Accident on Alton Towers Smiler

[bjcolglazier]

Anybody on here ever worked at Kings Island operating one of the coasters?  Is it even possible that a human-error "oops I hit the wrong button and released that train" type of thing could happen?  Sounds possible though not ideal to me, but I've never been behind the controls, or even seen what they look like.  I'm thinking a computerized system where it says, "Hey, I haven't received a signal that Train 2 has reached its necessary destination, so Train 3 isn't going anywhere" would make total sense as a fail-safe.

 

Anybody know how they work, and typical fail-safes on coasters these days to prevent such collisions?

[The Interpreter]

Four with "life changing injuries."

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jun/03/alton-towers-closed-investigation-smiler-rollercoaster-crash

This does not sound at all hopeful.

[malem]

^^ Several people on this forum work (or have worked) as ride operators at Kings Island.

 

What you described is basically how it works. For more, look up information about block braking systems. Here's a link to a basic explanation: http://www.coaster101.com/2011/11/23/coasters-101-brakes-blocks-and-sensors/

 

What failure led to two trains in the same block is one of the questions being discussed.

[jsus]

One wonders whether or not the train design had any impact in the severity of the injuries.  There is no car 0 and riders in the front car are right at the front of the train.  That makes it almost a given that their legs would be pinned between the two trains.  It also explains why our riders took such a brunt of the impact.

 

 

Contrast that with even an Intamin like Maverick that both has a car 0 and has what appears to be a bumper on the front (round) and rear (square) in the unfortunate case of a collision.

 

[The Interpreter]

Pinned or....

Terp, who doesn't even want to think it...

[TheCandyManCan]

Is it even possible that a human-error "oops I hit the wrong button and released that train" type of thing could happen?

 

Not one bit. The only way a system will in some ways bypass the safety system is in Maintenance Mode where everything moves manual, but this is never on during operation, and usually is key activated on most panels and operations does not have this key. Regardless the safety systems are still there. This is typically used when the ride has a fault and maintenance comes in.

 

 

Anybody know how they work, and typical fail-safes on coasters these days to prevent such collisions

 

 

The rides basically have a series of sensors along the course in certain areas (bottom/top of lift hills, before/after brakes, etc). The sensors basically detect where the train is along the ride and keep the trains spaced apart to prevent issues such as this. The sensors at the beginning signal that the train is in that area of the track. The sensors at the end after triggered tell the PLC (programmable logic controller) that the train is no longer in that area and that section is now clear. The system also will use cross checks (usually sensors come in pairs) and check itself. Any issues (say one sensor says the ride is there, the other doesn't) and the ride will fault and setup the ride, stopping any forward motion at the next available stop. Say a train is about to come close to cresting the lift hill, if a train hasn't cleared the mid course or safety brake (depending on the ride), the lift motor will stop, thus the train stops advancing on the lift. The anti rollbacks engage* and the train stops from entering the next block.

 

Whatever happened to Smiler makes me quite curious. Something either didn't grab in time, something faulted, or somehow the first train advanced past a block and somehow rolled back. I'll be watching curiously to see what all happened. Operator error could have come into play. Depending on how close the trains got, usually even if you know the trains will setup (using lift hill issue discussed above) the ride operators should still press the lift stop or e-stop as a preventative measure and stop it before the safety system does it automatically. This practice may not have been done and at that point too late. However, it's too early to tell. I need to watch the POV to even see where the blocks are, and try to get some nice off ride footage to see how the ride is run. Seeing as I've never been over there I can't really comment on how it's operated daily.

 

Regardless, something somehow happened, four riders have life changing injuries unfortunately, and now the industry as a whole is going to react, and in some ways overreact. I'm sure you will see ripples here in Cedar Fair parks, new ride installation changes, and new SOP's coming later. Look post Texas Giant at all the changes, they were there, some quite drastic. See how operations at Cedar Fair parks changed and how quickly IROC was brought in and ride operations retrained. Cedar Point took quite the hit operationally this season as a result. 

[The Interpreter]

No.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3107569/Two-carriages-Alton-Towers-Smiler-rollercoaster-collide-16-people-board.html

Sigh.

[jsus]

It just keeps getting worse and worse.

Definitely expect to see huge changes in the industry and huge lawsuits (or at least settlements).

[The Interpreter]

This did not happen in the United States.

Other countries handle legal matters QUITE differently.

[silver2005]

Something tells me Smiler's days are numbered after this.  Gerstlauer is going to be feeling this for a while, too.

 

What a bad event.

[jsus]

There is still a legal system in the UK and this would be anything but a frivolous matter.  That's all I'm saying.

[The Interpreter]

And I'm saying huge lawsuits over matters like this are unheard of there. So are huge settlements. Criminal charges, on the other hand...

And medical costs are covered by the Government. England is not the USA.

[TheCandyManCan]

Oh no, this is what I feared would happen. 

 

Watching the POV (created in 2013), there are several proximity switches on the lift hill to detect the trains location along it's ascent. There seems to be a trim or block brake between inversions three and four with proximity switches there. This trim I would suspect caused the previous valley issue that was caused by a trim brake. The next set of sensors and brakes are right before lift two. There's a trim brake right before the ride engages onto the vertical lift. Interestingly enough, the train can roll back down the second lift to be reset before climbing again. There brake before the lift can hold a train as well.

 

 

The brakes on the lift hill look to be eddy current brakes. This isn't the first coaster that lets a train roll back down a lift hill (see Maverick). However the eddy current brakes are equipped on the left side of the train and track. There are friction brakes on the right side of the track and train. Before the lift hill it looks like there are very VERY small calipers to engage these as a blocking mechanism. At the end of the ride and on the transfer table there are normal Arrow esque sized ones, but these are virtually nonexistent on the second lift hill.

 

So, just speculation. Either the ride came down the lift hill or didn't advance all the way to the lift hill. This would trigger the sensors to clear the previous block, allowing the next train to advance up the lift and enter the first ride block. However, if it rolls back, the eddy current brakes there aren't enough to completely stop the ride. However, the ride would then have to have enough momentum to climb back through two inversions to meet the train where the collision happened. This event seems very unlikely but I won't rule anything out just yet, this is a bizarre scenario to begin with

 

Second scenario is when the train clears the trim brake between inversions three and four, somehow clearing the block, or giving the ride the go ahead to send the next train given it's speed and distance. I don't like this setup and I wouldn't believe a manufacturer would let this system be setup this way, however here we are today. I could liken it to almost Dragster. The sensors up on the top hat detect the train, once it knows it's cleared, the next train advances from the transfer track to the launch track. If you notice, even while the train is still at crest, the next train can still advance. So if the first train cleared that, but somehow stalled and valleyed, the next train is sent thinking the block is clear, as the next train should be at the lift hill or on it already. However the train has no sensors to detect a valley or any way of preventing it. The only thing at this point it could maybe do if it faults out is engage the trim brake which looks to be another eddy current brake with no friction brakes, so it will only slow, not completely stop. Thus, collision in the batwing element

[Dalefan]

Anybody on here ever worked at Kings Island operating one of the coasters?  Is it even possible that a human-error "oops I hit the wrong button and released that train" type of thing could happen?  Sounds possible though not ideal to me, but I've never been behind the controls, or even seen what they look like.  I'm thinking a computerized system where it says, "Hey, I haven't received a signal that Train 2 has reached its necessary destination, so Train 3 isn't going anywhere" would make total sense as a fail-safe.

 

Anybody know how they work, and typical fail-safes on coasters these days to prevent such collisions?

Top Thrill Dragster at Cedar Point has a fail safe built into the ride. If you see it roll back, you will see what i mean.

[shark6495]

So 1: the news article there involves so much more investigating and reporting...

2: early reports look to say the coaster with people did hold up before being released..... Bad brakes or bad sensors to release the ride? Also why were to trains so close. I thought there should always be on block gap between the trains?

[TheCandyManCan]

Two trains can occupy blocks right next to eachother (say one on lift, one after) there isn't always a brake between them. As long as a train can be stopped at the entrance and exit, the train can occupy that area. Two trains cannot occupy that same area however. 

[The Interpreter]

But, obviously they CAN.

And DID.

[bkroz]

Another thing that'll be learned from this: marketing.

 

Alton Towers and other Merlin parks are notorious for their methods.

 

If Cedar Point was obsessed with breaking records, Merlin was obsessed with inventing them. Thirteen - the scariest roller coaster in the world. A nurse on site just in case. Free diapers for terrified adults. "Don't ride alone." Most every major coaster / thrill ride installation at their parks has been dripping with outrageous advertising.

 

See also, Merlin's Thorpe Park's Swarm. Their marketing for that B&M Wing Coaster and its scenic near-miss elements? Test dummies allegedly returning to the station missing limbs. See "UK amusement park redesigns roller coaster after dummy passengers lose limbs," wherein the media knowingly or unknowingly touts this as fact.

 

Smiler is going to change. Merlin is going to change. The industry is going to change.

 

And next time Alton Towers constructs a large thrill coaster (IF that ever happens again), expect a very different spin.

[The Interpreter]

Point taken, but:

Query: Have the Six Flags Superman, Bizarro, New Texas Giant incidents changed Six Flags and its marketing?

[TheCandyManCan]

^^^If done correctly it never happens. Something broke, some sensor was incorrectly tripped, or my scenario is true.

 

Not like it makes this outcome any worse, but I hope my scenarios are wrong. I hope it's some out of this world, never could happen, 1 in infinity chance, how the hell accident versus bad PLC programming. If the train made it to lift #2 and engaged, this wouldn't have happened, so lift #1 should have stopped until then. However I believe potentially for the sake of capacity, scenario #2 is true. If the ride judged the speed of train #1 and said, it'll clear, and kept train #2 going on the lift, but then train #1 valleyed before it got to the second lift, oh boy. 

[PyroKinesis]

The article on the Daily Mail says that the train filled with passengers stopped in the middle of the loop. Is this normal operation for The Smiler? How does one stop a train halfway through a loop?

[TheCandyManCan]

That is not normal operation at all however. It can stall in the inversion, however, there is nothing on any of the inversions to purposefully stop the ride

[silver2005]

It was likely a stall that stopped it in the loop.  If you look at the trains, they don't look like the most aerodynamic trains ever built, that's for sure.  For a ride which does all those twisting maneuvers and loops (14 inversions), the trains looks pretty bulky, and the UK can be a windy place.  I do see bits of forums talk about how it stalls semi-often, but the ride usually stops until its fixed.  

[bkroz]

Point taken, but:

Query: Have the Six Flags Superman, Bizarro, New Texas Giant incidents changed Six Flags and its marketing?

 

Point taken! But Six Flags hasn't planted advertisements in news sources hyping their rides by saying test dummies are flying out of them. 

 

I couldn't tell you what Six Flags' marketing strategy is. Which is a whole other issue.

[jsus]

Probably because Americans would take it seriously and nobody would ride it, or even visit the park..

[silver2005]

I remember AT marketed Thirteen by saying guests would have to fill out a waver before riding trying to hint to how intense it was supposed to be.  They also labeled their big ride projects as 'Secret Weapons'.  

[McSalsa]

Yikes- I know Smiler has had some big issues in the past, but this is awful. While it's a good thing no one has died (yet- I fear some of these injuries sound like they may eventually be possibly fatal though I hope that doesn't happen) but the rumors (though reported by news sites) of crushed legs and lives changed forever sounds horrible. Add this incident in with the past issues with Smiler, and I'd say it's pretty safe to say this ride has had a a VERY rough first 2 years. I wouldn't be shocked if it doesn't make it to 2020 (if even that) after all these incidents. I agree with Terpy- we will see changes in the industry because of this. This ride is starting to remind me of Son of Beast- a revolutionary ride that pushed the limits, but may have pushed them too far for its own good and thus had many issues.

[jcgoble3]

I wouldn't be shocked if it doesn't make it to 2020 (if even that) after all these incidents.

 

I wouldn't be shocked if it never reopens after this. In fact, given the ride's history of incidents, if this turns out to be anything other than purely operator error (which at this point, I doubt, and for the sake of the person manning the controls, I sincerely hope it isn't), I would be at least mildly surprised if it DOES reopen at any point in the future.

[McSalsa]

^
At the very least, I think if/when the ride does re-open, it won't be the same and there will have been some kind of modifications. Possibly the removal/changing of track sections, bumpers added to the cars, better sensors and safety systems, etc. Though whatever caused this accident still needs to be figured out before they know what changes to make. Then, if it STILL doesn't work and keeps having more issues...it'll likely be more than Alton Towers can put up with and thus bye-bye Smiler, say hi to Son of Beast & Hypersonic XLC, etc. in the realm of innovative but failed coasters. Which will be sad because Smiler seems, based on photos & POV's ( have yet to get to Cedar Point so Alton Towers is way outta my coaster range ATM) at least, to be a VERY unique and interesting ride and potentially a very fun one.

[FoF96"]

Anybody on here ever worked at Kings Island operating one of the coasters? Is it even possible that a human-error "oops I hit the wrong button and released that train" type of thing could happen? Sounds possible though not ideal to me, but I've never been behind the controls, or even seen what they look like. I'm thinking a computerized system where it says, "Hey, I haven't received a signal that Train 2 has reached its necessary destination, so Train 3 isn't going anywhere" would make total sense as a fail-safe.

Anybody know how they work, and typical fail-safes on coasters these days to prevent such collisions?

Not done Kings Island but have done our favorite theme park in Kentucky. There is only one way that would allow 2 trains on one block assuming all systems are operating normally. The ride would have to be in maintenance mode and be under full manual operation.