McSalsa

Also- a big part of the reason Kentucky Kingdom did get past 1,000,000 visitors the first time...they added this that year (1997)... A massive, world record-breaking B&M Roller Coaster...attendance went from 722,000 in 1996 to 1.1 million in 1997, a increase of nearly 400k visitors. Wait a second, what kind of ride was Holiday World opening this year again...oh. Uh-Oh (for KK). If Holiday World gets the same ROI Kentucky Kingdom got for Chang (which would push Holiday World from 1.1 million to 1.5+ million visitors), it very well could really hurt Kentucky Kingdom as guests would go to Holiday World instead for Thunderbird. This would be ON TOP of the questionable PR, too...plus Kentucky Kingdom is at a price disadvantage versus Holiday World as previously stated in this thread (Parking is $8 more, and soda isn't free at KK, while ticket prices are the same)...and they need to attract a certain % of out-of-state guests, who will be more likely lured by the big shiny new rollercoaster at Holiday World rather than the refurbished one at Kentucky Kingdom. Forget 1,000,000 in the near future- Kentucky Kingdom has to get its game up FAST to even hit the required 650,000 visitors in 2015, and do so with only a refurbished Vekoma SLC and some flat rides. At least in 2014 they had Lightning Run and multiple large waterslides- including a world record breaker- making their debut... I could see Kentucky Kingdom doing a "hail mary" at some point in 2015 to try and reach 650,000 visitors this year. I would not even rule out something crazy like $20 tickets or BOGO Admission (2 people get in for the price of 1!).

Ouch. While Invertigo is my least favorite current KI "Adult" coaster, I don't hate it (will ride it if the line is shorter than 30mins and it has the strongest G-Forces in the entire park's coaster lineup at 5G's) and it does kinda suck that it won't be running for those who do love it. Though I'm not too surprised, given the Invertigo model line's history, that it's the ride that's down for a major part of the season. I have seen it broken down for entire days before too- and I have only visited KI 8 times in the past 6 seasons. It hasn't been the most reliable of rides...

Ehh, SLIGHTLY rougher would be expected after sitting a whole offseason. So it may not have been you. It would need to have gotten quite a bit rougher than last year though before I'd see it as a huge problem- and I have yet to see KI let Beast get that bad (heck, my rough ride on Racer last year was at least 4X worse than my roughest ever ride on Beast...and nothing so far rivals what Voyage was like in 2011...at least wood. And granted I never rode SOB and have yet to go outside Kings Island & Holiday World so far in recent years...)

Wow- doesn't sound nearly as crowded as it was last year. Then again, last year was Big New Coaster year. Still sucks to hear food service is slow. Reminds me of when I went for Haunt last year and we waited 20 minutes...FOR SODA REFILLS. That was LONGER than I waited for Vortex and BLSC COMBINED that night! Beast was also a shorter wait than Drinks, but we waited for the front which added 10-15 minutes to the wait time. Hopefully it gets fixed as the season progresses, otherwise the park could have a big problem on its hands... BTW, a little off-topic, but did The Beast's re-track it got last year hold up well this offseason? It ran AMAZINGLY smooth last season every time I rode it (granted, that was just 3 times...).

Well, seeing track at the B&M Plant this early is a bit odd. I would guess this is probably for overseas, as right now the only rumored B&M's coming to the states in 2016 (for now) would be the Rumored Dive Machine @ Cedar Point and possibly Shot Rod @ Dollywood, and since track rarely shows up pre-announcement and said announcements are usually around August. From the picture though, I can make a guess that said coaster has a lift hill (in the background I think I spot a piece that would be the bottom of the lift) and also from that, this is NOT an invert. So it's no invert or launched coaster. The rumored CP Dive Coaster would still be a possibility but again- awful early for track to be popping up. Then again, the quicker it's built the better for its rumored 2016 opening... It is very, very red though. And if it is the CP Dive Coaster...CP will have red overkill. (This, Magnum XL200, TTD, Maverick...)

^ Looked like that guy had his hat off and was holding it. At 95mph, even a lightweight hat like that could become dangerous though. I didn't even see that at first... Unless it was something else I didn't notice.

CoasterForce has posted an awesome off-ride video of Fury 325 that really shows off its pure speed: This coaster just flies...this monster is close to the top of my "Coasters I have yet to ride but really want to try out" list...and that is a BIG list since I have only been to Kings Island, Holiday World, and Indiana Beach...

Holiday World actually got a blip on my local 24-hour news channel today, and it wasn't about Thunderbird. They actually mentioned how Voyage was #3 in a poll, and not the Amusement Today Golden Tickets for once (aka the one that is almsot always used by news media). They actually mentioned...the Coasterbuzz Top 100!?!? Wow. Must be a very slow news day. They did also mention the #1 and #2 rides though, which ATM (March 30th, 2015) are El Toro @ Six Flags Great Adventure and Leviathan @ Canada's Wonderland with some footage of each, so those parks also got a bit of "air" time via this spot. Oh, and via that same poll, Kings Island's Banshee was able to be ranked as it had enough votes as well (they used seasoned rider votes of users with at least 80+ coasters, and then the rides need at least 45 riders to rate them from that group) and it was #8. That's incredible for an inverted coaster. Sadly it seems a lot of the RMC Coasters (save New Texas Giant) do not have enough votes to be ranked yet...even Outlaw Run or Goliath. So...the poll has some holes in it. Full List: http://coasterbuzz.com/RollerCoasters/Top100 I just found it odd a local TV station would even bring up a fairly small poll this this one. And it's not even annual- CoasterBuzz has it running all the time and updates every week...

Well, just read through this thing and realized I haven't even posted my Banshee experience here yet in spite of riding it 3 times last year (for me, that's a lot on 1 coaster in 1 year). Not too late to fix that, right? First off, the ride experience itself: wow. Fast and Forceful, Banshee is one of the most intense coasters I have been on (based on my very small sample size at least which mainly just includes Kings Island and Holiday World for the most part). The g-forces are pretty strong, and the pacing is excellent- non stop for most of the ride, then it throws you off with the "slow roll" at the end. The restraints felt a little tight, but I've felt far worse (...cough cough...Invertigo...cough...) and they didn't tighten at all. At night, the lighting effects do enhance the ride, though not quite as much as being in the middle of the pitch black forest does for Beast. It's still an epic night ride though by all accounts. But I'm just repeating like a broken record 'cuz this has all been said before. I just agree with all of it. Banshee was worth the 4 1/2 hour wait I had for it on Opening Day 2014...that alone should say something. As for the theming? Again, I'm a broken record, but it's very well done. Yeah, there's not too much of it outside of some gravestones, lighting, and the look of the station and it's nowhere near Disney/Universal levels but for a seasonal park this is pretty darn good- especially at night. Though to be honest, I would argue Flight of Fear actually has Banshee beaten in this regard- then again, that ride went all-out with a big fake UFO and all that stuff... And for the off-ride visuals? Banshee is one beautiful coaster from nearly any angle, and even though it is 50+ feet SHORTER than Son of Beast, the fact it wasn't built in a ditch but right up next to the main midway makes the size difference not seem nearly as big and thus Banshee, like SOB before it, can be seen all over the park. My favorite views though would have to be from Hanks Burrito Shack's back porch (eating a tasty Chicken Burrito and watching Banshee at same time? WIN. ) or from the Coney Mall Midway headed towards Oktoberfest and Action Zone (which is nice because the view the other way with Vortex & WindSeeker is also great, hence Coney Mall has nice views from both directions now). It being so close to Delirium has also enchanted that ride, with added near-miss effects that were not there from 2003-2013. I have to agree 100% with Terpy- Banshee was the PERFECT pick for KI's 2014 coaster. It filled a much-needed gap (KI needed a true, full-circuit invert) and didn't conflict with any of the pre-existing rides in nature (in comparison, a B&M Giga might have gone just a bit against Diamondback, for example). It was placed perfectly, has a great layout, is forceful enough for enthusiasts but not so much the GP cannot enjoy it, is reliable, well themed, and has very high capacity. It is also on the opposite side of the park from the other two "huge" draws, Diamondback and Beast, so it spreads out the crowds as well. And, unlike its predecessor which was SBNO within 10 years of its debut, Banshee should still draw crowds 10 years from now. Whatever Kings Island does for their next big ride, around 2019 or so, it's gonna have a hard time matching what Banshee did in 2014- regardless of how tall it is, how fast, who builds it, etc etc. Banshee simply nailed it that perfectly.

Completely random but I MUST do it...(Thanks Terpy...) "Rubba-Dub-Dub, 3 men in a Flying Scooters Tub- the Butcher, the Baker, and the Candlestick maker. But there's a 2-rider-per-tub limit, so the ride op forces Candlestick maker out and he can't ride. D-oh!"

I'm pretty sure the park still has SOME of the cars from both sets, via Google Maps, and the fact they were using a car from the "lightweight" blue train as a "crashed coaster" prop last year (along with some cars from the also-defunct Jetson's Jet Orbiters ride). I'm also pretty sure the old trains had the same use at one point as well, if I recall.

I think that's the new Coca-Cola marketplace they said they were building...seems about that location.

Hey, I don't blame you. Going to Kings Island is very nice, but some things are more important. What you're doing on opening day? Yeah, that's a lot more important that KI opening day. And hey- you will be riding coasters on your honeymoon in California. That sounds like it'll be awesome. And congratulations on the whole thing.

^ OOPS...sorry. Will fix.

Well, most of what I could say has already been said, so I'll just confirm on some points: #1- While it may not affect the quality of the ride, for visual aspects, yes color is VERY important. Especially if said ride is going tower over the park or something. #2- Some paintjobs are great fresh, but need maintaned...or else. For example, Vortex here at Kings Island IMO has a great paintjob, but when it was neglected for quite a long time in the late 90's, by 2000...it looked horrible. Thankfully that problem was easily fixed with a new paintjob. And also... #3- Certain colors should be mixed with other colors, otherwise the ride will look horrible. There will be an example of this later in this post. And now, some of my personal favorite paintjobs... Afterburn @ Carowinds Silver Track and Blue Supports on an inverted or suspended coaster is ALWAYS a good combo in my book. This ride shows it off perfectly. With both this and Fury 325, Carowinds will have some pretty pretty coasters in 2015. Other rides have also had this paintjob, and they look often as good, but I'm just going to use this one example here. Millennium Force @ Cedar Point The "inverted" (LOLZ) version of the color scheme is also gorgeous IMO...granted MF has white supports, but it's close enough. Other coasters also have this color scheme too of course, but I'm just using the most famous example... Blue Streak @ Cedar Point Cedar Fair seems to know some good color choices IMO, even if they do over-use red (due to being over-used, no red coasters will appear here even though I don't really mind it though). Blue Streak is the first woodie to appear here, and the slight hint of blue in the supports and blue track make it just that much prettier than your average wooden coaster. Now for some exceptions to the rule of "you need more than 1 color" (mostly)... Batman: The Ride (original paintjob) @ SF Great America OK so there is SOME gold track. But it's 99% all-black. While most color schemes would be painful to look at like this, All Black just makes a coaster look more intimidating. And said gold track is an awesome touch. The new paintjob isn't bad, but compared to THIS... Woodstock Express @ Kings Island It's a bit easier to get away with an all-one-color paintjob with a wooden coaster- with some exceptions. The natural browns usually work for them, but Woodstock Express here shows off how pretty a nice all-light-blue can be. I love the "official" color name too...Blue Ice Cream... Also it should be obvious by now what my favorite color is... And now, one of the few paint schemes I have seen that made me cringe...prepare yourself for... T3 @ Kentucky Kingdom (Pic from: http://www.coaster2coaster.com/) MY EYES!!! Seriously, this one looked 100x better in all black...TOO MUCH RED!!! EVEN Cedar Fair WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO WITHSTAND DIS!!! Well, I hope you all enjoyed this post. Save the last part. I'm so sorry. But I had to include a bad one, and that one came to mind...

Well- looking at the area with Google Maps- while the former Tower Gardens are big enough for TWO standard-sized flat rides (based on the size of the nearby Scrambler and Monster at least), I wasn't sure an Antique Car ride would even fit...so I looked up how big Holiday World's Lewis and Clark Trail attraction is in comparison. To my surprise, Lewis and Clark trail could very nearly fit- though to be honest, the area would result in a very small antique car ride and thus likely not be nearly as good as the one that we lost. I'd still go for the spin-and-barf tubs or a Tilt-A-Whirl myself there.

^ Hmm...that I never knew. I had only heard the deal was with Dive Machines. That sounds like it could have been a factor- after all, we know B&M made a deal with Cedar Point on Raptor (no other B&M Inverts within 200 miles or so, destroying Canada's Wonderland's plan and forcing them to buy a Vekoma SLC) so it is highly possible. If that's still in place (it may not be- Busch Gardens and SeaWorld have bigger issues to worry about ATM than keeping B&M's away from their direct competitors) that would automatically mean when Cedar Fair wants a new coaster for Kings Dominion (will probably happen fairly soon- I305 is 5 years old now and KD is one of Cedar Fair's bigger parks), the often suggested B&M Wing Coaster (I also think they could add an B&M Invert and it would be different enough from Volcano for both to exist) may not be an option, and they would probably be forced to go to another company for a different type of coaster...

Umm, I'm pretty sure there are other comapnies besides B&M Cedar Fair would work with- yes B&M will probably get the big stuff for now, since Cedar Fair would hate to throw away $20 million+ on a huge ride and have it need modified, or get a fair chunk of negative feedback from the GP (quite a few people don't like greying/blacking out on rides- some of the newer Intamins have this issue), or worse yet have it involved with the death of a rider. However for smaller coaster projects (probably for the smaller or less popular Cedar Fair parks) I would not be shocked to see Cedar Fair buy from any of these: -Mack Rides (Blitz, Mega-Lite, and Launched Coasters...also Water Coasters...) -Gerstlauer (Euro Fighter Coasters, Spinning Coasters, etc...) -Premier Rides (Launched Coasters, etc...) -Chance Rides (Hyper GTX Coasters...) -Great Coasters International (Twisted Wooden Coasters...) -Rocky Mountain Coasters (Steel Coasters with wooden supports & some characteristics, though the NTG Incident may have slightly hurt their stock in CF's eyes...though that was just their first offense so far and we'll see if it ever happens again...) Besides the previously mentioned reliability, safety, and needing modified after testing/opening issues there's probably another reason parks aren't eating Intamin coasters up anymore. In 2007 and before, Intamin was installing quite a few big rides at both Cedar Fair and Six Flags. But then, Six Flags went bankrupt, Cedar Fair nearly did and did go into debt, and the economy crashed. Suddenly the 2 big US chains had a change of heart concering what they wanted in their coasters- no longer did they favor the high g-force enthusiast-pleasing rides Intamin made, but wanted rides that the general public (aka 95%+ of park guests) could enjoy without getting off and thinking "OMG I BLACKED OUT! TOO SCARY! I'LL NEVER RIDE A COASTER EVER AGAIN!". B&M fit into that perfectly, so Cedar Fair began buying B&M Hypers for their newly aquired former Paramount parks- all of which opened to very good reviews, with great capacity and no major issues so far. While Intimidator 305 was built during this stage in 2010 at Kings Dominion (probably due to the increased competition from Busch Gardens Williamsburgh KD faced versus the others) that was probably due to CF wanting a Giga (plus Kinzel was running the show), and B&M didn't offer that in 2010 (they were still 2 years out...). Intimidator 305, however, opened with many members of the GP complaining it was too intense and forceful, and it turned out it was tearing its wheels apart and thus it was trimmed, then modified in 2011. Then it's cable broke in 2013 after only a few years of operation. And it still gets complaints of grey-outs. In 2012, B&M finally broke the 300-foot barrier with Leviathan (I have to wonder if Cedar Fair went to B&M for this ride because of the I-305 issues and begged B&M to go over 300') and I'd bet Cedar Fair has been happier with the performance of that ride: Rave Reviews, High Capacity, No Major Issues so far, no accidents...Leviathan so far has hit all the right notes. And then came the Shoot-the-Rapids incident...while not a coaster, that was probably when "Cedar Fair may never work with Intamin in the near future" became "Cedar Fair will NOT be working with Intamin in the near future..." It has been a B&M-fest ever since for major Cedar Fair steel coasters (a few GCI woodies have also debuted in this time frame, and a Mack Wild Mouse, and a ART Engineering Coaster/Dark Ride Combo...all of those are smaller additions though), and there really isn't a huge reason for them to stop: the rides work great, get great reviews, and are high capacity. Yes they could try out someone else, but I doubt Intamin would be it...probably Mack, If I had to guess. They have their own take on the Blitz Coaster, and I could see Cedar Fair trying a Mack Water Coaster out... So...In short...why CF won't add a new Intamin is...(for those who hate wall-o-text)... #1-Cedar Fair decided to add coasters to cater to the GP more around 2008, rather than enthusiasts. Which lined up with B&M more. #2-Reliability issues (including rides needing modified) #3-Safety issues #4-B&M has done great work with CF so far, with great results, hence they may not see a reason to switch yet at all. And, to add my two cents on what makes a good coaster: I like speed, airtime, and length. High capacity is also nice. I also enjoy hard laterals, but that for some reason was NOT an option...but none of those is really needed too much, so long as the coaster does "what it's supposed to do". I can expect something like Beast to have no airtime and am OK with it- the darn thing has 1 "normal" drop after all and am not bothered. But, if I ride Diamondback- a huge tall hilly coaster- and get no airtime...then I will be like "WTF!!!". (Disclaimer: I have never actually gotten zero airtime on Diamondback- there's ALWAYS been at least a fair amount- but I figured it would be a decent example...actually got LOTS on my 3 rides in 2014...) Pacing is also pretty important, but I don't think a coaster needs to be 100mph all-the-time...I actually do enjoy the "eye of the storm" calm moments, especially if they occur right before something chaotic and awesome or give you a great mid-ride view. So overall, it's a mix...and depends what the coaster is trying to do, and how well it does it. So if you build a speed-centric coaster, it should feel fast. Airtime-centric, should have lots of air...etc etc.

Ehh, if you read the intro he did say this was not in any particular order. So...KI didn't outrank CP in the author's mind, he just had both in his Top 5 for their coaster collections. He even did blurb a bit that if he did, Cedar Point would probably have been on top in his opinion.

^ Just a quick question- do we have to give our real names? 'Cuz I just used "McSalsa" if I recall for the Mitch Hawker poll, and that worked out just fine. Also do we include dedicated "kiddie" coasters like Great Pumpkin Coaster? The Mitch Hawker poll ignored them. Anyhow, I will probably vote on this so here's how my ballot should end up....not including kiddie coasters. I'm apparently only worth 150 points though. (I'm also giving my personal grades for each for a bit of clarity...) 1. The Beast @ Kings Island 2. The Legend @ Holiday World 3. Banshee @ Kings Island 4. Diamondback @ Kings Island 5. Voyage @ Holiday World 6. Raven @ Holiday World 7. Flight of Fear @ Kings Island 8. Vortex @ Kings Island 9. The Bat @ Kings Island 10. The Racer @ Kings Island 11. Backlot Stunt Coaster @ Kings Island 12. Adventure Express @ Kings Island 13. Hoosier Hurricane @ Indiana Beach 14. Firehawk @ Kings Island B 15. Favorite Invertigo (Invertigo @ Kings Island) Including Kiddie Coasters... 16. Woodstock Express @ Kings Island (not sure if this would be a clone ride or not...) 17. Great Pumpkin Coaster @ Kings Island 18. Howler @ Holiday World Oh, and to clarify a bit: Invertigo is still a ride I do like and would wait up to around a half-hour for. Wouldn't wait longer than that though. I have yet to ride a roller coaster I actually didn't like to this point...granted, so far only 15 of them...

Oh...sorry. I brain-farted on that a bit. I was thinking more about their more recent creations and kinda forgot that B&M has been doing this since the early 90's...fun, crowd-pleasing coasters with great reliability. I've edited that post. ^ Also that picture is incredible. In addition to being crowd pleasing and reliable, B&M's are also IMO pretty...usually. Unless the park that builds one goes for a hideous paint job or something. Thankfully not the case for Thunderbird...

Wow. That looked a lot faster and more intense than I was expecting it too. If the rest of the ride maintains that kind of speed, then this will be a real smash hit for Holiday World. B&M may well have yet another hit on its hands...

Wait- doesn't B&M usually test with slower soft wheels first before switching to the final hard wheels? If so, then once those go on Fury 325 is going to get even faster...which should push it from "Wow that was fast" to "HOLY (BLEEP)!!!" speed.

And that "issue" was a comfort problem, not a safety one. B&M's safety record speaks for itself. Yeah- I'd rather be slightly uncomfortable with a ride than thrown out of the seat by it. But B&M themselves have proven it is possible to make a ride with comfy seats and still not toss riders with their hypers- Diamondback has some pretty comfy seating and restraints IMO, and no B&M hyper has yet to throw anyone out. Probably because B&M knows the "safe" G-force limits and sticks to them...

YOU FORGOT WindSeeker. And I actually like all of them I have ridden. Dodgem is one of the few Kings Island rides I still have yet to ride, however, so that one I cannot make comment on.