TombRaiderFTW

Standbyme, you always post the coolest KI history on here. This is no different--thank you for sharing! I love this!

Holiday World has more than 3 coasters... Howler ERT, anyone?

I think I remember reading once that that slide, when tested with a dummy, proceeded to disassemble said dummy by ripping some of the limbs off. Unlike Thorpe Park, I don't think they ever publicized it as being a reason to ride.

I would LOVE to, but once again, Holiwood Nights falls the weekend before finals. I'm pretty much guaranteed a nasty homework load that weekend, so my chances of attending are slim to none. Can't wait for semesters next year...

^ I've seen several people incorrectly abbreviate Great Coasters International as CGI... This is the first time I've ever seen it work the other way!

^^ Fair enough on the layout. If nothing else, the ride's got this insanely powerful feeling when you ride it. The roughness of the helices actually added to the pacing, in my opinion. And you make a good point. But there's also the fact that the ride had to pass design evaluation by RCCA (whatever that's worth), Paramount, and the Department of Agriculture, as well as several outside sources over the course of the incidents. With that much design evaluation by diverse sources, I can't imagine a static structure (which is what most rides spend their lives as) being that unsafe. I got the impression from the accident report that it was unexpected dynamic loading due to the trains shuffling all over the place that caused that ledger to break, but I could be (and probably am) wrong. They never explicitly said anything like that; it's just what I assumed based off the forces they found to be unaccounted for in the design. The mid-construction collapse keeps coming to mind, but I don't know if that's something that can be blamed on design or if it was an unfortunate mix of incomplete structure and severely damaging winds.

An IAAPA or two ago, Rocky Mountain emphasized that neither their topper track nor their Iron Horse rails weighed significantly more than the classic wood stack used on wooden coasters. I think there's also a popular assumption going around about the supports that I'd bet is a little off. Parks don't seem to regularly replace the actual supports of wooden coasters nearly as regularly as they do the track. Take a look at the horizontal beams on The Beast lift hill: there are several there that have sagged due to a long exposure to gravity at that angle. And that's with the ride being in almost daily use every summer for the past 33 years, a majority of which I'd bet those supports have seen. (Granted, you could easily argue that those certain supports don't experience much stress, and I'd agree. But the park also has replaced high-force track and support sections over the past few years where needed, and they certainly wouldn't have excluded Son of Beast from that sort of maintenance. You wanna talk about liabilities?) I don't pretend to know diddly squat about wood rot, but if The Beast, with supports like that on a structure that repeatedly bears the weight of trains hundreds and hundreds of times per day six months out of the year, passes inspection from the state of Ohio, why are people so convinced that a significantly younger Son of Beast, which hasn't experienced any sort of loading in the past three years, is a rotting termite buffet that will topple over in a slight wind? It wasn't the quality of the wood that caused the 2006 incident; the official 2006 ODoA incident report essentially cited faulty design as the cause. Solely from what I understand from other posters here, the wood used on the ride has been pressure-treated, thus preventing it from being weathered as easily as everyone is assuming it currently is. People aren't concerned that Kentucky Kingdom's/Bluegrass Boardwalk's Thunder Run will implode upon itself if someone happens to sneeze in the nearby vicinity, and it's been SBNO almost as long. From a fatigue standpoint, Son of Beast is actually faring better standing still than Beast or Racer. I don't mean to sound like I'm coming down on you, Klockster. I just don't get where people are coming from. As far as your last question goes: you make a really good point about how exciting the ride would be if the track was steel. It'd depend on what they'd change about the layout, but it sure doesn't seem like there's a lot of room for creativity if they stick with what they've got...

From my extremely limited perspective, I don't really see why it couldn't work. In terms of forces, it'd just be the same as braking, but with the force exerted on the track going in the opposite direction. With LSM technology similar to the fins on rides like Sky Rocket and Maverick, it seems like they'd just need to design some sort of magnetic component for the trains to respond to the LSMs. I'm sure there must be more to it than that.

^ And they took video of people literally hurtling the metal detectors and posted it online. I don't mean to come down on the park, as it said a whole lot of good about the excitement of opening day, but... wow. No matter what you believe about whether or not the metal detectors are actually used, that also says some things that aren't very nice about park security.

I don't really know that I can point-blank rate Thunderhead as being better than Beast, or vice versa, though I realize I've got a top 5 on my "About Me" page* that doesn't include Beast. The coasters are great for their own reasons, and if you try to apply those reasons to one another, you're sorely disappointed. The Beast is the model for how to appropriately pace a roller coaster, even with magnetic trim brakes. It doesn't have airtime, and, quite frankly, I don't think it needs it. From the top of the first lift to the bottom of the second, the ride literally facades itself. It's wide, almost lateral-free turns and long stretches of straight track that lull the rider into believing the ride is tame. The pacing increases slightly over the course of this first half as you start to encounter the tunnels, the trains making this tremendous roar as you pass through the concrete portions to increasingly sudden turns. Then, just as the speed hits its peak--you hit the second lift. With how far you've come and how big the lift is, you almost expect it to be the end of the ride, until you remember you saw the double helix from the top of the first lift. You reach the top of the second lift and see the park in its entirety, but then you're turning away from that--the ride's teased you with the idea of being done, but its "worst" is yet to come. You're heading down this long stretch of track with a minuscule 10-degree downward angle towards this ominous tunnel mouth buried in the trees you thought you'd escaped, and the train is bucking like crazy and picking up speed. I honestly like the trim on this drop--it's like the ride's last-ditch attempt to let you "save yourself" before you get swallowed by the tunnel and go through the crazy intense helix. And only after that does the ride decide it'll let you go. Night rides only amplify the theatrics of the pacing, which is why people tend to like night rides on The Beast more, in my opinion--instead of The Beast toying with you, it's like he's chasing you through the dark woods. The helix tunnel becomes this pitch black hole that literally devours you, thus increasing the impression that you never really escape The Beast; he decides to let you go... for now. (The Beast is basically the Chuck Norris of roller coasters.) Thunderhead, on the contrary, only vaguely relies on pacing in comparison to The Beast. I don't mean that in a derogatory way; I'm just saying that the pacing starts on "fast" and ends on "very fast," where The Beast goes from "intentionally slow" to "fast." I see Thunderhead more as GCI's attempt to stuff as much airtime into a somewhat limited area as possible by using the terrain, and the results were these crazy fast banking/G-force transitions and high-banked turns that only increase their frequency the closer the train gets to the brakes. Does that mean it's a bad ride? Definitely not, but it's very difficult for me to appreciate it the same way I appreciate rides like The Beast, Kennywood's Thunderbolt, or Holiday World's Raven or Voyage, all of which also place a higher emphasis on pacing. I love me some Thunderhead, but it's not in the same way I love those other rides. It's a great ride, but there just isn't as much depth in the design as it feels like there is on The Beast, which is something that seems to be common on the GCI rides I've been on. The only ones that come close are Hersheypark's Lightning Racers, but not very. The Beast lulls you into a false sense of security then wows you with its double helix; Thunderhead throws everything it's got and the kitchen sink at you from the top of the lift to the brake run. It's almost apples and oranges. (Again, just to stress this: GCI makes fantastic rides. I don't mean to hate on them, as they're easily some of my favorite coasters to ride. I've just never seen a GCI that made me think, "Wow, they're really switching up the pacing like crazy on that guy.") By the by, guys, have I ever mentioned I really get into dissecting design elements and themes in rides? *My top 5 functions more like a "top 5 rides I'd most like to ride right now" list than a "top 5 rides I've ever been on" list. The only reasons The Beast isn't on there is because I've ridden it so many times and because it's so close to where I live. I might only get to visit Holiday World and Kennywood once each per year, so that's why they get a slightly higher priority. I can't wait to ride The Beast in a week!

I'm very interested to see how this works out. My initial reaction is that this is a very unique way of appealing to the same teen market that the late ads under Kinzel (like Ride Warriors, etc.) were aimed towards. Considering Ouimet's aim for experiences the whole family can enjoy, I'm curious to see if it's got as much of a "club" feel as the animation suggests.

That's kind of how amusement parks work. They try to make improvements and additions each year to give people a reason to come back. You could apply your theory to most major parks in the world, as well as several smaller parks. Not to mention that, if you're trying to find a pattern, you'd probably want to look more closely at what Cedar Fair's doing and less at what Paramount did. If CF even has a pattern to their installments (which I slightly doubt), I don't think they're going to say something like, "Oh, the last owners installed a yellow ride in 2003. We'd better install a yellow ride in 2013 to keep up the pattern."

^^ I have to agree with Terp. Dollywood's definitely got the most consistently friendly staff I've ever encountered. I also agree with kingsrattler that the guests themselves have been far friendlier in my two visits than at any other park I've been to, too. It's the sort of mutual respect I wish Kings Island's employees and guests had, but I don't really know how they'd establish that at this point.

Huh, looks like that photo actually shows Racer with its final drops. I always thought those were removed when that path was placed. Apparently not. gad198, thanks for sharing that! It's very cool reading about FoF's opening.

Had to revive this thread. As I've discovered this quarter, everyone I know within my major (as well as several outside it) is convinced of three things pertaining to Kings Island: 1. Son of Beast has killed multitudes of riders. 2. Kings Island is still owned by Paramount (which, I'll grant you, is not something immediately noticeable if you don't follow the park to any degree, but I figured at least one person would be in the know after six years. Apparently not.) 3. Vortex was torn down last year. Facepalming is abundant these days.

I think it will have no atmosphere change on the neighborhood, and I think it will have an incredibly minimal effect, if any, on drawing new customers in from the surrounding neighborhood. I do think it presents an influence on the actions of the guests that were going to be there anyway, and you can't promise that that influence will always be positive. I can't promise it will, with any frequency, be negative, but theme parks attract a wide range of folks.

Any Dartron Industries Hurricane (or Down Draft) at several county fairs. Awful.

I find it a little ironic that, in a single post, you've accused all who dislike this change as being closed-minded, yet you seem to base your argument entirely on every person who buys Kennywood's beer being responsible and orderly. I'm not going to pretend some of the people opposing this change aren't being closed-minded, but do you really think introducing alcohol will introduce no new security issues at all? The opposing arguments aren't entirely unreasonable. And, for the record: I'm not wild about the idea of Kennywood selling alcohol, but I'll still be there sometime this year if possible. I'm not there for the beer; I'm there for Thunderbolt and Potato Patch fries. Given how the park already exceeded my expectations last year, I'm sure they'll handle this just fine.

^ ...and, if I had to guess, potential security issues. And PR issues, as this isn't flying well with several people, at least on the park's Facebook page. The idea of Kennywood selling beer corrupts many guests' impressions of the park as a family place, it seems.

^^ Really? I never knew that. Thanks for the tip, Browntggr.

Kings Dominion: where the best thing to do is in Ohio.

I've already been to Dollywood's opening day. The only thing that's for certain for me is multiple KI trips over the course of the summer. In an ideal world where I've got the money and time for such things, I'd like to visit Holiday World, Camden Park, and Kennywood. I'd also like to try a Conneaut Lake Park/Waldameer trip.

Yeah... not to rain on your parade, but you might as well look into the Save Son of Beast page on Facebook if you're wanting somewhere to rally. Those guys are pretty crazy about the coaster. (Not that it'll force a decision for KI, like The Interpreter said.)

Yeah, Michigan's Adventure is kind of random. I've only been there once, but it's pretty obvious the dry side of that park is not why people go there. In the middle of the afternoon, the midway by Corkscrew, which is adjacent to the waterpark, was crazy. The further you walked to Shivering Timbers and Thunderhawk, both on the opposite side of the park, the more deserted it got. I think the longest wait of the day was for their (excellent) wild mouse, which was something like 5-10 minutes. (The midway near Shivering Timbers was a ghost town.) It'd make a whole lot more sense if their Fast Lane was for the waterpark, but maybe they don't have the accessibility to do that.

I love the Pigeon Forge/Gatlinburg area. It's slightly cheesy and a bit of a tourist trap, but it's endearing. I'm incredibly jealous that you got to ride the Ober Gatlinbug alpine slide--it was closed in December, and I didn't get the chance to visit OG during my spring break trip. What'd you think of it?