super7

A show with dedicated, choreographed dancers like Yuletide Follies or even the previous Cool Yule (after the split the cast into dancers and vocalists) belongs in doors for the sake of the dancers well being. The KI Theatre should host something that’s more of a total Christmas production like an expanded version of the Follies.

They have been removing eye sores from the park, such as the slingshot in the sky coaster. But the Tomb Raider building and the Stunt Coaster are the two remaining biggest eye sores. Doing anything with that tomb raider building would be an improvement for the entire park.

IMO the main thing holding back Winterfest is the low quality of the production of the live entertainment and the lack of sit-down entertainment locations. And perhaps its shorter five and six hour days compared to other events. The entire park is lit up with lights (although they could do a better job with the lights in the trees like Carowinds in previous years, there are enough rides open, and Winterfest has some creative activities that the other events lack.

I don’t think Kings Island Winterfest will ever win the best Christmas event simply because it only operates 20 something days compared to how many days the other events like Dollywood and Busch Gardens operate. More days means more people means more votes.

I agree it would be very difficult to take away the meal plans in anyway. But the meal plans should’ve never been part of Winterfest. That was a huge business error. In fact, implementing the meal plans at all was a huge business error. The whole point of the season passes is to get people to come back and spend money. This defeats that. I know there will be the people that say they spend money on something else since they don’t have to pay for the meals, but they’re still getting nonprofitable meals, and I would guess the majority of the people on the meal plan. Don’t feel obligated to spend anything when they come back. The holiday events that seem to be the most successful, Dollywood and Busch Gardens. Do not include any form of a meal plan. They also include higher quality, entertainment, and experiences such as the train that everyone can do together. I also don’t feel these events, push up charge attractions such as ice-skating and cooking decorating etc. these events are profitable through admissions and selling food. Both of which Six Flags/Cedar Fair has given away at the gate. One other note about these events is that they are an excellent opportunity for these companies to bring in new customers that have absolutely no interest in amusement rides. Because the park is now this magical Christmas village. The rides are secondary. Carowinds has chosen to totally abandon this aspect of the event and just provide more ride operating days by closing at 7 PM. Which is just going to attract the same people that come for the rides in the summertime and most likely have season passes a meal plans and won’t spend any money

I think having attractions like the train that the entire family can ride together are key to this event. Kings Dominion Winterfest failed competing against Busch Gardens, which has multiple family attractions to enjoy the lights. Carowinds Winterfest has also been drastically changed and it lacks a great family attraction as well. It appears that these events just regurgitate season passholders, and then Six Flags small cost cutting minds they don’t make any money because the season pass holders aren’t paying to get in the gate and the season meal plan holders aren’t buying any food. The season meal plans are a terrible business decision that has affected these events negatively. But cutting out these events, just reduces the value of the season pass. I know myself if they discontinue Winterfest in Kings Island I will no longer buy a season pass regardless of the price. it also speaks of the gross mismanagement of Cedar Fair that they could pull crowds at these events like they did not make them profitable. From the beginning, Winterfest should’ve been some kind of ad on the season pass and the season meal plan should’ve never been included with the event. also, they are so terrible at running theme parks. They cannot figure out how to run these events more than just the weekends except for the school break weeks. So the limited number of operating days makes it hard to justify the labor involved in the lights, etc. Dollywood runs their event daily, and even Busch Gardens runs their event daily in December. Their assets aren’t sitting dormant like six flags assets are during this event

The train would be better with lights in the trees/or uplit trees instead of the framework lights.

Can that ride even run in less than 50°? Every time I’ve been to the park when it’s below 50 in normal operating season it has been closed.

The trees are gone in area 1 now. Even though it was just a few trees, any more tree removal around that ride is concerning since thats a lot of its magic. Grizzly at KD was once totally surrounded by trees. Look at it now…..

They are reporting despite a 3% increase in attendance they have a 2% decrease in revenue. Also keep in mind that more people in the parks is going to increase expenses to maintain the parks. The loss and profits will be even greater than 2%. Their business plan is not “resilient.” It is a failure. Anytime more customers result in less revenue and less profits that’s a failure. The other thing to keep in mind is that if people weren’t buying, they already underpriced season passes and decided to buy them because of this lower price, they probably aren’t going to be the kind of customer that’s going to pay the high prices in the park and contribute to end Park spending We should enjoy what we can of what’s left of 2025 because I have a feeling that they are going to be massive cuts in 2026 if they’re revenue is decreasing They may have a short term bump in revenue because of their up charge of the haunted houses, but that is not going to reverse course.

, I agree. But they have dug their ditch with these meal plans. The customers expect them now. They can’t eliminate them or they lose customers, but if they keep them, they lose money.

Yes. They were a great souvenir. this was the kind of souvenir that would actually make you want to return to the park when looking at it. But they were another victim of cost cutting. What Kings Island did the last year they have them would’ve been the best way to handle it. They had a limited number of these maps over on the side by the customer service instead of in the main entryway. That way, the people that really wanted them would get them and there was less waste. these parks are missing a revenue opportunity and not having the souvenir poster size maps like they did back in the 70s and 80s. Especially now with computer computers, they would be easy to modify from year to year. oh yeah, Dollywood still has them. Because their goalis to provide the best experience possible to everyone. Apparently enough customers still want them.

Every other Cedar Fair park that I have been to has brisket at their barbecue. Which just further cements that Kings Island has the worst food of any Cedar Fair Park.

I don’t think a Disney executive could even save this sinking ship. The problem is cheap season passes, and meal plans, and then having to cost cut to make up for the low revenue leading to a lower customer experience and decreasing attendance. Plus, they also try to make up for the loss in revenue of the cheap season passes by overcharging for everything else, and that leads to lower spending. they also have the problem that they only install attractions for trail, riders and little children, so they can’t operate most of their assets when school is in session. These parks said vacant almost half the year. in order to right the ship, they would have to lose a significant amount of money for quite some time and invest in a very high quality customer experience. That includes investing in more midtier attractions that everyone can do like dark rides, transportation rides, and live entertainment. That would lead to an increase in attendance and the ability to raise season pass prices to a realistic prive. and eliminate the meal plans. It would also bring in a guest that would spend more at the park. They also need to reduce the in park prices for food merchandise, etc.To reasonable prices so people will actually spend if they are attracting more people and a higher quality customer than the spending will happen if the prices are reasonable but they can’t do it because they don’t have the cash to do it and they are too far in debt so it’s a downward spiral. instead, they keep following the formula of cheap season passes, meal plans, high prices on everything else and only having attractions for low spending thrill, seeker and little children. It’s definitely not a recipe for success.

I think it was Huckleberry Dairy after they removed Smurfs

Lord its still going to be a shooting ride. That means half the capacity of the original Phantom theater and probably lots of cheap screens. as much as I loved the original Phantom theater and thought blue blasters was absolute garbage. It’s hard to get excited about anything this cost cutting company does these days

we don’t know how many of these all season access passes that they actually sold. It seems like they are now saying that they were “sold out” to make a sense of urgency for people to buy the passes that they are now offering for $75….. we know the kind of behavior that this company engages in when selling passes

It was usually crowded. Only Cedar Fair mismanagement could pull crowds like that and not make money.

There are several reasons at this business is bleeding right now. All of them have been caused by mismanagement. But one of them is because they are actively chasing off customers by cost cutting that has negatively affected the customer experience. So their solution is to keep on cutting, reducing the and keep on losing attendance…… Unfortunately, like I said before there’s no way out for this company other than bankruptcy at this point. Maybe a few of the better parks will get sold off to ownership that can properly manage them and not become housing or warehouses

Oh, I’m not saying they should do it now. That would be an absolute disaster. Once you give customer something you can’t take it away easily. I was saying they should have done that in the beginning. I remember at Busch Gardens before they started year-round. Memberships Christmas town was an additional $35 for unlimited admission on a season pass. And Busch was able to eliminate their meal plans after experimenting for one or two years. It’s the same thing with these ridiculous meal plans. And I mean ridiculous in a business sense. They are great for the customer. Six Flags tried to take them away when Bassoul took over and it resulted in a huge drop in attendance that is still continuing at this point they are so engrained in the customers that it will be impossible for Six Flags to take them away successfully I don’t believe there’s any hope for this company other than bankruptcy. They have dug their ditches too deep with the way they have sold season passes. If they raise prices, they lose customers if they continue the same path, they lose customers because the experience will continue to deteriorate

I believe that the problem with these Christmas events at Six Flags and Cedar Fair is the same problem that is causing cost cuts all year long across the company that has actively chased off customers year-round They sell these cheap season passes, especially the cheap meal plans and people are able to attend the park all year and average their cost per visit down to $25 or so. Including meals. When they added the season meal plans, it just gave people the ability not to spend money on each visit. When Winterfest was added, the season pass price did not increase significantly. Now with these cheap season passes, the price actually went down. So there is no motivation for them in the short run to extend the operating season to include these events because they are just regurgitating season passholders and giving them more meals, etc. Plus, there’s the incompetence of this company that only allows operations when is school is out. That’s because their attractions are mainly for children. Other more successful holiday events, such as Dollywood and Busch Gardens have significantly more operating days on the Christmas schedule. It’s expensive to put all these lights up for just 20 some days of operation. also, the shorter hours of this event allow one time customers not to spend money in the park. It’s easy to eat elsewhere and not pay 20 some dollars for a mediocre quality meal. Parks like Dollywood and Busch Gardens tend to have longer operating days for this event, which encourages more in spending. Back in the beginning, Winterfest unlimited admission, should have been an add-on to the season pass in my opinion. The meal plan should’ve never been implemented to begin with because season passes are designed to encourage spending on every visiit. But the meal plan definitely shoukd have ended at Labor Day. I know if Winterfest goes away at Kings Island I am absolutely done buying season passes from this company. It’s the only thing that’s kept me renewing my season pass through all of this other awful cost cutting and reduced customer experience. this makes me sad because the Winterfest events were my favorite events of all the theme parks in this region because of the Christmas lights. It had the most immersive lights in the mature trees, on the shrubs, on the centerpiece, tower, etc. Carowinds was my first personal favorite because they had about twice as many lights in each tree as Kings Island and even more trees with lights in them. It appears that’s going away this year. Cutting out this event may save them a few bucks in the short run, but like all their other cost cutting it’s going to chase off customers in the long run IMO.

They also cut two weekends in November from the event. It now only operates 21 days. Last year there were around 29-30 operating days.

Carowinds just announced their Winterfest operating hours are going to be 11 AM until 7 PM. I have the feeling this is the end of the event there They probably will not put up many lights for that early of a closing. Additionally, a few years ago they tried operating from 3 PM until 11 PM and they went back to 5 to 10 the next year. So it did not work. Also, when Carowinds tried operating in the winter during the daytime, it did not work. They only did it one year. The majority of the crowd for these events comes after dark. That includes Kings Island. I’m often surprised how crowded Winterfest is at Kings Island on cold nights the people of the area know how to bundle up and as long as it is dry, it seems like there is a good crowd it less it rains. The same issue of this event just regurgitating season passholders remains regardless of the operating hours Let’s hope Kings Island does not go down this route. I know they have fired a lot of their staff with knowledge of the parks and now decisions like this are being made.

This was the period of time were Cedar Fair was just slapping new trail rides in the parks without much theming. The “Golden” period of Cedar Fair ownership was after that around 2106-2017 and ended in 2020

KI avoided the mass ride removal that some of the other parks experience last year, so it won’t be surprising if they remove some rides from the park