screamingnight Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Why can`t they make Top Gun at PKI go upside down? I know it would never be possible but why not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclaimer Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 I know it would never be possible You just answered your own question. Just look at the ride...Not gonna happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Why mess with something if it isn`t broken? The old saying "if it ain`t broke, don`t fix it" applies in this situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screamingnight Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 why is it not possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdboy007 Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 the money it would take to redesign it they could just put a new one in somewhere else, leave top gun alone except for a paint job and themeing like it used to have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screamingnight Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 I meant while thay was building back in 1992 why could they not add a loop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyrocoasterkid Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Its the wrong kind of cars. There is a difference between suspended cars and inverted cars. Suspended cars can swing freely from side to side, while inverted cars are rigid and can't swing side to side. If a suspended car went into a loop, it would flop sideways at the top of the loop and probably hit the track. The only way to prevent it from going sideways there is to have such a high speed into the loop that the force keeps it straight. This force would probably knock out all on board, but hey, LETS DO IT!.... Difference in cars: Inverted Suspended I hope i made some sense...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screamingnight Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 Its the wrong kind of cars. There is a difference between suspended cars and inverted cars. Suspended cars can swing freely from side to side, while inverted cars are rigid and can't swing side to side. If a suspended car went into a loop, it would flop sideways at the top of the loop and probably hit the track. The only way to prevent it from going sideways there is to have such a high speed into the loop that the force keeps it straight. This force would probably knock out all on board, but hey, LETS DO IT!.... Difference in cars: Inverted Suspended I hope i made some sense...lol Hey thanks for answring my question without calling me stupid! You rock! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bat Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 Actually, to be honest, a loop on a suspended coaster is well within the boundries of physics to preform safely. The amount of force one would feel, would of course be greater than normal, but it is doable. Speed is a misconception in this particular case. Centrifugal force, (NOT CENTRIPUTAL, THAT DOES NOT EXIST), would be great enough to keep the cars suspended linearlly, i.e. not fall on their side. So to answer your question, a loop on Top Gun is technically possible, however, Arrow felt the need to simply not include one. Hope this all helps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screamingnight Posted August 13, 2005 Author Share Posted August 13, 2005 That really helped thanks alot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyrocoasterkid Posted August 13, 2005 Share Posted August 13, 2005 lol...thank god someone came up with the word: CENTRIFUGAL!.... I tried my best w/ limited knowledge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLorean Rider Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 Nothing is wrong with top gun. Why add a loop, i dont see how that could make the ride any better.Plus, the way the ride swings, that could result very badly. Several prototypes have been made of suspended coasters with inversions and none of them have worked. I have several videos put out in the mid 90's showing prototypes and models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
screamingnight Posted August 14, 2005 Author Share Posted August 14, 2005 Could I see the videos? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLorean Rider Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 They were produced by rhino productions and theyre old, but they are cool. I bought them at Blockbuster a long time ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flightoffear1996 Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 YOu could easily have a barrel roll or some other smaller inversion but if you were to do a loop I just dont think it would happen the way they have the ride set up now. The best bet would be to have that thing in the station that make the cars not move from side to side but going into that 5 MPH sucks much less 40 mph. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoasterKrazy Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 The suspended prototypes with inversions had only corkscrews, and they were not full-scale models (from the videos that I have seen, so PKINickRoedl correct me if I'm wrong). Apparently, Arrow determined, probably for a number of reasons (safety, reliability, forces) that the inversions would not be possible, although they did originally plan for suspended coasters to have inversions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLorean Rider Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 ^I agree 100%, the only inversions were corkscrews and as far as I know many models were made and one prototype with just a short piece of track and an inversion but it failed badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Bombay Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 ^Where was the prototype made? Is it possible to put some kind of computer system on the car and when it hits a sensor before the inverson, it some how locks up and prevents the car from swinging? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdboy007 Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 and if that sensor failed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Bombay Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 THe ride stops itself at brakes right before the inversion or the nearest brakes like every coaster does when a sensor fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moore Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 I think your safest bet would be to just add like a "feed" that guides the train into a center peice that guides/prevents it from swinging. I think that TG is fine the way it is and that the costs of maintaining a suspended looper would be too much to bother with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Bombay Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 It sure would be nice though if PKI could add on to it and add inversions. It would be the only inverted suspended swinging coaster. I love Top Gun for its swinging features, but if you could add some inversons, make it longer, and give it theming it would be so much like a fighter plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLorean Rider Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 ^Where was the prototype made? I think just in the back yard of Arrow Dynamics, Im sure they had a lot of space as at the time they were the leading designer of steel coasters. Kind of like how when S&S introduced the thrust air coaster, they built the prototype Thrust Air 2000 in their back yard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Ackbar Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 Actually, to be honest, a loop on a suspended coaster is well within the boundries of physics to preform safely. The amount of force one would feel, would of course be greater than normal, but it is doable. Speed is a misconception in this particular case. Centrifugal force, (NOT CENTRIPUTAL, THAT DOES NOT EXIST), would be great enough to keep the cars suspended linearlly, i.e. not fall on their side. So to answer your question, a loop on Top Gun is technically possible, however, Arrow felt the need to simply not include one. Hope this all helps! Uh you got that backwards. Centripetal force is real. It is latin for Center Seeking. It is a force that accelerates an object inward toward the center of a circle. Centrifugal force is the one that is used for convenience - but does not actually exist. There is no such thing as Centrifugal force. But there is Centripetal force. Centripetal force is what keeps you pushed down into your seat in a loop. INERTIA is what would keep the cars from flopping over. The cars tend to move in a straight line, but the track forces them to follow a bent path. So INTERTIA forces the cars outward, but the force acting against INERTIA is the CENTRIPETAL force... Centrifugal force is an imaginary concept used to make things make more sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoddaH1994 Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 Actually, to be honest, a loop on a suspended coaster is well within the boundries of physics to preform safely. The amount of force one would feel, would of course be greater than normal, but it is doable. Speed is a misconception in this particular case. Centrifugal force, (NOT CENTRIPUTAL, THAT DOES NOT EXIST), would be great enough to keep the cars suspended linearlly, i.e. not fall on their side. So to answer your question, a loop on Top Gun is technically possible, however, Arrow felt the need to simply not include one. Hope this all helps! Uh you got that backwards. Centripetal force is real. It is latin for Center Seeking. It is a force that accelerates an object inward toward the center of a circle. Centrifugal force is the one that is used for convenience - but does not actually exist. There is no such thing as Centrifugal force. But there is Centripetal force. Centripetal force is what keeps you pushed down into your seat in a loop. INERTIA is what would keep the cars from flopping over. The cars tend to move in a straight line, but the track forces them to follow a bent path. So INTERTIA forces the cars outward, but the force acting against INERTIA is the CENTRIPETAL force... Centrifugal force is an imaginary concept used to make things make more sense. Oh jeeze... we always get the science buffs on here. I think we can all agree that if TG were made longer and with inversions, it would quickly take the trophy as being the best ride in the park. To me, that whole swinging sensation really keeps me on edge, although I've ridden the ride countless times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KIBeast Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 Coastercrazy is right. Arrow originally had planned for the suspended coasters to do loops and other inversions. They also discovered that it wasn't possible and had to scrap the idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdboy007 Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 Cannot argue with physics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 I just wish those OTSHs were replaced. They're really not needed and they hurt my 6' 4" body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Bombay Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 ^Where was the prototype made? I think just in the back yard of Arrow Dynamics, Im sure they had a lot of space as at the time they were the leading designer of steel coasters. Kind of like how when S&S introduced the thrust air coaster, they built the prototype Thrust Air 2000 in their back yard. Do you know of any pictures or can you tell me what the video of the prototype is called. Id love to see it. The suspended coaster is great and really simulates the feel of a fighter plane better than an inverted coaster from what ive heard, but man, if Top Gun was longer and had say a corcskrew and some theming........we can only imagine. However, if say they did find some way to do it it would probably get re-themed to something like Sky Captain...pssh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoasterKrazy Posted August 14, 2005 Share Posted August 14, 2005 *Information no longer needed, and it was wrong. Check out the videos on page three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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