Shaggy

Ick! Lock the freak up and throw away the key!

"I wonder if maureen really rode x-flight before. Or maybe just borg?" Maureen has definitely ridden X-Flight. How do I know? I was present during her 1st ride on the coaster. Actually, Jeff Seibert, Maureen, two Martketing interns and myself spent the day at GL 2 years ago. I have to say, that day was an absolute blast... and Maureen's reaction to the initial "flip" on X-Flight was priceless ;-)

Bravo Tomb Raider Nick! Dead on. Hit the nail right on the head. Kudos! Bottom line... it's gone... it aint coming back... it was junk falling apart when closed... it's a memory... move on. SDATHC is currently making new memories for tons of little ones just like Enchanted Voyage/Land of the Dooz etc. did for me as a kid. Let them enjoy it. I am personally happy to see a line for this attraction, PT NEVER had one. All too often little ones were terrified and had to be calmed by parents when entering Phantom Theatre. I have never been a proponent of scaring a child away from rides. Oh and someone mentioned something to the effect of Enchanted Voyage, Smurfs, Gulliver, Winnie Witches Cauldrons etc being on par with Disney. Well, I am sure Uncle Walt just sommersaulted in his grave (or at least his head spun around in the jar) Nothing... and I mean NOTHING at KI has ever been on par with Disney. KI is my favorite park... however it's ride quality is that of a seasonal park. Disney rides have always been backed by an immense floodgate of studio money so they are built to reflect that. Shaggy

Now see, my vote would go to Mean Streak, TTD or Iron Dragon for worst. ;-) Shaggy

The most intense part is the first time it flips, and the force exerted on your chest at the bottom of the first drop. The restraint system is uncomfortably tight. Your first time on, it will feel like you are dangling by your ankles. But heck, my attitude is, if your on it, you might as well stick your arms out and fly like Superman. If the restraint fails, your a dead duck no matter if you are holding on or not. Ha ha! Shaggy

It wasn't. Actually under Paramount KI was slated to no have a new install of ANY sort in 2007. I learned that direct from the park itself. Actually, it would have likely LOST a ride. I was told that KD's FOF was closed and removal to Carowinds had already been planned. When Viacom decided to sell the parks, the plan was put on hold. KI's FOF was slated to close after 2007 and be relocated to Wonderland. Shaggy

"refurbishing every year, doesn't get any better..... whoa.... are you talking about the wood coaster at Gauega (or however it's spelled)? 'cause I could have sworn you were spekaing of SOB. " Ge-au-ga. I am definitely talking about Raging Wolf Bobs at GL. I have ridden it several times over the years and have not seen any major improvement. I was not a fan of the ride to begin with, nor have I become a "changed man" as many others proclaim to be. I am glad others find the "improvements" worthwhile, or think that it's a great coaster now. I don't. The layout has never been a thrilling one, and IMO the switch from PTCs to Gerstlaurs is not inspired. I mean Gerstlauer trains are HORRENDOUS. Speaking of which, there's a bad rumor floating around that CF is looking at placing Gerst trains on Sonny. God help us all if that's the case. Bottom line, a bomb should have been dropped on Sonny about 2 years ago. Shaggy

Hmmmmm... painting it before they assemble it and in the dead, freezing cold of winter. Can you say touch ups? Oh, and does anyone remember what the "touch ups" looked like on Face/Off when the sun "chalked" the paint after it's first year? It resulted in a Dalmation effect. You know what baffles me? How come parks and ride manufacturers don't use Auto paint? Call me naive, but I've never seen a car's paint fade as fast as coasters seem to. Shaggy

"In addition, the Raging Wolf Bobs coaster has been completely refurbished" My God how many times are they going to re-do that coaster? It's been "refurbished" about 10 times over the years... and never gotten any better. Shaggy

Those poor, unfortunate construction guys. It is bitterly cold! Shaggy

"It has been how many years since KI has built on previously undeveloped land?" Not that many. Boomerang Bay used undeveloped land to the left of the wave pool. Here's a Post article that sheds a bit more light as well as has a construction pic. Kudos to Connie, you can always count on her to be the first to get info out there. (She loves KI.) http://news.cincypost.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar...02050372/-1/all

Too bad we cannot call WCPO and tell them to move their webcam about 2 inches to the right. ;-) It would be the perfect shot! http://www.wcpo.com/webcams/pki/

Not sure if this is proper board posting etiquette, however it’s worth a shot. I have been downsizing in life quite a bit of late, and as a part of that have decided to part with quite a chunk of my coaster and amusement park related paraphernalia that I have acquired over the years. I threw the items up on Ebay since I figured many coaster fans may enjoy having them. There are many things up for auction right now that may be of interest to folks here. There are rare PKI, Cedar Point, Six Flags, etc etc etc pieces that may be welcome additions to collections. There’s also a TON of really unique and rare Son of Beast items that I bet many of you have not seen before. I posted this on this board not to necessarily seek a profit, but I'd rather they go to the homes of friends and fellow enthusiasts that may enjoy them as much as I did. Here’s direct links in case you are interested. Also, my Ebay seller name is Shagscooby and you can find them all listed by that. Thanks! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...p;rd=1&rd=1 Shaggy

On the flip side, it's bad from a PR standpoint. Would the park really want to showcase the fact that many, many, many rides have been removed? Shaggy

Vortex DOES lose wheels from time to time. Well, actually, it loses it's "tires." The wheels are coated with a rubberized polyurethane that over time wears and can strip off much like a blown tire on the road. When I worked at PKI years ago, and was on Beast crew, we would occasionally hear one blow or hear the sound of a running train that had a blown wheel. When we heard it, we'd simply call The Vortex station and they'd cycle off the train for maintenance. Shaggy

Do you honestly think that Michigan's Adventure can support a coaster as complex as X-Flight? I cannot see this at all. Michigan's Adventure does not have an abundance of steel coasters, especially ones as technically complex as X-Flight. KI on the other hand, has a staff that is very well versed, and very well trained on highly complex and computer driven coasters. Heck a few of them even helped oversee the installs of Stealth (and then later... Borg.) IMO installing X-Flight at MA would be on par with installing it at a park such as Knoebles, or Holiday World. It's leaving GL because it was too much for too little of a park. Placing it at MA woudl create the same issue all over again IMO. Now, I may eat crow on this... but my money is KI. Shaggy

Captain Nemo said: "I love all of these tiny clues. As you can see it seems we are going into a Cedar Fair way of hinting new rides.' Well, that's not a new "Cedar Fair" touch. KI has "hinted" at new attractions for ages. Are we forgetting the likes of: "Dropping in Next Season" (Drop Zone) "Getting ready for a New Adventure" (Wild Thornberries) "Discover New Thrills at PKI" (Tomb Raider) and "Pardon us as we stir up dust." (Delirium) just to name a few ;-) It's pretty obvious that X-Flight is headed to KI. It will be a good fit. And they'll get it open in 2007. We need only look at the turnaround time it took for Borg to be installed at PCow. Ground prep is the hard part... well that and the electrical portion. They had Stealth moved across country, painted installed and opened in 6 months time. My guess would be that the park's target is to open the coaster in time for full season hours. KI has never really been "on time" with past installs either. This will be no different. I do think that they probably have a goal of opening the ride also in time for the ACE Coaster Con. That way they will no doubt use it to spur media attention. (i.e. "Hundreds of members of the American Coaster Enthusiasts converged on King's Island today to try out their latest scream machine. Details at 11") Shaggy

Sonny cannot run "off the shelf" trains. Stadard wooden coaster trains... no matter M Flyers or PTCs, would have to be custom built. The reason is, the gage for SOB's trains is wider than typical wooden coasters. I would suspect, that if they have yet to contract new trains from a manufacturer, then SOB will not open with the park in the spring. The loop removal is nothing but a side effect of having to change trains. The trains (along with the overly intense rose-bowl) have always been the main issue with the coaster. From a ride quality and enjoyment standpoint, the wisest thing would be removal of the rosebowl and replacement with an out and back jaunt. But this step is just another "fix" to the ride, that will not produce a more enjoyable experience at all. SOB has, as predicted, suffered the same exact fate as it's predecessor... The Rattler... at Fiesta Texas. It was built prior to SOB (by the same company) and suffered the same exact fate. The Rattler still exists, but is one of the least noted and least enjoyed wooden coasters today. SOB will follow suit. Well, correction... it will live on in legend. SOB will go down in history as yet another "Bat." Which people will be talking about 30 years from now. Mark my words... the tide will turn and people will begin to recall "fondly" their rides on SOB "back in the day." Shaggy

Chose not to mention it. I had learned that from a former PP exec after Delirium was installed. I don't think the "Core" proposal never made it past the drawing board. Shaggy

"The Core" was almost used as the ride name of another attraction already at PKI. Originally Delirium was to be called "The Core" and was supposed to have a themed volcano surrounding the load station. No lie. The theming was dropped due to, you guessed it, budget cuts. Shaggy

Cedar Fair already communicated that they were going to go ahead with the current Paramount plans after the sale, and he also communicated that it would not be a major expenditure. Not exactly. PKD's Flight of Fear was slated to be relocated to Carowinds. That was nixed and the coaster has now been re-opened. Shaggy

"we're geting the adams family coaster" LOL, if only! Wanna know the honest to goodness truth? Dollywood is getting the Addams Family Coaster. Mystery Mine is exactly what the Addams Family attraction was going to be. No kidding. When Paramount nixed the idea for IJST, the ride was proposed to Dollywood execs by Anthony Esparza, the guy who designed it. And they bought it. So when you ride it at DW next year, click your fingers while you ride and you'll get the same effect. As far as a new attraction... I am not counting on it. General rumor is that 2007 may be the first season in KI history that they have not added a new attraction of any sort. We may see the Paramount logo and ride names stay the same through next season (the sale allows for CF to use the Paramount branding through the 2007 season if they so choose.) But I expect we'll see all Nick licensing start to spread into CF parks. I highly doubt that the former Paramount Parks will see the Peanuts gang. Bottom line, Nick will stay... but Paramount will eventually go bye-bye. Shaggy

I was there Monday, which was the very first time that the park played the National Anthem at opening. (Maureen verified at lunch.) It is played right at 10am, and when finished the ropes are dropped on International Street. This is one of the Cedar Fair implementations... per Dick Kinzel himself. It's a Cedar Point tradition. Shaggy

You are are putting an awful lot of faith in CF. Fact is, CF *knows* how to operate parks... they've been doing it for quite a while... however from an install standpoint, they often make choices that are not at all true to the parks original esthetic. If you are looking at the CF buyout from a ride standpoint, I think we'll see good things to come. The reopening of FOF and the likely reopening of SOB (like it or not) are good indications of their intent to operate rides at the parks well. I also can't help but note that Dick Kinzel likely obtained extra capitol when buying the Paramount parks for initial new attraction investments. From a general park standpoint, I think we'll see some dissapointing changes as well as the good ones. I think the loss of Winterfest is a prime example of this. Irregardless of last year's turnout, it's obvious that CF just doesn't want to deal with it... so they dropped it. One has to wonder how many other things they will not want to deal with, and will drop as well. But more importantly, CF's business practices are really ancient, and steeped in tradition. They harken back to the 1970's and 1980s. From a marketing and promotional standpoint, CF cannot even begin to hold a candle to the former Paramount folks. They excelled at it, and they had the name and money to back it up. Out of that came years of steady and increased attendance at Paramount Parks, at which time CF parks saw decreases. CF traditionally pays less in employee wages and salaries than other major park chains. They get away with this by implementing on-property housing initiatives as well as pursuing foreign exchange students who were willing to work for lesser wages than locals. They also rely on a very small staff housed in Sandusky to operate all the parks that they own across the country, rather than a direct hands on approach to local markets. At the tail end of the Linder reign, the Kings Parks were in near financial devistation. "Paramount" who has always been involved with KI since it's incarnation, stepped in and bought out the lion's share in order to salvage their investment. Costly installs year after year at the Kings parks prior to "Paramount" had hindered their ability to turn a good profit. For those that like to blast the "Paramount Folks," I challenge them to name the exact people they think were so awful, and did such terrible things. Although I certainly do not agree with some of the choices that were made at the parks over the years, I do credit them with stepping in and maintaining the parks in a positive way for 15 years. People like Al Weber, Tim Fisher, David Mandt, Bob White, Linda Jensen etc were extremely dedicated and devoted to the overall experience and focus on families. They recognized that not only are kids a key to financial success, but they are also the future of the park. CF, IMO, spends little to no time focusing specifically on children, or the family experience.. hence their decline. I am anxious to see what CF does, and I hope there will be good things to come. But I am sad to see the loss of so many of my friends that worked very hard at the parks for many years. I know everyone of them worked as hard as they could to make Paramount Parks a success, and a great place to go. So to hear uninformed statements against "Paramount" is really ridiculous to me. It says that those pointing their fingers do not realize many of the people that oversaw the parks during the Paramount days were actually long time employees. For example, Al Weber started at KI when it opened... I think he operated the Bavarian Beetle. David Mandt started 25 years ago at Carowinds parking cars. Obviously, I feel insulted for them by the constant barrage of complaints about "Paramount" people that were sooo terrible. Especially when I know that is a generalization that has nothing to do with the good job the leaders in Paramount's parks division did. The loss of some of the key players is, IMO, a huge mistake that CF is making. Shaggy

Quoting Interpreter: Oh, you mean wood? Yep, that would be in Germany. Also an Intamin. I am a little curious about this response. I am not clear if you believe the largest wooden coaster to be located in Germany or not. If you mean Colossus at Heide Park, well... it CLAIMS to be the largest, but it is in fact, not. SOB is indeed the tallest and fastest wooden coaster in existence. It's lift tops out at 218, beating Colossus by around 22 feet. Here's a link to Colossus' specs. http://www.rcdb.com/id988.htm Even if Colossus were to stand taller than SOB, there would still be the great debate as to the sincerity of it being an actual "wooden" coaster. As with El Toro at SFGADV, it uses the unique Intamin laminated steel track. At this point, I guess you could say that Colossus is the largest operating wooden coaster in existance. That is until SOB reopens... which I believe it likely will. Shaggy