Skywriter Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 Great Wolf Resorts Inc. of Madison could lose its two-year-old resort in Mason, Ohio, if it can’t renegotiate its mortgage by the end of this month. A dried-up credit market seems to be the culprit. The $76.8 million mortgage on the indoor water park resort matures Nov. 30. Great Wolf said in its third-quarter report that through Sept. 30, the property had $6.3 million in adjusted EBITDA (earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization) and made $4.8 million in debt payments. “We are disappointed with the lack of progress in our discussions with the loan’s head lender toward obtaining an extension of the loan’s maturity date,” said James Calder, chief financial officer for Madison-based Great Wolf. “The Mason resort continues to provide more than sufficient cash to service the current loan balance.” The Great Wolf Lodge in Mason opened adjacent to the Kings Island theme park in December 2006, with more than 400 suites, an arcade and themed restaurants, along with the water park. Great Wolf Resorts (NASDAQ: WOLF) owns and/or manages 11 Great Wolf Lodges and the Blue Harbor Resort in Sheboygan. The company posted third-quarter net income of $2.2 million, or 7 cents per share, compared with $1.8 million, or 6 cents per share, in the year-ago quarter. Business Courier of Cincinnati is a sister publication of The Business Journal Serving Greater Milwaukee. Source:http://www.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stori...10/daily38.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 http://www.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stori...10/daily38.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dane Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 You need to link to source per copyright infringement. See any of "The Interpreters" threads for a correct method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 Also see the GWL conference call transcript, where this was discussed: http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15443 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BavarianBeatle Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 Who is this lender? If anyone knows.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted November 15, 2008 Share Posted November 15, 2008 GE Capital. http://news.cincinnati.com/article/2008111...40409/1168/NEWS http://www.wcpo.com/content/specials/2008/...27-1fe73c24a2a5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywriter Posted November 15, 2008 Author Share Posted November 15, 2008 You need to link to source per copyright infringement. See any of "The Interpreters" threads for a correct method. Yeah I usually do that but I forgot thanks for posting a link Interpreter and reminding me Dane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted November 30, 2008 Share Posted November 30, 2008 http://www.itbusinessnet.com/articles/view...e.jsp?id=593021 (put another way, we will continue to operate the Mason GWL until such time as we are informed we won't be, unless we can get the lender to refinance, in which case never mind...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Discussions continue on Great Wolf's Mason Mortgage: http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/stor.../01/daily2.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DegenRider Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Something tells me Cedar Fair may get there resort for Kings Island after all. Let it default buy it cheaply rename all the rides Water slides as generically as possible and boom! resort! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 ^ you need a course or two in proper English, Spelling & Grammar! Another Ohio water park bit the dust last week. There are too many of them to support the market. And face it, as long as you can still buy a Slip n Slide, it's a heck of a lot cheaper than a water park's fees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Well, as someone who has done a lot of research on indoor water park resorts (that`s part of my thesis topic), I can offer some insights. The Sandusky area has a LARGE amount of indoor water park resorts. They have Kalahari, the largest indoor water park resort in the country, the Great Wolf Lodge, Cedar Fair owned Castaway Bay, and the now bankrupt Maui Sands. Those four (now three) attractions definitely over saturated the Sandusky market. Keep in mind that the Sandusky area only has a population of nearly 60,000 people in the winter. Certainly not enough to sustain all those indoor water parks. And keep in mind that the Kalahari Sandusky has over 170,000 square feet of indoor water park space. By comparison, Great Wolf Lodge at Kings Island has 78,000 square feet of indoor water park space and Coco key has 50,000 square feet. And from the numbers that Great Wolf has released for the Mason property, it is certainly making money for the company. It`s just that GE Capital, the lender that owns the mortgage was not wanting to extend the time period, due to the current state of the economy. I would not say that Great Wolf is about to loose the lodge. Secondly, it would be even more unlikely for Cedar Fair to acquire the property, due to the large debt load that Cedar Fair has from the Paramount Parks purchase in 2006. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 ..not to mention the FACT that Cedar Fair was offered CBS's then interest in Great Wolf Lodge as a part of the Paramount Parks acquisition. Cedar Fair declined. Separately, it's not just Great Wolf Lodge with mortgage problems. Now its lender, GE Capital, is tapping the FDIC backed bond program: http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssFinanci...226892220081202 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 More on GE Capital...here characterized as "ailing." I'd think the strong scrutiny GE Capital is now under would make a deal at Great Wolf Lodge in Mason less likely....or at least make the terms more onerous: http://www.forbes.com/markets/2008/12/02/g...2markets36.html In plain English, the mortgage was due on Great Wolf Lodge Mason on November 30. The company didn't pay it as it apparently didn't have the money and couldn't get refinanced. And GE Capital apparently doesn't want stuck with the property, as it must now be worth less than the balance due. This could get...interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westcoaster Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Can we maybe say Cedar Fair : SCOOBY LODGE or HANNA BARBERA LODGE..or will they even think of buying it. Its the best of the two parks in cincinnati Surely they can come to some agreement on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Did you not see my post above? I do not think that Cedar Fair would be in a position to acquire this property given their own debt load. Not to mention that Cedar Fair, as Interpreter noted, passed up the opportunity to own a minority stake in the property when they purchased Paramount Parks from CBS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRider Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Heres a thought though. Cedar Fair cut the woodie for GA out of the budget this year. Could that be in part because they are planning on buying the Mason resort at a greatly discounted price? Yes I know that the mortgage is more than the total capital expenditures for Cedar Fair this year, but that all would not be due up front and they could possible get the property for less. I know what others have said, but just being a little devils advocate, after all it is an interesting conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PREMiERdrum Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Did you not see my post above? I do not think that Cedar Fair would be in a position to acquire this property given their own debt load. Not to mention that Cedar Fair, as Interpreter noted, passed up the opportunity to own a minority stake in the property when they purchased Paramount Parks from CBS. Didn't Mr. Kinzel say they were interested at creating resort destinations at the former Paramount Properties? If the price is right for the business, never say never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Did you not see my post above? I do not think that Cedar Fair would be in a position to acquire this property given their own debt load. Not to mention that Cedar Fair, as Interpreter noted, passed up the opportunity to own a minority stake in the property when they purchased Paramount Parks from CBS. Didn't Mr. Kinzel say they were interested at creating resort destinations at the former Paramount Properties? If the price is right for the business, never say never. Yes, he said that it was prime to develop such at Carrowinds, Kings Dominion and Canada's Wonderland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DegenRider Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 If the price is right why not pick up a fully built resort on the cheap? As far as debt load goes if GE defaults the loan and they want to sell it for a quick 40-50mil. That would be a drop in the bucket for CF to pick it up. This could be a purchase that could pay for it self fairly quickly if the opportunity knocks. The place makes money but Great Wolf it self just can't afford to pay for the place all at once. This move could make the shareholders very happy because the park would be picking up a profitable unit and can be made more profitable once you merge operations into the company itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jzarley Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 To swing a deal for Great Wolf, CF would need to do so without incurring much (if any) additional debt. I'm not sure they've got that kind of cash on hand to spare right now... It could be a great deal, though--and one they'd need to think long and hard about before walking away. Back a few years ago when the rumors were swirling about CF buying Paramount Parks I posted then (multiple times ) that CF would be smarter to buy the entire GW chain instead of the Paramount Parks. At the time GW was having some major shareholder issues, and CF probably could have picked up the whole company for about 25% of what they paid for Paramount...that certainly would have made their debt situation a lot better off today, and would have given them more assets generating revenue year-round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRider Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 I think Cedar Fair is far more knowledgeable about opperating theme parks than they are lodging. Yes I know they have numerous choices at CP, but I still see their main skill set as leading to the efficient running of parks and not moving in to the lodging market so much. Maybe a cherry picked property here and there, but I just see CF staying away from a large lodging network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Keep in mind that I believe they also own and operate a hotel at Knott`s. Why would Cedar Fair be interested in owning hotels adjacent to their parks? Because it gives them the chance to capture out of park revenue, while offering a service to resort guests. Translation, the hotels provide Cedar Fair with additional revenue that capitalizes on the success of the park which Cedar Fair owns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jzarley Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 I agree that CF is far from an expert hotelier, but if you add up the properties they currently own & operate (at CF, Knotts, WoF, etc.) they have a fair number of rooms. They hired a VP of resorts & accommodations a few years back that I believe came from the hotel industry, so it does seem like it's an area with a fair amount of interest for them. And, of course, the margins in the hotel business are pretty good compared to the theme park business. (Of course, most of my career was spent in the hotel industry, so maybe I'm a little biased ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRider Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 I understand opperating a hotel on or next to your park, makes perfect sense. But do they really want hotels spread out all over the country? I mean there numerous Great Wolf's that are nowhere near a CF park, not to mention that they would shut one of the 2 down in Sandusky. Doesn't make sense to me. I think cherry picking properties to opperating makes much more sense. Like buying the Mason prop on the cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 A 30 day extension on maturity announced: http://www.ibtimes.com/prnews/20081203/wi-...olf-resorts.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRider Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 The last thing GE wants to do is forclose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italianchef Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 I hope that GE doesn't foreclose on the Great Wolf Lodge. Let's assume for a moment, that GE does foreclose on the GWL and then sells it. I am quite certain that the same of the lodge would have to change unless the buyer paid royalties to the GWL company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Well, at least the Loose Moose would be history....proving good things can come from bad things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italianchef Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 What is wrong with the Loose Moose? I have enjoyed excellent meals at the restaurant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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