Gordon Bombay Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 The parks are for sale as a chain, the chain is for sale, not each park seperately and yes KBF is somewhat withing "competitive" range of PGA, but Bonfante Gardens is even closer, Paramoun probably manages that park to keep competition like Cedar Fair from coming in, aquiring it, deleveloping it and competing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragerunner Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 If the parks are for sale as a group then probably an investment firm is the only potential buyer. As someone else mentioned, Blackstone does have the buying power. Might be interesting since they own 50% of Universal parks and Legoland parks. They could still turn one or two of the biggest parks into a Universal label or/and add lego themed lands at each park. This would help them expand the lego end of the business without needing to build new parks. Not to start and arguement but I dont see how KBF and Great America are in the same markets. They are almost 400 miles apart. That would be like saying PKI and Six Flags Great America in Chicago are fighting for the same market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Picard Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 They don't own 50% of Universal parks they own 50% of the Universal Orlando Parks. GE is the owner of Universal. If you want PKI to be Universal it will have to be bought by GE. GE would have to buy the other 50% of the Orlando parks before I think they would take on more parks. GE on CNBC said they didn't want out of the parks but was worried about the 50% that Blackstone has at Orlando. I seen that Star Trek The Experience attraction is going with the parks so the rights must go with them. Star Trek The Experience wouldn't be much good with out the rights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKlockster Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 You all are still assuming that it is going to be bought by a group already in the theme park industry... Like Universal, Disney, Six Flags, Cedar Fair etc. I think the only one of those who could buy the parks is Universal - and they probably wont. It will more than likely be a group we haven't really heard of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ragerunner Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 You are probably right. It will be an investment company. Question from one of my previous post: Who owns the Alton Towers, et... park system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 With that kind of news breaking and the virtual sale of the parks eminent, I suppose that will put a limit on what is being invested with NU. I can't see Paramount or Viacom investing a lot into the parks when the sales are basically in the works. If the sale is to take place by middle of the year, the only numbers that really count are last years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Picard Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 You are probably right. It will be an investment company. Question from one of my previous post: Who owns the Alton Towers, et... park system? Tussauds Theme Parks or Tussauds Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby_Doo Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Most likely an Investment group of some kind. It could actually be really good for the park. They could run the park and license Paramount brands. To us, this will probably mean very little - except bigger and better rides in the future than Paramount is capable of giving us. The company will stay pretty much the same - it will just be owned by a different parent company. Look at Universal - it is owned by an investment firm - not Universal Studios. I think this can only be good news for us. Knowing you guys though you are probably going to panic... So - I would say don't worry about it - you won't see that big of a change. But go ahead and panic - not much else to do in the offseason. I think Klockster said it best...I just hope Bigger and Better rides come outta this deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thrill_Biscuit Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Hopefully someone whose primary focus for revenue-generating is in family entertainment! This may sound ridiculous, but I hope it's picked up by people who happen to be PKI fans. I'd like to see Kings Island become the benchmark, flagship park by which all other parks are compared (including the Disney parks). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKlockster Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Keep in mind that as part of CBS - we aren't getting anywhere near what we make in profits. Meaning that the money we make in profit goes back to CBS - then CBS lets us have a little bit of it. With a private group - CBS would get the money for the licensed theming - but then the profit made by the Paramount Parks, for the most part, would go back into getting better rides and maintaining the ones we have - at the same time earning a sizable profit for the investment group. Then also, CBS doesnt have to worry about running the parks. So everybody wins! Especially the theme park goers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jzarley Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Let's not fool ourselves into thinking that if an equity investment company buys the parks, they're going to look at it as some "pure" calling and run the parks with the same love we've all always wanted to... By definition, an investment company buys an asset, improves its value, then sells it later (either whole or in pieces) for a profit... There's no "love" involved. If it's announced that the parks will be purchased by Blackstone (or KKR, Madison-Dearborn, Texas Pacific, Morgan Stanley, or a slew of others), that's exactly what their exit strategy will be...maybe not today or tomorrow, but at some point. That's just the fudiciary responsibility of their management... As far as operating the parks with "love" is concerned, the best thing to have happen in that regard would be a group of former KECO people getting the financing together to buy the parks...second to that would be CF. (Although, as I've said...they'd have to risk leveraging everything they have to do it...which wouldn't be very "fudiciarily" responsible to their unit holders in my opinion...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outdoor Man Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 just to clear something up.... when I made the post regarding Knotts Berry farm... I really have no idea where PGA is. And as I recall (and I may be wrong, but isn't Knotts near LA? they could very well be 400 miles apart... i don't know... but I thought they were more like 40 miles apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firefall Pkd Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 ^ KBF is 10 miles from Disneyland, and both very close to LA. PGA is just north of San Fransisco, making the parks a good 6-7 hour drive apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoddaH1994 Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Let's not fool ourselves into thinking that if an equity investment company buys the parks, they're going to look at it as some "pure" calling and run the parks with the same love we've all always wanted to... By definition, an investment company buys an asset, improves its value, then sells it later (either whole or in pieces) for a profit... There's no "love" involved. If it's announced that the parks will be purchased by Blackstone (or KKR, Madison-Dearborn, Texas Pacific, Morgan Stanley, or a slew of others), that's exactly what their exit strategy will be...maybe not today or tomorrow, but at some point. That's just the fudiciary responsibility of their management... You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it seems as though they'll improve the profitability through budget cuts rather than by improving the poduct itself. It's a quicker and cheaper way of doing things... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollerNut Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Paramount Parks does not own the land PGA sits on, they just manage it. Paramounts owns all the rides that KECO and they installed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 You are absolutely correct. Unfortunately, it seems as though they'll improve the profitability through budget cuts rather than by improving the poduct itself. It's a quicker and cheaper way of doing things... Actually that is likely a cost prohibitive proposition. It's more likely that a company that would want to purchase a group of amusment parks is looking to branch out or become involved in this type of business. By no means is any park or group of parks an "easy sale." Someone looking to "flip" a business would not buy into a group of parks for the mere fact that it would be too difficult to realize a return on their investments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortex Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 (edited) Cedar Fair, Cedar Fair! Sadly, that happens we will lose the Nicktoons(oh well), and possibly Scooby-Doo . Well the person the buys Paramount Park's can still use Nicktoons and Scooby with the rights. I thought I read some where they Blackstone whated some new Lego lands. Edited January 27, 2006 by Vortex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jzarley Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 ^ ^ Of course, the same argument could be made about a chain of 100+ full-service hotels...not real easy to sell. Yet Blackstone bought Wyndham Hotels for over $3B, then "flipped" them to Cendant less than six months later... Boston Ventures bought a huge stake in Six Flags in 1995, then flipped their investment three years later in 1998 by selling SF to Premier Parks... Granted, both are unusual situations... And I don't completely disagree with your point--usually an investment of that size takes years to mature so that the purchasing company makes a return on the investment. And, of course, selling a chain of parks isn't going to be like flipping a house... But, having worked around, for, and with investment companies for years, trust me that they always have an exit strategy. It's just the nature of The Beast... Of course, we still don't even know who has got their check books out at this point Maybe someone (thing?) who really does care about the theme park business will buy them... But recent similar sales (i.e., Legoland Parks) make me wonder... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 In response to Rollernut`s post about Paramount Parks not owning the land that Great America sits on. That is correct, but they have a long term lease agreement for the land with the city of Santa Clara. They signed a 50 year lease on the land back in 1989, so the park should be safe until at least 2039. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Titanic_Mess Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 I say sell the park as scrap metal !!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Gee, that was a valuable statement! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollerNut Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 In response to Rollernut`s post about Paramount Parks not owning the land that Great America sits on. That is correct, but they have a long term lease agreement for the land with the city of Santa Clara. They signed a 50 year lease on the land back in 1989, so the park should be safe until at least 2039. Yes, but that lease is with Paramount Parks, a parent company could cause it to be terminated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Yes, but that lease is with Paramount Parks, a parent company could cause it to be terminated. Depends on how the lease is written. Remember, it's possible that the parks are being sold individually - in groups or as a whole. I could forsee Canada's Wonderland being sold to a Canadian Conglomeration and the remaining US Parks being sold to a US Entity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vortexdemon05 Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 this is the Video on WKRC Click Here I just wonder what will happen. i hope it is for the good of the parks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WooferBearATL Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 What great video of Vortex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tubaman Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 That is a good video, thanks Vortexdemon05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vortex Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Does anyone think that the new owners would sell off the land that Kings Island is on or anyother Paramount Park? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKlockster Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 I think that PKIC will be buying the parks! Check it out! PKIC is an investment group! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jzarley Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 I think that PKIC will be buying the parks! Check it out! PKIC is an investment group! Good one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastersRZ Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 I don`t think that whatever company which buys PP will sell off any land. For that matter, I doubt that there will be any drastic changes that occur to the parks this season. Whomever the new owner is of the parks, they will most likely implent changes, if any, next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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