The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Or perhaps it's just Terp who will be retired soon. With Terp, one never knows: Diversions. Driving clues. Life analogies. You just never know...until you do. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 It can't be. Taking Vortex out of Kings Island is like taking Magnum XL-200 out of Cedar Point. Its one of the most iconic rides in the park. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homestar92 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Taking out Vortex would be enough to bump Kings Island from my second favorite FUN park to my least favorite. If not for the fact that I'd be getting a Platinum to get into other parks anyway, it might be enough to make me stop buying season passes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 It doesn't make since to take out a ride that has been getting great numbers, a perfect safety record, and not terrible maintenance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TombRaiderFTW Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I imagine folks probably said such things about Great American Scream Machine, too. Rides have service lives, whether we want them to or not. Things can be done to extend or renew them, like rebuilding Florida's (Space Mountain?) with new track and supports, but truthfully, I think Disney's the only one who would ever spend that kind of money. For the rest of the world, which has far less iconic rides (would anyone in New York City know what Vortex is by name alone? How about Space Mountain?), it's just a better business decision to bring in a new ride. There isn't an ROI on a seasonal park replacing steel on their Arrow looper that's been around for 25 years. There is, however, an ROI on taking down the coaster and replacing it with something new that can be put on TV commercials and radio commercials and flyers and discount coupons at the local Wendy's. I wish it wasn't that way, because I know that, when Vortex goes, Adventure Express probably won't be far behind. But that's the nature of our hobby. Enjoy the rides you've got while you've got them. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 But TombraiderFTW would you say the same thing about The Racer and The Beast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindingSon Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Wood is much easier to be replaced than steel. If a wood coaster is popular enough, it can be renewed so long as there are trees. You can replace small sections of the track at a time very cheaply. With a steel coaster, I don't imagine there's much option outside of manufacturing steel for the entire ride. That's quite a lot more expensive. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I was just told that my Dad who was a wielder that wood is actually more expensive than steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 But a wood coaster is far cheaper to build than a steel one. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 But if a wooden coaster is cheaper to build but more expensive to maintain. Doesn't that mean steel is better though, they are expensive to build but cheaper to maintain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Only until the end of their service life. Then, it becomes more economical to replace most steel coasters than to attempt continued maintenance. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIBeast Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I'd like something to go in the old Son of Beast spot first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 But Banshee is sitting there now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stashua123 Posted October 2, 2014 Author Share Posted October 2, 2014 Banshee only took up a little bit of where SOB used to be(Lift hill second and third helix and first drop.) There is still a absolutely HUGE part of land where and near the former Rose Bowl. But Banshee is sitting there now 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaestroMan Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Banshee took up a lot of space from where King Cobra used to be as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skylab Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I'd like something to go in the old Son of Beast spot first. Banshee uses that bit of land pretty well. Better than SOB ever did. I think they should work on X-Base before anything. You know, some benches, some shade trees... make it more like an inviting entrance plaza rather than the cramped eyesore it is now. Though with the problems it's had this year, I wouldn't be surprised if FOF was on the chopping block. I know nothing about anything, of course. Just my $0.02. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I think they should work on X-Base before anything. You know, some benches, some shade trees... ...and restrooms. No X-Base work will be complete without public restrooms. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homestar92 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 And as much as we hate it, no matter how beloved something may be by its fans or how reliable it is, or even how iconic it may be, that doesn't guarantee it will stick around forever. Money talks. Things that don't make money are bound to go bye-bye one day no matter how much people love them. See my avatar for proof (well, maybe "iconic" wouldn't apply there, but the other examples all do). Not saying I'd be OK with it if Vortex or Adventure Express left us. It would be devastating. It would fundamentally change Kings Island for me, and probably not in a way that I like. But such is life. Besides the woodies, I reckon I will outlive every coaster at Kings Island (assuming I live for roughly the average amount of time). Yes, that includes Diamondback and Banshee. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 The park needs to use more of their acres but they probably won't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 There are reasons for that. Ironically, Cedar Point has far more easily developable space than does Kings Island. Yet, every few months, someone shows up here and tells us (incorrectly) that Cedar Point is running out of room. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delirium13 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) ^^ What makes you say that? I think over the past few years of ownership under Cedar Fair, the park has moved from the "remove a ride, and replace it" method to "make use of the land we have and add a new a ride." I don't count removing Son of Beast for Banshee, because that is an extraordinary situation, that hopefully the park won't have to deal with again (and Days of Thunder/Thunder Alley was an extremely minor pay-to-play attraction). But since 2007, we've seen Firehawk go in on unused land, Diamondback, while I'm not a huge fan of the location of its station, extended into unused land behind TR:TR/The Crypt, Dinosaurs Alive extended unused land, and The Soak City renovation made use of even more. I think the park is expanding more in recent years, than it has since Action Zone in 1999/2000, they have been making great use of their land. And I think it will continue in that direction in the near future. Cedar Fair has been smart in realizing that a ride doesn't need to go in order to add a new one, that is one of my favorite things about the current management. It seemed in the later years of Paramount Parks that everytime something new was added, that something had to go: 2002: Kenton's Cove Keelboat Canal for Tomb Raider 2003: King Cobra/Phantom Theater for Delirium/Scooby Doo and the Haunted Castle 2005: Antique Cars/Flying Eagles for Italian Job I'm glad they've gotten away from that. As for Vortex and Adventure Express being retired, I'd be very sad to see either one go. Vortex was my first looping coaster and I've always had a soft spot for Adventure Express because I love themed rides. I'd love to see Adventure Express get a revamp in theming similar to the Calico Mine Ride and Timber Mountain log ride at Knott's, but I also know we don't have Disneyland right down the street so that is unlikely... Sorry for the rant, I may have gotten a little off-topic... Edit: Looks like Terp beat me to a response, he undoubtedly knows more about Kings Island's developable land than I do, but I still think the park has been expanding in recent years. Edited October 2, 2014 by Delirium13 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark6495 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Don't get confused by what he is saying KI has a bunch of land but, there are major grade changes in land, etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goki32 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I guess that is true actually. I just hope they keep doing it that way and not do what Cedar Point did with Disaster Transport & Space Spiral. Gatekeeper could've wrapped right around those rides, but no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 There were other reasons those rides were removed. Stay tuned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKIVortex Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I would say unless parts for the Arrow Coasters become very hard to find or very costly, the Arrow coasters are not going anywhere anytime soon. Heck Cedar Point has 2 of the oldest Arrow Coasters in operation. Cedar Creek Mine ride has been operating for 45 years, and Corkscrew has been operating for 38 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 Shockwave at Six Flags Great America. Great American Scream Machine at NJFTP. Big Bad Wolf at Busch Gardens Williamsburg. Drachen Fire, same.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark6495 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 I'm putting on my thinking hat here... Could it be that since Arrow had a tendency to bend the track on site, that it would be harder and more expensive to replace a piece of arrow track versus say a B&M track? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delirium13 Posted October 2, 2014 Share Posted October 2, 2014 To clarify, I wasn't saying that certain rides never need to go, or that there isn't ever a good reason to remove a ride. There are reasons. In fact I could name a couple that I'd like to see go/be replaced in the near future. Wasn't saying that no rides should be removed. I thought removing Disaster Transport and Space Spiral was a good decision... (mostly Disaster Transport). 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TombRaiderFTW Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 ^^ I wouldn't think so, unless whatever means of bending track that Arrow used has since become obsolete. I would imagine Arrow kept drawings of the parts to its coasters, including records of how to bend the track. They had to have had some means of communicating to their people on-site what they were supposed to be making. That's just how manufacturing anything works. I would imagine the bigger obstacle to replacing Arrow track is the price tag. If the ride has reached the end of its service life, you're going to have to replace a significant portion (if not all) of the track and supports. You're basically paying for a new ride, except you're getting the same old ride you always had, and none of your guests are going to notice the difference. And I seriously doubt that rebuilding an Arrow coaster to the same specs it was originally built to is going to make the ride any smoother. I'm not claiming parks have never, ever had track or supports replaced. I don't have inside information about the maintenance of roller coasters. I'm just saying that, apart from accidents or poor design, I can't think of a viable reason that they would need to. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Such as... A tree falling on the track.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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