The Interpreter Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 No. $1.5 to $2 million if I remember correctly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McSalsa Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 ^Wait, so they start spending only $2.5 million in 2016...isn't that when they are supposed to be fixing and re-opening the Twisted Twins wooden dueling coaster? Even without a full-blown Iron Horse treatment, $2.5 million would likely only BARELY even get the ride running again- and leave $0 for other improvements. EDIT: And Terpy's latest numbers which have been suggested may not even cover that. And that's if Kentucky Kingdom GETS to 2016. With Thunderbird opening in 2015, Holiday World has launched a major assault, and then you have the elections and if the "other" guys get elected, they may not look so kindly to Ed Hart's park- though this isn't new information at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 The way I've been interpreting that $1.5M-to-$2M figure is that the lease requires that they invest that much, but there's nothing prohibiting them from investing more. The plan may be to invest far more each year, say $6M one year, then $18M another year on a brand new coaster, etc. Likely (and this is just my speculation), the Fair Board demanded that Hart guarantee a minimum investment every year, and Hart went with a low figure so he could have freedom to have a year with low capex (e.g. 2013 at KI, when we got the Reds Grille and not much else) to allow saving money for a large capex the following year (e.g. 2014 at KI with Banshee). What I'm getting at here is that if the lease specified, let's pick a number out of thin air here, $8 million per year, then he would have to spend $8 million EVERY single year, hurting the ability to save for larger capital expenditures in future years. Thus, a low minimum figure enables more freedom to have large capexes more frequently, which is a good thing. Correct me if there's hard evidence to the contrary, but the word "minimum" doesn't have to be present in the lease proposal or contract here. If the contract says one figure, and Hart and company spend a higher figure, I seriously don't think the Fair Board would complain in the least. And for a preemptive rebuttal to those who would respond by asking where this extra money will come from, yes, Hart risked very little of his own money at the outset and had trouble getting loans, but I think once a couple of years pass and the park shows that it seems to be succeeding, all parties will see less risk than there was during the initial financing stage last year, resulting in banks being more willing to lend money, and Hart maybe being more willing to dig into his own pocket. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 You can interpret it however you want, but Mr. Hart HIMSELF has told investors that Kentucky Kingdom will succeed where Six Flags failed, as Hart & Co. intend to reinvest $1.5 to $2 million a year back into the park each year starting in 2016. He said that. Not me. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Perhaps he meant to say "at least". We don't know. Hopefully the park will survive for a few more years so we can find out for sure. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 It was quoted in many newspaper articles. The man is a businessman. I assume he says what he means and means what he said. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marth555 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 So Cyclos is like a smaller Delirium that loops? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkroz Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Which is to say, it'll have almost nothing in common with Delirium in real life. Falcon's Fury vs. Liberty Launch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homestar92 Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 I find the smaller Frisbees to be more fun than the larger ones. Of the ones that I've ridden: Rattler > Black Widow > maXair > Delirium > Psyclone. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 No KK BooFest in 2015. Park To Close Sep 27, 2015. http://www.bizjournals.com/louisville/news/2014/09/25/kentucky-kingdom-to-expand-rides-hours-in-2015.html?full=true&page=all And season pass sale starts November 1? My head hurts. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hendrick Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 The new park map is already up here. One thing to note, the 2013 map said T3 was coming in 2015 and Twisted Twins in 2016. While Twisted Twins is on the 2015 map, there is no mention of it opening in 2016 (and besides the lack of a name and number on the park map, there also isn't any mention that it is closed for 2015. That can be confusing...) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 And today, Mr. Hart flatly refused to say when, if ever, Twisted Twins is reopening.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 The new park map is already up here. One thing to note, the 2013 map said T3 was coming in 2015 and Twisted Twins in 2016. While Twisted Twins is on the 2015 map, there is no mention of it opening in 2016 (and besides the lack of a name and number on the park map, there also isn't any mention that it is closed for 2015. That can be confusing...) I clicked that link. I sat waiting for the image to load for two minutes before I finally got this message: The image "http://www.kentuckykingdom.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/newparkmap-2015.jpg" cannot be displayed because it contains errors. Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBEASTunchained Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 I hope that map isn't an indication of the "new" coat of paint that will be applied to T3...... In my opinion, it has ALWAYS been one of the ugliest roller coasters out there, as far as color goes. I REALLY hope it doesn't end up having a matching color on the track and supports, as the last few color schemes were...... ...And please Mr. Hart DON'T bring back that hideous red color...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hendrick Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 I clicked that link. I sat waiting for the image to load for two minutes before I finally got this message: The image "http://www.kentuckykingdom.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/newparkmap-2015.jpg" cannot be displayed because it contains errors. Really? Any luck on this? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Yes, that link works for me. Thank you! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkroz Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 My favorite from the article is: Revenue and attendance were hurt, he said, by winter weather that delayed the summer recess for schools. Summer, okay. Winter weather?! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 In other articles, he cites the hot summer as hurting attendance. A State Fair with a 16 percent DROP in attendance demands introspection, in my opinion. Something is very not right here. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkroz Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Seriously though... A 16% drop? What? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcgoble3 Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 My favorite from the article is: Revenue and attendance were hurt, he said, by winter weather that delayed the summer recess for schools.Summer, okay. Winter weather?! In theory, a harsh winter can create excessive snow days, which can require schools to make up a lot of days, which requires students to stay in school longer, which reduces leisure time for those same students in the early part of the summer, and reduced leisure time means fewer chances to go out and do things like go to amusement parks. In other articles, he cites the hot summer as hurting attendance. On the flip side, what hot summer? It seemed rather cool to me, and given that southwest Ohio isn't that far from Louisville, I wouldn't think there would be that drastic of a temperature difference between here and there for a whole summer. This statement just baffles me. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Especially since the water park is the main attraction. Hot weather in an urban environment would increase water's attractions. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 WLKY tells us that 2015 KK gets a "$30 million expansion." http://m.wlky.com/news/new-rides-coming-to-kentucky-kingdom-in-30m-expansion/28255932 IF that were true, it would be impressive indeed. Alas, Mr. Hart himself has said it's $8 to $10 million. I wonder how THIS happened... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magenta Lizard Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Well apparently they've hired better PR than they had earlier in the season 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RailRider Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 600,000 park visitors was not enough to keep Six invested in Kentucky Kingdom. What does the Fairgrounds and Kentucky Kingdom share in common? Location. Just because you build it does not mean they will come. As we learned from Hard Rock Park, Location will dictate a parks success more than rides, shows, and attractions. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPKI Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 I hope that map isn't an indication of the "new" coat of paint that will be applied to T3...... In my opinion, it has ALWAYS been one of the ugliest roller coasters out there, as far as color goes. I REALLY hope it doesn't end up having a matching color on the track and supports, as the last few color schemes were...... ...And please Mr. Hart DON'T bring back that hideous red color...... You may not be pleased with this clip (1:05 mark). Although its unclear whether it will be a monotone scheme, mentions include Ohio State and Cardinal Red. http://www.wave3.com/clip/10625671/kentucky-kingdom-to-add-5-rides-in-2015 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldiesmann Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 Their operating calendar makes my head hurt. Closed for private events: April 18th, May 16th and 17th and September 20th, 26th and 27th KK 11-7: Saturdays and Sundays April 11th through May 10th "Check Website": May 18th-22nd, 26th and 27th KK 11-9, HB 11-8: Fridays and Saturdays May 23rd through August 15th (also May 24th, September 5th and September 6th) KK 11-8, HB 11-7: Sunday through Thursday May 31st through August 11th KK 11-7, HB 11-6: May 25th and 28th, August 16th, September 7th, 12th, 13th and 19th State fair hours: 4-9 weekdays, 1-9 weekends (HB closed except for Big Surf Wave Pool, which is open til 7 all days during the fair) To recap: Open for no more than 10 hours a day even during the peak summer season. Only being open part of the week the 2nd week in August (why Monday and Tuesday but not the next three days?) Being closed the last three "operating days" of the season for a private event (which means the last public day will be a week earlier next year than it was this year) Water park once again closed during the fair, despite August being one of the hottest months for this region, except for a single wave pool. Edit: And it seems the 2015 operating hours suddenly vanished from the park's website while I was typing this post. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron88stang Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 WLKY tells us that 2015 KK gets a "$30 million expansion." http://m.wlky.com/news/new-rides-coming-to-kentucky-kingdom-in-30m-expansion/28255932 IF that were true, it would be impressive indeed. Alas, Mr. Hart himself has said it's $8 to $10 million. I wonder how THIS happened... Maybe they are including the original cost of the shuttered rides plus the cost to refurbish them. It would make the statement of a 30 million dollar "expansion" technically true but not a 30 million dollar investment for 2015. I know that is really stretching things but is plausible in how they came up with the figure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sccard01 Posted September 26, 2014 Author Share Posted September 26, 2014 Their operating calendar makes my head hurt. Closed for private events: April 18th, May 16th and 17th and September 20th, 26th and 27th KK 11-7: Saturdays and Sundays April 11th through May 10th "Check Website": May 18th-22nd, 26th and 27th KK 11-9, HB 11-8: Fridays and Saturdays May 23rd through August 15th (also May 24th, September 5th and September 6th) KK 11-8, HB 11-7: Sunday through Thursday May 31st through August 11th KK 11-7, HB 11-6: May 25th and 28th, August 16th, September 7th, 12th, 13th and 19th Only being open part of the week the 2nd week in August (why Monday and Tuesday but not the next three days?) School starts Wednesday August 12! That is the reason for the closure. Where did you find the calender? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 It WAS on the website. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBEASTunchained Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 I hope that map isn't an indication of the "new" coat of paint that will be applied to T3...... In my opinion, it has ALWAYS been one of the ugliest roller coasters out there, as far as color goes. I REALLY hope it doesn't end up having a matching color on the track and supports, as the last few color schemes were...... ...And please Mr. Hart DON'T bring back that hideous red color...... You may not be pleased with this clip (1:05 mark). Although its unclear whether it will be a monotone scheme, mentions include Ohio State and Cardinal Red. http://www.wave3.com/clip/10625671/kentucky-kingdom-to-add-5-rides-in-2015 Oh My..... - TheBEASTunchained......Becoming more frightened..... .....As long as they use the new restraints......I can deal with the paint color......Probably...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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