Big Dipper may not be "saved" after all

[PREMiERdrum]

from savethebigdipper.org

I apologize for the lack of updates to this site and other forums I have been active on. There have been many events that have called for my attention and I was hesitant to post anything until I knew for certain what was going on.

The owner and the owner’s agent have expressed their desire to cancel the deal we had come to agreement on concerning the sale of the Big Dipper. Harold and I are working together on this project. Our interest at this point is in saving the Big Dipper from the previously announced demolition by the parties that purchased the coaster from the Cedar Fair auction. We are currently under experienced legal guidance so that we may do everything within our power to save an important piece of amusement history.

I sincerely hope for everyone’s understanding as we work through the new challenges we are faced with. Harold and I are completely dedicated to this project and are determined to see this through to the end, which we see as the successful restoration of the Big Dipper to operational status.

So, she didn't yet officially own the ride? And was soliciting money for the cause? Ouch.

Bainbridge — The forecast for the future of the Big Dipper roller coaster at the former Geauga Lake amusement park may turn out to have more twists and turns than the ride itself.

Ohioan Kat Jones, the organizer of the project to save the ride, and Harold Garmonsway, the project’s founder, reportedly were involved in purchasing the coaster Sept. 30. But according to a blog post today (Dec. 2) on the website “Save the Big Dipper,” — http://savethebigdipper.org/ — the purchase of the coaster from its owner may have hit a snag.

“The owner and the owner’s agent have expressed their desire to cancel the deal we had come to agreement on concerning the sale of the Big Dipper,” the post states.

“Our interest at this point is in saving the Big Dipper from the previously announced demolition by the parties that purchased the coaster at the Cedar Fair auction.

“We are currently under experienced legal guidance so that we may do everything within our power to save an important piece of amusement history.

“I sincerely hope for everyone’s understanding as we work through the new challenges we are faced with.”

Tom Woosnam of APEX Western Machinery Movers, an agent for the coaster’s former owner, and Jones did not immediately return phone calls or e-mails for comment.

For more, see the Dec. 8 edition of the Aurora Advocate.

Aurora Advocate

[IBEW_Sparky]

Le' sigh..... I read this on GLT as well, and if this is genuinely the case I will be incredibly upset/disappointed/nearly angry. I had genuinely had my Heart set on the fact that it was going to be saved... at least the trains if nothing else.... and was going to have the genuine opportunity to have a hand in the process as a volunteer to remove all of the rides electrical and control components. I really, really hope this can all be straightened out

[Vortex]

I don't think the Big Dipper will be saved at all. If the coaster moved not much or any wood could be used to rebuild it. The coaster trains also could not be used unless updated.

[PREMiERdrum]

The trains have been sitting out on the midway, totally exposed, since the auction. I can't image the work it would take for them to be restored.

[pkiboy]

PREMiERdrum I really don't Appreciate your comment. First off Kat is very good person and she has a great hart I love her as a Sister. She would never EVER take peoples money. For one I have Traveled and taken many different Coaster Trips with her. She be the last person on earth to do such a thing.

[Colonel_SoB_fan]

Adam while Kat is a great person, with a big heart and would not intentionally steal anyone money, PREMIERdrum is speaking truth.

[pkiboy]

Bret I understand that but People really need to Lay off her with this project.

[Erosarrow05]

No, they don't need to lay off her, she needs to be accountable. Remember business is business, it's not personal.

This might not be a popular statement, but I totally disagree. People, especially those who donated to this project, need to stay on her until she becomes more transparent with what the plans are. For months she has been collecting donations, albeit only 384 dollars, under the false pretense that she is the owner of the object. The last I checked, the Save the Dipper project was quite literally, a one woman show. There is no timeline, there is no master plan... the only we have is this website where we can donate money. To be honest, it makes sense why there isn't a timeline or overall plan, she can't plan to disassemble and store a rollercoaster she doesn't own. I hope she makes it very clear on that website that she is not the owner of that coaster, and any donations made are made under that understanding... (btw - did anyone ever find out if shes filed a 501c3, and Im curious who is funding this 'legal advise')

Maybe if she, and by she I mean the man from New Zealand who is funding this project, can come up with enough money to satisfy the sellers pocketbook, then publish a master plan and of course then provide to the public some proof they now are the owners of said object - maybe then people will start donating and the project will move forward. Sadly though, the lack of organization from the start, then the lack of Mr. Overseas, now this bit of news - isn't helping the credibility of her cause. Just to put it in perspective - without any large donations... at the current rate they are raising money - she should have enough to complete the project by roughly the year 2510.

In closing - it takes a big pair of cajones to step up to the plate and try to tackle this feat and thats admirable and my best wishes are with her, but I can't say I expect the project to ever come to fruition.

(but by god, should she get a master plan up and provide me with some details - ill be happy to donate something)

[PREMiERdrum]

PREMiERdrum I really don't Appreciate your comment. First off Kat is very good person and she has a great hart I love her as a Sister. She would never EVER take peoples money. For one I have Traveled and taken many different Coaster Trips with her. She be the last person on earth to do such a thing.

I didn't say she had bad intentions, I made a statement based on what she said on her blog: She never officially owned the ride. She claimed that she owned the ride when soliciting donations.

As for "Laying off" her and this project, she was the one who got herself on TV and in the papers talking about this great plan to save the Dipper. She said, on multiple occasions, that she and the other guy were the new owners. That obviously isn't the case. Intentional or not, this was a scam.

[Vortex]

Well looks like the Dipper is coming down around June 30, 2011.

[flightoffear1996]

I would love to buy a car of a train if I only had a good spot to put it.

[DegenRider]

Im sorry nice person or not this person got way in over her head.

It provided some nice entertainment.

[BavarianBeatle]

Many of the posts in this thread are bordering on defamation.........

[Erosarrow05]

perhaps you could point out these posts that are making false statements damaging a persons reputation... Most of the comments have been regurgitation of what she herself said...

Although, I guess since you said "bordering on" that doesn't mean they are defamatory. So in that case, the conversation should continue on its said path?

In all fairness, this is a conversation that needs to happen... There are quite a few people in the coaster community who will donate money at the drop of a hat to help a project like this. A lot of those people take the information provided on the news, and her website as fact and donate accordingly. I'm not sure when it's been okay to take money from someone under false pretense... So again, to ere on the side of caution, perhaps its a good thing the word is out and potential contributors are now informed of the risk in donating to this said cause.

[The Interpreter]

If it is true only $384 has been raised, apparently not very many people contributed at the drop of this hat...

Terp, just sayin'

[PREMiERdrum]

Many of the posts in this thread are bordering on defamation.........

Care to elaborate? I don't see anything but facts presented here.

She said she and the kiwi owned the ride. They asked for money. Apparently, they never owned the ride to begin with.

I don't know Kat, but many of you do. I trust your perceptions of her, and trust that the $384 will be returned. If not? There could be trouble.

[Dvo]

Very shady situation indeed. I'm on the side of the fence where quite honestly, I don't care what happens to the ride. I would like to see something happen though, so at least the people who did donate money can rest assured that it was indeed used for something.

[DegenRider]

Many of the posts in this thread are bordering on defamation.........

You may wanna stay off Theme Park Review. They have ripped her to shreds by just presenting the facts. Although there is a prince Desmond that may be able to help.

[PhantomTheater]

Big Dipper purchase may have hit snag

http://www.auroraadvocate.com/news/article/4943769

Things are getting interesting in Aurora.

[AZ Kinda Guy]

Not looking good for the Big Dipper. Can't say I'm surprised with the way the whole ownership situation either. Either way, I'd be POed if I donated money.

[The Interpreter]

Go read these two one for yourself, I won't be commenting on this:

http://behindthethrills.com/2011/01/save-the-big-dipper-project-is-no-more/

http://www.savethebi...1/final-update/

[windshawne]

At least they tried. It's sad, but what can ya do?

[Browntggrr]

Individuals who have donated money, please contact me directly at kjones@savethebigdipper.org. I can explain the options for the return of your donations, or the options for the redirection of your donations to other preservation efforts in the amusement industry. The good news is, the Big Dipper is not the only coaster that has people trying to save it, and there are many projects that could use the assistance as well.

Options?

People donated for "Saving the Big Dipper". Now that clearly appears to not be happening, and those that donated have options?

How about they just refund the money? That seems simple enough.

This was a half-hearted effort from the beginning, and has ended like most suspected.

[XGatorHead 8904]

I assume what she meant by "options for the return of your donations" is different methods to get the money back to those that donated.

[The Interpreter]

More, again without comment:

http://www.wkyc.com/news/regional/akron_article.aspx?storyid=169452&catid=6

[DegenRider]

I think we can finally put a nail in this coffin

[Browntggrr]

I assume what she meant by "options for the return of your donations" is different methods to get the money back to those that donated.

I would honestly like to assume the same thing, but, I would also assume that she would have everyone that donated on speed dial and would have already paid the money back leaving the "options" message on the website as never being written because a "we already paid the money back" message was done instead.

[The Interpreter]

Aurora Advocate write-up:

http://www.auroraadvocate.com/news/article/4965701

[Erosarrow05]

"This was a half-hearted effort from the beginning, and has ended like most suspected."

While I personally felt as though she didn't have her ducks in a row and bit off way more than she could chew, your statement couldn't be farther from the truth.

In truth, her whole heart was in saving this object, and her deep passion for roller coasters drove her, what I would consider naively so, forward with plans that were at best "private". More than likely though the plans she had were contained in her head.

Perhaps she could provide details one day, even provide a master plan at best, but again - I think if you boil this whole story down it comes down to two enthusiasts who tried to come in and save the day at the last minute without concrete plans, funds, or know how. It probably came as quite a shock to her all those hours she spent sitting in front of a computer reading about other fanboys talk about roller coaster, thinking she was "informed" - proved to be nothing more than fluff and showed her she had little idea what to do.

I can't help but cite her youtube account where she used to make videos of her opinions on parks she visited, rides she rode and her overall travels. Her commentary, to me at least, gave the impression she considered her opinion to be highly regarded and she had quite a bit of "knowledge" behind her opinion. But alas, thats just my opinion.

But to sit and say she was half-hearted in her attempts to salvage this object is an insult. This may come out wrong, but I know I wasn't rallying any support for the Big Dipper at Geauga Lake and the at last check, I didn't see you starting any petition or fundraiser, let alone a plan to rescue it from the wrecking ball. Not only was her whole heart in this project, every fiber of her being thought she could save this ride, and she was doing a great thing for fans, and history buffs alike.

Passing judgement without all the facts, to me, is one of the most deplorable actions one can take and Im not narrowing that statement to this specific case. Look in media outlets all over the world today, god forbid a major news outlet got wind of her efforts who knows how it would have been spun. I guess it is always safe to wait until the facts are known before placing judgement on one party or the other.

Does she get any award from me for excellence in master planning, relocation and procurement of historical items? Absolutely not, in fact I was rather critical of her.

However - never... ever... in my wildest dreams would I undertake, or even think I had the ability to undertake, a project of that magnitude. My hat is clearly off to her in that respect, and that respect alone.

(I really hope this makes sense, its amazing what comes out of ones hands at 715 in the morning on a potty run - lol)

[Outdoor Man]

"This was a half-hearted effort from the beginning, and has ended like most suspected."

(I really hope this makes sense, its amazing what comes out of ones hands at 715 in the morning on a potty run - lol)

that's awesome- and at the same time, TMI!

there's a lot of fowl-ness coming from th former GL park. Many things of that whole mess, even from a business standpoint don't make sense. I also tip the hat to them for trying to save the coaster, but when I read that it was a college student (at least I think that was her "profession") and an investor from New Zealand I happened to think that she may have been in over her head. that being said- it seemed they had a few duck in a row to begin and stopped on the "owners" pull back from the agreement.

I think that a great location for a classic coaster, if it could ever be pulled off, would be at a classic park on the banks of the Ohio River (Coney Island).