McSalsa

Oh, on another subject, I do also wonder if a existing coaster (Son of Beast, cough cough) could be CONVERTED into a Plug & Play via retracking? It seems possible, and might work wonders for Son of Beast. Just an extra thought.

Well, for the most part, Son of Beast was a flop. Sure, it worked for a while, and has its fanbase, but when the ride sends rider after rider to the hospital, is mocked by enthusiasts, and is closed down most of the time, it's a flop. While its fate remains unknown, I ask you a question: do you think we will ever see a giant wooden coaster on this scale again, or has SOB killed the entire idea? There is also a bonus poll, will loops in wooden coasters ever return? My Opinion: While Son of Beast has "hurt" the idea of a 200+ foot wooden coaster, I do think it's possible, but only 1 company I can think of stands a chance. Intamin. Why do I think this? Meet Colossos @ Heide Park, in germany... http://www.rcdb.com/988.htm Colossos stands 196 feet tall. 4 feet taller and it would be considered a hypercoaster. Yet this coaster doesn't suffer from any of Son of Beast's problems. Why? It's a pre-fab plug & play coaster. From accounts I have heard, the coaster is steel smooth. If you cannot make it to Heide Park, then at least go ride El Toro @ Six Flags Great Adventure, which stands 181 feet tall and has been known to reach 75 miles per hour(they are running it FASTER than the design calls for...Cedar Fair would never do that! ). There is also a chance the Gravity Group might do it, but I don't seem to like the idea of that because their coasters, as good as they are, can be quite rough (I have heard Voyage described as "abusive boyfriend/girlfriend you can't get enough of!" before) and if that style of coaster went over 200 feet, it could be just as bad as Son of Beast if not worse. This is all just theory, but I do think it could work. If Son of Beast does get removed, hopefully Cedar Fair will put a Intamin Plug & Play Hypercoaster in its place for us shortly afterwords. As for loops...yes, that IS possible. Just don't make the loop so big the train has to be ultra-heavy to "do" it. That means that it is possible, but not beyond a certain size. I would also suggest having steel supports on such a coaster. Sorry for the long post. If you don't like my polls...why did you click the polls section!?!?

I know. But in the roller coaster industry, being an ACE landmark does help a ride as it will give it "extra value"(and a popularity boost, though if a coaster becomes an ACE landmark it is probably already popular) compared to coasters that don't earn the title. I didn't say Racer & Beast would last forever, but they have both already outlived quite a few of their younger peers and will probably outlive a few more before their time finally does come. I would expect both Beast & Racer to remain standing for at least 25 more years, if not longer. Unless, of course, there is some sort of freak accident (meteors, tornadoes, crazy dudes, etc). Then no coaster is safe from destruction. PS: Do not think short lines at The Racer or any other ride means "it's not popular!". In 2000, Racer had short lines. And yet when the final tallies came in, more people rode The Racer that year than any other coaster! Son of Beast, which was new for 2000 and had CRAZY long lines(I remember those)wasn't even in the Top 5. PS #2: Wonder what coaster got rode the most thus far this year...probably Racer or Diamondback...

Beast isn't going anywhere soon. Same goes for Racer. By becoming ACE landmarks, they pratically became invincible. As long as Kings Island stays open, that is...heck, I could even see Beast staying open after KI is long gone much like the Coney Island Cyclone is today (Astroland is dead, it's still running!). Racer...maybe not so much. As for what ride will go next, there is actually a bit of a formula for this for the steel coasters. Take opening date. Add 20-25 years. There you have it, because that's how long the average steel coaster lasts. So...adding 20 years... Flight Deck-2013 Vortex-2007 (It should already be gone!!!) (I say 2013 to 2015) These still have quite some time though... Invertigo-2019 Flight of Fear-2016 (I doubt it, it has a good chance of becoming an ACE landmark) Firehawk-2021 (I am taking into account its years as X Flight) Diamondback-2029 (I also doubt this one, B&Ms seem to be able to last longer than "normal" steel coasters) I am not taking into account the "family" coasters because I think those are probably, due to their smaller size, easier to maintain and keep up. Either way, it appears we are about to have a very bad decade as far as coaster removal goes...uh-oh..

Do I even need to explain this? The title says it all. Some of the original theming is still intact in this video. Enjoy. 111% Coasterbob62's work. Also check out this video, it's a news feature of Kings Island in '93, the year Paramount took over: Also from Coasterbob62.

Umm...we already have one of those. It's called Diamondback. Having 2 B&M Hypercoasters would be a waste of money, unless you build it right next to DB using a similar layout and make it like Racer... So your saying we can't have 2two B&M hypers if they are not racing? What if one had a loop, or if one was a flyer? That would be OK, but a B&M "Hyper Looper" would render Vortex useless though...and a 200+ foot flying coaster...hmm...I am getting some ideas... A B&M Hyper Invert! BWA HA HA HA HA!!! Just remembered, I have ridden a B&M Hyper Invert in No Limits called "The Bat Returns". It stands a whopping 270 feet tall, has 6 inversions, and is just awesome. Link to page: http://www.coastercrazy.com/track_exchange...il.asp?tid=7664 You will need to join the page to download it. Now, how to convince B&M to build it...hmm...

Umm...we already have one of those. It's called Diamondback. Having 2 B&M Hypercoasters would be a waste of money, unless you build it right next to DB using a similar layout and make it like Racer... So your saying we can't have 2two B&M hypers if they are not racing? What if one had a loop, or if one was a flyer? That would be OK, but a B&M "Hyper Looper" would render Vortex useless though...and a 200+ foot flying coaster...hmm...I am getting some ideas... A B&M Hyper Invert! BWA HA HA HA HA!!!

OK, having not made a poll in a few weeks, I need to get back on track. So, here is an interesting topic. When you think, "the average roller coaster", what kind of ride pops in your head? A Arrow Mega Looper? A classic woodie? Something that should not be considered anywhere near "average"(X2, Son of Beast, and other "oddities" and such)? Here is what still pops in my head: a classic out & back wooden coaster. Pictured is Blue Streak @ Cedar Point, a perfect example. What do you think of when you imagine "the ordinary roller coaster"? Enjoy. PS: If you don't like polls...you shouldn't be here. Though this really is more of a "discussion"...

Or "Tractor O' Zoom"...wait, that's not supposed to exist until 2010...never mind.

ROFLMAO! THE FRICKIN THING GOES 93 MILES AN HOUR!! How much more "express" can you get? 120mph+ on "Top Thrill Express?"?

A very quick and sloppy response joke to this...(Terpy should LOVE this ride!) PS: Red squiggly line thing is supposed to be Diamondback. And I got Sear's Towers name "wrong" (what u talking about Willis!?!?).

Well I am not Shaggy, but I would go with option B if I were Cedar Fair since it is $13 million cheaper. Might take a few years before we start trusting SOB again though. PS: The $13,000,000 saved could buy us a roller coaster like Voyage @ Holiday World, which if I am correct only cost $7 million to build or so, AND have enough left over for a giant flatride!

You never know. That dog can eat a lot of food, so he might be able to eat you! DA DA DUM!

...what seat on Son of Beast? Because it's its front seat of blue train...I choose Son of Beast. If back seat...I choose oil. PS: Have never ridden SOB, so punishment might end up being fun for me. And I would get a credit. And if they tore it down afterwords, I could go around bragging about how I was the last one to ride it. Trust me, I would brag. If I were still alive that is...

Where did you get that idea that SP was once considered "garbage"? Sure, it suffered in it's age as many Arrow loopers have, but "garbage"? I would like to see some facts to back that statement up, because right now, you are sounding exactly like those people that shark 6495 brought up that you dissected into nothing. I was just thinking that because they overhauled it (massivley) into Phantom's Revenge and removed all the loops/inversions. Terpy has already corrected me. Sorry bout that, it was just me being foolish. I need to ride at least 20 more roller coasters before I start commenting on these things...I think. Good news is, a Cedar Point trip may be in the works for 2010. I have my fingers crossed. PS: What's the record for "longest topic in KIC history"? Because I think we broke it...

I was talking about its reputation before it became Phantom's Revenge...when it had loops. I never rode it then, nor have I rode its current form. Wait(looks this up), on coastergotto: Steel Phantom rating, based on 106 votes: 7.1 (about average) Phantom's Revenge, based on 207 votes: 8.8 (Beast has the same rating...) I stand corrected. It may not have been "garbage", but they did improve it. At least, according to the polls. Hopefully if they do re-open Son of Beast, it improves just as much...or more. Sorry about that. Ignore my previous comments on Steel Phantom. Though just the concept scares me a little (a 200+ foot arrow mega looper!?!? Vortex is big enough!) Update: Deleted comment above on the Phantom. Update 2: While we improve Son of Beast, let's improve every ride in the park! Paint Racer and revive recar! Install those inverted-coaster style trains on Flight Deck and paint it too! Fix up AE! No more trims on Beast...wait, now I'm just dreaming... PS: Thanks Terpy for correcting me on these things. I am still a noob...

Again, true. Perhaps it was just the accident "briging Son of Beast's problems into the limelight". And I sure hope the industry's enimies are not reading this page...or are they? Or am I one of them? BWA HA HA HA!!! DA DA DUM!!! (Just kidding! I am NOT an enemy of the amusement park industry!)

While on the topic of Son of Beast, it should be noted that it may still not be all gloom & doom, and I'm not 100% certain the ride will be torn down. Yes, Hercules was torn down, but what about Mean Streak @ Cedar Point? It has a lot of the same problems Son of Beast does (save injuries, but it's only a matter of time before MS has one if it's as rough as I have heard it is...). Son of Beast could still redeem itself. Might take a few years after an overhaul, but it can be done. (Though I am sure even if it does, enthusiasts will talk about how SOB went through 3 "forms" before they got it right. V1 was with the loop, V2 is current, and V3 could be coming...or not.)

True...man, I geuss it's true then, a few bad apples can sour the entire bunch. Or in this case, a few(relativley speaking) angry coaster enthusiats can bring down the world's tallest wooden roller coaster. You need a "satisfaction rating" of at least 80% to be safe in this industry and even then, you can't satisfy everyone. I have heard people slam even some of the best roller coasters (Examples: Millie, Maggie, Diamondback, Beast, Voyage, etc etc...yes even they get slammed sometimes) I was just trying to shine some light on how most people feel about Son of Beast. I also should note it could be most of those ratings could have been from before 2006, when the ride had a loop. Before that, I don't recall hardly anyone hating on Son of Beast. It even showed up on a TV show I remeber seeing as the #2 wooden roller coaster on Earth (Hint: #1 was at the same park back in the woods. You get invisible funnel cake if you guess which one it is!) in 2004. Then came the '06 accident and...wham.

OK, to add to this already freakishly long discussion (it's longer than all of KI's coasters combined two times over!!! ), I have dug up several reviews of Son of Beast: http://www.coastergrotto.com/reviews/param...ings-island.jsp Coastergrotto's Kings Island page. Includes Son of Beast, which is rated at a 7.4 average based on 322 votes thus far. (According to this, Diamondback is by far the best coaster in the park at a 9.5 average) http://www.coastergrotto.com/review.jsp?argId=137 The coastergrotto moderator also reviewed Son of Beast back when it had the loop. He gave it a 7/10 overall. http://www.themeparkcritic.com/Scripts/Vie...aspx?RideID=169 A bunch of riders review SOB here. The average rating is 3.5 out of 5...or 7/10 once more when converted. http://www.themeparkinsider.com/reviews/ki...d/son_of_beast/ 85 people have rated Son of Beast on this web site, and it averages...a 7/10. I think I see a pattern... That's just what I could dig up. Hope this helps give you the "general idea" of what people think of Son of Beast. It seems to get a 7/10 rating from "the entire group" overall. Too bad my "rate SOB" poll got destroyed, or I would give you a link to look at that as well. It was more of the same though (a 7/10 average YET AGAIN!?!?).

A bizzare idea has just popped into my head as I was thinking about Kings Island. I thought of this... (Yes the picture is from this site) An idea popped into my head: what if KI, and the other Cedar Fair parks, did this will almost ALL of the rides? For example... "The Beast, presented by Snickers!" "Coca-Cola is proud to bring you, Diamondback!" "Millennium Force...sponsored by Taco Bell." etc etc etc... Possible advantages of this... Cedar Fair would be able to cut back on prices and still be able to make a profit (cheaper food) They could also talk the companies into paying for the rides upkeep ("Hehehehe, we can turn the trim brakes on Beast off now because those suckers at Snickers are paying for it...) They could hire more workers (and upkeep rides better) More new rides (and more sponsors for said rides, which means more $!) Disadvantages... Do you REALLY want to see "The Beast, presented by Snickers!?!?" Signs everywhere!!! AAAAAAAGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!! Restraunts like LaRosa's could be ousted by places like Pizza Hut just for sponsorship money If you don't like polls, click back. I think this could be my WEIRDEST poll yet, which explains question #2... (Yes, there is some humor here) Anyhow, Enjoy. PS: Are there ANY companies out there that would be stupid/desperate enough to sponsor Son of Beast or The Crypt? Double PS: I would like to see anyone use paint/photoshop/etc. to show what some of KI's ride signs might look like if this did happen...not needed, but it would be kind of funny...

Thanks, these are good pages for anyone looking for information on the ride itself. And here are two "Bat Videos" Includes TV stories, commercials, etc... A music video featuring the ride in action. Most of us have already seen it, but here it is again for those who haven't.

Added this date to the timeline. Thanks!

That's what Wikipedia said. And you spelled years wrong. I doubt that date a little bit myself, though...I think it was gone by 1985 but have no proof otherwise.

I have done some research about The Bat recently (see the Son of Beast thread and look around pages 75-78 or so) and have started to piece together a timeline about this legendary and ill-fated ride. Here it is. Oh, and I used Wikipedia(not all info came from them however), so some of this MAY NOT BE CORRECT. (If it isn't please comment below. If you were at KI in '85 or '86 and Bat was being torn down, or already gone, LET ME KNOW SO I CAN UPDATE THIS TIMELINE!) Sometime in 1979 or 1980- Kings Island decides to add another innovative coaster to follow up their last one, which was The Beast. April 13th, 1981- Testing on The Bat begins (Source: http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=_2ELA...q=kings-island) (Thanks for this TombRaiderTy!) April 21st, 1981- The Bat opens (Source: Wikipedia) July 11th, 1982- The Bat closes. It would never run again. (Source: http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=pH0UA...q=kings-island) November 9th, 1984- Park officals decide to remove The Bat. (Source: Wikipedia) Sometime in 1986- The Bat is finally removed. (Source: Wikipedia) (Update: I highly doubt this date, but have no proof otherwise, if you do please comment about it) April 11th, 1987- Vortex opens where The Bat once stood. (Source: Wikipedia) April 22nd, 1990- McSalsa is born! From these dates, I conclude The Bat only ran for about a year, and was SBNO for 4 years. I also assume Vortex was built rather quickly from these dates! If Wikipedia is wrong on any of these dates, please inform me. Otherwise, enjoy this otherwise useless info. Only in the the time peroid between "normal" KI and Haunt would a topic like this arise... If you don't like, click back.