eek! Top gun!

[Skywriter]

All i got to say is Top Gun is a fun ride when u got nothing better to do I like b.c it's pretty fast and has sharp turns I would never wait over 20 min for it.

[Browntggrr]

Let me just say this...I don't think either of you have enough data to say definitively whether or not the GP likes SOB.

When did I say anything about the GP's feelings?

[KIBeast]

Ok, then to me, it makes your arguement less valid then, if you are basing everything off of entusiasts' opinions. We all know us coaster nerds only make up .000001% of their customer base. I was trying to be polite in saying that you are both right and you are both wrong.

[Browntggrr]

^ You can only base information off of enthusiasts opinions because, again, they are the only ones that actually compile data. The GP does not. Nor has the GP actually been on enough coasters to form an opinion that is not tainted or fanboy driven. I'm not saying that the GP doesn't count, but if they have only been on 5 wooden coasters, and are all in the state of Ohio, how can they say (hypothetically) that SoB is better than El Toro? And even though an enthusiast makes up a small percentage of the customers base, if an enthusiast goes to 50 parks a year, and the GP only goes to 2 parks a year, which group has a better feel as to which parks/ rides are better?

And in reading all the enthusiast sites, a majority (90%) of them dislike SoB. You can't change how they feel, they just don't like it.

I can't hide the way they feel. It is clearly in black and white for all to see. And again, an enthusiast has been on more rides, has an idea what to expect, and knows how to "ride" a coaster. The last thing an enthusiast wants is to hate a coaster.

[KIBeast]

But, we are not comparing one coaster against another. We are only trying to figure out if the GP loves or hates SOB (and the gp does not need to compare from one coaster to the next to know whether or not they like said coaster). The coaster geeks are not enough of a basis to determine whether or not the GP likes or dislikes this coaster, which is really the arguement. I think we can all agree that the enthusiasts don't like SOB, but as stated before, their opinions do not make up enough of the GP's opinions to even determine what the GP likes or dislikes. Like I said before, you would have to survey every person who rode SOB over at least a three year period before you can even START to come to any conclusions at all about what they like or don't like. Both sides that have been debating are only drawing from a SMALL sample of guests and neither arguement can DEFINITIVELY represent the GP's opinion.

[Browntggrr]

But, we are not comparing one coaster against another. We are only trying to figure out if the GP loves or hates SOB (and the gp does not need to compare from one coaster to the next to know whether or not they like said coaster). The coaster geeks are not enough of a basis to determine whether or not the GP likes or dislikes this coaster, which is really the arguement. I think we can all agree that the enthusiasts don't like SOB, but as stated before, their opinions do not make up enough of the GP's opinions to even determine what the GP likes or dislikes. Like I said before, you would have to survey every person who rode SOB over at least a three year period before you can even START to come to any conclusions at all about what they like or don't like. Both sides that have been debating are only drawing from a SMALL sample of guests and neither arguement can DEFINITIVELY represent the GP's opinion.

And I am also not comparing one coaster against another. Where did you get that from?

And I am not trying to figure out if the GP loves or hates SoB. You are. Again, with the information we have through "coaster geek" sites, SoB is not a good coaster. If the GP would have their own input about SoB, you would immediately tag them as an enthusiast and throw out their opinion. So, as I have asked before, what is valid? And now since you have brought it up, what do you consider a SMALL sampling of guests?

And since representitives of parks do frequent "coaster geek" sites like KIC, obviously the park does listen to a "SMALL sample", even though you refuse to.

If the "coaster geeks" do not provide enough information for you as to how well SoB is received, so be it. But then that also means that all "coaster geek" sites should be treated with the same respect and their feelings thrown out as well. It's a good thing that park representatives do not feel that way or such events as: Coastermania, KIC day, BeastBuzz, Holiwood nights, and the X2 campout would never happen.

[KIBeast]

I'm not saying throw out the opinions of us coaster geeks. What I am saying is that KI has millions of visitors every year. A few hundred thousand (if there are even that many, a small sampling)coaster geeks do not represent the opinion of the entire general public who visit anually. You're making generalizations. You are making the conclusion that since most coaster enthusiasts don't like SOB, then it must mean the GP doesn't like it and you just don't know that.

And no, if there was actual data that represents the GP, then I wouldn't say, well, they are enthusiasts, so we can't count them. Fact of the matter is, there is no real representation of what the GP thinks. Just as witnessing a small crowd of marathoning guests does not represent the opinions of the GP, neither do the opinions of the coaster community.

And I do listen to what the coaster community thinks, but I also take it with a grain of salt because I'm not going to decide whether or not to ride a coaster based upon what someone else thinks just like I won't refuse to go see a movie just because some people have stated that they don't like it. I go and see the movie or ride that coaster for myself and make up my own mind. Something I would suggest everyone do.

As far as coaster events go, I couldn't really care. They don't sway my opinion to go or not to go. Coaster sites wouldn't drop off the planet just because they couldn't have an event just for them.

I suppose you think the new coaster(if that's what is being built) is being built to satisfy the coaster community because people on here and other boards have been whining for years about how KI needs something like this?

[Browntggrr]

I suppose you think the new coaster(if that's what is being built) is being built to satisfy the coaster community because people on here and other boards have been whining for years about how KI needs something like this?

Replying to your edit: Has the coaster community been whining for years that KI needs something like this? Where did you get that information from?

As far as coaster events: it really doesn't matter if you care about them or not. But if the parks felt the same way, the events would not take place. Since they do take place, it is quite obvious that parks do listen to what "coaster geeks" say and react to how they feel within the best intrests of the park.

I am also not making generalizations. I simply supplied information of various sites from "coaster geeks" on how they feel about SoB. I never mentioned that the GP likes or dislikes SoB. I do not have access to that information. Do you? I would love to hear it. I have simply stated that with the information that we do have access to, people do not like SoB. But the opinions of how "coaster geeks" feel about SoB certainly show a trend that most don't like the ride. Much like a straw poll, internet poll, movie ratings, or a restaurant review etc. Sure, they are not the end all of how the majority feels, but they are certainly listened to and they also give a good pulse as to the trend. For instance: you can usually find a good movie review for every bad movie review. But when the majority of critics agree that a movie is bad, the trend is that the movie is bad (i.e. Gigli, Batman & Robin etc.). I really don't see that much a difference when it comes down to coasters.

[KIBeast]

For someone who gets all of his information from coaster sites, you sure don't read much. I've seen it here, on coasterbuzz, and other coaster sites that people have been wanting some type of hyper coaster built at KI for years. I've heard it since I've joined these forums. I have said it myself. If KI listened to me so closely or anyone else from the coaster community, we'd have a lot more coasters than what we do now.

I totally disagree with you about movie reviews. I believe ET was given the thumbs down, as well as many other movies that went on to become highly popular with the general public. On rare occassions, like the two movies you suggested, they are actually right.

But the opinions of how "coaster geeks" feel about SoB certainly show a trend that most don't like the ride.

It only proves a trend that most "coaster geeks" don't like SOB.

The other person debating was the one stating about how they believe the GP is seeming to love SOB and she/he has no more proof that this is true than you have that they do not. I never claimed I know how the GP feels about SOB. But I also never claimed that the coaster community alone speaks for everyone.

[Browntggrr]

For someone who gets all of his information from coaster sites, you sure don't read much. I've seen it here, on coasterbuzz, and other coaster sites that people have been wanting some type of hyper coaster built at KI for years. I've heard it since I've joined these forums. I have said it myself. If KI listened to me so closely or anyone else from the coaster community, we'd have a lot more coasters than what we do now.

As I anticipated you would, you missed the point.

Yes, "coaster geeks" have been banging the proverbial drum for a hyper steel, preferably B & M, for YEARS now.

(And an FYI, KI does have "some type of hyper coaster". Ironically it is SoB.)

Those same "coaster geeks" that have been begging for a hyper steel, also dislike SoB. So if you listened to the "coaster geeks" complain about the lack of a huge steelie at KI, you have to of heard the same complaints about SoB.

Now to answer your question without the sarcasm: Is KI building the new coaster to satisfy "coaster geeks"? I'm sure that the "coaster geeks" opinion was factored into the planning of this new ride, but they certainly were not the only group thought of during planning. Will the "coaster geeks" be completely satisfied? Hell no. They are never satisfied.

But now let me ask you: Were record breaking coasters like MF, TTD, SoB, KK built with the GP in mind? Do you actually think the GP in Texas gives a crap about a record breaking coaster on the shores of Lake Erie? Or a wooden looping coaster in Southern Ohio? Does the GP even know that TTD was the first 400'+ coaster on the planet. Do they even care?

[KIBeast]

Yes, I knew that SOB is indeed a hyper coaster.

Why were all of those larger or -est coasters built? Bragging rights. Something to advertise to draw people in which mostly would include the general public. They probably had coaster geeks in mind as well, but surely you don't believe they built it simply to satisfy that small demographic. You make it seem that is the only reason that they would build KK, TTD, SOB, or MF. And if every park was truley in it for the enthusiasts, why even bother building other attractions since it seems you think only the coaster communities' opinions really matter? Why would KI have dropped out of the coaster race if it's the coaster community that matters most? Because they are the minority, not the majority.

[Browntggrr]

^ When was KI even in the so-called "coaster race"? That conversation is usually a CP vs. SFMM debate.

And again, I never stated that any coaster is built primarily with the "coaster geek" in mind. But simply that the "coaster geeks" do have influence on a park's decisions.

And yes, those -est coasters I mentioned were built for bragging rights. No doubt. Now do you believe that those "bragging rights" influence the GP more, or enthusiasts more?

Also, let's take a look at what CP did with Maverick. Did they build the anticipation with online stories, signs, and clues with the GP in mind? Or did CP do all those things with the hope that members of the GP would become enthusiasts themselves, purchase season passes, and give the park all kinds of free advertisment by discussing the new project with others?

In years' past I have believed that, as you do now, enthusiasts don't mean that much to a park.

A few weeks ago, I was proven wrong.

My local park, Waldameer, opened a new coaster. There were so many groups of "coaster geeks" there for media day and opening day, I was astonished. The park provided behind the scenes picture and video opportunities for the "coaster geeks", so much so that I felt it could have ruined the opening day for the ride if one person would have been injured (people were on the walkways of the track with trains going by). I could not also believe that the park also provided Applebee's lunch to those in attendance. The "coaster geeks" were treated like royalty.

I had the opportunity to ask the owner of Waldameer, Paul Nelson, why he would allow such events, and his hospitality, to take place. His response was simple. "Those coaster "kids" () will keep bringing in people 10 years from now more than any advertisments will. How they feel about this park and how they feel about our new ride will have the largest influence than our park had ever experienced."

While "coaster geeks" may be a small percentage by an attendence standpoint, what they say and how they say it has a profound influence into how the GP feels about a park and about a ride. The GP may not be members of a "coaster geek" site, but that does not mean they don't look up information as well. What they read is spread around by word of mouth. Sometimes the information is accurate, often times inaccurate. But when people keep hearing the same thing over and over, it becomes believable.

And when a person keeps hearing that SoB is not worth it, and then finally experiences the ride for themselves, they are already going in with the attitude that the ride is crap.

Now what about SoB is going to change their mind? Other rides can change a person's mind (Beast is a prime example), but does SoB have the same effect on people?

[KIBeast]

I don't know when KI was in the coaster race exactly, but it was during the Paramount years. I think the part of the race that they were in was the -est business as in tallest or fastest or onlyiest( ) and not coaster count. I remember Sieffert stating that they were not going to be in the coaster race any more and instead, would focus more on "family friendly" attractions. Hence the reason that Italian Job was built and not something more thrilling.

I have to concede, after hearing your story about Waldameer, your arguement seems a bit stronger now. It's not that I didn't believe you, I just wanted to hear strong arguements to make your case and I think you did just that. It's what I like about a good debate.

[catzdrummer09]

^ now you see what i was trying to say, but I'm glad somebody got the point across. I still feel that generalizations are being made just by "coaster geeks" but oh well. Let the lines and ridership prove it.

Oh, and I very seriously doubt Kings Island sits down and says, "Welp, ACE is wanting a new coaster...maybe we should think about it." It's probably more along the lines of, "We need to bring some more guests in and it has been a while...what can we do." Not that I'm saying they're losing attendance, god forbid.

And, honestly, how many people do you think are aware that groups like ACE et al exist. I highly doubt that number is high...it's mostly fanboys who read sites such as these that are aware...I would say (notice the opinion) that if you asked everyone who went through KI gates in, say, a day, if they knew what ACE was the would scratch their heads. (Now it's data...see what i did there?)

Oh and by the way KIbeast....it's he. Thanks for understanding what I was getting at.

[The Interpreter]

Attendance at Kings Island (and Cedar Point) has been going down for some time now....you can probably put a lot of the blame for that on general economic conditions in the midwest...and new coaster installs have not brought the stellar results they once did, either...

[catzdrummer09]

I've noticed that...but I was just giving a "for instance". But thanks for the data cause I was wondering about that...however I sort of had a hunch.

[Browntggrr]

Let the lines and ridership prove it.

Again, you cannot determine a coaster's popularity by how long the line is. There are too many variables such as: amount of trains, train capacity, effort put out by the crew, attendence in the park, other rides being down, blocking, etc.

Imagine if SoB had a 20 minute wait with a 2 train operation and 24 riders/ train vs. Beast that was a walk-on with a three train operation and 36 riders/ train. Does that mean SoB is more popular because it has a longer wait?

You could try and argue that the capacity for SoB is 1600 people/ hr. But that also means trains are being dispatched at a rate of 66.7 trains/ hour. Do you think that is happening?

If there was some way to see the amount of guests that actually went on the coaster over a season's time and compare that figure with years' past is a good way to determine the popularity, but SoB is no there yet with all the changes made in the last 18 months.

[catzdrummer09]

^ Isn't that sort of what I said in my last post on the last page but the arguement still persisted? I also said that maybe we should se our differences aside but apparently that was missed too. AND, maybe lines won't prove it but ridership will..

[Browntggrr]

^ Isn't that sort of what I said in my last post on the last page but the arguement still persisted? I also said that maybe we should se our differences aside but apparently that was missed too. AND, maybe lines won't prove it but ridership will..

Huh?

What arguement? KIBeast and I had a really good discussion on our beliefs, and then you chimed in. If you don't want to be part of the discussion, don't comment.

I really have no clue as to what you are trying to accomplish. Could you be less open ended? It would really help out!

Thanks!

[catzdrummer09]

Um...i didn't chime in...I was the one having the original discussion with you if I'm not mistaken. And I'm really not being open ended but I'll try to sum it all up.

Enthusiasts do not represent the opinions of the GP. Most of the GP (DOUBTEDLY) gets their info from entusiast sites being that most people don't know they exist.

This entire arguement/discussion is getting old and neither one of us have the right to say who is more correct as to the popularity. There are too many variables and neither of us have enough of a sample to back us up.

However, I do feel that you are still making generalizations based on enthusiasts.

And as neither one of us has enough info we should let ridership prove it. (as lines may not prove anything)

Sorry if this is still unclear...I'm rushing to get to work.

[Browntggrr]

Wow. Here we go again. The only reason this is getting old is that you have provided no new information past the 4-5 marathoning trains you heard. Do you have something else?

When did anyone say that enthusiasts represent the opinion of the GP?

On top of that, now you are assuming that people do not look up information on the internet.

Enthusiasts do not represent the opinions of the GP. Most of the GP (DOUBTEDLY) gets their info from entusiast sites being that most people don't know they exist.

So you can argue that enthusiasts do not represent the opinion of the GP, and then turn around and assume that people do not look up information on the net?

You must be joking.

You have witnessed the opinions of 4-5 marathoning trains on SoB. I have provided thousands of people's feelings through websites. Those same web sites that you assume people have to be an enthusiast to reply on. Did it ever cross your mind that members of the GP actually may look up information on the net, find a site, and then decide to share a trip report? How can you possibly listen to a total of 24 people enjoying themselves vs. thousands of others who may or may not be an enthusiast at all?

That makes no sense. Have a nice day at work.

[catzdrummer09]

When did anyone say that enthusiasts represent the opinion of the GP?

YOU DID

While "coaster geeks" may be a small percentage by an attendence standpoint, what they say and how they say it has a profound influence into how the GP feels about a park and about a ride.

You haven't provided any new "info" either. Again only enthusiast sites.

And these "thousands of people" that you speak of would be?.......enthusiasts. If you need proof of that...you may also refer to a quote above by, none other than, you.

And when did I ever assume that people don't look up information. What I had said was that I doubt a lot of the GP look up information before they go to the park and there is some support for this....just listen in line. I don't think half of the stupid things, and rumors that you hear standing there would be said if people were more educated in the world of Kings Island.

Oh and by the way...work was great.

[Browntggrr]

So you consider that "profound influence" means that "enthusiasts represent the opinion of the GP?"

Wow. That is intresting.

You certainly know how to twist things. Or in this case, just make stuff up.

And yes, I have provided new information such as: direct quotes from a park owner, the possibility that people on an enthusiast site may not be enthusiasts, and that the 24 marathoning guests you witnessed could have very well been enthusiasts themselves and not members of the GP as you have claimed.

And the thousands of people that I speak of are the members of coaster sites, as well as the amount of votes SoB receives (or in this case, does not receive).

You assumed that people do not look up information with this quote:

Most of the GP (DOUBTEDLY) gets their info from entusiast sites being that most people don't know they exist.

If that does not mean that people do not look up information on the net in your opinion, then what does it mean?

And now, you claim that the same people that you are basing your entire arguement on that like SoB say stupid things and promote rumors.

And when did I ever assume that people don't look up information. What I had said was that I doubt a lot of the GP look up information before they go to the park and there is some support for this....just listen in line. I don't think half of the stupid things, and rumors that you hear standing there would be said if people were more educated in the world of Kings Island.

You should consider a career in stand-up comedy! Because this entire discussion has gone from stupid to comical.

[catzdrummer09]

Do you know how rude you are? You know...I tried to be nice and end this discussion a few posts ago but you couldn't stand it could you...and now you're just being an arrogant jerk.

So you consider that "profound influence" means that "enthusiasts represent the opinion of the GP?"

Well...you're saying that enthusiast opinions have a "profound influence" (look who's assuming now) on the GP's opinion correct. If you are influenced by an opinion doesn't that mean that you have a similar opinion? Ergo, what I said is applicable. Sorry that you can't handle that fact that you sort of screwed up a bit.

And, the "direct quote from a park owner" doesn't even apply to Kings Island being that it wasn't KI's park owner.

You are very delusional if you think that is even relative.

If that does not mean that people do not look up information on the net in your opinion, then what does it mean?

It doesn't mean that people do not look up information...it just means that I don't think people look up that specific info. Yeah maybe they look up specs and info but I don't feel that everyone goes straight to their computer and googles "Opinions of {insert ride name here}."

And please tell me how a persons opinions of a ride and rumors they promote, because they likely haven't boned up on their info, are remotely related.

You should consider a career in stand-up comedy! Because this entire discussion has gone from stupid to comical

This discussion was stupid because I, as well as KIbeast, found glitches in what you were trying to argue. If you can't handle that then you're really immature, which was clearly shown when you ignored my truse and continued to be the a** that you're being.

[Coasterkidman]

I have a bad feeling that top gun is on its last leg. What are your comments on this ride? and if it was taken out, what would best fit in its place.

I went to Kings Island the other day, and I rode Top Gun (I think it's Flight Deck Now ). It had a lot of rust on the track and the brakes really seemed to hurt. I don't see it getting removed soon, but I do think it needs some TLC.

[Phantom Theater]

I have a bad feeling that top gun is on its last leg. What are your comments on this ride? and if it was taken out, what would best fit in its place.

I went to Kings Island the other day, and I rode Top Gun (I think it's Flight Deck Now ). It had a lot of rust on the track and the brakes really seemed to hurt. I don't see it getting removed soon, but I do think it needs some TLC.

I think its going to be painted in '09.If its not,then I dont think it can take another harsh winter.

[Browntggrr]

Do you know how rude you are? You know...I tried to be nice and end this discussion a few posts ago but you couldn't stand it could you...and now you're just being an arrogant jerk.

So you consider that "profound influence" means that "enthusiasts represent the opinion of the GP?"

Well...you're saying that enthusiast opinions have a "profound influence" (look who's assuming now) on the GP's opinion correct. If you are influenced by an opinion doesn't that mean that you have a similar opinion? Ergo, what I said is applicable. Sorry that you can't handle that fact that you sort of screwed up a bit.

And, the "direct quote from a park owner" doesn't even apply to Kings Island being that it wasn't KI's park owner.

You are very delusional if you think that is even relative.

If that does not mean that people do not look up information on the net in your opinion, then what does it mean?

It doesn't mean that people do not look up information...it just means that I don't think people look up that specific info. Yeah maybe they look up specs and info but I don't feel that everyone goes straight to their computer and googles "Opinions of {insert ride name here}."

And please tell me how a persons opinions of a ride and rumors they promote, because they likely haven't boned up on their info, are remotely related.

You should consider a career in stand-up comedy! Because this entire discussion has gone from stupid to comical

This discussion was stupid because I, as well as KIbeast, found glitches in what you were trying to argue. If you can't handle that then you're really immature, which was clearly shown when you ignored my truse and continued to be the a** that you're being.

Sorry kid, but you have issues. But you do seem intelligent enough that there will come a time where you can sit back and listen to others before trying to twist their words.

If you will only listen to 24 people on one ride vs. thousands of others, there is not much more that can be said.

And the discussion has only gone to comical only because you want to twist the truth.

When I was 16, I did the same thing. No matter what evidence was in front of me, I would also make things up and refuse to listen to logic. It's really not your fault because most others at the same age, including myself, have done the same thing.

If you want to believe that I'm being rude, that's ok. Letting discussions like this get to a personal level is petty, especially when it resorts to name calling. KIC is better than that. My intent was not to get on a personal level, and if I have insulted you in any way, my apologies. I do respect your drive to prove your point, but you do need some better angles.

If you would like to IM me, please feel free to do so.

End of discussion.

[shark6495]

QUOTE(Elmer Fudd @ Sep 3 2007, 02:38 PM) 174978[/snapback]

i never said i wanted to see it removed. i think everyone would agree that TG has needed some TLC for several years now... and it never seems to happen. which i contend is a bad sign for it's future.

as a side note, I have never seen a primer paint a dark red.

How about this dark red primer?

Aswell I think it is ridiculous that we're all of a sudden on this ride removal thing.

People talking about removing Tomb Raider, removing Congo, removing Top Gun, removing Vortex, removing Action Theater, removing SOB, removing Days of Thunder; threads about your least favorite ride, what should be removed next, which ride you would take out, etc. Its kind of getting out of hand dont you think? Why does everyone all of a sudden seem to want so many things removed? None of the rides are going anywhere untill there is something to take its place. I cant imagine why anyone would just want a ride to no longer be there. If you dont like it, then dont ride it, but dont ask for it to be removed.

Top gun is a good, very intense coaster. I cannot say that there is a better suspended coaster than Top Gun. All others seem to follow the trend of Iron Dragon or Big Bad Wolf of slow, continuous, and boring, with a second boring lift.

And yes top gun has a red primer to mask the old red paint that used to be on the track.

QUOTE(SOB_TOM @ Sep 4 2007, 01:16 PM) 175087[/snapback]

Come on people, lets use common sense in these discussions PLEASE.

Agreed

So I was looking for something else and it brought me all the way back here... the bold are the removed rides....

[Jr for Birdy]

SOB was more alive in this thread than even Top Gun, some things never change!

[SonofBaconator]

QUOTE(Elmer Fudd @ Sep 3 2007, 02:38 PM) 174978[/snapback]i never said i wanted to see it removed. i think everyone would agree that TG has needed some TLC for several years now... and it never seems to happen. which i contend is a bad sign for it's future.

as a side note, I have never seen a primer paint a dark red.

How about this dark red primer?

Aswell I think it is ridiculous that we're all of a sudden on this ride removal thing.

People talking about removing Tomb Raider, removing Congo, removing Top Gun, removing Vortex, removing Action Theater, removing SOB, removing Days of Thunder; threads about your least favorite ride, what should be removed next, which ride you would take out, etc. Its kind of getting out of hand dont you think? Why does everyone all of a sudden seem to want so many things removed? None of the rides are going anywhere untill there is something to take its place. I cant imagine why anyone would just want a ride to no longer be there. If you dont like it, then dont ride it, but dont ask for it to be removed.

Top gun is a good, very intense coaster. I cannot say that there is a better suspended coaster than Top Gun. All others seem to follow the trend of Iron Dragon or Big Bad Wolf of slow, continuous, and boring, with a second boring lift.

And yes top gun has a red primer to mask the old red paint that used to be on the track.

QUOTE(SOB_TOM @ Sep 4 2007, 01:16 PM) 175087[/snapback]Come on people, lets use common sense in these discussions PLEASE.

Agreed

So I was looking for something else and it brought me all the way back here... the bold are the removed rides....

Gas was $2.57? Wow