05/27/09 Nightmare Trip Report..Linejumping, Please read and help..

[HTCO]

Does anyone know where I can buy a "no line jumping" t-shirt?!?

[markhudson17]

Does anyone know where I can buy a "no line jumping" t-shirt?!?

http://www.cafepress.com/nolinejumping

[HTCO]

Thanks! I might actually buy this!

[LongLiveTheSmurfRide]

The people who made those shirts probably line jump. So they'll jump in front of you AND have your $20. But you'll still have a t-shirt.

[PKIbabe89]

I am so sorry you had to go through that. I've had plenty of experiences with line jumping especially FOF. I work at KI and i will make sure no line jumping happens on my ride.

[Dalefan]

Yesterday, Cedar Point had a zero tolerance policy for line jumpers. Security was straight throwing line jumpers out of the park left and right. The ride ops were watching the queues and picking up the phone to call security every time they saw a line jumper. I was impressed.

Good for them! I hope they waited and met the line jumpers in the station of the ride. Make them wait as long as possible and throw them out! If they keep that up, people will learn pretty quick not to line jump there. Kings Island needs to get their act together and do the same thing. Maybe people that spit can go right along with them.

Cedar Point also has cops that have guns too. I had to deal with line jumpers that felt the need to try to do something about me saying something to them. I just tell them that if you was to lay a hand on me that by all laws i can fight back and you can get halled off to jail for throwing the first punch. That and if you tryed to lie and say something different that the people in line can go against you. It dont matter if its one or a group. They can be sent to jail. I know that Cedar Point isnt happy with the way Kings Island did the 09 Platinum Passes. I know that i had to redo mine when i went to Cedar Point cause i couldnt get in the park. I got a new one for free so i was happy. I know most was mad about it but its not Cedar Point's fault.

[IBEW_Sparky]

I will have to say that, after reading this, I am definitely beginning to realize that my park days are close to over. Although this is quite unfortunate to me, I simply know how I am, and what type of personality I have, and how things would have gone had it been me in that situation. I am not one who subscribes to the "greater good" B.S philosophyof life, but in this case Im going to have to agree with it. I have had some GREAT experiences this year (First Rider Auction, RWCW) and have met a number of absolutely wonderful people though KIC, but I have enough life experience and common sense when it comes to how Corporate America works to know that this issue is not going to improve, no matter "how important an issue we at KI feel this is" , and have to say this will be my last year of Passholder status and patronage of the parks.

[The Interpreter]

Wait a minute. There is hope. The SAME company runs Cedar Point. Compare:

http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=17808

THIS is why I suggested a letter (not an e-mail, not a phone call) to Mr. Richard Kinzel. Stopping linejumping CAN be done. It just takes the will to make it happen. A will that is apparently lacking at the top levels of Kings Island. Not taking action is a choice. Putting up with at least some employees' blase indifference to linejumping is a choice. A choice made, apparently, by management. The season did not start yesterday. By all accounts, the situation has NOT gotten better. Perhaps some Sandusky attention will fix the problem.

[Erosarrow05]

I CAN'T argue my side anymore with The Interpreter. I suggest we ALL heed his advice and just bypass everyone at the local park level and go straight to the top. (That was my feeble attempt at humor, caps lock and all )

In all seriousness, I would like to know, from "The Interpreter" what his estimate would be for the following...

How many instances of line jumping, on average, occur at Kings Island during a normal summer operating day

and of those instances, how many are addressed by a staff member of Kings Island.

... Actually, I'd like to open that question up to everyone. Since the park reads these threads, it might be interesting for them to see what people actually think, in an actual figure.

[Kman6]

If it was the 22nd for the accurate trip date that was Friday. I was there (as mentioned in another post) and left around noon. I counted over 40 buses and more entering. With that said

you have all kinds of unsupervised kids running wild and probably not the typical guest. Friday was my second time this season. My first was on a Sunday and it was a great visit, low crowds and

not too hot. Friday I could see it wasn`t going to be a good day so we left ( easy to do with passes ). I have seen some line jumping in my two visits, never in many years of visits had a spitting incident and I think the park is well kept and landscaping incredible this season. I have talked to employees and haven`t had any trouble with any of them. I think with Cedar Fair Corporate being made aware of the problem that something can and will be done about this problem. My next visit will be in mid June, school will be out mostly and the problem of all the unsupervised kids will gone. Looking forward to my next ride!!

[The Interpreter]

I CAN'T argue my side anymore with The Interpreter. I suggest we ALL heed his advice and just bypass everyone at the local park level and go straight to the top. (That was my feeble attempt at humor, caps lock and all )

In all seriousness, I would like to know, from "The Interpreter" what his estimate would be for the following...

How many instances of line jumping, on average, occur at Kings Island during a normal summer operating day

and of those instances, how many are addressed by a staff member of Kings Island.

... Actually, I'd like to open that question up to everyone. Since the park reads these threads, it might be interesting for them to see what people actually think, in an actual figure.

I'm not playing that game. I have different questions for you. What is an acceptable level of linejumping? What level of employees ignoring that linejumping is acceptable? (Incidents like that have been reported here and I have personally seen them). Why is Cedar Point run so differently from Kings Island? Why does Cedar Point have less of a problem in these areas than Kings Island appears to? Could it be because Mr. Richard Kinzel may stroll through the park at any given moment (and often does)? Could the problems at Kings Island stem, at least in part, from the types of entertainment presented? If so, is this acceptable to Cedar Fair? To most of the guests? To most of the guests who spend the most inside the park? To the company's creditors, who have a large say in how it is operated under some circumstances that may happen soon?

[Erosarrow05]

You aren't playing that game, yet by everything you write I feel that you think virtually nothing is being done about "the problem". I guess I should consider myself fortunate that it doesn't bother me as it clearly does you. Carry on your crusade to fight the line jumper problem plaguing Kings Island.

I've found debating with you is usually futile because you come back with generally open-ended, vague answers or even questions to answer a question. I've stated my opinion and don't feel like I can offer any more debate than I already have.

People who subscribe to this site respect what you post, but in my personal opinion I can only hope those who wish to voice concern follow appropriate channels.

So all I can say to "The Interpreter" is I disagree with you, no more no less.

[LongLiveTheSmurfRide]

^ It's hard to give a straight answer about a policy decision and what a company is doing to fix it when you're just a guest. Everyone on here could give their guesses at how many line jumpers there are, but that's like asking a cop how many drug deals they think go on at any given time on any given day in a city. You can't know.

I believe line jumping is most likely happening constantly throughout the park in some shape or form and the fact that so many people of us few on this site have witnessed multiple occurrences of it help strengthen my belief. I personally haven't noticed it on my 2 visits this year, but I'm just 1 person who was in a certain place where there either wasn't a line jumper, or I didn't see it.

If any action is to happen on this issue, it will be for everyone who witnesses line jumping that goes unchallenged by park workers to contact upper management at KI or CF in whatever way is most affective.

*Edit* I notice that this same argument is going on in another thread as well with many of the same participants.

[Tchu]

I'll answer Terpy's questions with my own opinion.

For starters, an acceptable amount of linejumpers? I'd say a small handful (2-4) per hour or so of a ride's wait time. Fact of the matter is, line jumping happens everywhere, and nothing can be done to ever catch it 100% of the time. I've seen line cutters at KI, at CP, at Disney, at Universal's IOA... it happens everywhere. The goal is to eliminate it... the reality is to keep it as infrequent as possible.

To answer the question of what level of employees ignoring line-jumping is acceptable? Zero. Absolutely nothing. That's not to say that a Ride-Op is always going to be able to handle the problem themselves or be able to remedy the situation the exact way the guest would like to see it taken care of... but its unacceptable for even a single count of an employee ignoring it, simply saying "nothin I can do", or worse yet... encouraging it (as apparently has happened a couple times this season with Ride-Ops helping people meet up with their group further ahead in line). That sort of thing... there should be zero tolerance for.

With all that said, in fairness to Kings Island... they are a different sort of park than Cedar Point. This weekend specifically featured a big extreme sports event. That sort of thing is going to draw a young, often rebellious, teenage crowd. Also, Cedar Point is more a resort park. You see more in the way of families on vacation, and the park features marina's, hotels, restaurants etc. As a resort park, they will attract somewhat different crowds and have access to a varying level of income to disperse across different areas of business (in this case, on security). Some of that $250 a night that guests spend to stay inside the park at one of its hotels can be used to hire an extra security guard. And an extra set of eyes to police the line will cut down on the number of successful line-jumpers.

I've made two trips to KI this year. Made two trips to Cedar Point last year. And in those four trips, I personally saw a very similar amount of line-jumping at both parks. Thankfully, and luckily, in all four instances... thatwas a minimal amount.

-Matt, who really thinks the Memorial Day holiday coupled with the extreme sports special event has probably lead to inflated amounts of problems on this specific weekend.

[Mikewhy]

I visit about 30-40 parks a year, and I always notice that Kings Island is one of the very worst when it comes to line jumping, smoking out of designated areas, and scary park patrons screaming obscenities and wearing offensive clothing. It is sad really, and I am certain it does affect attendance, and could hurt the park even more as the word gets out.

I was at Ride Warriors Weekend, and the park went out of its way to tell us how they are stressing customer service and such, and yet I simply do not see it. When I politely report problems to Guest Services, they usually blow me off as well. The park is simply too frightened or hesitant to do what is really needed, which is to add more security patrolling the lines and midways, and when finding the worst rule-breakers, throwing them out of the park. If that happens enough, and word gets out, it will eventually have a positive affect. Sure they can not catch all line-jumpers, but making good examples out of those they do catch can have a really good effect. It seems the park is too worried about offending the rule breakers, rather than punishing them. A rule with no true enforcement is not a rule at all. It is so sad, because Kings Island could be such a wonderful park...

I can not tell you how many times I see security talking amongst themselves and looking really disengaged from what their job should be, which is keeping order and keeping an eye out for disorder. I am simply not convinced all that could be done is being done to correct these problems.

I wish at least they would put in Q-bots or something like that. If people are going to cut anyway, I would like a chance to pay and do it myself, but legally. I usually have a better time at Six Flags parks. Not because they have better crowds, but because I can use Q-bot to skip the lines, and then I do not have to witness the line-jumping and smoking (Although at some Six Flags parks, they have really done a good job at reducing these things...) Cedar Fair does not implement pay-to-cut options because they claim we should all be equal and wait our turn. Sadly, the fact there is so much line cutting pretty much makes a mockery out of that noble standard...

[Dalefan]

The reason Cedar Point is the way they are is due to the main office being right at the park and that the big shots of Cedar Fair walk the park daily. I know i seen Dick K. a few times. I know that at CoasterMania every year, we have a Q&A with a few of the big shots of Cedar Fair. Dick K. also goes to it alot of he isnt busy. I know that they took a few of the problems that was said to them in private. They just told them i would like to talk in private. Alot of people at CoasterMania found this to be the way to get to the bottom of a issue. That and with the big shots of Cedar Fair being at the Q&A, its a good way to get ERT on a coaster. Lol.

[rotag]

pardon me for sounding dumb, stupid, & ignorent {yes i know it repedative, & redundant} ,but what is q-bot?

is that like disneys fastpass?

rotag, who is confused, & usually finds hidden chunks of knowledge in terpy's qoutes, & doesn't go all caveman on attacking the unfamilliarity.

[The Interpreter]

It's a handheld device that rents for anything from about 12 dollars (at Dollywood) to more than a hundred (for a group, with no waiting, aka "gold") at Six Flags. You enter into what you want to ride/see, and it signals you when it is your turn to enter the special line designated for device users. The company that leases them to parks is called Lo-Q, and the generic name for them is Q-Bots. They are called everything from Q to Q (Dollywood) to The Flash Pass (Six Flags).

[KDCOASTERFAN]

Yesterday, Cedar Point had a zero tolerance policy for line jumpers. Security was straight throwing line jumpers out of the park left and right. The ride ops were watching the queues and picking up the phone to call security every time they saw a line jumper. I was impressed.

Good for them! I hope they waited and met the line jumpers in the station of the ride. Make them wait as long as possible and throw them out! If they keep that up, people will learn pretty quick not to line jump there. Kings Island needs to get their act together and do the same thing. Maybe people that spit can go right along with them.

Cedar Point also has cops that have guns too. I had to deal with line jumpers that felt the need to try to do something about me saying something to them. I just tell them that if you was to lay a hand on me that by all laws i can fight back and you can get halled off to jail for throwing the first punch. That and if you tryed to lie and say something different that the people in line can go against you. It dont matter if its one or a group. They can be sent to jail. I know that Cedar Point isnt happy with the way Kings Island did the 09 Platinum Passes. I know that i had to redo mine when i went to Cedar Point cause i couldnt get in the park. I got a new one for free so i was happy. I know most was mad about it but its not Cedar Point's fault.

That's the thing with CP,they employ officers from the Sandusky police dept. to help keep order in the park while all of the others rely on rent a cops to enforce the rules & of course most people aren't half as concerned about getting busted by an underpaid,overworked rent a cop than they are a fully fledged law enforcement officer so it's no wonder things like line jumping get so out of hand.

[StalkerChick]

Thats the thing that gets me about KI..... I know they have a pretty extensive security force, but i know personally, i hardly see their presence.... yes DB has a done a better job of having an officer stantioned and kind of roaming the que, but he needs to go to the second set of queue's as well, as i see the majority of it happening. But i also know that there are a few exceptional employees that have been around. In fact i believe it was RWW that a group of us went into guest relations and wrote up 3 positive write ups yes we're dorks like that.

but even with those great ppl, there are a few bad apples, and i've seen them, and they all seem to work together.... which makes it even worse.... and then some ppl (like me ) still hasn't heard back from the park in ways of employment.... ugh lol

[TopThrill]

Wow if that's true about Juke Box cafe having large ****roach's, then I'm never eating in the park ever again. Even know I don't plan on eating in the park anyway, from those high prices.

[Beast Man]

Wow if that's true about Juke Box cafe having large ****roach's, then I'm never eating in the park ever again. Even know I don't plan on eating in the park anyway, from those high prices.

Just think of it as extra protein.

[rotag]

Wow if that's true about Juke Box cafe having large ****roach's, then I'm never eating in the park ever again. Even know I don't plan on eating in the park anyway, from those high prices.

Just think of it as extra protein.

lol my ggpa used to tell me that all the time {god rest his soul}, he would also tell me pepper is made out of ground up fly butts, road apple pies, and that when stung to get the sting out to stick his wad of chew on the stung spot which suprissingley worked.

[The Interpreter]

I bet he was not allergic to peanuts!

[rotag]

he was like that fun old man everyone liked but could be serious and roll it off funny like

[Beast Man]

I bet he was not allergic to peanuts!

How can anyone be allergic to Charlie Brown and Snoopy?

[The Interpreter]

Ask Viacom...they are hoping...

[Scooter4Ever]

Wow if that's true about Juke Box cafe having large ****roach's, then I'm never eating in the park ever again. Even know I don't plan on eating in the park anyway, from those high prices.

Yeah, it's true. I did not see it at first and I was all ready to order but then my family was just standing there with horrified faces and saying "We are not eating here!". It was one lone roach and it could have creeped in from somewhere else but when you see just one one crawling around on the floor of a place you're about to eat in, most people would decide that it's not wise to eat at that place.

[ZukoGirl]

I'm sorry you guys had to experience that on your trip down here.

[rypie91d]

We have seen the same sorta problem with the staff at the drink counters. They chat up with their friends and don't pay attention to the customer.....

We also had an incident in line for Firehawk during our last trip, 2 weekends ago..... we were almost through and only had 2 lines to go to get to the front and separated by the attendant..... A guy, two rows back, lit up a cigarette and started smoking in line..... We yelled at the attendant and he just nodded his head at us and did nothing.....