides and still they have managed to add some major non family friendly coasters during this time frame. Given it takes a lot of money to accomplish what Cedar Point has with additions of rides and attractions, but it is possible. My whole point just goes back to the fact that SFMM wanted to keep up with Jones, but completely neglected the infastructure of the park. SFMM is a very similar situation for SF as is Geauga Lake for CF. Instead of scaling SFMM back SF has decided just to kill the cancer off while CF has decided to salvage their park. Then again SFMM is just a bit more of a problem than GL.

Time for Shapiro to actually earn that bonus.

I don't believe that CP has been adding family type attractions recently. How is adding MaxAir or Skyhawk (flatrides) adding family type rides? These rides received a rating of 5 for thrills by CP. MF, Dragster, and Maverick are not rides focused on the family experience as well. So that leaves us some new shows and food options - which most parks change and provide on a normal bases and the indoor waterpark was really not an addition to the park. Weather or not CP moves towards more family type rides in the future is only speculation at this time, since the past shows otherwise. My personal belief is that CP and most of the CF parks will focus more on family type rides and experiences because that is were the money is headed and it will allow them to also attract retiring baby boomers (this is going to be a huge demographic over the next 20 years). The parks that can attract these groups have a very good chance of growing financially. Those that ignore these groups may find a different financial fate. As a fan of thrill rides and a father of small children parks that hit the middle ground are going to probably do the best. Right now CP is no ways near the middle ground.

[TheKlockster]

The Voyage is considered a "family" ride too - but it is one of the (if not THE) most intense roller coaster I have been on. It isn't my favorite - but it is one crazy ride. But it is still considered a family ride - and apparently families love it. So Maverick could still be a family ride.

I think to be a good park you have to have a mix. You have to be able to cater to everyone. Kings Island is a good park in this way. It has some ok high thrill rides for the big kids - and an amazing kids area for the little kids. It also has a large variety of flat rides and roller coasters that enthusiasts and families alike can enjoy. But I think money spent on adding things like Italian Job would better spent toward adding a high thrill ride or a low thrill / family ride. Trying to make a ride that is a mish-mash of the two is a mistake in my opinion. It is too scary for many little kids - and too boring for the big people. True alot of people like IJST - and I know everyones going to be all "omfg IJST is such a huge people magnet" but at least as many people think it sucks as like it. And I have talked to non enthuiasts who visit the park once a year who think it is stupid.

Avatar on the other hand is a perfect addition. It is a fun as hell ride for thrill seekers - and any intimidation the ride may cause to children is easily overcome by the big likeness of Aang on top of the gondola. It truly is a ride where both thrillseekers and families can ride together, and everyone can walk off happy. Parks need to add more rides like this - and not waste their money on disguising crappy low thrill rides as fast fun rides that everyone can enjoy.

Thats just my opinion.

Also Poland.

[RailRider]

I don't believe that CP has been adding family type attractions recently. How is adding MaxAir or Skyhawk (flatrides) adding family type rides? These rides received a rating of 5 for thrills by CP. MF, Dragster, and Maverick are not rides focused on the family experience as well. So that leaves us some new shows and food options - which most parks change and provide on a normal bases and the indoor waterpark was really not an addition to the park. Weather or not CP moves towards more family type rides in the future is only speculation at this time, since the past shows otherwise. My personal belief is that CP and most of the CF parks will focus more on family type rides and experiences because that is were the money is headed and it will allow them to also attract retiring baby boomers (this is going to be a huge demographic over the next 20 years). The parks that can attract these groups have a very good chance of growing financially. Those that ignore these groups may find a different financial fate. As a fan of thrill rides and a father of small children parks that hit the middle ground are going to probably do the best. Right now CP is no ways near the middle ground.

As you would notice in my previous post I said Cedar Point has continued to add attraction for the thrill seeker, MF, TTD, WT etc... at the same time they have added great restraunts, Coasters, Daves Famous BBQ, Johny Rockets just to name a few. While parks like Kings Island has added fast food choices like Chic Fila. Also Cedar Point has added Camp Snoopy for the youg ones that before Nick Universe was one of the nicest childrens areas around. Also they have added the Snoopy Night Time Spectacular as a great night show for the entire family. Cedar Point has done the best job of any park out there to add a mix of Thrill and Family attractions. More so than any other park. Now they are starting to focus more on family thrills with Maverick, which will be intense for the whole family.

[The Interpreter]

Maverick was probably the last addition planned before the new constraints of crushing debt were added. What CP has done in the past is not necessarily any indicator of what may come in the future, especially now. And that doesn't even add in that management has greatly changed, and even Mr. Kinzel will be gone sooner than it may seem.

[ragerunner]

I don't believe that CP has been adding family type attractions recently. How is adding MaxAir or Skyhawk (flatrides) adding family type rides? These rides received a rating of 5 for thrills by CP. MF, Dragster, and Maverick are not rides focused on the family experience as well. So that leaves us some new shows and food options - which most parks change and provide on a normal bases and the indoor waterpark was really not an addition to the park. Weather or not CP moves towards more family type rides in the future is only speculation at this time, since the past shows otherwise. My personal belief is that CP and most of the CF parks will focus more on family type rides and experiences because that is were the money is headed and it will allow them to also attract retiring baby boomers (this is going to be a huge demographic over the next 20 years). The parks that can attract these groups have a very good chance of growing financially. Those that ignore these groups may find a different financial fate. As a fan of thrill rides and a father of small children parks that hit the middle ground are going to probably do the best. Right now CP is no ways near the middle ground.

As you would notice in my previous post I said Cedar Point has continued to add attraction for the thrill seeker, MF, TTD, WT etc... at the same time they have added great restraunts, Coasters, Daves Famous BBQ, Johny Rockets just to name a few. While parks like Kings Island has added fast food choices like Chic Fila. Also Cedar Point has added Camp Snoopy for the youg ones that before Nick Universe was one of the nicest childrens areas around. Also they have added the Snoopy Night Time Spectacular as a great night show for the entire family. Cedar Point has done the best job of any park out there to add a mix of Thrill and Family attractions. More so than any other park. Now they are starting to focus more on family thrills with Maverick, which will be intense for the whole family.

I am sorry, but I don't consider adding a few restaurants and a night time show as a great balance between thrill rides and family attractions. As for Camp Snoopy, it was a nice addition to the park and well done but it happened almost 8 years ago (1999). Since then we have seen, MF, WT, Dragster, Maverick, MaxAir, Skyhawk and they took out WWL (a family ride). I am not trying to be combative, but I truly can't see how anyone could say Cedar Point has done the best job of adding a mix of Thrill and Family attractions more so than any other park? What family attractions, some restaurants, and a night time show? While I have no financial numbers, here is a guess for what they have spent in the park since 2000. 80 million on thrill rides and 8 million on restaurants and the night show. That doesn't seem like much of a balance to me.

[RailRider]

Never said they were the best at balancing it, but they have attempted to add attractions for everyone. Also a major thrill ride is much more expensive to install than a resturant or a show. So if they had spent $40 million on major thrills and $40 million on resturants, family attractions, and shows I would be the first to say they over spent on their family attractions because the cost difference between the 2 is major.

During this time Cedar Point has stayed profitable and continued to enjoy a very enjoyable family experience along with a very thrilling expereince for more thrill seeking guests. Unlike SFMM who tried the same approach as CP. So I think now that Cedar Point is starting to focus away from groundbreaking coasters and move in to more family friendly attractions like MaXair, SkyHawk, and Maverick (considered family rides because of height requirements). Something the entire family can enjoy, if they choose.

[TOPGUN1993]

Cedar Point got rid of some family flat called, Schwabinchen, Dogem 1 and WWL. The last three rides taken out were family flats.

[ragerunner]

Never said they were the best at balancing it, but they have attempted to add attractions for everyone. Also a major thrill ride is much more expensive to install than a resturant or a show. So if they had spent $40 million on major thrills and $40 million on resturants, family attractions, and shows I would be the first to say they over spent on their family attractions because the cost difference between the 2 is major.

During this time Cedar Point has stayed profitable and continued to enjoy a very enjoyable family experience along with a very thrilling expereince for more thrill seeking guests. Unlike SFMM who tried the same approach as CP. So I think now that Cedar Point is starting to focus away from groundbreaking coasters and move in to more family friendly attractions like MaXair, SkyHawk, and Maverick (considered family rides because of height requirements). Something the entire family can enjoy, if they choose.

As other have stated here, MaXair, SkyHawk, MF, Dragster, WT and Maverick are NOT family type attractions. Check there height requirements and their thrill rating by Cedar Point. They are at the top of the thrill list. I think your definition of family friendly attractions and my definition of family friendly attractions are two different things. To me a family attractions is SDHC, Wild Thornberrys, Adventure Express, Avatar, Reptar, and IJ. Not Delirium, Face Off, FofF, Vortex, etc... these are thrill rides not family rides. With that said, I think a good park provides both types of ride experiences in abundance. Cedar Point does not due this (at this time). PKI, Universal Studios, Busch Gardens, Dollywood and Silver Dollar City do a very good job at this.

[RailRider]

Agree to Disagree

[KIBeast]

Ragerunner, the definition of a family ride is not easily cut and dry. First, back in the 70's, when The Beast first opened, my grandfather, whom was in his 60's, rode and loved The Beast. He was not the only older person riding that coaster either. So, wouldn't The Beast in fact be a family ride since I was pretty young, around 8, riding that coaster and my grandfather was in his 60's and there were those riding between those ages? So, to me, The Beast is and always will be a family attraction.

[ragerunner]

Ragerunner, the definition of a family ride is not easily cut and dry. First, back in the 70's, when The Beast first opened, my grandfather, whom was in his 60's, rode and loved The Beast. He was not the only older person riding that coaster either. So, wouldn't The Beast in fact be a family ride since I was pretty young, around 8, riding that coaster and my grandfather was in his 60's and there were those riding between those ages? So, to me, The Beast is and always will be a family attraction.

I was not trying to say that no one over 60 rides thrill rides (I hope when I am 60 I am still riding thrill rides) or that some 8 year olds would not ride a thrill ride (as long as they meet the height requirement). But in general, I very seldom see 60 and 70 year old people or 8 year old people in line for Delirium, FofF, Vortex, Face Off or The Beast (all though I think The Beast is less of an extreme machine than Delirium, or FofF - just a lot rougher). Most parks, even CP will list certain rides as family rides, slow rides, etc... and other rides as extreme thrill rides. My point was that CP has focus on the extreme thrill ride experience since 2000 and has add no family rides during that time period and that a major part of the US demographic over the next 20 years is going to fall into the 60 and older crowd and the family crowd. I believe that the parks that can attracted this crowd and still attract thrill ride fans will do the best financially. The parks that omit these large demographics will struggle. I guess time will tell which parks thrive and which parks go the way of Astroworld.

Agree to Disagree

I enjoy reading other people views. The reality to all of this is your opinion and my opinion probably will not change PKI or CP market plan. Maybe we will end up with the best of both worlds, a great B&M or Intamin at PKI and NU at CP?