Tuskin Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 well you would assume that if the trains where lighter they would gain speed somewhat but i couldnt tell you how much .. it just all depends on if the trains fit the track better or if they are just lighter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Picard Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 It's the structure of the ride that is the problem. Putting lighter trains on it and removing the loop cost less than taking down and rebuilding the complete structure of the ride. Lighter trains will have less speed not more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flightoffear1996 Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 Ok I think the lighter trains would give the ride more speed and here is why. 1) The Son of Beast is made of wood and the wood structure will give. With a lighter train there will be a lot give in the structure thus giving the ride more speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZ Kinda Guy Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 You think wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 Lighter trains will result in the trains having LESS speed and, theoretically, less stress on the structure of the ride. That is the real reason why they are switching trains. It goes back to the old theory momentum. Momentum equals mass times velocity. A heavier train will naturally induce more forces on the structure than a lighter or empty train. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollerNut Posted March 9, 2007 Share Posted March 9, 2007 A 5 car train is going to lose more speed than a 6 car train also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuskin Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 well if thats the case then how much speed will these cars actually lose and will they have to take out the loop cause if they do that would just suck .. personal opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Uh, it was announced quite some time ago the loop is going. And, in fact, it is GONE. It was carted off to a recycling place. Honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cory Butcher Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Um, you didnt know that the loop was taken out?? lol, where have you been? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuskin Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Uh, it was announced quite some time ago the loop is going. And, in fact, it is GONE. It was carted off to a recycling place. Honest. really? when was it annouced how long ago i wasent really checking the forums for a while thus why i appoligized for not being active for a while i was busy with college but the new ride has got me excitied again .. when did they take it out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I believe it may have become public in mid-December of last year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKIVortex Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Check the photo gallery too, they are aerial pics of the missing loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cory Butcher Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yes, December 15 after the ODA completed their investigation....I believe it was the 15th! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Here's the press release: December 13, 2006 Son of Beast Inspection Complete Kings Island, Ohio – The State of Ohio's Department of Agriculture released today its final report detailing the outcome of the extensive Son of Beast inspection. The report reaffirms initial indications that the incident was an unforeseen single event failure. Kings Island will now focus its energies on the appropriate and necessary changes needed to reopen the ride in 2007. In addition to reinforcing the physical structure of the ride, the Park plans to remove the loop. Taking this extra step enables the use of lighter trains, which will reduce the load and lead to a more comfortable ride experience. The Park is making good progress on Son of Beast and is fully committed to reopening the ride in 2007. Cedar Fair Entertainment Company (NYSE: "FUN") is a publicly traded partnership headquartered in Sandusky, Ohio. The Partnership, which owns and operates twelve amusement parks, five outdoor water parks, one indoor water park and six hotels, is one of the largest regional amusement park operators in the world. Its parks are located in Ohio, California, Toronto, North Carolina, Virginia / District of Columbia, Pennsylvania, Minnesota, Missouri and Michigan. ### Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonaldMacRonald Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I recall hearing that the loop was actually already removed when they announced the removal of the loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeLorean Rider Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 According to physics, lighter trains would go slower because though the acceleration of gravity is always 9.81m/s^2, the FORCE of gravity, according to newtons second law (F=MA), is the acceleration due to gravity times the trains mass. The greater the mass, the greater the force. The greater the force, less forces like resistance, drag, and friction are going to affect the movement of the trian. Now knowing that those are the main forces that slow the trains down, if these forces have less effect on the train (heavier train), the train will reach and maintain higher speeds. Man its times like this that I really wish I would have been able to patent gravity. (^refrence to comment made in magnetic breaks patent lawsuite topic^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKIVortex Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 I recall hearing that the loop was actually already removed when they announced the removal of the loop. The loop is already gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuskin Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 lol well crap i didnt know they did that thanks guys thats what i get for not being active for like 5 months lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flightoffear1996 Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yea I just hope the removal of the loop will really help improve the rest of the ride because it was the most unique thing that Kings Island had going for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yeah i am anxious to see what it will look like without the loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortex Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yeah i am anxious to see what it will look like without the loop. A S shape pice of track will go in where the loop was at. I just hope KI banks the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PKIVortex Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 It would have to be banked. The forces would be too great if it wasn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuskin Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 It would have to be banked. The forces would be too great if it wasn't. exactly right if the s turn wasent banked it would be worse then u think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cory Butcher Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 well I hope that they have enough room to bank it at the angle that it needs to go the one way and then switchback the other to meet with the track! For instance if an unbanked s-shaped piece of track only takes 140 feet of space, I would imagine that a banked piece would take another 50 feet or so to get into the bank, turn, get out of the bank, get back into the bank and turn the other way, and then unbank again to match with the unbanked track ahead. I certainly hope that they execute this right and this area doesnt turn out to be a rib-breaker like the wildcat's of old....some of you older gentlemen know what unbanked turns were like on most coasters named "Wildcat". Speaking of such, were any of our members here ever privaledged to ride the Wildcat at Idora or the one in Dayton, Ohio many years ago? I have been told the forces on those coasters were tremendous...laterally speaking! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted March 10, 2007 Share Posted March 10, 2007 Yea I just hope the removal of the loop will really help improve the rest of the ride because it was the most unique thing that Kings Island had going for it. The most unique thing that Kings Island had going for it? Have you been to the park? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWildman424 Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 According to physics, lighter trains would go slower because though the acceleration of gravity is always 9.81m/s^2, the FORCE of gravity, according to newtons second law (F=MA), is the acceleration due to gravity times the trains mass. The greater the mass, the greater the force. The greater the force, less forces like resistance, drag, and friction are going to affect the movement of the trian. Now knowing that those are the main forces that slow the trains down, if these forces have less effect on the train (heavier train), the train will reach and maintain higher speeds. Man its times like this that I really wish I would have been able to patent gravity. (^refrence to comment made in magnetic breaks patent lawsuite topic^ I agree that if the trains are heavier, they move faster, but if the trains are moving faster (with more force), won't the friction between the wheels and the track, and the air resistance be greater on a faster train than on a lighter(slower) train. Just a point to ponder, and possibly chat about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 While their may be more air resistance on a train that is moving faster, the result causing the train to slow will be minimal compared to the increased speed and momentum of the train. Because heavier trains have more force and momentum, friction is less of an issue for heavier trains and slowing them down. Just look at the mass of a semi compared to that of a compact car. Obviously, a semi has more mass and needs a greater amount of friction to slow it down compared to the compact car. (Which is why the semis always seem to "win" in accidents). So, to answer your question, no heavier trains will not increase the friction experienced by the trains. In fact, there would need to be more friction added to realize the same frictional force of the lighter train, ie compact car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWildman424 Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 OK...i know what your talking about with the semi example, my sister was in an accident involving a small car, falling asleep, and the back of a semi. Everyones fine, I just thought it was funny that you should mention that. I don't think the guy driving the semi even knew that anything happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWildman424 Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 I didn't mention that it was last week, which makes it even more funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cory Butcher Posted March 11, 2007 Share Posted March 11, 2007 Don't mention such a horrible accident being so funny, some people may take offense to it and let you know about it! Note: This post is in reference to the hostility exhibited by some members on other topics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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