Grand Carnivale 2024 Reviews

[IndyGuy4KI]

We will use this thread for Grand Carnivale reviews and tips. We hope you enjoy the event this season. 

• Food Tents - 5 to 9 PM
• Opening Procession - 6:00 PM
• RetroSpect - 6:30 PM
• The Spectacle of Color Parade - 9PM

[Timchat2]

Overall Grand Carnivale feels a bit stronger and more cohesive this year with the rearranged scheduled. Having a couple of the daytime shows (Trailblazers X-treme and Country Crossroads) available after 7PM was nice for us since we generally visit later in the evening.

The decor looks great, especially at night. The little alcove between French Corner and Sweet Spot is particularly nice.

The new lighting on the floats adds a lot to the energy of the parade. The synchronized building lighting on International Street really ramps up the energy during the show stops too.

While it feels a bit strange to not have the big finale dance number with the full cast it was a lot of fun having so many of the performers mingling and taking pictures as  the dance party continued at the Bandstand.

It was nice having two of the floats out at the dance party after the parade. We noticed the lights on the floats were synced with Under the Stars, which was a nice touch.

The tasting cards would have been nice and we still miss having performances in each country but at a time when so much is getting cut we're still happy to have an event of this scale so close to home.

 

[IndyGuy4KI]

Experienced the event yesterday evening. The decorations looked good. The parade was awesome. The few people I found that purchased food said it was really good. I will say the food looked wonderful. The key word there is looked. 

I will likely not purchase individual food. It seems that is the consensus among a lot of the guests at the park. At any given time there were 0 to 3 people in line at a food stand.

With the tasting cards in previous years there were 5 to 10 minute waits to order at every food stand. If I was a KI gold tag, I would be on the phone with Charlotte and telling corporate to send me tasting cards ASAP. Otherwise it will be very likely for the first time ever this event at KI will loose a lot of money. 

A look at a few of the food items. I would recommend giving them a try if your are ok purchasing a tasting for 3/4 the price of a full meal. 

.

 

 

[BeeastFarmer]

No International Chicken Tenders?

[BoddaH1994]

5 hours ago, IndyGuy4KI said:

Experienced the event yesterday evening. The decorations looked good. The parade was awesome. The few people I found that purchased food said it was really good. I will say the food looked wonderful. The key word there is looked. 

I will likely not purchase individual food. It seems that is the consensus among a lot of the guests at the park. At any given time there were 0 to 3 people in line at a food stand.

With the tasting cards in previous years there were 5 to 10 minute waits to order at every food stand. If I was a KI gold tag, I would be on the phone with Charlotte and telling corporate to send me tasting cards ASAP. Otherwise it will be very likely for the first time ever this event at KI will loose a lot of money. 

A look at a few of the food items. I would recommend giving them a try if your are ok purchasing a tasting for 3/4 the price of a full meal. 

.

I’m with you on the cards. I’ve bought a card every year for every event that they’ve had like this. I guess this year I won’t be participating in the tasting, and from the looks of it, others feel the same way.

What’s scary is the park was PACKED. Presumably there were large groups. They’re big spenders, stereotypically speaking. The food at the tents being $8.95-ish should have given the veneer of a better value, but few seemed to have seen it that way.

Also, I saw some people lined up for the parade around 6:50, which was incompetently miscommunicated/not communicated to the media last week. I hope the people who were waiting got the info before giving up.

Of course, when I asked on their Facebook… well, they didn’t bother to reply, but when a former KI PR (not Don) responded saying that info would be nice, they said “check the app” in a very, “it’s not my job to deal with people like you” attitude. 
 

So much talent.. so much effort.. so much hard work… the people actually putting on this event deserve so much better. 

[brenthodge]

1 hour ago, BoddaH1994 said:

I’m with you on the cards. I’ve bought a card every year for every event that they’ve had like this. I guess this year I won’t be participating in the tasting, and from the looks of it, others feel the same way.

What’s scary is the park was PACKED. Presumably there were large groups. They’re big spenders, stereotypically speaking. The food at the tents being $8.95-ish should have given the veneer of a better value, but few seemed to have seen it that way.

Also, I saw some people lined up for the parade around 6:50, which was incompetently miscommunicated/not communicated to the media last week. I hope the people who were waiting got the info before giving up.

Of course, when I asked on their Facebook… well, they didn’t bother to reply, but when a former KI PR (not Don) responded saying that info would be nice, they said “check the app” in a very, “it’s not my job to deal with people like you” attitude. 
 

So much talent.. so much effort.. so much hard work… the people actually putting on this event deserve so much better. 

You shouldn’t need to “check the Ap” when I believe she was posting in response to them bragging they published a GUIDE that you had to click 2-3 things to get to, only to realize it 1) had a blank space for a map and 2) told you nothing in a guiding way like times or prices. The incompetence is becoming staggering. You have to wonder does Senior leadership like Koontz not see it, is he powerless to do anything to change it, or does he just choose to not? 

[BoddaH1994]

31 minutes ago, brenthodge said:

You shouldn’t need to “check the Ap” when I believe she was posting in response to them bragging they published a GUIDE that you had to click 2-3 things to get to, only to realize it 1) had a blank space for a map and 2) told you nothing in a guiding way like times or prices. The incompetence is becoming staggering. You have to wonder does Senior leadership like Koontz not see it, is he powerless to do anything to change it, or does he just choose to not? 

It's fine. Someone else who does not get paid by the park to communicate with the public did the park's work for them and posted the times in that post. Glad they didn't bother to respond to me, and replied to the next poster, but didn't bother to directly answer their question. I know they're very busy updating their web site, updating the app with show times, getting the media out to the park, etc. Oh wait. 

[IndyGuy4KI]

Watch the opening day of Grand Carnivale!

 

 

[brenthodge]

1 hour ago, BoddaH1994 said:

. I know they're very busy updating their web site, updating the app with show times, getting the media out to the park, etc. Oh wait. 

I was like… Whasaaaat? What international tasting did HE eat last night that made him go cra??

[brenthodge]

OK - Made it over last night and... Its a mixed bag for sure. Better than last year, way worse than first, reflects the new reality that I think we are living in.

1) The idea that this is a "cultural festival" left the building after year one when the mini-stages with authentic entertainment and country-related crafts never returned. It's definitely a "cultural appropriation and stereotype fest". Honestly the longer this runs, the more culturally insensitive I think it feels. Maybe its time to either return some authenticity to it, or just make it "Summer Party-Gras"

2) There's really nothing to do after the "opening" and before the parade (see above items that got cut) outside of one craft tent and the scavenger hunt. Really wish there was more entertainment options to make it feel more "alive". Even if this went to weekends only to make it stronger... I'd be all for it.

3) The lack of food tents affects the feeling of a true festival. Most all of the food has moved to "relevant" permanent food service locations and seems to be just sort of mixed in with the regular stuff. Why they didn't just go ahead and use Grill and Grain for Spain and not even bother with that tent, or move China there since half of the G&G grain menu has already gone Asian - maybe add India back in. I don't know... people seemed to be snapping up LaRosas WAY more that Lasagne Frita or Canolis. The lack of tasting cards makes sense now as I honestly think they are ok with reduced sales on these items, as moving them into the regular service line cuts down on payroll which probably makes up for the loss of revenue. Also the kitchen staff would be stretched if they were cranking out high volume of these things - heck a triffle at "Germany" took close to 10 minutes with only one person in front of me. They have cut so much of support staff, that I don't think the volume that tasting cards drives could be supported, and the "food festival feel" is gone without tents or temporary structures everywhere to taste at. I certainly didnt see a lot of tastings on people's plates. To me, I only do desert as thats what I can't get on meal plan since the cards went away. 

4) Parade looks great... until the end. FOT THE LOVE OF GOD can they not figure out a good way to end this thing that isn't a traffic nightmare. I threw out a suggestion in the parade thread of a way to end it around the tower so the cast could just organically go to the closing show, some of the floats could stay, and a few others "sneak back" right before the fireworks. This could add to the overall festival feel.

5) Speaking of closing show and fireworks, the ending is... ok. But I REALLY miss the first few iterations where the show just flowed right into the fireworks. I thought with the later parade time they were doing that this year, but it just ended, the stage went dark and quiet, the cast all left and a few minutes later the regular closing show started. We have GREAT infrastructure now - way more that we ever had in 2019. Craft a CARNIVALE exclusive closing that can be used every year, but only runs 2 weeks during the event. Maybe another original song. Drones make flags of different countries as lyrics are sung in that language - cultural landmarks in drones bring France, China and Italy to life. Bandstand cast close with live version of the chorus. The way it is now is just clunky and kills any momentum they had going. I used to want to never leave when it was the big dance party, now I had to convince my kid to stay another 15 minutes for fireworks.

It really feels like - as much as I hate to say it - this has run its course. Maybe I've just been there too much, but so have a lot of us. SO MAKE IT BETTER EACH YEAR!! There are so many things that could be done to build on the energy that 2019 started, but instead its been a slow drain. Some things - like permanent festival stages or food/beverage locations that could've been built and adapted for other festivals - required long-term planning that just doesn't seem to be there for this. Long-term solutions for getting a parade to make a full circuit in a timely manner so cast can get to next mark that needed infrastructure reworked were never acted on. Decor and seating seems to have been cut  back, but doesn't seem to be missed as most people seem to just wander through and reconvene for the parade. I really WANT to want to go back another time or two (or three) like I did in 2019 and 2021, but I just don't really care to make a trip just for this over the next week. 

[BeeastFarmer]

^ @brenthodge...you expect them to IMPROVE year over year?  They follow the opposite model where they devolve year over year.  The event is a whisp of what it was; from my perspective, corporate is just thinking about today instead of five years from now. So much hard work by the implementation team and performers with what they were given to work with.

But as long as people buy cheap season tickets and meal plans, this is what we get.  Corporate thinks they are killing it.  Until people vote with their finances, they will continue to chop the meat awat and leave just a little tiny bit of fat for flavoring the gristle they are going for.

[brenthodge]

3 hours ago, BeeastFarmer said:

^ @brenthodge...you expect them to IMPROVE year over year?  They follow the opposite model where they devolve year over year.  The event is a whisp of what it was; from my perspective, corporate is just thinking about today instead of five years from now. So much hard work by the implementation team and performers with what they were given to work with.

But as long as people buy cheap season tickets and meal plans, this is what we get.  Corporate thinks they are killing it.  Until people vote with their finances, they will continue to chop the meat awat and leave just a little tiny bit of fat for flavoring the gristle they are going for.

That’s why sites like KISeasonPassholders that copy paste anything the park tells them to, or gush about how “amazingly, fabulous, wonderfully, specially, amazingly wonderful” everything is don’t help. There’s little room for actual dialogue about how things might not be as rosy as they paint. I’m all for having a good time regardless, but I refuse to go on and on about how AWESOME this event is when it simply isn’t anymore. It’s fun… it’s ok… it doesn’t cost me anything extra and that’s about what I’d spend on it now. Flashback to 2019 when I didn’t even have a pass and bought 3 after 5 tickets and 2 tasting cards and went 2x. Once alone and once as a date night with my wife. Felt like I could’ve gone a third time to catch all the local entertainment, tried 2-3 more things that sounded tasty and seem the parade one last time. THATS what you aim for with events like this, not “let’s provide the bare minimum to the people who already paid to come and eat to hopefully milk them for at least another few dollars.” I’d be embarrassed to bring anyone to this “cultural food festival” as it stands now. 

[IndyGuy4KI]

What has to be very hard for Kings Island management is they are told what they are doing by corporate. Then the park looks like they themselves are incompetent or incapable when they don't have much say in the matter. That has to be most frustrating for them. I really do feel bad for them in that regard. 

[brenthodge]

2 minutes ago, IndyGuy4KI said:

What has to be very hard for Kings Island management is they are told what they are doing by corporate. Then the park looks like they themselves are incompetent or incapable when they don't have much say in the matter. That has to be most frustrating for them. I really do feel bad for them in that regard. 

I agree to some extent, but there still seems to be some leeway just based on variances you see from park to park doing the same event. I neither blame the solely or excuse them completely. 

[BeeastFarmer]

Cedar Fair's once-lauded portfolio has suffered a catastrophic decline, with Kings Island bearing the brunt of this mismanagement. The park's inexorable degradation since 2023 is a testament to corporate negligence and a profound disregard for its legacy. It is disheartening to observe the creeping apathy among patrons who seem to have resigned themselves to this decline.
 

[brenthodge]

1 hour ago, BeeastFarmer said:

Cedar Fair's once-lauded portfolio has suffered a catastrophic decline, with Kings Island bearing the brunt of this mismanagement. The park's inexorable degradation since 2023 is a testament to corporate negligence and a profound disregard for its legacy. It is disheartening to observe the creeping apathy among patrons who seem to have resigned themselves to this decline.
 

I don’t know if we’ve taken the brunt of it. If so, it’s only because we got the lions share of good. Dominion’s CARNIVALE is dark on Wednesday nights (and was on Tuesdays last year) Carrowinds 50th was hollow compared to ours just one year prior (rehashed logo, reused parade parts without the actual fun of a parade, fireworks that reused a theme song from a ride that was never there, minimal live entertainment (and still next to none) . I think we got a great lucky run of: Initial concept event CARNIVALE that was essentially designed for the “International street parks”, followed up with a CARNIVALE (and season in general) that rode the “post Covid” wave of pent-up visits and spending. That funded an amazing 50th that got all of the budget that had been allocated for it, then the poop hit the fan. I’m impressed we’ve been able to hold onto what we have, but so many of these things I’m talking about could’ve been solved more more long-vision planning. I guess when the money is flowing, you assume it always will, then when the cuts come, it’s harder to “fake it” 

[BeeastFarmer]

@brenthodge You're absolutely right, Brent. It’s disheartening to witness the park's downturn after the phenomenal 2022 season. That year was truly exceptional, a high point I haven't seen matched since my first visits in the 70s. I'm hopeful for a turnaround in the future.

Perhaps when you next connect with Mike Kootnz, you could suggest that Mr. Zimmerman would benefit from gaining insights directly from a guest's point of view. Their firsthand experiences could offer valuable perspectives on what's working and what's not, helping to inform decisions that could revitalize the park.

 

[brenthodge]

2021-22 was truly a new “Golden Age” for the park. It felt “right” for the first time in a long time. I have to believe it also showed in revenue numbers. The problem with corporate structures though is, the highs have to carry the lows. That was a pretty dismal year for other parks in the portfolio, and unfortunately anything we “banked” was spread thinned to cover for others losses. 

[BoddaH1994]

Grand Carnivale vs Bland Carnivale: how does 2024 stack up?

[BeeastFarmer]

@brenthodge Brent, your assessment is accurate, but I would argue that the period from 2017 to 2020 warrants inclusion in this discussion of peak performance. The introduction of Mystic Timbers in 2017 marked a significant departure for Cedar Fair at Kings Island, demonstrating a commitment to immersive theming and a high level of execution. While Firehawk, Diamondback, and Banshee were undoubtedly thrilling additions, their thematic elements were relatively superficial. However, the return of WinterFest in 2017 showcased the park's potential to create truly magical experiences through comprehensive theming and atmosphere.

The following years saw continued progress, albeit at a slower pace. 2019, in particular, was a standout year with the revitalization of International Street, the reintroduction of the Glockenspiel and restoration of the beerstein and the successful execution of Grand Carnivale. The COVID-19 pandemic disrupted operations in 2020, but the park's response and subsequent performance in 2021 and 2022 were commendable.

It is, therefore, disheartening to witness the current trajectory. A return to the levels of innovation and guest experience demonstrated in these previous years would be a welcome development.

[brenthodge]

1 hour ago, BeeastFarmer said:

@brenthodge Brent, your assessment is accurate, but I would argue that the period from 2017 to 2020 warrants inclusion in this discussion of peak performance. The introduction of Mystic Timbers in 2017 marked a significant departure for Cedar Fair at Kings Island, demonstrating a commitment to immersive theming and a high level of execution. While Firehawk, Diamondback, and Banshee were undoubtedly thrilling additions, their thematic elements were relatively superficial. However, the return of WinterFest in 2017 showcased the park's potential to create truly magical experiences through comprehensive theming and atmosphere.

The following years saw continued progress, albeit at a slower pace. 2019, in particular, was a standout year with the revitalization of International Street, the reintroduction of the Glockenspiel and restoration of the beerstein and the successful execution of Grand Carnivale. The COVID-19 pandemic disrupted operations in 2020, but the park's response and subsequent performance in 2021 and 2022 were commendable.

It is, therefore, disheartening to witness the current trajectory. A return to the levels of innovation and guest experience demonstrated in these previous years would be a welcome development.

Oh, I agree that those were build up years to the peak of 2022. I get it was the 50th, and I don’t think anyone expected 15 minutes of fireworks every night the next year, but there were operational and strategic decisions being made that seemed to be setting the park up for long-term success and greatly enhanced guest experience. Those decisions, sadly have either been reversed, or so undermined by new objectives and strategies that it feels like nothing was learned from that time. I’m honestly surprised the darn dog show hasnt returned yet. 

[BeeastFarmer]

@brenthodge, Brent, the promotional show, 'Fun, Fireworks and Fifty,' represented a strategic and deliberate effort to position the park's fiftieth anniversary as a mere prelude to an even more grandiose future. The nostalgic undertones and emotionally charged rhetoric employed in the campaign were designed to cultivate a sense of anticipation and excitement, implicitly promising that the park's best days were yet to come.

And then 2023 happened. Hilda Bovine sang, the streak was over after this. That's the scariest thing. 

[brenthodge]

9 minutes ago, BeeastFarmer said:

@brenthodge, Brent, the promotional show, 'Fun, Fireworks and Fifty,' represented a strategic and deliberate effort to position the park's fiftieth anniversary as a mere prelude to an even more grandiose future. The nostalgic undertones and emotionally charged rhetoric employed in the campaign were designed to cultivate a sense of anticipation and excitement, implicitly promising that the park's best days were yet to come.

And then 2023 happened. Hilda Bovine sang, the streak was over after this. That's the scariest thing. 

Oh I know. I had a great conversation with senior leadership toward the end of 2022. Truly thanking them for an amazing season. They agreed that if you got a little lump in your throat when the line “here in our own backyard” echoed through the park, it wasn’t happenstance, but very intentional to highlight the multi-generational, memory and tradition building aspect of the park. It sounded believable, because it was authentic, and , I believe, rooted in a strategy and sincere plan to do that. Fast forward to 24 and they try to force some of that into Under the Stars, but it just comes off as marketing buzz words, because I don’t think they really believe that, and certainly aren’t supported corporately any more, to do that. 

[BeeastFarmer]

@brenthodge, Brent I completely understand and appreciate your sentiment. It was evident that their gratitude was genuine, and their commitment to creating memorable, multi-generational experiences was deeply rooted in their strategy. It was a deliberate effort to foster a sense of tradition and shared memories. This authenticity made the experience believable and impactful.

However, as you said, we fast forward to 2024, it is clear that attempts to replicate this sentiment in "Under the Stars" fall flat. While "Fun, Fireworks and Fifty" did pull at the heart strings...I still get a lump in my throat and a tight chest when I watch it on YouTube, the short version of the current show is logistically better to keep the drones active.  But it doesn't elicit the same emotions.  Granted, I've only seen it online and not in person, but this is my feeling.

In short, I have not visited much this semester except for the spring conference and a very short visit in June...and I live two hours away. The FUN has been gone. 

[Outdoor Man]

Just did a quick glance through the video posted by IndyGuy. Is it just me or are there fewer parade dancers this year as well? Maybe I'm not as observant as I think I am but the individual "groups" seem smaller.

[brenthodge]

24 minutes ago, Outdoor Man said:

Just did a quick glance through the video posted by IndyGuy. Is it just me or are there fewer parade dancers this year as well? Maybe I'm not as observant as I think I am but the individual "groups" seem smaller.

Pretty much the same at previous years. The show stops have been simplified (as they don’t select kids to drum on the India float, and drummers in general have been cut. Plus we haven’t gotten the airship float with the “explorers with flags” for a couple of years. 

[BeeastFarmer]

On 7/26/2024 at 7:31 PM, brenthodge said:

Pretty much the same at previous years. The show stops have been simplified (as they don’t select kids to drum on the India float, and drummers in general have been cut. Plus we haven’t gotten the airship float with the “explorers with flags” for a couple of years. 

Do we have a different Spain float this year, or are there two with the Spanish woman moving her head from side to side. I saw this one in a kd video. I thought that was the best float last year. 

[IndyGuy4KI]

On 7/26/2024 at 7:01 PM, Outdoor Man said:

Just did a quick glance through the video posted by IndyGuy. Is it just me or are there fewer parade dancers this year as well? Maybe I'm not as observant as I think I am but the individual "groups" seem smaller.

We do have 2 less floats than we did the first year. So that means there are fewer dancers.

[brenthodge]

On 7/28/2024 at 9:12 AM, BeeastFarmer said:

Do we have a different Spain float this year, or are there two with the Spanish woman moving her head from side to side. I saw this one in a kd video. I thought that was the best float last year. 

Yea, we had that one last year. We had a different dragon as well. It looks like we have the set that was at Carrowinds this year, and KD has the set we had last year. Not sure what happened to the self driven ones we had  the first year that were fabricated here in BlueAsh- the opening, the air ship and the elephant. I wonder if the chassis were used here in 22 for the gift floats (since those were self driven) and the parts were just reassembled onto towed bases instead. Those 3 units are definitely a different design style. 

 

21 hours ago, IndyGuy4KI said:

We do have 2 less floats than we did the first year. So that means there are fewer dancers.

What’s the second one? I know we had airship year 1 and 3. That’s the one that there seems to not be duplicates of. There’s King’s throne(former trampoline) , France, Germany, China, India, Spain, Airship/Italy, and 2 MardiGras wagons with guests. Is there just 1 of those this year? I don’t remember from the other night. 

[BeeastFarmer]

1 hour ago, brenthodge said:

Yea, we had that one last year. We had a different dragon as well. It looks like we have the set that was at Carrowinds this year, and KD has the set we had last year. Not sure what happened to the self driven ones we had  the first year that were fabricated here in BlueAsh- the opening, the air ship and the elephant. I wonder if the chassis were used here in 22 for the gift floats (since those were self driven) and the parts were just reassembled onto towed bases instead. Those 3 units are definitely a different design style. 

The logistical decisions surrounding the transfer of floats between Kings Island, Carowinds, and Kings Dominion raise several questions regarding cost-effectiveness and resource allocation. Specifically, if Kings Island received floats from Carowinds and subsequently Kings Dominion acquired floats from Kings Island, the rationale behind such asset transfers warrants scrutiny. Given the geographic proximity, a direct transfer from Carowinds to Kings Island—spanning an extra distance of approximately 140 miles—versus Carowinds to Kings Dominion, would ostensibly be more economical.

Transporting these sizable floats likely necessitates multiple trucks, each incurring significant fuel and/or subcontracting costs. Hypothetically, if five trucks are required, with an incremental cost escalation of $2,500 per truck to transport to Island vs Dominion, the total expenditure for the move would amount to $10,000. This figure excludes the additional costs associated with relocating floats to parks not hosting the event, which appears financially imprudent.

From an outsider’s perspective, this $10,000 could be reallocated more effectively, such as funding tasting cards, which have the potential to generate higher per caps revenue compared to individual sales. Alternatively, these funds could cover the cost of approximately 50 medium-sized box trees, assuming a unit price of $200 each, or address smaller but essential operational expenses like lids and straws for Icees, that some guests at Kings Island mourn the lack of. Such expenditures highlight a potential misalignment in cost-cutting strategies versus unnecessary spending. Corporate boggles the mind.