Discussion & History on the Kings Island & Miami Valley Railroad

[Klabergian Empire]

Am I the only one who misses how much trees and wilderness used to be around the train?

[kimv1972]

The train has always run clockwise and the rail "walks" around the loop since the loco's wheels are always pushing backwards on it.  Every year things need to be realigned, and maybe even a bit of rail taken out to compensate.  We proposed at one time to put a crossover on the double track so we could equalize the wheel wear by running the other way, but the water tower prevented that being practical.  Since the left side of the coaches are open, the intent was to put the trestle walkway only on that side, but the carpenters put it on the wrong side so they had to add the second one.  I walked out on it in December 1971 before the second one was added.  The original cartoon map published in 1971 when Coney was still open showed the enginehouse outside the loop parallel to the last straight before you curve into the station (in the picnic area), and a low trestle just after you  pass the water tower leaving the station.  When we opened in 1972, there was a small field behind the watertower and the intent was to extend the canoe pond over there, no doubt deleted by the cost of the extra trestle.  If anyone can ever find a copy of that cartoon map from 1971, I would love to see it.  A college buddy who worked at Coney had one and I wished I had bought it from him.  I've never seen another one.  It is truly one of the most rare KI souvenirs.  I wish I could remember other things in the park that were changed since that one was printed.

[CoastersRZ]

Thanks for those sharing those insights!

[gforce1994]

One of the coolest things was seeing the original train down in Atlanta. Furthermore, it is ironic that the Texas is just down road from the General.

[TombraiderTy]

@kimv1972 Could you tell me more about the changes between these aerials, specifically how the "kink" in the track (just below the center of each photo, behind the carriage storage shed) appears to have been straightened? (Although I'd be happy to hear about any other changes or details too!)

(Photos from ODOT)

As CoastersRZ said, thank you for sharing your insights and experience! It's always wonderful to hear from a primary source on park history. 

[gforce1994]

16 minutes ago, TombraiderTy said:

@kimv1972 Could you tell me more about the changes between these aerials, specifically how the "kink" in the track (just below the center of each photo, behind the carriage storage shed) appears to have been straightened? (Although I'd be happy to hear about any other changes or details too!)

(Photos from ODOT)

As CoastersRZ said, thank you for sharing your insights and experience! It's always wonderful to hear from a primary source on park history. 

They likely changed it to prevent excess wear on the rails, as well as to increase capacity.  Hypothetically, a curve like that would likely require the train to slow, to ensure that it made the curve. Removing that curve would enable the train to run quickly and consistently through the course.

[SonofBaconator]

On 5/29/2020 at 5:23 PM, gforce1994 said:

They likely changed it to prevent excess wear on the rails, as well as to increase capacity.  Hypothetically, a curve like that would likely require the train to slow, to ensure that it made the curve. Removing that curve would enable the train to run quickly and consistently through the course.

It might've also helped it tackle the grade a little bit better with a full train. There's been a few instances even recently where the train couldn't make it up the grade and had to reverse and start over to rebuild momentum. Weather conditions can be huge factor in this.

 

Fun fact, the Walt Disney Railroad has a 2% grade which was the maximum permitted grade allowed on the American Transcontinental Railroad. 2% isn't a lot for us as humans but for a multi ton locomotive hauling tons of weight behind it, its a struggle.

 

[kimv1972]

Basically we used to highball across the trestle hooked up, then shut off and coast until you felt the engine lunge to the right of the first big curve, and that was your cue to drop her in the corner and start digging in for the 1% climb.  I never worked steam into the beginning of that curve behind the coach storage, I let momentum get the drivers into it so I wasn't shoving the track sideways.  In 1972, we had problems with shaving metal off the insides of the rails due to the track gage being laid too tight.  This held the wheels slightly off the rails (we were basically running on the fillets of the driver flanges) so we didn't get good traction.  To stop the wear, they hired a kid to walk the track with a grease stick on a pole and grease the insides of the rails.  But they didn't tell him not to grease the tops of the rails.  It was tough getting up the grade.  Chug, chug, slip, slip, slip, slip.  Chug, chug, slip, slip, slip, slip.  You learned to run by listening to the strength of the exhaust and it really became a fun challenge to use your ear to hear exactly when to back off the sticky throttles just before you spun the wheels. It separated the railroaders from the railfans and it was a contest to see who could make it up with the least slips.  Yes, rolling resistance is a combination of grade resistance and curve resistance, so straightening that curve probably helped, but  that was a few years after my time.  Anyhoo...  one wet day with 450 souls on board, it was more slip than chug.  I didn't make the grade and had to back down to the trestle to take a second try.  We had actors playing Native Americans that came out of the woods on the hill and attacked us, and when they saw me stop, they froze in place.  As I backed down the hill, the actors backed into the woods.  It couldn't have been better if we rehearsed it.  Not long after that, Dick Carmell installed small pipes that poured water on the flanges of the front pilot wheels to cut the rail wear and the kid with the grease stick became part of Kings Island history.

[SonofBaconator]

@kimv1972 do you know when they officially did away with the actors/actresses? Also what of the props? I saw some props like a horse and carriage in some videos from the early 90s but I grew up with the remnants of the old western town in the late 90s.

[IndyGuy4KI]

Don made a post on the KIBlog about The Kings Island & Miami Valley Railroad. 

https://www.visitkingsisland.com/blog/2020/june/11-things-you-may-not-know-about-the-kings-island--miami-valley-railroad

[Oldschool75]

Old 19 looks as good as it was on day 1, literally day 1.


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[Klabergian Empire]

2 hours ago, Oldschool75 said:

Old 19 looks as good as it was on day 1, literally day 1.


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They re-paint the engines every off season I believe. So indeed they do. I really like that the park invests time and energy into maintaining such a great attraction!

[kimv1972]

I wonder how the eagle ended up on the top of the headlight?  He was on the sand dome when I was there.

[kimv1972]

When we opened on 4/29/1972, the two bare settlers cabins had been built (I watched them go up in March on very cold Saturdays when we were shaking down the brand new trains), but there was nothing else out there but mud and weeds.  Then they started bringing in the old Coney animation, starting with the beaver that cut down the tree at the little pond as we started around the horseshoe curve.  It took a while to get the controls timed and sometimes the tree popped back up as soon as the frustrated beaver tipped it over.  At other times, it was already down and popped up in his face.  Along the hill were some deer and a bear.  Trapper Charlie Flatt's cabin I think came next along the straight stretch behind the three houses.  He sat there on his porch with his rifle in his hand when an arrow suddenly popped out of his chest and his head dropped.  Ol' Lobo the wolf stood in the woods next to the yard switchstand and howled when we tripped the contact on the track.  Ed McHale pointed him out on the narration tape and late at night when I was standing there to throw the switch after the last train passed, the passengers thought I was Lobo.  The indian mannequins probably were installed next, popping up from behind the pine saplings on the mountain.  They had propane rifles, and late one dark night a mannequin caught fire and popped up from behind the tree in an eerie self cremation.  There was a tipped over covered wagon on the earth berm behind the houses just as we straightened out after coming around the mountain and a mannequin indian lethargically waving a tomahawk at the poor wagon to scare the termites that infested it.  They were way behind schedule finishing up things in the park due to weather, so Fort McHale didn't start going up until perhaps June and for a couple weeks, the carpenters and electricians were part of the show for the passengers since we were open seven days a week.  It was a polebarn falsefront made out of lumber slabs cut from logs with two cannons mounted in block houses on the corners.  The cannons were propane and shot blanks which tripped an air blast coming out of the water in the pond when the "cannonball" hit.  Again it took time to get the controls right and sometimes the ball hit the water before the cannon fired.  And sometimes the wrong air blast went off making it look like a cannon shot a curve ball.  If I recall, they also had a perforated propane pipe along the top of the wall making it look like part of the fort was on fire.  It never really did catch fire, but the first iteration of the Gatling Gun did prove entertaining.  One day it self destructed and took a chunk out of the fort, but once they got in right, it worked quite well.  I think the last thing that went in was the indian burial ground back in the corner outside the first big curve starting up the hill.  One of our crew snuck back there one day with fishing line and tied it to the wrist of a skeleton so it would wave at the passengers.  Through today's eyes, many of the ways Native Americans were represented would never be tolerated.  Finally they started building the falsefront barn and store that hid the propane tank and locomotive crew parking lot across from the enginehouse and at last my old 1965 Mustang ceased being part of the 1870s.  The Inn came after I left, probably 1974 or 1975.  But back up to mid-May when they put some mannequins at the cabins, particularly the lady stirring the cook pot.  When we opened one morning we were surprised to see the mannequins suddenly had appeared overnight but clothing them had not yet become part of the equation.  To add grief, someone had painted some details on one of them.  It didn't take long to hear from alarmed parents.  Hence, they sent out a very shy red headed area manager to safety pin sheets on them.  We were passing him with a fairly full train observing his progress when the wind came up.  And there he was, alone with naked mannequins and his face as red as his hair.

 

[kimv1972]

Don's article noted that the management was surprised by the large size of the trains when they were delivered.  Keep in mind that they were probably ordered in 1970, a year before either Busch Tampa or Six Flags over Mid-America opened in St. Louis.  Nobody had ever seen a 5700# TE Crown before.  The biggest parktrains the Taft/Coney people had seen were Disneyland (5/8 size models and small narrow gagers) and Six Flags over Texas (very small narrow gagers).  Possibly they might have seen the 5/8 size trains built by Harpur of Six Flags over Georgia, the same size as Disneyland.  Crown already had five lighter 4000# TE engines running at Legend City, Frontier Land, Six Gun, and Pioneer City, but likely the Taft/Coney people never visited those parks.  Well, Crowns are definitely NOT scale models.  They are the same size as a Baldwin 8-14C, only very slightly smaller than the Miami Valley Narrow Gage RR #2, an 8-18C that led the first train into Lebanon.