Your View?

[Guest IceCream329]

I know we have had post's about this before but lets take a different view on it...Cedar Fair's big decision is next Thursday...What do you think will happen? How do you think CF has done these past four years, do you think CF or Paramount did/does better???

[CoastersRZ]

Well, technically it is out of Cedar Fair`s hands right now, and up to their unit holders to decide the fate of the company.

[Guest IceCream329]

OK well lets not talk about 040810 too much...lets talk about how the 2 company's have done in the past!

[selective]

I never felt like Paramount did anything. They just bought the park and then ran around putting movie names on stuff. They did get that cool theater between The Racers, and Flight of Fear, but other than this they didn't do anything great.

CedarFair on the other hand has delivered. We got Firehawk and Diamondback

[CincyMan98]

Paramount themed things better, Cedar Fair gave us better roller coasters. For both, 50-50.......there are ups and downs all the time.

[Fear the Four]

I never felt like Paramount did anything. They just bought the park and then ran around putting movie names on stuff. They did get that cool theater between The Racers, and Flight of Fear, but other than this they didn't do anything great.

CedarFair on the other hand has delivered. We got Firehawk and Diamondback

I think Diamondback started being designed when Paramount owned the park. I remember hearing something that was in the newspaper when Paramount owned the park saying something big was coming to Kings Island. I think this was mentioned when Diamondback was announced at the media day. Someone correct me if I'm wrong that the lake was being drained in 05' or 06'?

[CoastersRZ]

Paramount didn`t do anything? Who was the one that installed Drop Tower? Who was the one that added Delirium, arguably one of the best flat rides that Kings Island has seen introduced in years. Yes, they did do some terribly stupid things (removing the Eagles and Tiques ranks right up there with among their worst decisions). But they did install Flight of Fear, which is fourteen years old this year, and still has retained much of its theming over the years. At least more so than some newer rides like the Crypt and Backlot!

From what I understand, B&M had proposed a design to Kings Island when it was under CBS/Paramount. They were at the time not interested in the ride, as CBS was more interested in milking the parks for every penny they could muster. When Cedar Fair took over, they initiated the conversations with B&M about the ride they had previously proposed. And enter 2009 and Diamondback was here. So while the ride was likely commissioned by Cedar Fair, B&M had a concept design for the ride before CBS even sold the parks.

[Guest IceCream329]

Has anyone seen the site yet, I didn't notice this but we don't have a Roller Coaster section, all the coasters are listed under Thrill......Hope the new site makes a change!!!!!!

[Dbfan]

Paramount=Theming

Cedar Fair=Performance

[Guest IceCream329]

darn.....that is exactly how it is....never could come up with the words but you told it just right!!! Thank you!

[selective]

yeah I know...

Food Items are listed under "Rides & Attractions"

Well, I guess people are attracted to food, but still I wouldn't refer to food as an attraction.

[Guest IceCream329]

Well I have pretty high hopes for this new site, I am so excited for it!!!!!!!!!!!

[The Interpreter]

Paramount=Theming

Cedar Fair=Performance

The unit holders would beg to differ with you. Walk up to one and ask them how they like their new distributions! Or the current unit price!

[Diamondback96]

I would say Paramount did great. The only thing they did wrong was IJST BLSC.

Cedar Fair, on the other hand, seems to care a little more about KI than GL, which isn't really saying much. I voted 50/50, but my feelings about CF get more and more negative every day.

And I would give CBS a "bad", but if they kept the park for the rest of the season, I would have given them a "horrible".

[bkroz]

I never felt like Paramount did anything. They just bought the park and then ran around putting movie names on stuff. They did get that cool theater between The Racers, and Flight of Fear, but other than this they didn't do anything great.

There's not a single ride I can think of that was here before Paramount that got re-branded with a movie name. If Paramount didn't own the park, here are some things we would not have:

Drop Tower

Invertigo

Backlot Stunt Coaster

Tomb Raider: The Ride

Son of Beast

Action Theater

Scooby Doo & the Haunted Castle

Flight of Fear

Flying Ace

Avatar

It would be a very different park today had Paramount not owned it. That can be good or bad. There are those who would say that, had Paramount not purchased the park, it would not be open today. Similarly, should Cedar Fair put the parks up for sale and find no bidders, the park may not exist in the future. Paramount wanted to "put the park on the map" and in many ways, they did. We would certainly have a much different park without them, and as a Northeast Ohioan, I probably would not know it the way that I do if it were never owned by such a corporation.

Cedar Fair has continued the trend and added two fantastic new rides. The question is, of course, if its worth it to sacrifice theme in order to gain thrills. There was a time, as I recall, that people were upset with the park sacrificing thrills in return for added theme. Few parks have found that perfect balance. I, myself, think that the park was never closer to balanced than it was under Paramount.

Of all the theme park owners out there, I would argue Universal is the closest to perfect - they have the thrills that Disney often lacks, but a theme to match Disney's; their parks are very very clean, and their rides have relatable, current, emotional ties. Not to mention they have fantastic employees and great marketing. Cedar Fair is lacking in a few of those categories, as was Paramount.

[KIBOB]

Tomb Raider: The Ride - The Crypt

Italian Job Stunt Track - Backlot Stunt Coaster

Top Gun - Flight Deck

Drop Zone - Drop Tower

Paramount Story - I dont wanna talk about it

Great theme fitting music especially on IS - The same endless music playing throughout the park.

Then again..........

2 or less live shows - A multitude of live shows

Empty Field - Firehawk

Swan Lake - Diamondback and a near complete renovation of Rivertown.

More cleanliness

IMO, better safety measures

Nuff said....

[CincyMan98]

We would have so many things missing. Kings Island wouldn't have been complete without Paramount. It would be impossible if they had done nothing, because what is going to an amusement park worth if they don't add new things every 4-5 years? So far Cedar Fair has been doing great with the rides - Firehawk, 2007, then 2 years later Diamondback. At this rate, we may get another coaster in 2011. Paramount didn't do that. They focused more on theming than top-notch thrills. But, once again, we have many rides that may not be here if it wasn't for Paramount coming in and helping us out.

[bkroz]

I disagree with that, personally. Paramount put a LOT of investment into the park:

1996 - Flight of Fear

1997 - WaterWorks doubles in size

1998 - Three new kids rides, Action Theater movie changed

1999 - FACE/OFF and Drop Zone

2000 - Son of Beast

2001 - Nick Central

2002 - Tomb Raider: The Ride

2003 - Scooby Doo & The Haunted Castle, Delirium

2005 - Italian Job

Not saying Cedar Fair isn't following in the same footsteps, just that it would be silly to say that Paramount didn't do huge investments, because they did. And while they were doing this, they were putting equally large investments into Kings Dominion, Carowinds, etc. Cedar Fair's sort of on a rotational program with two parks getting big rides every year, whereas in 2005 Paramount built two Italian Jobs and Tomb Raider: Firefall, as well as smaller additions at their other two parks so there were rarely any "dead years" where the parks were left unchanged. Sure it was more 'medium sized' additions like Scooby Doo rather than huge investments, but it kept the parks fresh and clearly there was never a problem with attendance... 2+2=?

[CoastersRZ]

It should be noted that Cedar Fair is now spending LESS on capital projects for all of their parks than what Paramount and Cedar Fair were spending prior to the merger. And yes, Kings Island rarely has had any years in which no new attractions were added. 1978 and 2008 come to mind. However, the following year after those two years saw the introduction of major new rides.

[CoasterKrazy]

I'll be the first to admit that there are a number of themeing changes made by Cedar Fair with which I am not happy (the new paint job for BLSC trains being just one of them). I think, however, that some of the anger here may not be entirely warranted. It seems people tend to remember only what Paramount originally installed, and not what they actually maintained.

For instance, when Tomb Raider first opened, the themeing for that attraction surpassed that on similar sized attractions at Universal Studios (Doctor Doom's Fearfall). But even during the first season, special effects came and went and the attraction really went down hill. Cedar Fair made a huge mistake by ransacking it they way they did, but TR:TR was a shell of its former self even before CF took over. Flight of Fear has seen a similar fate: while admittedly on a smaller scale, I feel that the original themeing was comparable to that on the Incredible Hulk. Now, however, the hanger is a mess, the lighting effects aren't used, and you're lucky to see the pre-ride video. These issues too, started with Paramount, not Cedar Fair. The same can be said for Italian Job Stunt Track, and for that ride, themeing was eliminated even before the coaster opened! Top Gun, Adventure Express, Action Theater, Phantom Theater, and Scoody Doo and the Haunted Castle all saw themeing installed and neglected.

Cedar Fair simply doesn't do extensive themeing. Personally, I prefer to have well-maintained moderate landscaping (i.e. Maverick and Diamondback) than extensive themeing which is left to rot. Could Cedar Fair have handled Kings Island's original themeing better? Absolutely. But as far as purely Cedar Fair additions go (Firehawk, Diamondback, and from the looks of it, Planet Snoopy) I think they've done a great job.

[Guest IceCream329]

I'll be the first to admit that there are a number of themeing changes made by Cedar Fair with which I am not happy (the new paint job for BLSC trains being just one of them). I think, however, that some of the anger here may not be entirely warranted. It seems people tend to remember only what Paramount originally installed, and not what they actually maintained.

For instance, when Tomb Raider first opened, the themeing for that attraction surpassed that on similar sized attractions at Universal Studios (Doctor Doom's Fearfall). But even during the first season, special effects came and went and the attraction really went down hill. Cedar Fair made a huge mistake by ransacking it they way they did, but TR:TR was a shell of its former self even before CF took over. Flight of Fear has seen a similar fate: while admittedly on a smaller scale, I feel that the original themeing was comparable to that on the Incredible Hulk. Now, however, the hanger is a mess, the lighting effects aren't used, and you're lucky to see the pre-ride video. These issues too, started with Paramount, not Cedar Fair. The same can be said for Italian Job Stunt Track, and for that ride, themeing was eliminated even before the coaster opened! Top Gun, Adventure Express, Action Theater, Phantom Theater, and Scoody Doo and the Haunted Castle all saw themeing installed and neglected.

Cedar Fair simply doesn't do extensive themeing. Personally, I prefer to have well-maintained moderate landscaping (i.e. Maverick and Diamondback) than extensive themeing which is left to rot. Could Cedar Fair have handled Kings Island's original themeing better? Absolutely. But as far as purely Cedar Fair additions go (Firehawk, Diamondback, and from the looks of it, Planet Snoopy) I think they've done a great job.

I totally agree!!

[Guest IceCream329]

Here is my feel, I love Cedar Fair...I fell that they care more about there guests, really I should know, Our guests are the MOST IMPORTANT!!!!!!! CF cares more about the feel, and the atmosphere and not so much about the fog, and paint.....yea paint on flight deck would be nice but for me it feels more cozy without it! CF cares about the landscaping and the big boys(Roller Coasters), not about the small little detail such as stickers on BLSC....Honestly I feel that CF has made the park wonderful. But Paramount paved the road for CF to make it great!!!! So thank you Paramount and thank you CF for making Kings Island again, as it was 38 years ago!!!

[The Interpreter]

Kings Island is not like it was 38 years ago. If it were, the complaints would never end...

[Guest IceCream329]

A somewhat feel as 38 years ago!!!

[The Interpreter]

Not even that. Kings Island in 1972 relied more on theming than anything else. The park had a magical feel to it, based on the roving entertainment, the intricate theming, the meticulous landscaping, the employee costumes which differed greatly from area to area and even ride to ride...

Kings Island in 1972 was a wholly different experience than any seasonal park in modern times.

It was far less dependent on rides than on the overall magical, immersive experience.

[CoastersRZ]

Yes. Just take a stroll through the history gallery here to see that going to Kings Island back in 1972 was more about the overall experience. It was a kin to trips to Disneyworld today, where the rides may not be that spectacular (some rides down there are awesome), but the attention to theming and detail makes for a memorable experience. Much of this original magic has been lost over the years at Kings Island. I so wish that some of that magic would come back, particularly some of the roving entertainment that the park once had. Some of my fondest memories from my early visits to the park in the late 80s and early 90s are of seeing the Kings of Komedy Clown Band running around International Street. Too bad KI can`t bring back some entertainment like that! It does wonders to the overall atmosphere of the park. That is partly what made Winterfest in 2005 so magical, was that they had entertainment just roving around the midways.

[bkroz]

It's very true - with the really "magical" parks, its the theme, the immersion, that really makes it. Think of Universal's Islands of Adventure - break it down and what have you got? Two roller coasters, two dark rides, three water rides, and shows. Why, then, is it consistantly considered one of if not the best theme park in the United States? It's the character! The themes, the relatable characters, the "streetmosphere," the feeling of being whisked away!

I don't have conscious memories of Kings Island any further back than 1999, but even then I could feel an excitement and a sense of adventure that I no longer feel... The grand music on International Street, the dancing fountains, the lights, the sounds, the flowers, the waterfalls, the rivers... It was all so inclusive and so extraordinary. To know that I was in Ohio riding rides like Tomb Raider or The Racer or Flight of Fear or The Beast. Each one made the park, each could stand alone as a flagship attraction, each was so well-concieved and so intricate and detailed that it made me feel like I was someplace special, because I was!

I no longer feel that, hard as I try. And please know, I do try.

[BavarianBeatle]

I still feel the magic of the old Kings Island almost every time I go. However, that is based more on memories than on the present condition of the park!

[bkroz]

That's what I mean - I realize as of late that, though I continue to have good experiences at Kings Island, it's because in my head I can hear the music on International Street, though it's not playing. Or, I can see the goddess on the wall inside The Crypt, and I recall how she used to "wake up." It always used to shock me when my friends would find Kings Island to be only slightly better than Cedar Point. But realistically, they don't have the benefit of remembering how it used to be, so they can't imagine a park where Premier rides are always set to musical scores, or where a certain Giant Top Spin provides a thrilling and immersive experience. They have not had those experiences, and try as I might, they cannot be coerced into feeling that they have.

I will always see those creative and eye-catching MINI Coopers blasting around the track. What will first time visitors see? And is it really that bad? Or does it just seem so awful to me because I always compare it to what it used to be? Either way, I have been let down. Backlot isn't necessarily a fan favorite, but even casually-returning guests will not have this go unnoticed. If our trains look like Kings Dominion's, we're talking a MAJOR change that isn't going to simply blow over people's heads. It will be noticed.

It's like a bad relationship - no matter how low they stoop or how many shortcuts they take, my excuse is always "But, I love it!" "It used to be so nice, and I know that the better version is still inside!" "Something will happen and it will change and we can live happily ever after!" Sigh...

[The Interpreter]

At least they let guests who have paid for a pass enter the park.

So far.