pkimike

Again - I never said that losing a job is a not a big deal. You are arguing something different. The comment was made that "tons of jobs" were lost. I would not call 50 fulltime jobs 'tons of jobs" I don't think the lose of jobs will mean anything to the local economy. That is all I am saying. I do feel bad for the GL fans. I would not want that to happen to KI. I just think some are exagerating the situtaion when it come to jobs and other aspects. If it stayed open they would have cut a lot more jobs to make money. I doubt the fans of Gl would be complaining about those jobs. They would be saying that CF made a good bussiness decision to keep the park open. I'll bet the local Wal-Mart has more fulltime employees than GL did.

Yes I agree that it stinks a park is closing. I hate that some great coasters will be lost. The point is that the majority of the jobs lost will be part-time employees. They still are going to be operating half the park as a water park with many part time employees. Most of the people only work there during the operating season. Many do other thengs the rest of the year for employment. That is why I said I though it would be no big deal.

I don't think anybody is trying to shoot you down. I think people outside of the situation just understand why Cedar Fair is doing this. Your emotions are involved and it is a lot more personal to you. On a GL board you are going to get people who feel the exact same way. You are on a KI board where I bet at least half the people have not even been there and the ones that have just went there recently when their pass would get them in. Personally I thought Americana was a better park overall. And yes you are entitled to your opinion. Just don't be so upset when others express theirs.

Lose your childhood? Your 16. Plenty of time to get great memories at Kennywood or CP. They are both far superior parks than GL was. It was not that great of a park anyways. Have you even been to other parks? If you live in Cleveland than you live as close to CP and KW as I do to KI and I go there all the time. You have much better options than GL that are within a reasonable distance. Jobs - Most of the jobs are part-time students. The executives will go to other parks. Job loses at the park are not that big of a deal in my opinion. From the media reports the effect on the local economy is not a big deal either. GL just didn't make money and had zero effect on the area like it did years ago. Not trying to be a jerk. I just think it is good for Cedar Fairs future and it makes a lot of sense. I'm not happy a park is closing but most of the rides may be saved and that is a good thing. If anything it will make the other Cedar Fair parks that much better.

The biggest problem is not very many people care about GL. From what I have seen it is the weakest major park in the area. Why would anybody go there when to the east you have Kennywood, to the west you have CP, to the south you have KI. Not to mention Dorney, Hershey and a whole host of others not to far away. The people I know from Cleveland thought it was very funny that I even bothered to go up there from where I live.

I was going to bring up the Carrowinds angle but I was unsure if I was right.

The ironic thing about this is that Cedar Fair will put in better things at KI than KI received the whole time it was Paramounts "flagship park." We were the flagship park? I dont ever remember the park being called that in press releases or the website or anything. If you go buy which Paramount Park perofrmed the best.....PCW did much higher attendance than PKI did. Come on! Just about everybody knows KI was considered the flagship park of Paramount.

I read this on GLtoday. "Now, Cedar Fair bought Paramount parks for $1.3 Billion. They also took out a second loan for $500,000,000 to upgrade each of those parks, so in turn, their debt is $1.8 Billion, but its dropping." I sure would like to know how they are using that $500,000,000. With that kind of money they could put a $15 million coaster in all 5 former Paramount parks for the next six years and still have $50 million left over for other improvements. That is if that information is accurate.

The ironic thing about this is that Cedar Fair will put in better things at KI than KI received the whole time it was Paramounts "flagship park."

I totally understand that under Paramount their was no plans for a coaster. My point was that people were saying there was no plans for anything new long after CF took over control of the park. Those predictions were proven wrong when we got the news about FH. The same types of things are being said again this year. Like I said before, I don't think KI will get a new coaster in 2008 either.

What was the plan? No coaster. A sitdown restaurant? What? I don't understand what part of the post you are talking about.

Sure it would. Your telling me a sportsbar with tv's would not work in international street.

What do you mean where did that come from? KI severely needs a sit down restaurant. CF has been known to make restaurants the new additions for their parks. CW and CP to name a few.

I still remember all the people who said KI wouldn't get anything last year. How did that prediction work out? I don't think KI will get a coaster either but to say a coaster is "out of the question" is a little strong. I would be very happy with a good flat and a new sit down restaurant. Maybe a slide for the waterpark.

So has there been any rumors at all to what might happen at KI next year? I go to a lot of boards and I don't think I have seen one.

Stand-ups are just not that fun! KI needs to go B+M floorless, hyper, or inverted. KI should look into putting in one of each over the next 6 years. (Every other)

Well according to coastergrotto.com Kings Island attandance dropped from 2005 to 2006 But then again so did Cedar Point by a larger percent... So if we're talking new ride for next season, then I have a feeling there would be no new coaster; not based on attendance but based on money. I would go the flat ride/water park expansion route, if they add anything. A dive coaster would be something like anything listed on this page. That is not what I am talking about. Nowhere have we seen that this years attendance is down. Is it down from the statistics you just posted?

I would like to see TR:TR taken out and a smaller top spin put in the place where Flight Commander used to be. A new sit-down restaurant put in, and some new additions for Boomerang Bay. 2009: A new B+M invert put in the place where TR used to reside. I think this seems resonable except I have my doubts on whether they will take out TR:TR.

I just think they are not going to bother right now with something they are going to redo in the offseason. Why put a lot of money in something you are going to change in a few months. That would be a waste of money.

Where do you get that attendance is low? I have never seen any numbers. Why would a new coaster fix an attendance problem when a new coaster didn't fix this so-called attendance problem this year? Not trying to be a jerk! I think we would be seeing some signs of this if it were going to happen there.

Apparently not everyone believes CP is the best there is. I think its attendance came in around 15th in North America (2006). CP has it positives (but so does other parks) but it depends on what you consider important. I would take Busch Garden Europe over CP any day. I love CP but BGE is one awesome park!

"Calm down man, you are taking Interpreter's comment way to personal." Not really. I don't really care that much. Sorry if it came across that way.

In the context my statement is just fine. I am saying that I believe that they will unload at least a few parks. I am not some kid on here trying to act like I know things. I am just having a discussion.

Since their debt load is really LARGE i would be very suprised if star trek and geauga lake would even come close to what they need financially. Ever get the feeling that no matter how many times you make a well-reasoned, logical statement rooted in real-world pragmatism, in some cases it will just never sink in? Yes, and I have seen you experience such events as well. I understand what you are saying but my thinking is that getting rid of properties can do a lot of financial good. I would get rid of Great America, Geauga Lake, and Star Trek. The only other park I could see being in danger would be MIA. I just don't know much about it. What this would do is: 1. They could use the attractions at those parks to add to the other parks for the next couple of years. Between ThunderHawk, Dominator, Double Loop, Head Spin, Invertigo, Vortex, Top Gun, Psycho Mouse, Demon, and maybe a few of the wooden coasters you could almost add a new coaster to each of the left over parks. Plus you could do water park expansions and add a few flats also. I know it costs money to move rides but it is still cheaper than buying new ones. 2. You would think the money they get from selling land (Geauga Lake) and the money they would save from not having to lease land (Great America) would at least help them make their payments on their debt for the next couple of years. Not even wanting to guess how much their payments are. 3. They would save a ton of money on employees. I just think something will happen. The funny thing is last year when I visited Geauga Lake for the first time I said to my friend that I bet they sell the land here and move the rides to other parks. They have done half of that. I have another friend that lives 15 minutes from GL and he thinks its funny that I have gone there the last 2 years. People that live around that park do not respect it very much. Where would they store all of these coasters from other amusement parks to install over the next couple of years? After all, they won't own those parks' properties any more. I would think every ride would have to be torn down and re-built in one year. Do you really think that would be a problem? I think every park has the room to store a coaster. They are doing it with SV at Dorney. In my opinion, something is going to happen to the parks! They may continue over the next few years to just scale down a few parks until they just close them or they could sell them as is in the next year. We shall see.

Since their debt load is really LARGE i would be very suprised if star trek and geauga lake would even come close to what they need financially. Ever get the feeling that no matter how many times you make a well-reasoned, logical statement rooted in real-world pragmatism, in some cases it will just never sink in? Yes, and I have seen you experience such events as well. I understand what you are saying but my thinking is that getting rid of properties can do a lot of financial good. I would get rid of Great America, Geauga Lake, and Star Trek. The only other park I could see being in danger would be MIA. I just don't know much about it. What this would do is: 1. They could use the attractions at those parks to add to the other parks for the next couple of years. Between ThunderHawk, Dominator, Double Loop, Head Spin, Invertigo, Vortex, Top Gun, Psycho Mouse, Demon, and maybe a few of the wooden coasters you could almost add a new coaster to each of the left over parks. Plus you could do water park expansions and add a few flats also. I know it costs money to move rides but it is still cheaper than buying new ones. 2. You would think the money they get from selling land (Geauga Lake) and the money they would save from not having to lease land (Great America) would at least help them make their payments on their debt for the next couple of years. Not even wanting to guess how much their payments are. 3. They would save a ton of money on employees. I just think something will happen. The funny thing is last year when I visited Geauga Lake for the first time I said to my friend that I bet they sell the land here and move the rides to other parks. They have done half of that. I have another friend that lives 15 minutes from GL and he thinks its funny that I have gone there the last 2 years. People that live around that park do not respect it very much.