Why doesn't Cedar Fair do this!?

[DropZone99]

Well it's a Friday night and I have nothing to do, so I'm bored at home online. I decided to go on rcdb.com and look at random coasters. I noticed how expensive some are.

Some of the bigger Cedar Fair coasters (price):

Diamondback: 22 Million

Intimidator: 23 Million

Intimidator 305: 25 million

Millennium Force: 25 million

Top Thrill Dragster: 25 million

Maverick: 22 Million

Behemoth: 26 Million

And than here are some other coasters across the world that alot of people may think is better, and cost less:

Voyage: 8.5 Million

Ravine Flyer II: 6 Million

Prowler: 8 Million

Terminator Salvation: 10 Million

So why not build coasters that are cheaper, but as good or better in most people's opinion? I don't see why we need to buy coasters that cost like 20 million + that are good, but most likely not worth the money, when instead we could buy much cheaper coasters that are just as good. I know people are going to get angry when I say this but I think Cedar Fair needs to be more like Six Flags and Holiday World. We could easily choose out a coaster from almost every CF park that is a pretty good ride but is plain and could use some help to make it popular. Than paint it, give it a new name, add sound affects and theme to it. Than people think as it as almost a new coaster and want to ride it. And as for being more like Holiday World we should equal out what we build in different areas. Instead of focusing on the theme park side for almost the whole time than every 15 years renovate the water park, why not just add a water slide or fix up the water park a little bit every five years or so? I have much more to say, but I want to hear what you have to say first.

[TH13TEEN]

I agree with DropZone99 %100. Water parks seem to be a huge hit these days. SFKK poor park went under; but the Water park thrived. Boomerang Bay hasn't seen any love since 2004. I think it's about time CF has used the Australian themed water park to their advantage. In 2009 despite the bad summer weather. On hot summer days I would drive past Kings Island and see a packed water park. On the other hand Six Flags has been adding some inexpensive family coasters. Tony Hawk's Big Spin, is a great example. They have added 4 of thoughs cheep yet fun family coasters. I have herd they are a hit. So now why doesn't Cedar Fair start to look around and relize that you don't need, 25 Million dollor coasters to keep their guest happy.

*Excuse my poor grammer tired.*

[Cory Butcher]

Dropzone, you raise a good point....but, you should go look at the cost of ownership for wooden coasters. Steel coasters have relatively little maintenance needs other than general upkeep once installed. With wood coasters, there is a marriage of sorts between constant maintenance/refurbishment and the park.

Then, you have to look at what generally catches the public's eye in terms of return on investment. Steel coasters typically are a bigger draw. To the mainstream public, they often may appear safer as well.

Cheaper is not always as it appears...keep in mind that 90% of the iceberg is typically under the surface!

And believe me, you don't want to be too much like Holiday World. Kings Island would not exist in its current state and size if it only pulled in a million guests a year!

[AintNutinElse2Do]

I would argue that the ratio of people to the size of park would be in favor of Holiday World when compared to KI. Also not all steel coasters are 20mil. I doubt wood coaster maintenance would double the original investment in under 30 yrs at least.

[The Interpreter]

AintNutinElse2Do, I think you greatly underestimate what it costs to maintain a wooden coaster. Does Vortex get walked each morning? Top Gun? Diamondback? Are pieces replaced on each virtually every morning? Do steel coasters often require that large sections be retracked? Are you aware of the differences in train wear and maintenance required on the various types of coaster trains?

Regardless of all that, I suspect the parks owned by Cedar Fair (careful wording there...) will soon be looking more at first costs than longer term costs of ownership. And I am also not alone in my thinking that the Cedar Fair parks may well be deluding themselves in thinking that large steel coasters rapidly pay for themselves. Were that the case, why is Cedar Fair alone among major operators in frequently installing them? Why do others that do install them highly theme them, while Cedar Fair does not?

And another factor. Long term popularity. Why did Six Flags find it necessary to make Superman: Ride of Steel into Bizarro at Six Flags New England? Was it because ridership of that steel coaster, which many considered to be the best in the world when it opened and now (again careful wording), was declining? Ten years out, which sustains ridership more effectively? An excellent large steel coaster or an excellent wooden coaster? It's too bad we can't look at Cedar Point to make this comparison. On a busy, busy day at Kings Island, which ride has more riders--The Beast or Vortex? At Kings Dominion, how many riders does Volcano: The Blast Coaster now get compared to when it opened? Is the decline more than on, say, Grizzly?

Cedar Fair is unique among operators of its type in putting large steel coasters year after year after year. I strongly suspect the days of its doing so are over...regardless of whether or not Apollo rides in in a chariot to save the CEO's--I'm an operations guy, not a finance guy's--financial future.

[jzarley]

^ I remember hearing on one of those Discovery Channel "coaster shows" years ago, that roughly 10% of a wooden coasters structure had to be replaced every year. I was absolutely amazed by the number, since according to that stat, The Beast has essentially been rebuilt three times over the years!

[mtl2013]

Thats amazing! I knew that there of course were constant repairs, and matinance, but 10% ??! Wow.

[HTCO]

I totally agree with you DropZone99. Could it be because CF and B&M and Intiman have a great alliance?

[TH13TEEN]

^ Not anymore they don't. I am almost positive all their contracts with B&M and Inatmin are up.

[CedarPointer]

^ I remember hearing on one of those Discovery Channel "coaster shows" years ago, that roughly 10% of a wooden coasters structure had to be replaced every year. I was absolutely amazed by the number, since according to that stat, The Beast has essentially been rebuilt three times over the years!

I could swear I heard that much of The Beast's support structure is original, but I can't remember where I heard that.

[jzarley]

^ I remember hearing on one of those Discovery Channel "coaster shows" years ago, that roughly 10% of a wooden coasters structure had to be replaced every year. I was absolutely amazed by the number, since according to that stat, The Beast has essentially been rebuilt three times over the years!

I could swear I heard that much of The Beast's support structure is original, but I can't remember where I heard that.

^ My guess is (if the 10% figure is actually accurate) that a lot of the replaced structure would be the same pieces over & over again, as opposed to every board being replaced at one time or another. I said that it would be as if The Beast had "essentially" been rebuilt three times...not literally rebuilt three times

[StalkerChick]

Cory hit a lot of this on the head. Generally steel is going to cost more than wood for one. And you're comparing steel coasters in bigger parks and wood ones in smaller parks. and then you're also comparing steel costers that are newer than some of those wood coasters. Woodies are sadly a dying trend, left for the enthusuasts and the nostalgic. ppl want the spped and smoothness and twisty turvy of metal now a days

[The Interpreter]

They can get all that, and more, in a nice, new wood coaster from Great Coasters International and/or The Gravity Group, just to name two...

(Aren't you proud of me? I didn't mention the I- word...)

[Browntggrr]

CF needs to be more like SF and HW?

I really think that the correct statement would be that CF & SF need to be more like HW when it comes down to customer service. When it comes to rides, there are way too many opinions out there. People, especially enthusiasts, are never satisfied.

We really need to compare apples to apples. Comparing wood to steel is an unfair. But even at that, some of the steel rides you listed are fantastic rides (Maverick & DB come to mind) and justify the cost.

IMO, many guests seem to favor the fast, smooth rides. Wood coasters generally do not have that combination.