Kings Island losing Paramount?

[jzarley]

By the way, Motel Six didn't buy Red Roof. Rather, both were acquired by Accor lodging company, of France!

Trust the insider on this one...I worked for RRI for 14 years (and Accor after that). Yes, Accor S.A. was the parent, but Motel 6 bought RRI. Take it from a guy who was acquired right along with it. I can give you a 100 internal operations changes off the top of my head to prove it

[The Interpreter]

Then I must defer...I know only how the transaction was painted to the public:

http://www.redroof.com/about_the_roof/pres...asp?Document=13

I also knew Mr. Truman and have been a Roof customer for many, many years...so long that my Redicard has many fewer digits than those issued today!

I can only imagine Mr. Truman's reactions to some of the changes that Accor has wrought!

[jzarley]

Then I must defer...I know only how the transaction was painted to the public:

http://www.redroof.com/about_the_roof/pres...asp?Document=13

I also knew Mr. Truman and have been a Roof customer for many, many years...so long that my Redicard has many fewer digits than those issued today!

I grew up in the organization...started in Central Reservations in Hilliard during summers in college. When I left in 2002 there was just one reporting relationship between me and the CEO of Accor North America. I saw a lot of changes over the years...from Jim & Barbara Trueman, to Morgan Stanley, to Accor.

And, yes, of course you are technically correct--RRI was acquired by Accor. However, I can tell you that to a "Roofer" we were bought by Motel 6

[WooferBearATL]

By the way, Motel Six didn't buy Red Roof. Rather, both were acquired by Accor lodging company, of France!

Trust the insider on this one...I worked for RRI for 14 years (and Accor after that). Yes, Accor S.A. was the parent, but Motel 6 bought RRI. Take it from a guy who was acquired right along with it. I can give you a 100 internal operations changes off the top of my head to prove it

Can ya leave the light on for us?

[jzarley]

By the way, Motel Six didn't buy Red Roof. Rather, both were acquired by Accor lodging company, of France!

Trust the insider on this one...I worked for RRI for 14 years (and Accor after that). Yes, Accor S.A. was the parent, but Motel 6 bought RRI. Take it from a guy who was acquired right along with it. I can give you a 100 internal operations changes off the top of my head to prove it

Can ya leave the light on for us?

Sure...I even met Tom Bodett once.

[CoastersNSich]

Sort of back to the original topic, I remember from my 2004 trip, all the highway signs along I-95 for KD said "Paramount's Kings Dominion."

On the other hand, pretty much all the highway signs for our home park, on I-275 and I-71,have always just said "Kings Island" - excluding the signs on Kings Island Drive and the brown sign Kings Mills Rd in front of Taco Bell, before the right turn to KI Drive, which said "Paramount's Kings Island".

Does this mean that Virginia's highway department might have some work to do...?

[CoastersNSich]

Going back to the "One chain buying their competitor" section...

Before being acquired by Accor, both Motel 6 and Red Roof Inns did one basic thing - provided budget accomodations- (as they still do). No sister companies that make soap, TVs, or alarm clocks.

Prior to acquisition by McDonald's, Boston Market, Chipotle, and Donatos were in the restaurant/fast food industry, and still are. They didn't also have subsidiaries like Kohler, Charmin, or Febreeze.

But, prior to acuisition by Cedar Fair, Paramount Parks seemed to do many things beyond what existing Cedar Fair parks did, which was promoting Paramount films and other characters, shows, and themes that Viacom and CBS own.

This brings up - why did Paramount choose to buy a chain of five seasonal theme parks? Was their intention to turn them into "movie-studio themed parks"? Other companies, like Universal and Disney/MGM took the approach of building new parks from scratch. Maybe in the 1990s, the idea of building new parks in North America from scratch was not as welcomed as it was in the 1960s and 70s - and the only way to get their own parks going - at least outside of Florida and California - was to acquire existing regional theme parks and transform them into their liking. Also, knowing that Orlando and greater L.A. are of great distance from much of America, why not bring the concept to the Bay Area, greater Cincinnati, the Carolinas, Virginia, and even Toronto?

It's possible Cedar Fair entertained the idea of keeping these parks going as Paramount Parks, with heavily themed rides and attractions, shows, and other tie-ins to properties they licensed from Viacom. But for that to work, they'd have to spend a lot more than CBS/Viacom did in recent years. Question is, though, do these things work for regional parks, where guests are looking for reasonably priced family entertainment? If Cedar Point started taking that approach and re-themed existing rides, or built movie-themed rides, would that "fluff" be worth the investment?

Using that logic based on CF history, I would assume that they would re-tool Kings Island as a well-run regional amusement park rather than keep it as a seasonal highly detailed movie theme park. Rather, they would use some of the theme money for better rides, improved cleanliness, capacity, staffing, upkeep, etc. Most guests are looking for speed, height, inversions, airtime, sudden change in direction, enjoying a scream or smile with family and friends - rather than playing roles of the likes of Steven Spielberg, Tom Cruise, Angelina Jolie, or Nicolas Cage.

One one hand, it's unfortunate that the movie tie-ins that make Kings Island feel different from other amusement parks surounding it are apparently going away. On the other hand, it's a great opportunity for Kings Island to reach its potential as a great amusement park by adding things that improve the guests' experience while also helping the company's bottom line.

[The Interpreter]

Paramount itself had the parks for only a season before Viacom marched in. Somehow, I think Viacom dashed whatever plans that Paramount had had for the parks.

Although you have a wonderful analysis there, CoastersNSich, and a lot of it applies, two parts of it trouble me:

...seasonal highly detailed movie theme park...

That doesn't describe what Cedar Fair bought. Not the Paramount Parks. Not any one of them. Universal Studio Parks these ain't. No matter what Jeffery Seibert may have thought. If Cedar Fair wanted seasonal highly detailed movie theme parks, they'd have even more work to do than if they decide to go another route...

...Most guests are looking for speed, height, inversions, airtime, sudden change in direction, enjoying a scream or smile with family and friends - rather than playing roles of the likes of Steven Spielberg, Tom Cruise, Angelina Jolie, or Nicolas Cage....

I'd submit there are many guests out there who are looking for an experience not unlike the Kings Island of old: rides, ENTERTAINMENT, landscaping, perhaps a great sit-down restaurant with a world-class view of a happy, fun place--a festival of fun, happy employees, a place to take the kids AND the grandparents. Not just rides.

That was the Six Flags mistake. Bigtime.

You know, Cedar Fair is looking at a great opportunity here. Kings Island needs to decide what it wants to be. Regional AMUSEMENT park? Movie park? Show park? Theme Park? Mostly a water park? Safari park? There are many options, and possible combinations.

I honestly think one of Kings Island's (and the other old CBS parks') biggest problems is that Paramount (under Paramount, Viacom and CBS) never really knew what it wanted the parks to be, had no consistent long term plan for the parks and went dashing around from one thing to another.

Contrast Flight of Fear to Tomb Raider: The Ride. Avatar to Son of Beast. "Where the thrills are Paramount" to "Where the magic of the movies meets the thrills of a lifetime" to "The Best of Hollywood entertainment, now playing."

Whatever Cedar Fair does or doesn't do, given at least a modicum of financial success with this acquisition, I bet within five years each of the acquired parks has a consistent, long-term development plan, a vision (heavens, I hate that word in a business setting, but it does have a purpose), and a well developed customer image that serves the business's long-term plans. And I do not see the word Paramount as having any part in that.

[WooferBearATL]

And that's why Six Flags is working so hard at correcting the problems of old.

Let us hope that Cedar Fair does not choose to make the mistakes that Six Flags has already made.

[beastfan11]

Back to the concrete jungle that is IJST, my only hope is that during a morning test run that the fire effect goes terribly wrong, burns up most of the ride.....

Then Cedar Fair, being the life savers they are, will put the Tiques back in.

[WooferBearATL]

Back to the concrete jungle that is IJST, my only hope is that during a morning test run that the fire effect goes terribly wrong, burns up most of the ride.....

Then Cedar Fair, being the life savers they are, will put the Tiques back in.

Of course while causing no harm to guests, associates or animal life in the area.

[ragerunner]

Back to the concrete jungle that is IJST, my only hope is that during a morning test run that the fire effect goes terribly wrong, burns up most of the ride.....

Then Cedar Fair, being the life savers they are, will put the Tiques back in.

I am sure that will happen since CF is well know for NOT creating concrete jungles?

[KI-ORIG-EMP]

Okay guys, if you call Kings Island (1-800-288-0808), they are only refering to the park as Kings Island. No mention of the P word. There is not even a mention of it on any of the park information, season pass information or ticket prices or hours of operation, on the information line.

I heard last season that they were removing the Paramount from the name. I look for them to revert back to the original Kings Island logo when the park first opened back in 72. Look for the sign in front to be changed to reflect the name.

I have worked at the park for 11 seasons and was one of original employees when it first open back in 72. I have also heard other changes that will be made but I look for major changes not to start until at least 2008.

Mike

[KIfan73]

^Hey there, welcome to the site. I for one would love to hear stories and see (hopefully!) any pics you have of the early years of KI!!

[Erosarrow05]

Isnt predicting that Cedar Fair would remove the word Paramount from the parks' name kind of like predicting that on June 3 the sun will rise?

Not exactly like it was some prolific revalation

[KI-ORIG-EMP]

^Hey there, welcome to the site. I for one would love to hear stories and see (hopefully!) any pics you have of the early years of KI!!

Hi...I do have some stories from the years that I worked at Kings Island. I will look up my pictures and post them. One interesting story was when I got caught in quick sand at Kings Island in 1974 while working on the old Lion Country. I was putting grout on the bolts on the monal rail footers and went to get some water from a small creek in the front entrance. Below surface of the water was all kinds of mud and I got stuck. Each time that I tried to pull one foot out, the other foot went deeper. There was nothing to grab onto and I ended up chest deep in the mud and after 30 minutes, the forman had the guy operating the fron end loader drop his bucket and I grabed onto it and he pulled me out. I was all covered in mud and the suckion almost pulled my shoulder out. It took a long time for me to live that event down! Charlie Dinn really laughed his head off after hearing about it.

MORE STORIES TO COME.....

Mike

[KIfan73]

Wow, that could be a 'theme' for a new ride j/k....scary situation, I'm sure...

I have some pics I'm going to post from my family's trip there in '75 (I was 2)...many pics from Lion Country.

[WooferBearATL]

Isnt predicting that Cedar Fair would remove the word Paramount from the parks' name kind of like predicting that on June 3 the sun will rise?

Not exactly like it was some prolific revalation

Nope, if you scan back you will find people that posted how there was not a chance that CF would lose the Paramount name or that they would be foolish to do so.

In fact, I'd venture to say that those of us that predicted that Paramount would be removed were in the minority.

[The Interpreter]

Especially since prolific means producing young or fruit most abundantly.

Perhaps the word he was looking for was prophetic?

In any event, since that one is supposedly so easy, Coke or Pepsi?

[Snake Attack!]

Well we will be able to tell that one fairly easily, basically when the Coke machines at the public drop off dissappear we will know, I drove by today and they are still there.

[CoastersNSich]

Paramount itself had the parks for only a season before Viacom marched in. Somehow, I think Viacom dashed whatever plans that Paramount had had for the parks.

I was initally excited about the 'new' Paramount's Kings Island. Paramount Communications had this great concept that they intended to fully implement eventually. Somehow, the concept fizzled...

Although you have a wonderful analysis there, CoastersNSich, and a lot of it applies, two parts of it trouble me:

...seasonal highly detailed movie theme park...

That doesn't describe what Cedar Fair bought. Not the Paramount Parks. Not any one of them. Universal Studio Parks these ain't. No matter what Jeffery Seibert may have thought. If Cedar Fair wanted seasonal highly detailed movie theme parks, they'd have even more work to do than if they decide to go another route...

"...seasonal highly detailed movie theme park..." is what Paramount/CBS/Viacom envisioned, and promoted. Seasonal amusement parks with attractions themed on a budget is what later resulted. My real question is, is "...seasonal highly detailed movie theme park..." something Cedar Fair really wants to do, if they were to adequately reflect the Paramount name? Again, knowing CF's history and what they have done so far with the 5 new parks, I'd assume NO.

...Most guests are looking for speed, height, inversions, airtime, sudden change in direction, enjoying a scream or smile with family and friends - rather than playing roles of the likes of Steven Spielberg, Tom Cruise, Angelina Jolie, or Nicolas Cage....

I'd submit there are many guests out there who are looking for an experience not unlike the Kings Island of old: rides, ENTERTAINMENT, landscaping, perhaps a great sit-down restaurant with a world-class view of a happy, fun place--a festival of fun, happy employees, a place to take the kids AND the grandparents. Not just rides.

That was the Six Flags mistake. Bigtime.

This, I would agree, is what Kings Island used to be up until the Paramount days. KI used to be the kind of place that people of ALL generations went to. The smaller ones went to H-B Land. Older kids and younger adults tamed the coasters. Parents and kids together rode some of the classic flat rides and some coasters. Families, including Grandma, rode the Wild Animal Habitat Monorail together. They would later see a show at Festhaus, International Showplace, or American Heritage Music Hall. Eat great food at Festhaus, International Restuarant, Columbia Palace, or other places. On top of that, there would be great shopping on International Street, with great hard-to-find gifts.

So true about the "Six Flags" mistake- they overdid Magic Mountain, while they shut down the monorail and observation tower - something that may seem boring to the teens, but something great to older adults, and their children that can't do quite yet. Mark Shapiro is trying to reverse these faux pas. Cedar Point has its fair share of gentler transport/scenic rides in between all these thrill machines, but could they use a little more, like something more family-friendly and/or a dark ride?

Yes, I want a B&M or two, and some more great flat rides. But why not a great show? Sit-down table service restaurants? Attractions with good (but not commercialized) theming that was kept up. Oh, and a Racer that races and has the red, white, and blue color scheme. And what happened to the costumed characters that would greet everyone upon entry into the park?

My original second point: Paramount spent good money on theming with OK thrill rides, while Six Flags and Cedar Fair simply used the money on larger coasters, with minimal to none theming. Italian Job and Millennium Force have the same height requirement - which one better appeals to kids who are finally just above 48"? While I would exclude the younger and older of guests from this sample, I would say that most of those who enjoy these rides would prefer all-out coasters to moderate- to low-thrill rides with theming.