Kenban

Just wanted to drag this topic up. What ever happened to the Stunt show? I have heard nothing about it and have not seen any reviews, pictures, or video from the show. The set construction pictures looked good though.

I think that paramount had the opportunity to produce something unique that would have been a big draw but instead took the easy and safe way out. What could have and should have been done is build a new section to the park to showcase rides and shows with the Paramount theming. Last time I checked there is plenty of land out beyond The Racer where FoF was built. I think IJST should have been built there, along with TRTR, and I still believe they should have produced an attraction along the lines of the Star Trek experience. Using similar technology including the beaming room and motion simulators they could have produced a ride that was truly Disney quality. I would have built the outside of the building to be based on a building from one of the Star Trek movies, displayed real props throughout the entrance area, and even had a themed food location inside the building.

I hate to say after I heard where it happened I thought I knew what went wrong and this article on The Enquirer makes me think I am correct. The track itself is layered wood boards (I believe its 7 layers) with a piece of steel on the top and bottom for the train to ride on. The problem is you can't use that for the loop so instead its solid steel. I have no idea how they join the two types of track. I have no idea how they would separate BUT based on where the problem occurred I think that's what happened the two sections of track moved in some way that produced a gap or edge that the train got hung up on for a split second. The sudden deceleration is what caused in the injuries. That's about as much speculation as I am willing to get into. I did not want to post my ideas last night until I heard something more but I figured with this new information I would post my thoughts.

and that was because... The track to The Bat was totally flat and had no banking. Because of this there was a LOT of stress put on the track and cars. Also the ride had brake problems due to putting them on the bottom of the cars. The ride was a maintenance disaster. The ride was taken down for one simple reason it cost too much to keep it running.

This is a continuation of a previous post I wanted to post a few images I took from the park. Note that all of them except for 1 are from around the lake. I resized everything down to 800 x 600 the originals are several megs a piece. I did not want to post this in the original thread for people who are on low bandwidth connections. Dominator Thunderhawk Walk way between the two sections of the park. Plus you can see the large stadium thats right on the water. This one is interesting my guess is its from the days of when the park was Seaworld. As you walk back to the Dino motion simulator this is off to the side and the odd part is its a path that leads no where. I don't remember now but I actually hope there is a bench here its really nice. You can see the skyline of the rides section of the park. I think but might be wrong the docks in the corner are from the water shows that Seaworld used to do (this was taken from the top of the stadium seen a few pictures ago) I believe this building is part of what used to be Seaworld. Don't think its used for anything today. Just figured I would share a few pictures of the park.

The 4 year old boy who died on Mission Space had been checked only a few months before his death and the doctor at the time did not find the defect. As far as the parents knew he was healthy. The 49 year old German woman had VERY high blood pressure. I can't remember if she knew or not but I think she did. The death on Rock n Roller coaster is still under investigation. I suspect it will be similar to the boy on Mission Space and will be linked to an undiagnosed heart condition.

Just want to correct this there has been 7 in the last 18 months... There has been a VERY bad run of bad luck at the house of the mouse. (This is just Disney World I can't think of any deaths at Disneyland (in the same time period) off the top of my head) Every single one was due to a preexisting medical condition. One was even on Pirates of the Caribbean.

I wish you were correct but there was Flight Commander. The problem was there was no seat divider and she slid sideways under the restraints. If she had not been drunk at the time I doubt it would have occured. Also there is the Eiffel Tower. I have heard several differant stories about this so I am not sure which is correct but he was also drunk. PKI is a VERY safe park but I am not sure about the whole top 5 thing. I would like to point out that Face/off (and everything at PKI) is safer then the car you drove to the park in. In my view as long as you don't drink too much and don't do anything stupid you will be fine and have a great time. Nothing wrong with being scared either if you don't want to ride it just skip it there is plenty of other rides in the park.

There is a chance I am going to go back this year but its too early to say (so I would assume its not going to happen). Good chance I will drive past the park though. I am going to write a letter to Cedar Fair but mostly talking about how I think they need more variety in food locations, just how bad the lemonade sucked, what I thought of the lumber jack show, and just how over worked this one guy was trying to work the stand next to the stadium. Since you work there I am sure you know the one I am talking about its between the bridge and the stadium. Plus if your going to make that big a deal about the 25 cent cotton candy have it in more then 2 locations in the park. One more note about the lumber jack show the guys tried they really did it just did not interest me and I don't think I was alone in that view. I wanted so bad for a killer whale to pop up.... oh well wrong park (wrong stadium as well). Maybe I was just not looking but I think the park needs more water fountains as well. As I am sitting here now I do think I was a little too hard on the park. But I still think that the park has major problems that a new water park is not going to fix. When your there on July 1st and the lines are walk on in every single ride in the park there is a problem. The park needs work and I think you will agree with me on that. I tried to offer some ideas on what I thought could be done. No clue that grizzly just opened for the year. I was more concerned about the fact that the foam that was produced in the load station was brown then the effects being down. I just wanted to point out that they did not work. Like if I wrote a trip report to USF and the doors on Jurassic Park did not work I would point it out (they often don't). Something has come to mind though. Have you ever wanted to do something so bad that after its over your left thinking that it sucked no matter if it was pretty good or not you just expected so much more that you were left wanting? I think that might be my problem I have been wanting to go to the park for a year or two and have driven past it several times without the time to stop and visit (I have relatives who live in Aurora). Maybe I just expected something that no matter how good it is the park could not live up to what I had stuck in my head.

You know I am wrong about kidworkz I should have known better. Ok I did not say Dominator was a bad ride (its not) but having been on a few B&M's I just felt that it was rougher then I was used to but still better then most coasters. Also the OTSR locked down at some point so hard that by the time we hit the brakes it was so tight I could not take a full breath. Although at the end of the day the two rides I wanted to go back and ride again were Dominator and x-flight. Rode second seat of steel venom will have to try the front seat was in a hurry and just took the closest seat to the front that was empty. Just never liked this kind of ride but then I don't like Face/off either. Food prices are less then PKI (Notice the only comment I made about prices were I felt the lemonade was not worth it and that the food prices at DISNEY are less. Dippin dots are not cheap no matter where you get them and I got the largest size available. I don't have a problem spending money as long as I get a quality product in return. Like now I leave Universal Florida and eat in city walk. I do think that the counter service locations need to offer more then just snacks and drinks. I don't know if I was looking for a bad time. I would like to think that I was not. I think the worst mistake Cedar Fair has made in the last few years was getting rid of the animals. In the short term maybe the non-union vs. union will have an effect but I don't think thats the problem. I keep thinking a good night show to close the park would be amazing. Short stunt show on the lake followed by fireworks over the lake. Best part is you can still use it for a different show during the day the stadium is huge and offers many possibilities. Having been to Sea World Ohio when it was Sea World (was a kid at the time though) I do remember having fun. Plus I have been to Sea World in Florida and California I do wish it was never purchased by Six Flags but they did not remove the animals Cedar Fair did. Like I said earlier the biggest mistake I think they could have made. The funny part is I thought villain was not that bad. Employees were everywhere and were friendly. My only problem spot there was when I was getting my lemonade the guy was getting very behind. It was not his fault a single person taking care of a large amount of people is rough. The problem was there was a girl standing right behind him that all she did was open the ice chest a few times (not even taking anything out just opening it to look in). Now I don't know why she was there but at most places you jump in and help out if she had helped it would have gone MUCH faster to me they needed two people both working to be able to handle the demand. My whole trip was not bad. Cedar Fair has put a LOT of money into the park so far and most of the changes have been good. I think the park needs some more flat rides, better food service, better shows, etc. Right now the park has the beginnings of being great but its not even close right now. For example there are 4 motion simulators I have never understood why they run the same film in all 4 (really don't understand why when you consider they only run 1 because of the low demand). By adding a second film you can reuse the simulators that are not being used and add a new ride cheaply. Like I feel Kings Island should almost always be running two different films one on each side of the action theater. Also there was almost no one in the theater showing Robots of Mars. Pick up the rights to another film or two and show them at different times throughout the day. You could show one film at 1 and a differant one at 2 etc.

The first two theme parks I visited years ago were Geauga Lake and Sea World Ohio both in Aurora Ohio. This was before Six Flags came in and purchased both and turned them into a single park. This was later sold to Cedar Fair who continues to operate them under the name Geauga Lake and Wildwater Kingdom. Just to tell you how long ago it was I remember Raging Wolf Bobs opening year (1988). You know its odd maybe I am growing up, getting used to Disney, or just sick of roller coasters in general. It might just be that Geauga Lake just does not have good coasters but whatever it was I did not have a very good time. I got to the park around 2 purchased my ticket ($24.95) and was very happy at the ticket price. I headed into the park took a right and went on X flight first thing. Its an interesting ride and I think with a good layout would be amazing flying around trees and over hills around King's Island. Next up was Steel Venom which really is nothing special it looks a lot more fun then it really is. As I walked past Head Spin it was either down or just not operating at the time it was up before I left but I never really wanted to ride it anyways. Its the same kind of ride as Face/off but your sitting down instead of hanging. Was going to ride Big Dipper but that was down as well. At this point I walked across the floating bridge to what used to be Sea World. The entire walk across you see this huge stadium right on the water and you think that maybe there will be a good show there well you would be wrong but I will come back to that later. I was not here for the water park so I just took a left and walked around the shore and headed over through happy harbor to the theater showing robots of mars. The film was not great but it was not that bad either. Its shown once and hour but there was total maybe 100 people there. The AC felt very good after walking around the park for about an hour. After this I went next door to Dino Island II. I thought that it was very lame and I noticed that there was 4 show rooms but they only had to run 1. So I had seen the two movies and figured I would go and catch the show in the stadium but first I wanted something to drink so I stopped by the booth out front to grab a lemonade. Well that was a bad choice it took 16 minutes (Sadly I really did look at my watch) and there was only 6 people in front of me. It was one person with too much work to do and no help doing it. After I paid my $4.25 I felt it had better be good and after I started drinking it I noticed just how wrong I was it did not taste like anything sure I watched him squeeze a lemon right in front of me into the glass but to me it tasted like I paid 4 dollars for a glass of water. I went and grabbed a seat in the stadium and watched the show while I drank my overpriced water. Its the Paul Bunyan Lumberjack show which I showed up several minutes early but because of how hard it was to get something to drink I sat down around 10 minutes late. Looking around and seeing 80% of the stadium empty was a sign of just how good the show was. Turns out it was just one more bad choice the show was stucktacular and the groups of people who got up early and left agree with me. At this point I figured I would head back over to the main section of the theme park and figured my day would get better. Next up Thunderhawk which left me with a headache. After I walked around for a few minutes I felt a little better and knowing the next ride was a B&M I figured I would go on it and maybe start having fun so I went on the Dominator. Which I think its the worst B&M I have ever been on the headrest has a lot of padding and thats good because it was the only thing that saved my head on the ride. At this point I stopped by a stand picked up a drink and sat down ended up sitting there for a while and went to the Dippin' Dots stand that was next to me and picked up a waffle cone of chocolate (always did like dots) ($5.99). After about 30 minutes I figured I was up for some more rides. I went on Raging Wolf Bobs next which is not bad but small and needs a paint job. At this point went on Grizzly Run hoping to get wet until I got to the front of the line (longest line in the park) and saw the brown foam forming in the water. I figured I would ride it anyways until about half way down when you get to the section where there should be water just pouring down over you from above and I realize that all the water sprayers and water falls are broke. I guess they all work off a single pump but they were all down. So still dry I rode the Villain. Which just like all the other rides in the park is small and short. Finally I just walked through a couple of the gift shops and left at 7:30. I think the park has a lot of potential but right now I can't see people traveling to visit the park. I think Cedar Fair needs to put in a LOT of money to get this park into what it should or could be but I don't know if they are going to be willing to spend the kind of money it needs. First it needs a kids area right now you have happy harbor which is all old junk rides from when Sea World was still in town and the kidworks play area which is left over from the original Geauga Lake. There is plenty of room between Raging Wolf Bobs and the Happy Harbor to build a good kids area and by moving the rides from the Kidworks play area you combine it all into one section cleaning up the water front. There is a HUGE stadium that could put on some amazing shows USE IT. Around 6 I started getting hungry at any other park I would have walked past a store selling solid food but not Geauga Lake I could get pretzels, drinks, ice cream etc but not a hamburger (at least not where I was if I wanted to walk half way across the park I could have gotten one). There were two locations selling cotton candy. This year Cedar Fair is making a big point of selling 25 cent cotton candy at least have a few more locations maybe a few carts selling it. There was some things done right though there was capacity everywhere I looked. A lot of the coasters were running half empty trains. Its just there were not many people there on a weekend where you would think the park would be packed. If your looking for a park where you can just walk onto any coaster in the park and all you want is to ride a few coasters or go to the water park Geauga Lake is great. If you have a family or looking for a park that you want to spend the whole day at go somewhere else. Because I had been busy this was the first park I have been too this year and it really made me just want to book a flight to Orlando and visit USF and Disney World. The food is cheaper, rides are better, and I have never wanted to leave any of those parks after 5 hours.

Well somewhat. There are two versions of the ride now. One that is the same since it opened and another which has the main motor turned off so you do not experience any g's.

Mission Space feels intense but actually is not that strong. You get up to a max of around 2 g's then are held there for a period of time. There have been years of g-force research that shows for someone without a medical condition you can be held at 2 g's for hours without any problems. Air force pilots can withstand 9 g's for 45 seconds before blacking out. Just ride ANY coaster and you just experienced something more intense then Mission Space. Rock n Roller coaster right after launch is around 4.5 g's (which actually is lower then face off at PKI). The rest of the ride is not very powerful though. Disney World overall (all 4 parks) gets around 20 times the number of annual guests of PKI. Just because they get so many guests you are going to have more problems. Research has shown that its not the g force that you should worry about but the intense shaking that will cause injury. The young boy who died on mission space had a condition that could have killed him on ANY ride. His condition was one that means he would not be able to play any sports, work out, run, do anything that would raise his heart rate. Because it is a hard condition to catch and he was checked only a few months earlier there is a very good chance even if he had never visited any theme parks he would have died within a few years.

SFKK is not up for sale. Actually its one of the parks thats on the short list as being core to the chains turn around.

But Six Flags as a whole is losing money because of the huge debt. I suspect the real reason they are selling it is that the park does not make that much money and when you consider the amount of money that the sale will generate you can pay down some of the debt which will lower the amount of interest that the chain has to pay. Its possible that the park is worth enough money that they will lower the interest more then the park makes. In the long run with how much the land is worth this is good for the chain. Also about Tatsu the new management has already said if they had been in charge they would not have built the ride and Magic Mountain would not have gotten any coasters for this year. Six Flags last time I looked at the numbers is about 2.4 billion in debt which is more then the company is even worth. I actually think this is the right thing to do I hope that we see a company step up that wants to continue running Magic Mountain as a theme park.

It stands for Bolliger & Mabillard viewed as one of the best if not the best builder of steel track in the roller coaster industry. Company is based out of Switzerland but the track is built in Cincinnati.

Well my understanding is that it was the electrical box that connects to the LIM's. The amount of power needed to launch the coaster is massive and that much current generates a lot of heat.

Its actually pretty easy. One is a game of chance the other is a game of skill. I know there is a LOT of luck involved in some of the games but thats how the state views it. My thinking is that in a game of skill its your fault you lost since you did not have enough skill to win. Actually in Japan they have anti gambling laws and how they get around them is by having two shops. One that has games (pachinko machines if your wondering) and a gift shop that exchanges the metal balls for prizes. You take the prizes to a little shop right outside the door to the pachinko parlor and they exchange the prize you just got for cash.

What do you think the Disney trains run on? They do burn diesel but thats used to heat a steam boiler. Its not even the only one in Ohio the Cedar Point trains runs on steam as well. Pretty sure the Knott's train is steam. There is an interesting story behind the Cedar Point railroad. In the 1950s Cedar Point was going to be closed and turned into a housing development. The owner took a trip to Disneyland and decided that instead he was going to update the park and one of the rides he wanted was a steam train based off of what he saw at Disney. The board of directors did not want to spend the money so he paid for it himself and he leased the land from the park. The train went on to become the most popular ride in the park.

I enjoy visiting theme parks and I have to admit PKI has one of the worst selections and worst prices of any theme park I can think of. The only other park that comes to mind as NEEDING better merchandise is Universal Studios. I know one of the comments about the difference between Cedar Point and PKI is that on average a guest spends $4 more dollars at Cedar Point. I suspect once we get decent food prices, better merchandise, and lower merchandise prices that the amount spent per a guest will be a lot closer.

I do want to point out that PKI does have volunteer workers. Not sure if the program is still in place but it was a year or two ago. How it worked was they would have nonprofit groups come in to work a single shift which PKI would pay the organization for the hours worked plus each person gets a free ticket and you get two tickets if you work food service. I do know there was a bonus of some sort if you had a large number of people as well. I know the program was popular with Church youth groups. The parents would go down and work, the church gets the cash, and the parents give the tickets to the kids. I don't think PKI will let us come and paint the buildings. It needs to be done but they look like they need more work then just a coat of paint. I would wait a year or two and see what Cedar Fair does. The only thing I can see them letting us do is maybe go and just work within the current volunteer program for a day, we would work rides, service food, etc. As a group we could pick a charity and they would get a nice check out of it. Plus we would all get a free ticket.

The chain continues to lose money and last time I looked was 2.1 billion in debt. Total they lost 111 million last year. In my view I doubt they will be able to turn it around.

Quick FYI its called a fastpass but no big deal just wanted to point that out. I am hoping you did not spend all day riding the rides there is a lot more to the park then just a few rides. At the end of your message you say you saw some shows I was just wondering which shows and what did you think of them? I am really hoping you saw the Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular at least. Also there is Lights, Motors, Action and you can't forget Fantasmic. Plus if it was your first trip to MGM the backlot tour is interesting.

Favorite park I would have to say Orlando I really like all the parks but if I had to pick just one I would have to say Epcot. MGM, IOA, USO, are all up there as well but I just love walking around Epcot the rides are great and then you end the day by watching Illuminations.

Interpreter says that "a hamburger and fries is $6.99." which to me sounds a little high but possible. If that is correct then Disney is cheaper I was only there in October and its $5.99 for a hamburger and fries. But then this should not be a surprise Disney's food, drinks, and souvenir cups are all cheaper. The $15 parking is happening at several Six Flags parks as I remember SFMM raised the price I believe in January.