McSalsa

Thanks for all the advice so far. To clear this up: I HAVE been to Holiday World before (my best friend was also there). However, MY SISTER HAS NOT, and I would like to go back, having only been there 1 time thus far (versus six for Kings Island). My trip report from this: http://www.KICentral.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21644&st=0&p=380815&hl=mcsalsa&fromsearch=1entry380815 I had quite a bit of fun, but forgot to buy fudge. If money becomes an issue, Holiday World will obviously get a HUGE advantage. If not, the others stand a chance. My SISTER has been to Cedar Point, but me and my best friend have never gone. I was actually supposed to go when she did, but a doctor's appointment forced me to stay home while she had a great day...well, other than Mean Streak and Mantis clobbering her. But besides that she said she had fun, and adored Maverick, and says Millennium Force terrified her (she has a fear of heights, and refuses to ride Drop Tower and WindSeeker at KI). NONE of us have been to Six Flags Great America. However, my best friend has family in the area that actually have season passes to that park, which means we won't need to pay $50+ on a hotel like at Cedar Point, which pretty much negates the $8-10 difference in parking prices. I have also heard this is one of the better Six Flags parks and Goodyellowcorn's comments above seem to further indicate that. Thanks again, and more tips will be welcome...

The Situation: Well, I just got in contact with my sister, and have learned that she will be getting a large sum of money soon. How much exactly, I am not sure. However, she informed me that she would like to go on a amusement park trip with this money. We have no season passes to ANY parks, so there are some options, but I would like some information that might help us make a choice. In early discussion, we have rounded things down to 3 possible parks: Holiday World, Cedar Point, and Six Flags Great America. I am aware that right now or in August, weekends are pretty crowded. However, my best friend, who will probably be going if this trip happens, now has his vacation days ready and we can FINALLY go on a weekday. So, how crowded are these 3 on weekdays in mid-late summer? I've noticed Kings Island (which has been ruled out since even though we all love Kings Island we want to spread our wings a bit more and visit other parks) hasn't been very crowded at all on weekdays right now, and it's peak summer, so I'd guess Holiday World being a small family park would be the same or even less crowded (though, due to this heat, I would expect crowds at Splashin' Safari). However, the other two are big ??? marks...(wait a second...Cedar Point WEBCAM!!!)...(looks on webcam)...well, not too bad at all today either! So, what about Six Flags Great America on a weekday? Another question is: how much is a "cheap" hotel near Cedar Point? For SFGA, my friend has family up there who actually have season passes we could stay with and Holiday World is close enough and closes early enough so we wouldn't need one, but for Cedar Point, we might. Any advice is welcome. Thank you! I have also added a poll here so I can use that to help make a choice, but READ THROUGH THIS first before voting. PS: Another thing that may be a factor- I have been to Holiday World, as has my best friend, but my sister has not. However, she has Cedar Point on us. None of us have been to SFGA. Also, with this, that Indiana Beach trip might have gotten axed for this- it just cannot compete with these 3 parks, especially since I have heard they are "run down" now with the new owners... UPDATE: Cedar Point has won! (Not the poll, we just ended up picking it) Tips welcome...

Uh-Oh. The last thing KIC needs is TWO McSalsas. That would be like Kings Island having TWO Son of Beasts. (Suddenly, another Son of Beast pops up behind Firehawk, however it too is SBNO!) Hehehehe...(This was just a joke, for all whom could not tell)

My Two Cents: I did some math, and realized that for most rides, if 100 Fast Lane people showed up AT ONCE, which is unlikely, most of the rides would get through them in under 5-10 minutes and would then serve the "normal" customers. Not too bad. The only problems I could see would be for low-capacity rides (Firehawk and BLSC come to mind) and Beast when it rains (ONE TRAIN. WORLD'S LONGEST WOODIE. ALREADY SUPER-LONG WAIT WITHOUT Fast Lane. OUCH.) Goodyellowcorn made a good point. I would expect on crowded days, the park may sell roughly 500-1,000 of these. (I may be understating though, we will have to wait and see how popular these become) Thats $25,000 to $50,000 in extra profits, with only a few minutes added to the wait times. However, on weekdays, only fools would buy them since KI isn't crowded at all on those days either. The park could make some serious dough on weekends, which could either be used to reduce food prices (or increase food quality) or help pay for new rides or park upgrades- although using money from this alone, it will be a few decades before we can build another Diamondback. One last point, but it has already been made: WHY ARE BOO BLASTERS AND RACE FOR YOUR LIFE CHARLIE BROWN ON THIS!?!? Ugh...and Invertigo, a ride that usually gets 30+ minute waits, is not...(I can understand why Flight Deck, Racer, and Adventure Express aren't on here though- they already have short lines! Same thing with Vortex when it opens back up, I've never waited more than 20 minutes for it, even during haunt!)

Your Welcome!

It's amazing what you can find on youtube. Here's a classic video of Kings Island from 20 years ago, when the park was celebrating its 20th birthday (and now look, here comes 40, my how time flies!). This was the final year of Kings Island before Paramount came in, and Phantom Theatre was new. The video can be defined in 3 parts: Part 1: Reflections On Ice A classic KI show from 1992, at least some of it. Part 2: General Park Overview Footage of King Cobra, Vortex, Antique Cars, and Beast to name a few...plus Scooby Zoom in its original form (now it is Great Pumpkin Coaster)! Mostly from the Eiffel Tower. Part 3: Phantom Theatre POV A high-quality POV of Phantom Theatre when it was brand new. For those who never got to ride it, here's what you missed. For those who did, here it is again...well, sort of. (Having watched this, with all due respect to Boo Blasters, which is ok, but this ride should have never left and kicks its butt!) Here's the video itself: Enjoy! By the way, this was NOT my video...I was only 2 years old when this was filmed! Also not Coasterbob62 this time, either.

Well, $12 is still better than $20, which from what I have heard is what you have to pay to park at Six Flags Great America. That's crazy expensive! Hopefully, Kings Island won't go that high...then again, their season passes are cheaper than Kings Islands: $75.00 versus $150, because a Six Flags pass gets you into ALL Six Flags parks so it must be compared to Platinum Pass...but you have to pay to park at all of them. And the price varies by location.

UH-OH...it's poll time! And this one isn't KI related (but I'm still putting it in KI Polls, since that's where most polls should go). Holiday World has teased us with a new "attraction" for 2012. What do you hope it will be? Really simple actually. Option #8 is pretty much for any type of non-traditional steel coaster, like Inverted, 4th Dimension, etc. in case you were wondering. Enjoy the poll. If you dislike, click back...or else. (Evil music plays!) MY CHOICE: I voted "Steel Coaster, Family" because this category is something I feel Holiday World needs. The gap between Howler and Raven is HUGE. It may sound weird, Raven is only 80 feet tall, but it is NOT a family coaster! A family-oriented woodie like Woodstock Express would also go well, but Holiday World needs a steel coaster. And I would love to see how they would theme a Mine Train...or any of these attractions, for that matter!

UPDATE: This trip will not happen...in July. It has been delayed until either August or September, I am not sure on the exact date. I'm not too upset about this, because I am aware that July is the worst month to go to an amusement park (Crowd-wise and because it is so freaking hot!). Late August appears to be a good time according to the "when the park is open for fewer hours, less crowds" rule... Tips are still welcome, if any are left.

I wanted to post this earlier, but my internet connection went belly-up until now, so... #1-Aeroplane Coaster @ Rye Playland One of the most legendary and intense wooden coasters ever built, and a beautiful one to boot. How could I NOT include it? #2-Big Bad Wolf @ Busch Gardens Williamsburg It was a tough choice between this and Kings Island's Bat, but I'll go with Big Bad Wolf for its excellent use of terrain since this park could use a terrain coaster. #3-Steel Phantom @ Kennywood Park needs a Mega-Looper. Park needs a hypercoaster. This will cover both. Could probably use better trains though, to prevent the head-banging. #4-Shooting Star @ Coney Island Ohio The park's "traditional" out and back coaster, Shooting Star was famous for its gobs of airtime and for being glass smooth. A perfect "partner" for the Aeroplane! #5-King Cobra @ Kings Island World's first looping stand-up coaster, and it would probably still be at Kings Island had the steel not been of poor quality. A "niche" coaster, yes, but thanks to King Cobra that niche is filled in this park. #6-Batman and Robin: The Chiller @ Six Flags Great Adventure A massive (it's the 2nd tallest ride in my park, at over 200 feet!) Premier Rides 2-tracked shuttle loop coaster. Terpy seems quite fond of it, which is part of the reason I picked it. Plus, it's Premier Rides, so it can't be too bad. #7-Greezed' Lightning @ Kentucky Kingdom The park's basic shuttle loop coaster. #8-Bavarian Beetle @ Kings Island My park will need a family-friendly coaster too...this will probably fill that void. #9-Thunderbolt @ Coney Island NY One of Coney Island NY's classic woodies, this will finish out the trio of woodies in my park. #10-T2 @ Kentucky Kingdom Only because we could use an inverted coaster, and there are no B&Ms to speak of...sigh. Once a B&M Invert dies, this is getting replaced, though.

POLL TIME!!! I thought up a fun one: you are building your own amusement park. While your flatrides will probably be new, you cannot build your own coasters. Why? Because, your coaster collection will be made up of nothing but coasters that have either: #1: Kicked the bucket and been demolished. or #2: Are Standing But Not Operating, or in storage. You may choose up to 10 of these "dead" coasters to "revive" in your new park. Any design flaws the coaster had that may have killed it, such as mechanical problems, will be fixed. Enjoy the poll. If you dislike, click back. PS: Relocated coasters, such as Dominator which went from GL to KD, are not selectable since they already have new homes.

Is The Beast rough? Yep. But it's a wooden coaster, you expect them to be rough. And while I've had some bumpy rides on Beast, I've never gotten off the ride in any sort of pain in my 6 rides from 2009-2011. If you want a smoother ride, these guys are correct, don't sit on a wheel, sit in the MIDDLE of a train and it's much smoother (but it still shakes a bit, it is a woodie after all). This is actually a general tip that should work on any 6-seater car coaster, steel or wood, it also works on Racer and I am told back when Son of Beast had the 6-seater cars and loop it made a huge difference. On another note, has anyone else noticed the laterals Beast has for some reason this season? They occur shortly before, during, and after the tunnel in the middle of the ride. They were as strong as the ones I felt on Holiday World's Legend, a coaster famous for them, and stronger than the laterals in the final helix! PS: There are rougher rides than Beast...Voyage at Holiday World left me in minor back pain when I rode it in 2010, although I rode in the converted Raven train, so perhaps that was the problem. And a freak Flight of Fear ride in 2010 really left me in pain...owch. However, both rides I enjoyed overall since they were more than exciting enough to overcome the roughness.

Just a thought that popped in my head- WindSeeker is this year's "big new ride", and thus why it got the ERT. So, what if the rumored brand-spanking new coaster or Son of Beast revamp happens next year? If they use the same concept as this year, it will be the "new" ride and something close by...(if it is a SOB revamp, or something in that same area, there are a LOT of choices!). WindSeeker ERT may only last 1 year if this is the case. Now, if there is NO new coaster/ride next year, the ERT question becomes much more complicated...would it carry over from this season, change back to Beast & DB, go to some other ride, or...dare I say it...go away forever (that would tick a LOT of people off though)? Did Diamondback/Beast ERT carry over in 2010 simply because there were no new rides (Planet Snoopy was just a revamp, nothing new was added)? Just some random thoughts I had while reading through this...

Wow. It almost seems like they read the poll I did on here a few weeks ago...remember, the "What Coaster would you give offseason work to?" one? Guess what coaster had the most votes on that poll...and now, here it is, all nice and cool and stuff. Wow. Kings Island, great job! We complain...you guys fix. Or at least it seems that way.

OH NO!!! TERPY DOUBLE POSTED!!! (Ducks as a massive explosion blows up half of Kings Island!!!) ...umm...anyone think the park can survive with just half of I-Street, Planet Snoopy, Diamondback, Boomerang Bay, and half of The Beast? (PS: The above was just a joke.)

I'm not 100% sure, but is this a better source?: http://www.themeparkinsider.com/flume/201106/2532/ Also, remember, Kings Island opens a few weeks BEFORE Cedar Point does.

Thanks, and yes! Most certainly, actually as we post ( ) I am editing photos of other rides like The Racer! ...which (speaking of Racer), at least according to Don Helbig, is the most photographed roller coaster of all time...but, it's probably been surpassed by Diamondback now. Ha, yeah, I got over 4,000 photos of Diamondback I am editing! all High quality! But, I am giving love of pics to the whole park! ...even the huge SBNO wooden coaster seen below?

Thanks, and yes! Most certainly, actually as we post ( ) I am editing photos of other rides like The Racer! ...which (speaking of Racer), at least according to Don Helbig, is the most photographed roller coaster of all time...but, it's probably been surpassed by Diamondback now.

Very Nice pictures. Just curious, will the other coasters/rides get some "pic" love too in the future?

I just think people hype it up for more than it is. It is not a bad ride, it is just not worth the wait. My favorite is still ZOOMbabwe. I actually do agree with you on both things... #1: Wildebeest is a bit overrated. I'd give it about an 8/10, it's a good ride but not worth waiting 2 hours for it...which, tragically, I did. #2: ZOOMbabwe is more fun than Wildebeest.

Did not see that s! Whoops. And you named 2 more rides where one "succeeded", but the other failed...and know that I think about it, for every Batman The Ride (successful prototype), there are failures...in fact, a lot of them. But you cannot give up if you are running a park. Kings Island has taken numerous risks with tons of prototype rides...here's a list for those curious: 1977: The Screamin' Demon, first launched shuttle loop coaster I'd say it was successful, but it did eventually become outdated, thus its removal... 1979: The Beast, perhaps not a prototype but it was built on a never-before-seen scale and with more terrain use than any other coaster before Success, Success, Success! How many coasters remain THIS popular 30 years after they debut? And get sequels!?!? VERY few... 1981: The Bat, first Arrow Suspended Coaster Failure, Failure, Failure...too many design flaws. But the concept survived and lives on in coasters like Flight Deck, which have become somewhat successful. 1984: King Cobra, first looping Stand-Up Coaster Success, it was only removed because the steel they used to built it was inferior, not design flaws and it lead to more stand-up coasters. 1996: Flight of Fear, first LIM launched coaster Success, but only AFTER it was modified with lapbars. 2000: Son of Beast, first wooden hypercoaster, first looping wooden coaster in modern era Failure in both of its initial forms, could still bounce back but... 2001: Flying Ace, first kiddie inverted coaster Success...it now has a few clones to show for it. 2002: The Crypt, first Giant TopSpin Failure thus far...the ride tears itself apart if they try to make it even mildy intense. Just an idea but, perhaps the best move here would to be...Stop promoting it as a thrill ride? (Say WHA?) 2003: Delirium, first Giant Frisbee Success, in spite of the semi-annual breakdowns. It is a popular line-munching ride. 2011: WindSeeker, one of the first Mondial Star Flyer Rides Success/Failure way too early to be decided thus far... And those are just the ones I could think of...

Ahh, prototype rides...while at one point in each of their lifetimes, both of those were "duds". Both have since their original debuts been modified. However, Flight of Fear managed to turn itself around, and actually became a great ride. And Premier Rides has since gone on to build a few more LIM launched coasters. Son of Beast, however...do I have to say anything about what happened to it? And how many more 200+ foot looping wooden coasters have been built since? There is still a small chance for it, but...the odds would probably be against it. At some point, everything was a prototype. What if everyone ALWAYS played it safe? No Hyper/Giga/Stratacoasters. No Inverted Coasters. No Launched Coasters. No Gyro Drops. No Giant Frisbees. Heck, perhaps even no roller coasters or thrill rides whatsoever! While many prototypes fail, some of them hit the jackpot. And then there are rides that failed at first, but upon return visits succeeded. Oh, by the way, were there not TWO Flight of Fears opening in 1996? Kings Dominion's also opened in that year... PS: I am sure Terpy already knew this, just pointing out the obvious...

After 2 months of delays and headaches, WindSeeker at Kings Island is now open. And thus, I have made a poll. Who would have thought it would come to this? The poll has 3 parts, but is quite simple: -How good did you think WindSeeker was? -What kind of ride, having ridden it, would you say it is? (I give other rides at KI as "category samples" to assist placement) -Is it better than Drop Tower? Enjoy the poll. If you dislike...you know what you need to do. And it's not post crazy, bashing comments...CLICK. BACK. UPDATE: Added a "Quickie Flatride Battle!". Is WindSeeker better than Kings Island's older tower thrill ride, Drop Tower? Could not resist!

I'm not even sure either...I made a brain fart. Sorry!

Yep. Learned that after riding Raven at Holiday World, though at 80' it is huge next to Cornball Express, it's still pretty small. But the thing feels like it's going 60mph, and has strong airtime and g-forces. And how many non-prefab giant wooden coasters are considered awesome? Only a few (The Beast, Voyage, Hades, etc etc), most of them tend to be ranked near the middle or bottom when the polls come out.