Son of Beast's Record Broken?

[flightoffear1996]

"On the other hand, it goes to show what monkeys are running Six Flags if they want to recreate our mistakes by building hyper-woodies."

I have to argee with you there and plus its freaking Six Flags and they have bad upkeep.

[Gordon Bombay]

SOB wasnt a mistake, sure it has its flaws but it was completely new and not done before (I'm tlaking abut the loop on it). THey have to have those cars on there for the loop and sure its rough to some people but its a great one of a kind coaster.

[Admiral Ackbar]

Here is a funny thought. A wood version of TTD. They can have it - Ill keep my SOB.

[BoddaH1994]

SOB wasnt a mistake, sure it has its flaws but it was completely new and not done before (I'm tlaking abut the loop on it). THey have to have those cars on there for the loop and sure its rough to some people but its a great one of a kind coaster.

I'm talking about all of the retracking, work, lawsuits, etc etc etc that have been a result of that ride. I don't think that the idea was bad, but I think that we now know the limits of a wood coaster, and if they try to break it, they have the same, if not worse, problems.

[Delirium_Guy]

The layout of SOB is great, It's the company that built it. If I remember, PKI sued because of the poor engineering and design. It was a mess. Hopefully Intamin has corrected these issues of a hyper woodie

Remember also, Paramount Parks was the general contractor for the ride as well. There are always two sides to the story. I'm pretty sure RCCA isn't completely to blame, considering the success they've had with other rides they've built world wide. Anyway you look at it, SOB is a flop.

[KIBeast]

Boddah, can't you admit that maybe with Intamin's new design, it could negate SOB's problems?

You guys are so hell bent on it will never work that you haven't even thought that maybe the technology is now there. For the longest time, no one thought that the 200ft. mark set by Magnum XL200 would ever be broken.

[thejoker8388]

^No, I really don't think that it will work. Technology has only progressed so far and some things still aren't possible, or if they are experience lots of problems ie. TTD and Kingda Ka. I don't think that a wood coaster 250 feet could be maintained, especially by Six Flags, they can't keep normal coasters running let alone a 250 foot woody. If they did build one it might be smooth the 1st year or two but then due to poor maitnence it would fall apart and become rougher than even SOB. Six Flags wouldn't be willing to spend the money to keep the coaster where it needed to be. Look at SOB, its still really rough, but PKI has put millions in it even after it opened just to keep it from getting even worse. Six Flags wouldn't spend that much, they'd just forget about it and have to tear it down. So yes, I could see Six Flags doing it, but I think the coaster would be rough and much worse than SOB which is well maintained, but still rough, just imagine what it'd be like at Six Flags.

Also, if you want to get technical Magnum wasn't the first 200 foot coaster. That mark had actually been broken for 6 years by Moonsault Scramble at Fuji-Q Highland.

[Jasper]

I hope they dont build it because it is cool to have a park with a record holding coaster.

[soviettraitor]

i really don't think its going to happen ether. Son of Beast alone saways bad during wind storms, an can't see 250ft tall wood coaster be stable.

[KIBeast]

The thing is Joker, you don't know. You don't work for Intamin and you have not been on Balder, so, if you're done being an expert....

[Captain Nemo]

i really don't think its going to happen ether. Son of Beast alone saways bad during wind storms, an can't see 250ft tall wood coaster be stable.

Well, during its construction wind blew down part of the wood at the top. I think people dont want Hight or Speed anymore, It's the theme!!!! But I will add one more thing, It is a classic design people love, and there is only one coaster I absolutely adore as a classic coaster. This coaster dosen't get the recognition it should have. The layout is perfect in every way, the turns and tunnels are flawless. This coaster can only be... Roar at Six Flags America. If you don't know this coaster or just think of it as any other coaster YOU JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND!!!

I guess I have gotten a little off-topic. Guess I'm just trying to say... ROAR RULES!!!

[KIBeast]

Yeah, obviously people don't want height or speed any more. That's why Kingda Ka was built.

[Jasper]

Intamin building a wooden coaster. I have to see this.

[thejoker8388]

The thing is Joker, you don't know. You don't work for Intamin and you have not been on Balder, so, if you're done being an expert....

If you actually read the post, you would realize that I wasn't talking about Intamin. I said the coaster may be very smooth but due to Six Flags maitenence the coaster would fall apart on itself, because whether its pre-fabricated wood or not, it still needs lots of retracking and Six Flags would stop doing it and it would fall to pieces. They wouldn't spend the amount of money needed to keep retracking it to keep it smooth. This dosen't require as you say "an expert" it's called common knowledge and simply examining Six Flags past record of letting coasters fall apart, so, if you're done being a smart a**...

[KIBeast]

Actually, SF maintenance at SFGadv, from what I understand, is doing a good job over the last couple of years. Or, are you just gonna make a blanket statment about the whole chain? There's no reason that SFGadv shouldn't install a new woodie, record breaking or not. Or, is it that you just read or heard that SF maintenance doesn't do a very good job?

[thejoker8388]

^Chang at SFKK is one of the roughest B&M's I've ever ridden, T2 is one of the roughest coasters I've ever ridden, period, both Thunder Run and Twisted Twins are fun but farily rough.

When I went to SFMM, Psyclone was rougher than SOB, Viper was much more rough than Vortex, Deja Vu was broken and from what I hear those 3 are always broken, Scream was brand new and one of the rougher B&M's I've been on (still smooth but rough for a B&M), Flashback was actually open and possibly the most uncomfortable ride I've ever been on.

At SFEG, Mind Eraser and Flying Coaster were rough and/or uncomfortable

At SFOG, Ninja was very rough, Deja Vu was broken again, and GASM was about as rough as Racer, which I don't consider bad but some do.

And then when Geagua Lake was owned by Six Flags, not much was wrong but Raging Wolf Bobs was really rough.

So, no I haven't been to every Six Flags and yes I enjoyed all of my visits, but generally these parks had more rides that needed painting, retracking, weeding, repair, random rides big&small closed all day, etc... than you'll ever find at a Paramount or Cedar Fair park. So that's why I don't trust SFGAV to build a a huge wooden coaster and actually keep it in decent operating form. Now, I have heard SFGADV is doing a better job than most Six Flags, but still i have heard from many that many rides at SFGADV are in need of repair/painting. Also, they never run both sides of The Chiller from what I've heard.

Also, I don't know where they'd put the coaster. If you look at this picture I don't know where it'd go. The new coaster is supposed to be built where viper is (the small coaster next to the white wooden one) Where would the coaster go? My only guess is that it would have to stretch across the river into that open field, but I doubt the city would let them build across the river like that, especially with a wood coaster that would need lots of supports.

[Delirium_Guy]

I disagree about the Holiday World thing. Taking into account the cost of construction in the amusement industry today, there's no way they'd make their money back on it quickly enough for it not to hurt. Clearly the industry isn't looking for record breakers anymore, which is why PKI, with very few records left on the books, is the highest attended and highest rated seasonal theme park in the world.

I wish the best of luck to any other park that would like to break our records, but I still have my doubts. I don't think that people come to ride The Beast because it's the longest in the world, but rather because of the reputation that it has developed over the past 26 years of being an awesome ride.

On the other hand, it goes to show what monkeys are running Six Flags if they want to recreate our mistakes by building hyper-woodies.

Ryan

I think Holiday World is perfectly capable of pulling off such an expansion. Keep in mind one thing, using the terrain is certainly going to cut down the cost of the ride. Secondly, there is always the option to use steel structure on parts of the ride. That greatly reduces their cost in the beginning and in the long run on upkeep. I think most of you don't quite take that little park quite seriously enough. I'm not saying they are building the new world's longest woodie, blah blah blah, just saying that they are definitely able to make such an expansion.

I definitely agree about not building anything taller than Son of Beast. Sheesh, like you said, what a mistake. Perhaps we'll get lucky and it'll burn down? :-) On the other hand, I have heard many positive things about Colossus at Heide Park. Its not too much shorter than Son of Beast, only about 20 feet. Its made it through several seasons, 4 I think, and all reports say its still glass smooth. I think if Intamin's plug-n-play technology works on that ride, then something taller may not turn out to be a bad thing at all.

As for Six Flags and stupid investments......I guess I understand them. I'm still not sure why Kingda Ka was chosen, given the reliability of all the other rocket coasters. However, I understand the reason they did it. A new, record breaking, attention grabbing ride at the flagship park. Keep pumping money and attention into the Parks that are actually making the money. I think I would have went with something different if I were them, but the reasoning behind it does make sense. I certainly wish them the best of luck in attempting to turn things around.

- Todd

[Delirium_Guy]

SOB wasnt a mistake, sure it has its flaws but it was completely new and not done before (I'm tlaking abut the loop on it). THey have to have those cars on there for the loop and sure its rough to some people but its a great one of a kind coaster.

How can you sit there and honestly say it was NOT a mistake? *scratches head* I think Son of Beast ranks up there are one of the worse theme park investments *ever*. It certainly didn't have much drawing power, because if I remember correctly, attendance that season didn't jump a considerable amount. The Park sank a boat ton of money into it once it opened just to keep the darn thing in a semi-rideable condition. I still remember at the ACE Add-On day, NOBODY was riding during ERT. I've seen more people than I can count get off *****ing about how rough the ride is and holding their heads. They are right. I can handle wood coasters that are rough, Son of Beast is simply almost unrideable in some seats. Despite how horrible it is, I give the park major props for maintanance on it. I don't think it'd run anywhere near the way it does if it were in another Park.....it'd run ten times worse. God, to think of what the Park *could* have built for that money wasted on SOB.

- Todd

[BoddaH1994]

I disagree about the Holiday World thing.  Taking into account the cost of construction in the amusement industry today, there's no way they'd make their money back on it quickly enough for it not to hurt.  Clearly the industry isn't looking for record breakers anymore, which is why PKI, with very few records left on the books, is the highest attended and highest rated seasonal theme park in the world. 

I wish the best of luck to any other park that would like to break our records, but I still have my doubts.  I don't think that people come to ride The Beast because it's the longest in the world, but rather because of the reputation that it has developed over the past 26 years of being an awesome ride.

On the other hand, it goes to show what monkeys are running Six Flags if they want to recreate our mistakes by building hyper-woodies.

Ryan

I think Holiday World is perfectly capable of pulling off such an expansion. Keep in mind one thing, using the terrain is certainly going to cut down the cost of the ride. Secondly, there is always the option to use steel structure on parts of the ride. That greatly reduces their cost in the beginning and in the long run on upkeep. I think most of you don't quite take that little park quite seriously enough. I'm not saying they are building the new world's longest woodie, blah blah blah, just saying that they are definitely able to make such an expansion.

I definitely agree about not building anything taller than Son of Beast. Sheesh, like you said, what a mistake. Perhaps we'll get lucky and it'll burn down? :-) On the other hand, I have heard many positive things about Colossus at Heide Park. Its not too much shorter than Son of Beast, only about 20 feet. Its made it through several seasons, 4 I think, and all reports say its still glass smooth. I think if Intamin's plug-n-play technology works on that ride, then something taller may not turn out to be a bad thing at all.

As for Six Flags and stupid investments......I guess I understand them. I'm still not sure why Kingda Ka was chosen, given the reliability of all the other rocket coasters. However, I understand the reason they did it. A new, record breaking, attention grabbing ride at the flagship park. Keep pumping money and attention into the Parks that are actually making the money. I think I would have went with something different if I were them, but the reasoning behind it does make sense. I certainly wish them the best of luck in attempting to turn things around.

- Todd

Once again, Todd tells it like it is.

I agree that HW is commonly underestimated. Would they be able to build a coaster that's longer than The Beast? Sure. My point is that it probably wouldn't be a very lofty investment.

Was Son of Beast a mistake? That's really hard to give a blanket answer to. I know of a lot of people who absolutely love the ride, but on the other hand, if you ever get into a conversation about PKI with someone who's not a regular, how often do they mention how uncomfortable the ride is? Pretty often in my book. I guess the tiebreaker is the countless hours of unnecessary maintanance and millions of post-completion dollars put into it. As Todd stated above, it's hard to imagine what else could have been done with that money. Burn it down? Nah... last year when I was in line for The Beast, some old guy told me this long-winded story about how it was made of a certain type of wood which will rot into nothingness within 2 or 3 years... then again, you know old people... they know everything.

Oh, and while we're on the subject of rotting away, let's talk about Six Flags. Yeah, Kingda Ka looks cool, but I think it was a terrible investment. A couple of years ago when CP built TTD, people were jumping over eachother to see this mysterious giant. Now, two years later, and less than 20ft higher, people still seem to think that if you've ridden TTD, you've ridden Kingda Ka. I suppose building an only slightly taller coaster than the tallest one in the world, and making it a clone is kind of like buying a Toyota Landrover... you might as well just buy a Chevy Blazer and tape $20,000 to the bottom of your hood, because that's what you just did.

Ryan

[Jasper]

I hope no one builds one longer than The Beast that is like a sin.

[KIBeast]

"it certainly didn't have much drawing power, because if I remember correctly, attendance that season didn't jump a considerable amount."

Well, that was largely due in part to the fact that it was not open a whole lot the first season. It's easy to say it was a huge mistake in hindsight. Now, when PKI was going to build SOB, the now SOB haters were probably all about it until after they rode it. Hindsight is always 20/20.

[coasterguy1991]

well that sucks

[Gordon Bombay]

SOB still draws in quite a few people, it is the worlds only wooden looping rollercoaster. I hear just as many good things as I do bad when I'm working.

[pkiboy]

Like what do you hear?

[Gordon Bombay]

What I hear from guests:

"That thing is so neat going upside down on a wooden coaster"

"I love how tall and fast it is"

"Its rough, but The Beast is rougher"

"Its my favorite coaster"

etc.

[harvesterofyoursorrow]

When you are in the station its soo funny. You hear people gasping and things like that. "Is that loop on this ride" "Noo! it cant be!" Then I break it to them that it is.

My neihbors that are in second grade wouldnt ride Adv. Express becuase they thought that SOB was AE.

[Kat_RPW_employee]

Inversions: 0

YEAH!!! THEY CAN'T TOP THAT!!! ha ha ha.

[Kat_RPW_employee]

What I hear from guests:

"That thing is so neat going upside down on a wooden coaster"

"I love how tall and fast it is"

"Its rough, but The Beast is rougher"

"Its my favorite coaster"

etc.

mmm mmm

The Beast is SO not rougher than the son. shame on them

[thejoker8388]

^Depends on how you view roughness. Beast is definetly rougher than SOB in a powerful shaking sense, but it's what I would consider a good roughness like what Legend at HW has, a powerful shaking that is fun. SOB's roughness is more of a jarring bouncing rough that isn't the "fun" type of roughness.

[moore]

I don't know what kind of rough you guys are calling fun b/c I find any kind of roughness painful and completely funless (if that is even a word).