BoddaH1994

Maybe, but for a certain percentage of the population they look at the calendar and say, “I’ll go a day when they’re open later.” Some may never follow through.

Okay, now do cutting Winterfest shows but still charging the same admission price. I’ll go first! ”OmG would U rAthEr THey havE showZ wiT pREformers Wit frOggy thrOTES.”

I don’t think it’s an accident. I found the page just navigating from the main page. This is probably really it

While other chains are adding operating hours…

10:1 says that when KI (finally) announces the event they count things that weren’t shows as shows, so they’ll cut 4 or 5 shows but the show count will go from 18 to 16 or something… This almost certainly accounts for why nothing has been announced. They are, once again, e-begging for your votes in another USA Today poll.

Or flat. They’re adding capital so typically that comes with an expectation of increased pass sales at a park like Kings Island.

I don’t think they’re concerned with WF attendance. I think they are trying to get people in the gate so that they can attempt to leverage them for season pass sales.

Normally I’d agree, but Kings Island was kind of unique in not offering a Groupon deal, especially since Cedar Point has done it for years.

This is interesting. I’ve never seen KI on Groupon. I’ve seen Cedar Point and even some really big players like BGT and Universal. http://www.groupon.com/deals/gl-kings-island-winterfest23?utm_campaign=UserReferral_mih&utm_source=undefined I suppose it’s a good opportunity for friends and family to get tickets.

Appreciate the support from everyone! We try to get a cadence of three episodes a week, all of which a more bite-sized than the main pod. Typically 15 - 25 minutes max. https://linktr.ee/towertopics

We were already sucking up.

Alternative history? Sweet!

You did great! If you prefer to listen, you can reach the podcasting apps here: https://linktr.ee/towertopics

Oh yes.

They said something about how the C Corp would have some sort of tax advantage in the call. I don’t want to talk out of turn because I don’t know tax law, but I wanted to throw that out there. Not trying to school ya! I bet most people think the way you did.

These two chains were already owned by large corporations. So I don’t think that’s gonna change much from that aspect. They were always at the mercy of their share/unit holders. This argument would work if Six Flags bought Dollywood, but the corporate governance of SIX and FUN isn’t changing all that much. Will this be good or bad? Who knows, but this certainly isn’t a case of Walmart coming to town and running everyone out of business. It’s more like if Walmart and Target merged, but they kept being Target and Walmart (if that makes sense). You could have made that argument when FUN bought Paramount, but that was a net positive, I think. I wish you would clarify about “righting the ship.” What do you think is too far gone to be fixed at this point?

For those of you who think this is a monopoly, you need to know what a monopoly is. Remember, Six Flags won’t own every aspect of entertainment. They’ll own the local park. The local park largely competes with other outside avenues to that are fighting for your discretionary income. As @DispatchMaster stated, the parks aren’t competing with each other, with the exception of some small overlapping markets. Kings Island isn’t trying to draw guests away from Kentucky Kingdom. They’re trying to draw fans away from the Reds. One could even argue that Disney World is a much stronger competitor than your neighboring park. With that said, the competition still exists. The buying power is stronger, thus typically leading to higher margins, which is something both chains desperately need. Let’s just hope and pray that they do take the best of both chains and do something special rather than making it kind of dismal like some of the Six Flags parks. How is this a referendum on capitalism? It’s two companies who were already publicly traded. If a private equity firm had stepped in, bought up the shares, and started making cuts then I could see a first semester freshman philosophy major blaming capitalism, but this is nonsense. You earn money, you choose what to do with the extra. The parks compete for that money. The parks absolutely exist because of capitalism.

Depends on the market. CP and KI certainly used to compete for Columbus. But that’s a A/B choice. But you’re right - the crossover, as people are thinking about it, is very small.

Someone on Facebook was asking where the performers were assigned, and I distinctly remember some commenting with those shows, so they’re safe.

That and probably Sounds of the Nativity. So that’s probably two shows down.

Certainly not out of the question. On my pod a few weeks ago, Joel Manby admitted that HFE threw their hat in the ring to purchase Paramount. I’ve actually heard of rumor attempts for them to buy KI as late as 2014. HFE clearly wants KI, they would just need it peeled off in order to afford it.

https://www.reuters.com/markets/deals/cedar-fair-explores-merger-with-six-flags-sources-2023-11-01/

Conveniently announced after the bulk of their passes were sold.

Sadly, you are 100% correct. Personally, I’d love to see higher prices and higher quality. They’d need to deliver on the higher quality consistently, though. When I was in high school, I worked at LaRosa’s. They were on this kick of making sure that people have the coupons that they claimed they had over the phone. Often they’d say they had something and show up without it, still getting the discount. They put their foot down and said we needed to, “train the customer” on the fact that it’s “no coupon, no discount.” It was painful but it worked. Same is true for KI guests. Gold pass holders expect: -Parking -Admission -Haunt -Winterfest -Waterpark Beyond that is just details. I wouldn’t agree that it’s always been that each party agrees and that’s it. Hate to beat a dead horse, but look at all of the Prestige benefits that were quietly removed. They got away with it. They may do it again. Also, people have been promised a Haunt. They can deliver 10 houses or three. The customer made their purchasing decision before any of this was presented to them. Would they have bought a ticket if they saw the product presented? It doesn’t matter. It’s not like you can get a refund if you aren’t happy with the product. When I say that I think that the guests deserve better, I think I should clarify that you, me, Tom, Dick and Harry and even the park as an entity deserves better. This problem has gone back about 15 years. Passes are too cheap, bring-a-friend discounts come too often, and payment plans make the park too accessible. The park has been devalued terribly and it has given free license to devalue the actual product accordingly. Accordingly, individual ticket prices remain high, people know what they are getting and some of the most lucrative guests are opting to spend their money elsewhere. This is coupled with things that were never necessary in the past. The chaperone policy, very visible security, etc. This is the beginning of the end if the product drops and only SP people show up. You know what would potentially increase revenue? Increasing the operating calendar. Last year a ton of parks figured that out, adding days and hours. Kings Island has been doing the opposite ever since Winterfest debuted.

All very true. Where it hurts is elsewhere. I have heard that a certain park is having solid HH attendance but very underwhelming individual ticket sales. This is a byproduct of the, “they’ll come no matter what” attitude. That may be true… for season passholders. But is it true across the board?