Trim Brakes

[Browntggrr]

By the way, I have been around longer than The Beast, and I also predate the trim on Racer. Also, in case you were wondering, I have been to parks and ridden coasters east of the Mississippi all the way from Canada to Florida, at many different parks than a Cedar Fair or even a Paramount park, and I still have never seen a park that has more coasters trimmed than CP or KI.

All that information can be supported how?

It certainly is not from your "favorite" list on another site:

Top 5 Steel Coasters:

1 - Millennium Force @ CP

2 - Magnum XL200 @ CP

3 - Flight of Fear @ KI

4 - Top Gun @ KI

5 - Adventure Express @ KI

Bottom 5 Steel Coasters

1 - The Mantis @ CP

2 - Boomerang @ Wild Adventures, Valdosta, GA

3 - Disaster Transport @ CP

4 - Firehawk @ KI (AKA Keyeater)

5 - Vortex @ KI (AKA Jawbreaker)

I find it difficult to believe that for such a coaster enthusiast you would have AE as a number 5 coaster compared to some of the steel coasters in Florida.

And as far as The Beast being ranked in the Golden tickets. That poll is about as valable as a used piece of paper. But if you think about it; Beast is by far the oldest on that list, and with the exception of Phoenix (1985) is the only coaster not built in the modern era (1995- present). And it still made the list? And with the trims? So does that mean Beast is better than all the wooden coasters out there in the World, except the 7 above them on the list?

That really sounds like that is the point you are trying to get across.

[dare-to-fly]

It sounds to me like the point was it could be closer to #1 if at least some of the trims were taken off. And since you brought it up, check the other polls and see what you come up with. Probably something very similar.

[Browntggrr]

But since the trims have always been there, and people still rank it in the top 10, what is the point?

It is almost a 30 year old coaster, and it still cracks the top 10? That speaks volumes.

If they removed the trims and made the ride unbearable to most it probably would not get ranked at all.

[Phantom Theater]

Theirs trim brakes on rollercoasters,get over it.You cant help one bit that theirs trims on coasters on a forum.Just enjoy the rollercoaster or you can complain to your friend next to you the whole ride that "that was to slow,take the trims off".

[The Beast Rider]

By the way, I have been around longer than The Beast, and I also predate the trim on Racer. Also, in case you were wondering, I have been to parks and ridden coasters east of the Mississippi all the way from Canada to Florida, at many different parks than a Cedar Fair or even a Paramount park, and I still have never seen a park that has more coasters trimmed than CP or KI.

All that information can be supported how?

It certainly is not from your "favorite" list on another site:

Top 5 Steel Coasters:

1 - Millennium Force @ CP

2 - Magnum XL200 @ CP

3 - Flight of Fear @ KI

4 - Top Gun @ KI

5 - Adventure Express @ KI

Bottom 5 Steel Coasters

1 - The Mantis @ CP

2 - Boomerang @ Wild Adventures, Valdosta, GA

3 - Disaster Transport @ CP

4 - Firehawk @ KI (AKA Keyeater)

5 - Vortex @ KI (AKA Jawbreaker)

I find it difficult to believe that for such a coaster enthusiast you would have AE as a number 5 coaster compared to some of the steel coasters in Florida.

And as far as The Beast being ranked in the Golden tickets. That poll is about as valable as a used piece of paper. But if you think about it; Beast is by far the oldest on that list, and with the exception of Phoenix (1985) is the only coaster not built in the modern era (1995- present). And it still made the list? And with the trims? So does that mean Beast is better than all the wooden coasters out there in the World, except the 7 above them on the list?

That really sounds like that is the point you are trying to get across.

OK, I'll bite. AE is (was) in my top five only because I really don't like looping coasters. It currently resides in my number 8 spot. FOF is my number 3 only because of the launch, even though it has been neutered in recent years as well. Believe what you will. All of the information that I posted can be easily supported with information that I have in my possession. I don't feel the need to post every detail about myself online, as some obviously have too much time on their hands to go digging for it.

The Beast would easily be in my top five wooden coasters if the trims were gone. As it is now, there are many coasters that have more of a fun factor to them. I still love The Beast, but it could be (and was) so much better without trims.

Another interesting side note, I see that you are from Erie, PA. After re-reading some of the information that you posted about various items in the maintenance department at KI, and KI's budget, I find that interesting. You must be getting really tired of paying $4 or more per gallon of gasoline for that long drive to work every day.

[Browntggrr]

Another interesting side note, I see that you are from Erie, PA. After re-reading some of the information that you posted about various items in the maintenance department at KI, and KI's budget, I find that interesting. You must be getting really tired of paying $4 or more per gallon of gasoline for that long drive to work every day.

I suppose you need to read better.

I have no idea what is in KI's maintenance department, I can only speculate. Just like the speculation that Beast would be better trimless.

Do you have anything to back up your claim? Please IM me.

[AZ Kinda Guy]

...I still maintain...oh my gosh I maintained something...that if maintenance was done properly there would be no need for trim overkill...That is my OPINION, is all...

Thanks for reminding me why I don't like to post on here much anymore.

Oh BTW, your opinion is wrong.

[WooferBearATL]

...I still maintain...oh my gosh I maintained something...that if maintenance was done properly there would be no need for trim overkill...That is my OPINION, is all...

Thanks for reminding me why I don't like to post on here much anymore.

Oh BTW, your opinion is wrong.

Cranky day AZ?

[Coasterkidman]

^He's always cranky, (Nothing to you, AZ).

[dare-to-fly]

...I still maintain...oh my gosh I maintained something...that if maintenance was done properly there would be no need for trim overkill...That is my OPINION, is all...

Thanks for reminding me why I don't like to post on here much anymore.

Oh BTW, your opinion is wrong.

Apparently you need to look the word opinion up in the dictionary. Someone's opinion can never be "wrong" because it is their opinion. Facts can be wrong and people can base their opinions on incorrect facts, but there are no wrong opinions from anyone.

[Gordon Bombay]

^Ok, than your "facts" are wrong, and your opinions are based on "facts" you believe to be right, but have been shown to be wrong.

Yes, The Beast was one of the best liked wooden coasters ever, but where is it in the popularity charts now? Number 8 on the Golden Ticket last year? And what might I ask were the numbers 1-7? I believe that they are seven trimless coasters. I find that interesting.

Also, where would they have room on the bottom of the trains for skid brake and braking fins? That seems a little crowded to me.

Thats the way it was since 1979 until 2003 when the skid brakes were removed and a new style brake fin was added to work with the magnetic trim brakes.

The earth is flat? That's news to me. I'm sure that dare-to-fly knows better.\

As far as block brakes being used to trim a ride, it happens every day at KI. There is not a reason to slow the train to a crawl in the midcourse brake, if the other train is out of the way. If it stops the ride for safety reasons, that is one thing. All they are using them for is a trim brake. Yes, I said it too.

There's no reason? Well you seem to have so much experience in maintenance and all....the rides are trimmed to keep the ride maintained and running in a proper manner, they exist for a reason and has been pointed out may times: safety, maintenance, and relibaility.

By the way, I have been around longer than The Beast, and I also predate the trim on Racer. I never really worried about The Beastie (which I know is now called FOC, which is also silly) but the trim there is also pointless. I have ridden The Beast without your famous trims, several times, even several times in one day.

So being older than The Beast makes you an expert on trim brakes? I doubt your "trimless" claime considering the ride always ran with some form of trimming, whether it was friction "skid" brakes or magnetic trim brakes. So unless they ran the ride, maintenance came out, removed the coutnerweights and let the ride run wild for a little bit (which they wouldn't do), then you probably have always been riding a trimmed ride. Different types of trims provide different ride experiences and work in different ways, however, on The Beast they have always existed and have always been on. As for Racer receiving trims, keep in mind that its trains were heavily modified with individual ratcheting lap bars that increased the weight on the trains which in turn increased the speed. The trims were put in place to keep the ride running at the desired speed it was intended for.

It has been a long time now, too long actually, but I believe the last time was around year 2000. The forces that the ride generates are tame, even untrimmed, compared to some of the bigger wooden coasters out there.

Once again, the ride always ran with the trim brakes on when the general public was riding it. They could be adjusted to various degrees but I seriously doubt they were ever just "turned off," and unless there was major downtime, they were not adjusted throughout the day while guests were riding.

[dare-to-fly]

Okay, you've made those claims again and again, now prove it! How can you possibly prove that trimless rides never happened or that all the people who say they have experienced them are liars? Good luck.

If my facts are wrong, and I find them to be wrong, then I'll admit that they're wrong. And...that's the beautiful thing about this country and everyone being able to choose their own opinions. It makes conversation so much more enjoyable. For example, I am choosing to have the opinion that you are incorrect about The Beast having two different methods of braking at the same time. I believe the reason that The Beast's skid brakes were replaced was because of a minor collision in the station that was caused by wet skid brakes. Ergo, the reason they were replaced.

What evidence do I have? The video that I posted back around page 6 will clearly show skid brakes in the brake run and the station. There is also a clear view of the brakes in the brake shed, or as you call them, the brake line. Nowhere in the video is there a pneumatic pinch brake, which leads me to believe they weren't installed until the skid brakes were replaced. I can check out the numerous videos on You Tube that were taken over the years if needed, but I really don't see the point, as I know what I'll find. I've watched numerous times.

I'm under the impression that the brake fin was actually mounted on the skid just like poor Jack Rabbit at Kennywood now is. This means there would be no room for a chain dog, skids on both sides and a brake fin. The logic just isn't with you on that one. My opinion has to go with what I can see. I'm not naive enough to take anyone's word for something when I see the direct opposite is true. You just can't tell me that a road was paved in 1980 when I saw it in gravel until 1995, and it was paved in 1996 right in front of my house. Weird example, I know, but it gets my point across.

If you have any pinch brake proof, let me see it.

Now, family friendly is definitely true for The Beastie, and yes I know it is called a different name. I'm usually good at calling things by their current names, see Flight Deck, Drop Tower, Invertigo, etc. However, I refuse to use a name that I think is totally lame when it had such a cool former name. I'm willing to use Flight Deck because I wasn't ever partial to the name Top Gun. As for the trim, please tell me the purpose, and why it needs one if it isn't on there just for maintenance. I've ridden it numerous times without the trim, and it's a blast for a kiddy coaster. I've never heard anyone complain, and it isn't fast enough to be rough as long as it has some TLC every now and then.

Also, Holiday World is also a family friendly park. After all, their slogan is "Number 1 for Family Fun," yet they let their coasters run trimless. If you say trims are on coasters like Beastie, The Beast, Gemini, Magnum, etc. so everyone can enjoy them, okay...but when I have that kind of comparison, I know where my opinion lies. I believe what I see in front of me, not someone else's illogical logic. I'll take my own very logical logic, or illogical logic if it is, and form my opinions on that.

Theirs trim brakes on rollercoasters,get over it.You cant help one bit that theirs trims on coasters on a forum.Just enjoy the rollercoaster or you can complain to your friend next to you the whole ride that "that was to slow,take the trims off".

I certainly do enough of that. I do enjoy the coasters, and would a lot more if they were allowed to move. And I would get over it if they were there to a lesser extent. And no, I can't help it if there are trims on coasters, but I can certainly complain about it on a forum in the same way that everyone else complains about food prices, drink prices, admission prices, policy problems, gas prices, rhubella, measles, oops...I got tired and went a different way with listing all of the different things I have seen complained about on a forum. Pointedly, those who don't want to read this thread need not.

[Cory Butcher]

What is it that they say about Ignorance?

[Browntggrr]

What evidence do I have? The video that I posted back around page 6 will clearly show skid brakes in the brake run and the station. There is also a clear view of the brakes in the brake shed, or as you call them, the brake line. Nowhere in the video is there a pneumatic pinch brake, which leads me to believe they weren't installed until the skid brakes were replaced. I can check out the numerous videos on You Tube that were taken over the years if needed, but I really don't see the point, as I know what I'll find. I've watched numerous times.

Again, that video I provided was during The Beast's initial test runs before the park was even open in 1979. How can you possibly see, or even try to guess, what happened after the video was filmed? Even in that video, the helix tunnel is not there, as matter of fact, the roof is still being built. But we all know the tunnel to be there now. So please explain to me how the roof is not present in the video, just like the brakes, but it is there now?

My opinion has to go with what I can see. I'm not naive enough to take anyone's word for something when I see the direct opposite is true.

Well if you feel that way, why would you claim this?

How can you possibly prove that trimless rides never happened or that all the people who say they have experienced them are liars? Good luck.

That, like your opinion, makes no sense.

You have never had a trimless ride on Beast. So exactly what are you basing your opinion on? It can't be other people's word for it. You said it yourself, you are not naive enough to take a person's word for it, unless you have seen it. And since your first ride on Beast was probably in 1992, what have you exactly seen?

And even if people did happen to have a unique trimless ride at one time, how does that constitute that the brakes are not necessary?

Do you actually believe that the engineers that designed Beast wanted to slow it down? Since they are the ones that designed it, and then they determined that the brakes were necessary, are you finding fault in their design? What qualifications do you have to dispute their work?

Now, family friendly is definitely true for The Beastie, and yes I know it is called a different name. I'm usually good at calling things by their current names, see Flight Deck, Drop Tower, Invertigo, etc. However, I refuse to use a name that I think is totally lame when it had such a cool former name.

Then why not call it Scooby Doo?

Or do you have a difficult time handling things you cannot control?

[Monroe]

What is it that they say about Ignorance?

It's BLISS MAN, pure BLISS.

[Browntggrr]

Please note that this was a ERT for ACE in 1994:

http://www.groupsrv.com/hobby/about33104-0-asc-0.html

Did anyone else go to the ACE Spring Con in 1994?

They gave us some early morning ERT on The Beast and I remember it was

brakeless or nearly brakeless. Everyone was complaining about how violent the

ride shook them, I really wouldn't want to ride the ride brakeless, if thats

how it would be.

By the way, the ACE Spring Con in '94 was great! We had Exclusive Park Time on

that Friday night, they had all coasters going (about 7 back then I think) for

about 4-5 hours with only a few hundred people there. It was good times for

sure. The only problem was there was one food stand open during that time!

-Cory Patrick

[dare-to-fly]

Again, that video I provided was during The Beast's initial test runs before the park was even open in 1979. How can you possibly see, or even try to guess, what happened after the video was filmed? Even in that video, the helix tunnel is not there, as matter of fact, the roof is still being built. But we all know the tunnel to be there now. So please explain to me how the roof is not present in the video, just like the brakes, but it is there now?.

Obviously I will have to post some links to videos that were taken at later times, which are quite readily available on YouTube. It'll have to be tomorrow, because I'm not going to go through collections of YouTube videos with dial-up, sorry.

My opinion has to go with what I can see. I'm not naive enough to take anyone's word for something when I see the direct opposite is true.

Well if you feel that way, why would you claim this??.

Not sure what you mean by this, but if you mean saying the trims have changed, it's because in my observation and opinion, The Beast seems to be much slower now than it used to be. I'm not the only one that has observed this, as there are a plethora of fellow Beast riders out there who agree.

How can you possibly prove that trimless rides never happened or that all the people who say they have experienced them are liars? Good luck.

That, like your opinion, makes no sense.

What exactly makes no sense. The fact that there are many people out there who make this claim, or that you just don't want to believe that it might be true?

You have never had a trimless ride on Beast. So exactly what are you basing your opinion on? It can't be other people's word for it. You said it yourself, you are not naive enough to take a person's word for it, unless you have seen it. And since your first ride on Beast was probably in 1992, what have you exactly seen?

The ride slowing more and more every year and multiple people that make the "trimless ride" claim. Perhaps it's just the optimist in me.

And even if people did happen to have a unique trimless ride at one time, how does that constitute that the brakes are not necessary?

That's not what I said. I have made the claim that the brakes are used to the point of overkill, and I still maintain that. The brakes being off the second hill would be enough for me, even if the rest were still there. That would keep it reasonable to maintain, since all the brakes wouldn't be taken off, and I think it would shut most of the enthusiasts up while still keeping the "family friendly" atmosphere of the ride. A little extra speed won't make the ride unbearable unless maintenance abandons it.

Do you actually believe that the engineers that designed Beast wanted to slow it down? Since they are the ones that designed it, and then they determined that the brakes were necessary, are you finding fault in their design? What qualifications do you have to dispute their work?

Point taken. As I really have no qualifications, I can't dispute the design, nor do I want to. I can dispute how much they brake it without needing qualifications, which is all I have done in this post. As far as I can see from the video, The Beast was designed with brakes, so obviously they just wanted the record. My only point is, a little more force wouldn't be that big a deal, and it would give the riders of The Beast a great ride every time instead of having to score a "lucky ride" every once in a while.

Now, family friendly is definitely true for The Beastie, and yes I know it is called a different name. I'm usually good at calling things by their current names, see Flight Deck, Drop Tower, Invertigo, etc. However, I refuse to use a name that I think is totally lame when it had such a cool former name.

Then why not call it Scooby Doo?

Or do you have a difficult time handling things you cannot control?

Go right ahead and call it Scooby Doo if you want. I won't say a word. I've just always felt that The Beastie was an overly cool name for a kiddy coaster, and I don't want to loose that even if the park does. As long as I'm not spouting off the old name if I ever operate that coaster (which I heard done at a coaster in the park this season, and she did it for spite) I really don't see the problem here.

And to the second part of that post, yes, one of many reasons I went into education. Control freaks are very common in the world, so if you aren't used to the competition, get used to it.

EDIT: As to the new post, see you found one! And that may be one person's opinion, but please note that my claim is not to ditch the brakes on all public rides, but to reduce the braking by simply removing the brake on the second hill. And I would still kill for a trimless ride.

[King Maple The Tree King]

Brown, don't you know anything? The folks running the amusement industry are complete fools. There is but one organization that exists to bring about justice in the amusement world....give me an A, give me a C, give me an E, whats that spell? ACE? Yes, these card carrying members know way more about "proper maintenance," maintaining a ride, safety, and the industry....moreso than any professional in it today. I've been riding The Beast since the year it opened, and I'm willing to agree that the experience of the ride has completely changed over the years. However, I'm also not too arrogant to the point where I can listen to the former employees on here and those who know what they are talking about. I trust them when they say the speeds run the same and "dare-to-fly," in reference to your youtube, videos you can clearly see that the skid brakes existed in the same spots as the magnetic brakes do today. While the experience has changed, the rides is still a great ride enjoyed by many today. The park and its people know what they are doing when it comes to safety and maintenance, better than any coaster club.

Gordon, while I agree with you on many points, you have been incorrect about one thing: The ride did not open with the pneumatic pinch brakes, while the "brake line" was originally a block, those brakes were not controlled or adjusted by the operator. The feed motors were originally installed so that if a train became stalled or needed a boost they could help it along, however as you pointed out the skid brakes there could only be adjusted by counterweights and only maintenance took care of them, not the ride operators (later in the mid 90's before the skid brakes were replaced, a set of pneumatic brakes was added so that, that section could operate properly as a block and a train could be stopped there in the event of an emergency stop). The skid brakes were not adjusted throughout the day unless there were significant changes made to the structure or trains. As for "trimless" rides; the park claimed to offer these for special events, but I seriously doubt they ever really did that. Ride The Beast on a hot afternoon on a wheel seat with the current magnetic trim brakes. After you recover from the headache, imagine what the ride would be like if you went even faster while riding on that wheel. As pointed out the trims are there for a purpose and that is to keep the ride running well and allowing it to provide a great ride.

Dare-to-fly, I think many members on here are having trouble seeing your points because of how immature, irrational, and illogical you are acting. This quote for instance:

Go right ahead and call it Scooby Doo if you want. I won't say a word. I've just always felt that The Beastie was an overly cool name for a kiddy coaster, and I don't want to loose that even if the park does. As long as I'm not spouting off the old name if I ever operate that coaster (which I heard done at a coaster in the park this season, and she did it for spite)

Did you know the operator? How are you so sure it was spite, and not an honest mistake? Your constant "jump to conclusions" and assumptions about things makes people reading your posts question you.

Like Monroe said.....Bliss.....pure Bliss!

[dare-to-fly]

Go right ahead and call it Scooby Doo if you want. I won't say a word. I've just always felt that The Beastie was an overly cool name for a kiddy coaster, and I don't want to loose that even if the park does. As long as I'm not spouting off the old name if I ever operate that coaster (which I heard done at a coaster in the park this season, and she did it for spite)

Did you know the operator? How are you so sure it was spite, and not an honest mistake? Your constant "jump to conclusions" and assumptions about things makes people reading your posts question you.

Thinking about this logically, what would you call this conversation over the microphone (late in the evening). I'll go ahead and give the coaster name, since by now no one will ever know who said what.

As I'm waiting in line...

Operator: "Oops, I mean Flight Deck. Sorry, but this will always be Top Gun in my heart.

Train is dispatched and the train I was to board comes in.

Boarding is over and bars are released.

Operator: "How many of you here wish this was still called Top Gun?"

Many raise their hands.

Me: "I doubt she was supposed to say that!"

Operator: "Me too...so enjoy your ride on Top Gun: The Jet Coaster!"

Person I was with: "I know she wasn't supposed to say that!"

Now, with that commentary, how is it immature, illogical, or irrational to assume that this was intentional? Is it not obvious that this was said on purpose? Obviously it was unintentional first, but then a perfectly intentional second time is illogical? Bliss yourself. If I'm ignorant, I'd like to know what sane looks like.

On another note, at least I agree with the majority of what was said in your post. I also appreciate your honesty about the brakes and the overall ride experience. At least there is someone chiming in with some sense about what speed feels like.

in reference to your youtube, videos you can clearly see that the skid brakes existed in the same spots as the magnetic brakes do today.

Except for the ones on the helix. But I never said anything to the contrary. The rest of the youtube videos show skids on the helix as well, so I'm fully aware that they were added soon after. Again, I never said anything to the contrary. The trim strength is what I dispute, and thanks for agreeing.

[King Maple The Tree King]

On another note, at least I agree with the majority of what was said in your post. I also appreciate your honesty about the brakes and the overall ride experience. At least there is someone chiming in with some sense about what speed feels like.

No offense, but I don't think anyone was intentionally being dishonest. Also, while the feeling of speed has changed in your opinion, the actual speed of the ride has not, contrary to what you claimed earlier.

Except for the ones on the helix. But I never said anything to the contrary. The rest of the youtube videos show skids on the helix as well, so I'm fully aware that they were added soon after. Again, I never said anything to the contrary. The trim strength is what I dispute, and thanks for agreeing.

The magnetic trims on the helix begin at the same point where the old skid brakes used to. You can still see the catwalk visible between the ledgers, however, the magnetic brakes are much shorter than the longer skids and as was pointed out by Gordon before....by the time the ride opened to the public the friction brakes had been added to the double helix.

[dare-to-fly]

No offense, but I don't think anyone was intentionally being dishonest. Also, while the feeling of speed has changed in your opinion, the actual speed of the ride has not, contrary to what you claimed earlier.

I didn't say they were, and I'm sorry if I made it sound that way. At any rate, I personally feel that the overall speed has changed for the most part. There are good rides to be had in the afternoon and evening usually, but if you really want to feel the braking at its worst, ride in the morning. The brake takes most of the fun out of it. I really wish they were adjustable, but that isn't my department. Anyway, probably the thing that I resent the most is the ruining of a good airhill because of the positioning of that second magnetic brake. I hate that brake. Not that I like any of the others, but that is the one that really bothers me.

The magnetic trims on the helix begin at the same point where the old skid brakes used to. You can still see the catwalk visible between the ledgers, however, the magnetic brakes are much shorter than the longer skids and as was pointed out by Gordon before....by the time the ride opened to the public the friction brakes had been added to the double helix.

I'm not disputing that.

[Monroe]

If I'm ignorant, I'd like to know what sane looks like.

Caution: language

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oboyox3L_MI...feature=related

[KIFAN!]

okay... i dont know if someone alredy said this but when i was riding The Racer i noticed the red one (the one that used to go backwards) slows down more on the turn around then the blue one does and the blue always ends up winning even when the red gets a head start. now, i only ride the blue. did anyone notive this?

[dare-to-fly]

okay... i dont know if someone alredy said this but when i was riding The Racer i noticed the red one (the one that used to go backwards) slows down more on the turn around then the blue one does and the blue always ends up winning even when the red gets a head start. now, i only ride the blue. did anyone notive this?

Oh yeah! If you go up the Eiffel Tower and watch a race, you can visibly see just how much Red Racer slows down at the turnaround. Since they recently retracked this side, I'd love to know what the excuse is for killing all of the airtime on the back side.

[Garret]

deleted.

[Garret]

Thanks Beast Rider, the chassis on the current Beast trains are original to the ride, as are many other mechanisms. Bear, they can repaint trains...in fact they repaint all the wood coaster trains every year (not sure about Son of Beast and Adventure Express, which the wood coaster department maintains, but the PTC trains on Racer and Beast receive a fresh coat of paint each off season).

As for the brake line of Beast being a trim brake, it was in fact always there braking the ride to keep it running within "acceptable" paramaters. In the past, yes, it was a block for the ride and could be stopped there and the ride resumed with feed motors, however it always featured a skid brake for trimming the ride.

Also the brakes on Beast do not make it go any slower, the braking is just way more abrupt and sudden than it was in the past. The skid brakes acted on friction and could be raised and lowered by a counterweight depending on how maintenance wanted the ride to run. When raised higher, they created more friction for more braking, when lower, they allowed less friction for less braking. The skid brakes extended nearly all the way down the first drop, a good deal down the second drop, right before the pneumatic pinch brakes in the brake line, and right as you entered the final brake run. The magnetic brakes do the same job, just much more quickly and do not require the signifigant amount of length the skid brakes required.

Vortex separating from the supports in 1988? Welded steel just coming apart? With how fast that train takes that turn, I really doubt there never used to be some form of braking there.

They can indeed paint trains, but in this case they didn't. The original trains were 4 row per car, 5 car per train configuration. They had a slightly wider undercarriage along the sides to be used along with the feed motors in the brake shed to start a blocked train. Beast was designed to run 4 trains, the brake shed was never designed to be trims, but to setup when necessary and restart a train when clear. When the 4th train was removed the trains were replaced with the current 3 row per car/6 car per train configuration and have been in use ever since. Here's another fun fact. Operators used to be able to use feed motors to reverse a train in the station when they overshot the queues. With the current set of trains however, the motors did not grip the trains as well and used to slip causing a nasty odor in the station. This feature has since been removed as it's no longer possible to blow the station brakes.

[The Interpreter]

As a service to those who recently wanted to discuss, yet again, trim brakes and, in that case, The Beast, I am also bumping this thread. Almost everything that can or should be said, and perhaps a few that shouldn't, can also be found here...

[Beast1979]

To those who complain about The Beast's Brakes:

The Beast Is a great ride with the Brakes, without the brakes it would be painful.

The Brakes are there for a reason. Quit whining.

[Jasper]

^Have you ever ridden it without the brakes?

[Beast1979]

^Have you ever ridden it without the brakes?

Yea, I couldn't feel my spine.