Kings Island's future under Cedar Fair

[TheKlockster]

I could see Kings Island as one of the last parks they would sell. I think PCW will be one of the first parks to go - regardless of whether they hold onto the others. Its in Canada, which makes it kind of tricky to run. Then I could potentially see them selling PGA and Geauga sometime in the near future.

The only thing for certain - is that if they have to sell all of their other parks - the one they will hold onto is Cedar Point - America's Rockin Roller Coast.

[westcoaster]

IN 15 years wow Kings Island will have a KIDZ AMUSEMENT PARK 10 hotels . A classic boardwalk with 15 rides all flats . 2 shopping districsts:

Parking garages

20 coasters

3 water parks

and Be big with a high speed tram running around the whole complex.

It will have a snow dome, a camp ground, and plenty fo food!

[screamingnight]

IN 15 years wow Kings Island will have a KIDZ AMUSEMENT PARK 10 hotels . A classic boardwalk with 15 rides all flats . 2 shopping districsts:

Parking garages

20 coasters

3 water parks

and Be big with a high speed tram running around the whole complex.

It will have a snow dome, a camp ground, and plenty fo food!

Someone`s been to crazy town, no wait . . .

You`re the mayor of crazy town! LOL

[TheKlockster]

Is that like Laxy Town?

Its a piece of cake to build a park on the lake. If the way is hazy you better do coasters by the book. You know you cant be lazy.

[cincyboy0830]

Why is Cedar Fair in debt like Six Flags...don't these parks build rides year after year and charge lots of money for admissions, food, parking etc.....So WHY are they in debt????

[The Interpreter]

Why? Because a company about the size of Paramount Parks (Cedar Fair) bought Paramount Parks for $1.24 billion dollars...and had been busy expanding for some time. Cedar Fair didn't have $1.24 BILLION dollars lying around (Do you?). They borrowed it (and about $750 million more). The banks and investors think the company is worth the money, and lent it to them, but the parks are now collateral for those loans. One thing that is troubling is that apparently about $300 million (or so) of the borrowed money was to have a fund to pay income to investors out of for the short term future. This is rather different than what is normally seen, but not stunningly odd.

This financing package is not all that unusual overall. Very few companies could self-finance a $1.24 billion acquisition. A few could, but not many.

Also, Six Flags got in trouble in large part BECAUSE of all those rides they put in every year at MOST (not all) of their parks (some very poor operational and staffing decisions also entered into their problems, among other things).

You can definitely spend your way to prosperity in business, or to bankruptcy. It is very difficult to toe the right line in the park industry. Spend too little, the customers may not come and you go bankrupt, spend too much, you either waste what would have been profit and/or you go bankrupt. Even if you make the right decisions, the theme park business is not the easiest...you then have the totally uncontrollable weather factor....get horrid weather and you can still lose your shirt, your parks and your reputation. Geographic diversification is one remedy to that, and Cedar Fair now has that to a much larger degree than it did before.

[cstrwomann]

I was shocked at first when I heard Cedar Fair had bought the Paramount parks. When they purchased the parks they said they were going to keep everything like it was and you wouldn't see any changes right away. The first thing they did that concerned me was cancelling Winterfest. The next thing they did that bothered me was change around season passes for the former Paramount parks. I thought that they would sell a pass for the Paramount parks and a pass for Cedar Fair parks but I was wrong. They sold a regular pass for each park and a Maxx/Maxx Plus pass and got rid of all the perks that we had gotten used to. Now they are talking about not keeping the Paramount rights for the parks. This is really bothering me KI is one of my home parks and I don't want them to come in and get rid of the movie theming, rename rides, and destroy the park. I hope this doesn't happen only time will tell. Another thing I don't like is they don't offer a parking pass anymore like they have in the years before for people who don't have a season pass. Cedar Fair is going to make people angry by doing these things and they won't visit the parks.

[WooferBearATL]

I was shocked at first when I heard Cedar Fair had bought the Paramount parks. When they purchased the parks they said they were going to keep everything like it was and you wouldn't see any changes right away. The first thing they did that concerned me was cancelling Winterfest. The next thing they did that bothered me was change around season passes for the former Paramount parks. I thought that they would sell a pass for the Paramount parks and a pass for Cedar Fair parks but I was wrong. They sold a regular pass for each park and a Maxx/Maxx Plus pass and got rid of all the perks that we had gotten used to. Now they are talking about not keeping the Paramount rights for the parks. This is really bothering me KI is one of my home parks and I don't want them to come in and get rid of the movie theming, rename rides, and destroy the park. I hope this doesn't happen only time will tell. Another thing I don't like is they don't offer a parking pass anymore like they have in the years before for people who don't have a season pass. Cedar Fair is going to make people angry by doing these things and they won't visit the parks.

Kinda like when Paramount came in and destroyed the rich theming and history of Kings Island.

The sooner the last vestages of Paramount are ripped from all the parks, the better.

[THE_BEASTmaster]

I was shocked at first when I heard Cedar Fair had bought the Paramount parks. When they purchased the parks they said they were going to keep everything like it was and you wouldn't see any changes right away. The first thing they did that concerned me was cancelling Winterfest. The next thing they did that bothered me was change around season passes for the former Paramount parks. I thought that they would sell a pass for the Paramount parks and a pass for Cedar Fair parks but I was wrong. They sold a regular pass for each park and a Maxx/Maxx Plus pass and got rid of all the perks that we had gotten used to. Now they are talking about not keeping the Paramount rights for the parks. This is really bothering me KI is one of my home parks and I don't want them to come in and get rid of the movie theming, rename rides, and destroy the park. I hope this doesn't happen only time will tell. Another thing I don't like is they don't offer a parking pass anymore like they have in the years before for people who don't have a season pass. Cedar Fair is going to make people angry by doing these things and they won't visit the parks.

Kinda like when Paramount came in and destroyed the rich theming and history of Kings Island.

The sooner the last vestages of Paramount are ripped from all the parks, the better.

Yeah, remember the Flying Eagles, Antique Cars, King Cobra, Kentons Keelboat Canal, Phantom Theatre, Skylab, and any other attractions I have missed. Kings Island was awesome before Paramount bought them. Ever since Paramount had KI, they took out the charm of old KI. I think Cedar Fair will bring that old charm back.

Again, the theming of these rides are NOT going to be removed. The only thing that could be removed is the movie reference by name like Tomb Raider, Italian Job, Top Gun, Days of Thunder, Drop Zone, and Face/Off.

Why is there some negativity towards Cedar Fair running KI? Cstrwomann, have you ever been to any of their other parks besides KI and Cedar Point?

Cedar Fair has said that they weren't going to change anything noticable to General public for the rest of this year, but next year we could see some changes of improvements. Already the park is a lot cleaner than it was when Paramount owned it. I thoght the landscaping has improved too.

[screamingnight]

I was shocked at first when I heard Cedar Fair had bought the Paramount parks. When they purchased the parks they said they were going to keep everything like it was and you wouldn't see any changes right away. The first thing they did that concerned me was cancelling Winterfest. The next thing they did that bothered me was change around season passes for the former Paramount parks. I thought that they would sell a pass for the Paramount parks and a pass for Cedar Fair parks but I was wrong. They sold a regular pass for each park and a Maxx/Maxx Plus pass and got rid of all the perks that we had gotten used to. Now they are talking about not keeping the Paramount rights for the parks. This is really bothering me KI is one of my home parks and I don't want them to come in and get rid of the movie theming, rename rides, and destroy the park. I hope this doesn't happen only time will tell. Another thing I don't like is they don't offer a parking pass anymore like they have in the years before for people who don't have a season pass. Cedar Fair is going to make people angry by doing these things and they won't visit the parks.

You`re the owner of crazy town!

[cstrwomann]

I have been to 72 different parks and I have 3 states left that I want to go to. California, Texas, and Mass. If they don't have the rights from Paramount they can't keep the theming for the rides. I was never at the old KI so I don't know how it was in the early days before Paramount bought it. I like the park the way it is now and I don't want it to change.

[Browntggrr]

The only thing I'm upset about is how Cedar Fair Canned WinterFest

What CF did in cancelling is no different than what Paramount did back in 1992.

And what did you do when Winterfest was non-existant for 13 years?

[WooferBearATL]

The only thing I'm upset about is how Cedar Fair Canned WinterFest

What CF did in cancelling is no different than what Paramount did back in 1992.

And what did you do when Winterfest was non-existant for 13 years?

And let's face the facts.

The whole reason that Winterfest did not survive a second time was due to the inept actions of Paramount.

Granted, CF will need additional time to work on the park but the whole reason it was a resounding failure was because Paramount folks did not have a clue as to pulling off that event.

[ragerunner]

I think the point on winterfest was, it sucked when they canceled it back in the 90s and now that we just got it back, it sucks that Cedar Fair canceled it again. I just think its not a good sign when one of the first major changes Cedar Fair does at KI is cancel Winterfest.

[WooferBearATL]

I think the point on winterfest was, it sucked when they canceled it back in the 90s and now that we just got it back, it sucks that Cedar Fair canceled it again. I just think its not a good sign when one of the first major changes Cedar Fair does at KI is cancel Winterfest.

Like Paramount Did?

[Captain Picard]

I can't wait for some change. I been waiting for it for a long time and don't know if we will live long enough to see it. It is getting old going and seeing the same thing over and over.

Paramount could have done big things with the parks but you could see it was not going to happen.

[CoastersRZ]

Hopefully, Cedar Fair, like Paramount will bring WinterFest back eventually, as I believe if it is done right, it can bring in money for the park. The Beach seems to have made it work for several years now. But, realistically, I doubt that WinterFest will ever come back to Kings Island, which is ashame, because (while overpriced) it was a wonderful event last December. The real reason it was cut was because it likely did not make money in 2005, and Cedar Fair did not want to deal with that potential given the fact that they just assumed five new parks to integrate and substantially larger debt load.

[KIfan73]

Its all about perception. Cedar Fair may very well be making some very good decisions, but I don't think they're doing a very good job of making current customers feel that they are.

Paramount, to me, did a good job of making the public feel like it was "their" park.

Cedar Fair seems to have the persona of "well, its our park now, and this is the way its going to be". Is that necessarily wrong? No. It is their park. I would just think they should be a little leary of doing anything to make dedicated patrons to feel like a "unfriendly" company has taken over. To cancel Winterfest and to jack people around on the season and/or parking passes are two pretty "unfriendly" moves to make.

[Browntggrr]

Paramount, to me, did a good job of making the public feel like it was "their" park. 

I am wondering, how did Paramount make the public feel like it was "their"park?

And what decisions has CF made that make the park seem unfriendly?

[WooferBearATL]

Paramount, to me, did a good job of making the public feel like it was "their" park. 

I am wondering, how did Paramount make the public feel like it was "their"park?

And what decisions has CF made that make the park seem unfriendly?

Remember?

Paramount Had WalMart Greeters Saying Welcome To Walmart!

Lord, I have no idea how this individual felt Paramount made people feel like the park was theirs.

[screamingnight]

Im for one really excited about Cedar Fair. KI is the biggest and best park Paramount had. CP is the biggest and best Cedar Fair has. So what I think is Cedar Fair is mainly going to work on CP and KI.

[The Interpreter]

KI was the biggest and best park that Paramount had?

I take it you have not been to the most heavily attended Paramount Park, the one with the gorgeous landscaping, the incredibly friendly and efficient staff, the one with scrumptious food, the one with some of the best flat rides in the world and the one that Cedar Fair is most likely to sell (in my opinion, at least)?

That, of course, would be Paramount Canada's Wonderland.

As for Winterfest, let's put the blame for it not succeeding where it belongs. There were PLENTY of people at Paramount who could have made it a success. Many of the decisions that kept it from being so were made far above the park level, even above the Paramount Parks level. In my opinion, Winterfest was a show to make the parks more attractive to a new buyer. And it DID succeed at what it was intended for. CBS got an outstanding price for the transaction.

You will note the one person at Paramount's Kings Island who felt most strongly about bringing Winterfest back, who spoke enthusiastically about it every chance he got for many, many years....left right before it began.

But, that's all water under the slide. Winterfest is gone, probably forever.

A pity, too. It was a wonderful event; it's just that the most recent version was badly priced, badly marketed and unevenly executed.

[KIBeast]

Its all about perception. Cedar Fair may very well be making some very good decisions, but I don't think they're doing a very good job of making current customers feel that they are.

Paramount, to me, did a good job of making the public feel like it was "their" park.

Like when Paramount removed a bunch of family attractions and replaced them with...well...nothing? Is that how they made everyone feel it is "their" park?

[Erosarrow05]

Im sorry, how many surveys did Cedar Fair ask you to participate in? Paramount Parks were obviously interested in what the GP thought would be good attractions at their park. So when you fill out a survey and see changes in the park that you noted on the survey, or checked "i would like to see that ride at pki" etc... then that is what makes the park feel like it is 'yours'.

As for Winterfest, I was watching all the videos I took this past winter today, and it certainly made me sad that it was not going to be returning

[adam47303]

I hope KI does not become randomly themed like Cedar Point. Cedar Fair has a reputation on keeping their parks randomly themed. I want to see KI restored and updated if Cedar Fair was to invest money to the park. Landscaping is also key to keeping people attending the park as well as cleanliness. Cedar Point is not the cleanest park in the midwest like Kings Island is. They were one of the contenders most likely to dominate Ohios amusement parks. On my list they were the very last people I wanted to own the park.

[The Interpreter]

Oh my. Thanks for making me spit water all over my monitor!

You hope KI doesn't BECOME randomly themed?

Jiminy Christmas! Become?

Will someone PLEASE tell me what unified theming still exists at Kings Island? Where does IJST fit? And how does it fit that area? What is left of Oktoberfest?

And, until recently, I wouldn't have said Cedar Point was themed at all. They seem to be taking some small steps in that direction. If CF wants to drop Maverick in the middle of Coney Mall, count me in. I am much more for well run, efficient, fun, well-priced parks with well rounded entertainment than I am for uniform theming. I can get all of that I want in Florida or California. Regardless of what the former Paramount Parks management may have thought, Kings Island is not the Universal of the Midwest.....and I really don't think the easiest or best path to success lies down that avenue anywho.