homestar92

Aight. I'mma head out. The only thing worse in my mind than a Vortex-less Kings Island is a Flagged Kings Island. I've been to many Six Flags parks. Only one of which qualifies as "better than average" in my mind and that's Great America. The only winner here would be Six Flags who would finally have a few decent parks in their portfolio.

To be fair, I think this is the first Arrow coaster that I can recall Cedar Fair retiring in the last decade or more. I don't think we can take one closure as a trend or an indication of things to come. Besides, the only other "big" Arrow looper in the chain is Anaconda, which is newer and far less beloved than Vortex. So if it were to close, there's no way it gets this kind of reaction.

Are we not considering the Darien Lake Viper as one of the "big" loopers? What about Dragon Mountain? Both are several years older than Vortex and have not had any indication of an impending closure.

I don't think they really make those anymore. I feel like floorless coasters have kinda rendered them obsolete.

Man oh man where to start. So, I think it's no secret that Vortex is extremely sentimental to me. Some members around here who used to be very active know the reasons, but most of the new faces probably don't. So I'll start with the beginning so that people understand why I love Vortex so much in particular. 2010 was my first visit to Kings Island in many, many years. I had been deathly afraid of roller coasters up to that point, but was dragged kicking and screaming onto Flight of Fear by a girl I was dating at the time and I loved the ride (not that it matters to the story, but that is not the girl I would eventually be married to, though our breakup was amicable and I do still consider her a friend). The next one we did was Vortex, which was her favorite and I think that enthusiasm for the ride rubbed off on me and made me love it. That was my first serious relationship and I think the desire to impress the girl can change someone in more ways than they might realize. We rode that ride over and over that day. I didn't actually have a pass in 2010, just a two-day ticket and then later a single-day Haunt admission, but I think that year I rode Vortex more times in those three visits than in any other season to date. Well, during one of those rides that day, we were in line in the section at the top of the stairs that overlooks the brake run and a mutual friend, Jeremy, was on the train below making a fool of himself as was pretty typical. He always was the class clown type. So we spent the rest of the day riding with him and while we had been friends for years (our parents ran the childrens' ministries at our respective churches and we ended up at A LOT of events and such together so we'd been friends for basically our whole lives but never extremely close) it was those days at Kings Island and on Vortex in particular that we really bonded and became the closest friends I think either of us had ever had. I didn't see him much except in the summer though because I went to college several hours away (Muskingum University, just east of Zanesville). Summer of 2011 rolls around and I have a gold pass now that my parents got me for Christmas the past year. Through May and June, Jeremy and I probably made 15 visits to the park, always making it a point to ride Vortex at least a dozen times. Vortex was our "classy lady" as we called it. So I leave to visit my grandparents in Milwaukee over 4th of July weekend. I remember WindSeeker having opened pretty late in the year that year and I hadn't yet had a chance to ride it. Jeremy and I were going to ride it that first visit after I got back from Wisconsin. One of my other good friends who would later be the best man at my wedding got a chance to ride it the day it opened to the public and had told me good things about the ride experience. I was really looking forward not only to the new ride but to all the cool new angles to watch Vortex from. On the 4th of July, I felt pain that I sincerely hope nobody else ever experiences in their lives. I got a call while I was away in Wisconsin that Jeremy had been killed in a car accident. He was with a couple of his other friends (I didn't know these ones, thankfully, as the day would have been that much worse) and they were driving far too fast and lost control and hit a tree. To this day, I can't drive through that part of Hamilton because seeing that tree shakes me to my core in a way that I can't even begin to describe. It was really hard to go to KI for a while without my riding buddy. If anyone here remembers seeing a strange man sitting in a fetal position crying at the entrance to Vortex in July of 2011, that was me. I didn't get to ride Vortex for a while after that because you may remember that just a few days earlier, its chain broke. I'm a religious man and I don't believe in coincidence, and to this day, I think God himself knew that I couldn't emotionally handle riding Vortex for a while and that he stepped in to make sure I didn't jump the gun and try before I was ready. On a similar note to that, I did get to ride WindSeeker on my first visit back after he passed. It was a night ride and it was right as the park closed. My first ride on WindSeeker was a fireworks ride and in that moment, I was happy at the park again, for the first time since the incident. That's part of why I have a deep sentimental attachment to WindSeeker too despite not even particularly liking the ride. Make no mistake, Vortex IS my favorite ride just based on my enjoyment of the ride experience, but because of everything I've written here, it became not only a favorite, but deeply sentimental and important to me. So for me, losing Vortex is not just losing a roller coaster that I like as was the case with Firehawk, I'm losing my last earthly memento of that friendship and it's not something I expected I'd have to part with so soon. Fast forward a few years to 2013. The aforementioned girl and I had actually just recently broken up. We had been together for three years. It was hard emotionally, but the long distance thing during the school year was just too taxing on both of us emotionally and we decided it would be better to call it off. Anyway, at the Ed Alonzo show during the KIC day event that year (still the best enthusiast event I've ever attended, BTW) we were all in the KI Theater waiting for the show to start and I overheard someone talking about how much they love Arrows and in particular, Vortex. Being the socially awkward dork that I am who can't pick up social cues, I didn't realize that he was chatting with his girlfriend and that it's really not an appropriate time to butt in. But thankfully, he decided to have a conversation with me anyway about all our favorite Arrows. Some of you may know him because it's the now-banned KIC member TheDevariousEffect. Anywho, we end up bonding over our mutual appreciation of Arrows and ended up becoming close friends over the following months and years. We were roommates for a while and ended up becoming extremely close friends and he was actually a part of my wedding party (just to alleviate the fears of those who know him, no, I did not ever let him have a hot mic at the reception ). I can tell you right now, that had Vortex not been so important and meaningful to me, I probably never would have butted into that conversation, and that's a very important friendship that I never would have made. I have so many Vortex memories and I could never even *begin* to share them all here, but this should summarize the important ones. The ride has been central to so many pivotal moments in my life. Losing it is going to be extremely difficult. It's going to be hard for a long time to go to the park and not see it there. I understand the business sense in the removal. While I probably will avoid the park for a while, it's not like I'm trying to punish them or boycott them. I'm just not quite ready emotionally to see Coney Mall without my Vortex yet. I'm not angry, bitter, or resentful at the park. Just sad. Very sad. I understand that they have to do what they have to do, but that really doesn't make it much easier. I happened to find one of my on-ride photos from that visit in 2010. I'm amazed I even kept it this long, but I found it funny. Try and forgive me for being in the wrong seat - this was before I realized that 7-1 is the only correct place to sit. Me and my ex-girlfriend are in the front and Jeremy is behind us acting silly because that's just what Jeremy did.

No. It would be unwise for them to do so. PTC has said they don't want their trains being run backwards. That may not have been the reason for flipping them back to both be forward (the park denies this and claims the reason was to restore the ride to its original experience) however, with that in mind, it opens the door for possible litigation if any incident, related or otherwise, were to happen on Racer. If a rider were to be hurt on Racer and their lawyer found out the ride was being operated outside of the manufacturer's recommendation, that is the kind of thing that any competent lawyer would jump on.

Note that I didn't say I categorize by what the wheels are sitting on, I categorize by what material is the predominant one between the upstop wheels and the drive wheels. Yes, all wooden coasters' wheels are directly contacting a series of thin steel strips. But between those thin steel strips? Wood. That's the key. RMC topper track wheels ride on a steel box with no wood in its construction whatsoever. It's no different than the construction of a mine train coaster, which are universally regarded as steel. The differentiation between topper track and I-box track is just enthusiasts and manufacturers being pedantic to claim records. The fact is, in either case, No wood exists between the wheels whatsoever.

If no wood whatsoever exists between the drive wheels and the upstop wheels at any point on the ride cycle, I have a hard time calling the coaster "wooden". Intamin prefabs, while certainly not traditional wooden coasters, are wooden coasters because the wheels ride on wood. It's not about "feel", it's about what the wheels are actually riding on. If we're going by "feel", then Adventure Express is a wooden coaster and El Toro is steel and both of those are obviously not true. The majority of Adventure Express is also wood, as are the majority of all RMC Iron Horse coasters (except Storm Chaser). Not a single person is calling those wooden coasters. A few wooden boards that sit under the actual track rails on a coaster where no wood exists between the wheels doesn't make a meaningful differentiation with something like a mine train coaster. RMCs are steel coasters that the manufacturer has decided to claim as wooden so that they can claim records.

Wait, are you implying that you think their announcement was fine? I'm not sure what would be a "good" announcement other than giving us a farewell season. What I can say, however, is that a 6AM push notification is the second-worst way this could possibly be handled. The only worse option would be to announce it after the park has already closed for the year.

To be honest, I just assumed that was where Stricker's got their Mosier tower. I guess not.

All we have to go off of are the published ridership numbers, which we haven't had in several years, but we do at least have a few years after Banshee, which means the numbers should still be fairly accurate relative to each other (I don't imagine Mystic would take riders away from Vortex in the same way that Banshee might). The most recent years when those numbers were published still placed Vortex's ridership solidly above average for coasters at KI. That's the only empirical data we really have, and that data pointed to it being reasonably popular. KI is a local park that caters primarily to season passholders (AKA, repeat visitors). If Vortex is pulling numbers, that means people enjoyed the ride. There aren't a ton of people at KI on a typical day who are ignorant to what the ride experience is like and will ride it without knowing what to expect and hate it.

This is generally why I believe the reason *must* be structural. People can claim nobody liked Vortex, but they'd be wrong. It may not often have a line, but it still sends trains that are usually mostly full, which means it still operates at close to capacity. The ride is still popular and KI acknowledged that in the blog post. I imagine the park knew that the news wouldn't go over well, which is also why I don't think they would remove it if it was within the realm of reason to keep it going. Anything other than a structural problem would be relatively inexpensive to fix, and I imagine that's the route they would go if they felt it was possible. I just wish it got a proper send off. The biggest hurt in all this is that the news was broken by a 6AM push notification from the app. That's like getting broken up with via a text message, and that aspect of the removal, I think we can all agree, is not cool. It feels wrong that freaking Mantis got a better send off than Vortex (and Mantis didn't even really go anywhere!)

*sigh* Again, parts availability for Arrows was not a problem and never has been, and won't be for the foreseeable future. Metal fatigue is what will be the undoing of the Arrows. Parts are readily available and still in production. We've beaten this horse time and time again, please let it be dead. The "aftermarket" parts you referenced are only "aftermarket" in the same way that parts for a pre-2010 GM vehicle aren't technically being made by the same company as when the cars were new (since the GM of today is technically a different company than the pre-2010 GM). Take the VIP coaster tour at Busch Gardens Williamsburg and they will let you see and handle some of Loch Ness Monster's wheels. "Arrow" is still stamped on the metal on those parts to this day. And Cedar Fair is most certainly not removing their Arrow Suspended coasters. Every single Arrow suspended coaster that has ever been under Cedar Fair's ownership is still operating, and none of them have had a closure announced at this time.

If the ride is going to be gone, I want it to be gone. Sitting SBNO for years is not the treatment that Vortex deserves. An empty field right off the midway next to your big new attraction is kind of a bad look, but an abandoned old steel coaster being left to rust away right next to your big new ride is a very bad look.

No. Not meaning to do a one word post, but that myth has always been absurd. People have been saying that for decades. If it was sinking that long, it would be about 30 feet tall by now.

If we are talking about possible situations like Mantis where they announce it's being retired but it actually isn't, I think the most likely situation would be a Blue Hawk conversion with new trains, paint, and a new name. If there are structural problems, though, that would do nothing to address the issue. If it's a popularity problem and the ride is otherwise fine, then it might.

"Reached the end of its service life" seems to me that it's industry speak for "we're removing this attraction and we don't want to share the exact reasons" Which, honestly, is fair. We don't need to know why and very little good would likely come from the general public knowing the park's M.O. in situations like this.

You must have had supremely bad luck on days you visited, because Vortex had extremely little downtime compared to most of the other coasters, and I'd challenge you to find me even one reputable report of an actual injury on the ride (no, a headache is not an injury). Also, hate to double post, but I don't know how to edit a quote into an old post...

You are right on that one. Especially older Arrows. While modern steel coasters are bolted together, which makes replacing a small section of track a little more feasable, old Arrows were welded in many cases, so the only way to remove a section of track is to cut it off. If there are structural problems (which seems the most reasonable explanation to me given how sudden the announcement was, but I certainly don't know for sure) then it would be an incredible pain to fix them. I know that the park is willing to go through those efforts if they deem it worth the cost, as a few small sections of track got replaced when Flight Deck became The Bat. I guess this time, they needed some extensive work and deemed it not worthwhile. While I have no idea what the reasons for the removal are, I'm confident that it's not parts (as in the normal wear and tear parts that need replaced regularly on any coaster) and I'm fairly confident it's not that they want that land for some plans in the immediate future. Which is why a stucture problem seems more likely, but heck, it could be a matter of not feeling it's worth paying 4 ride ops to run that one whenever the park is open anymore.

I don't disagree with you on that. I knew this day was coming one day, and in the not-too-distant future (though the timing feels like a gut punch from left field). I was responding in particular to the supposition that parts are no longer available and that being the reason for the ride's closure, which is definitely not true. Maybe we're splitting hairs, but I don't consider structure or track to fall under the same umbrella as "parts"

Parts availability is not and has never been a problem. I don't know why the ride is being removed, but I do know that's not the reason. S&S still produces replacement parts for all Arrow coaster models. Heck, they actually still produce actual 4D coasters, which were an Arrow creation.

The actual card doesn't have a coaster on it at all and hasn't for years. They haven't changed their stock pass image in years. It's the same at every park except Knotts and Cedar Point which both are using different artwork due to their major anniversaries.

OK, sure. But if they aren't using that land for five years, then there is no land-related reason for the ride currently sitting there to be removed for at least 4. The people who are celebrating its removal aren't getting excited over the nebulous attraction that may or may not come at some undefined point in the future. They're celebrating that a ride they didn't like and were never forced to ride is going away, despite the fact that many people loved it. That's pretty childish. If the land was to be used in 2020 or 2021, I get being happy that Vortex is being removed to make way for the future. But we just got the most expensive announcement in park history. I can safely wager that we are not getting anything there in 2020 or 2021. If the future plan is a coaster, I'd guess not even 2022.

And with all due respect, the general public are dead wrong on this one. A ride getting removed and being replaced by *nothing* is a bad, or at best, neutral thing for every guest in the park. Unless someone was literally forcing them to ride Vortex, there is no logical reason for anyone to celebrate its removal. I despise Invertigo as much as it is possible for someone to hate an inanimate object, but I would be a little bit miffed if they announced it was being removed and nothing would be taking its place at all. There are people out there who do like it and celebrating their disappointment is a bit petty and shallow.

Memes are my favorite coping mechanism.