Windseeker closed yesterday due to....wind

[Snowman]

But, it's RARELY open for ERT! it's not reliable enough for it. Yesterday, it was replaced by Shake Rattle N Roll and they were assigning seats! Really? Go back to the 2 most reliable rides in the park, Beast and Diamondback!

That's funny, do the cars still have numbers? Or do the ride ops just point and say, "ya'll take that one!"

The best part of Shake, Rattle, and Roll is the front seat! Well worth the wait.

[mikejenkins1]

But, it's RARELY open for ERT! it's not reliable enough for it. Yesterday, it was replaced by Shake Rattle N Roll and they were assigning seats! Really? Go back to the 2 most reliable rides in the park, Beast and Diamondback!

That's funny, do the cars still have numbers? Or do the ride ops just point and say, "ya'll take that one!"

The best part of Shake, Rattle, and Roll is the front seat! Well worth the wait.

Assigning seats on shake rattle and roll :-)

Well checking cams I see CP and KI WindSeeker not running. Go Figure.

Wish we had a cam for CW as well.

[Browntggrr]

But, it's RARELY open for ERT! it's not reliable enough for it. Yesterday, it was replaced by Shake Rattle N Roll and they were assigning seats! Really? Go back to the 2 most reliable rides in the park, Beast and Diamondback!

It's a new ride. And when it is down, another ride takes it's place.

Do you expect perfection?

I really don't see it as whining. As someone else has pointed out, imagine the outrage (or whining as you put it) if Cedar Point after 2 months of having Millenium Force, Raptor, Maverick, Iron Dragon, and Planet Snoopy, open for ERT just decided last tuesday to shut them all down and open just WS and Corkscrew.

The ERT for CP is apples and oranges compared to KI. CP has 5 different resorts, KI has none.

Your example is even more tainted. Yes, people would be upset if ERT was reduced from 5 rides to two rides at CP, but that has not happened, as KI was never reduced in ride ERT count either.

And yes, it is whining. This decision was not made just yesterday. It's about time one of two things happen for those who whine about it:

1) Deal with it. KI was a great park before ERT was even offered, as it is a great park w/o the rides you want offered.

-or-

2) Go somewhere else.

[Bennett]

You can try to belittle people if you want....bottom line is, KI is being incredibly stubborn when it comes to ERT rides, which, is a big reason that some of us spring for the Gold passes.

If they want to make WindSeeker an ERT next season, when the kinks are worked out, fine. I would just think that it is in their best interest to have your ERT rides, which by definition are your "premier" rides, operational. With a closed WindSeeker, you are left with the 24 year old Vortex, which has seen better days, and the Backlot Stunt Coaster, which is a glorified kiddie coaster.

Frankly, it is not worth coming early anymore...and, I've been at the park for ERT rides 8 times so far...twice to watch them work on the WindSeeker and toil on the tired Vortex.

[Pagoda Gift Shop]

I agree that you can't expect perfection, but it's hard not to after a year of B&M ERT. Diamondback is going to be the most popular ride for a while. I don't get why you wouldn't use the most popular and reliable coaster for ERT.

[bkroz]

You can try to belittle people if you want....bottom line is, KI is being incredibly stubborn when it comes to ERT rides, which, is a big reason that some of us spring for the Gold passes.

If they want to make WindSeeker an ERT next season, when the kinks are worked out, fine. I would just think that it is in their best interest to have your ERT rides, which by definition are your "premier" rides, operational. With a closed WindSeeker, you are left with the 24 year old Vortex, which has seen better days, and the Backlot Stunt Coaster, which is a glorified kiddie coaster.

Frankly, it is not worth coming early anymore...and, I've been at the park for ERT rides 8 times so far...twice to watch them work on the WindSeeker and toil on the tired Vortex.

Stubborn? I agree wholeheartedly that Diamondback and The Beast are a good choice for ERT, and I think most of us were taken aback when WindSeeker and Vortex were announced. But logically, there are so many reasons for it that have nothing to do with the park wanting to ruin your experience.

WindSeeker, as has been said, is the new ride. It has a huge capacity, and is the park's new draw. Based on advertising alone, wouldn't you expect that the "big new ride" for any given year be the one that's attached to Gold Pass marketing as an early-availability ride? Or would you have them say, "New for 2011, WindSeeker! But you'll have to wait until everyone else can ride it before you get the chance." From a marketing point of view it's smart. Given that, WindSeeker will be the ERT ride this year.

From a payroll / staffing point of view, it's obvious. Even if my understanding of the zones is flawed, it still remains that the park would need twice as much staffing to open two pathways to two rides in two corners of the park. If you've used the ERT as you say, you know that there are security guards at each bend in the path where curious guests may "accidentally" wander off. If that was needed in two separate directions, and two areas of the park had to be cleared by maintenance, and two separate zones had to be staffed, then you've created a logistical, payroll nightmare. The logical decision is to open another ride that is in the same vicinity. And given WindSeeker's location, the only options are Backlot, Shake Rattle and Roll, or Vortex. From a capacity standpoint alone, Vortex is obvious. From an "impressive size" standpoint, Vortex is the only real candidate as well.

Believe it or not, Kings Island is not trying to take away your precious time on Diamondback and The Beast. Rather, they're trying to offer their newest, most marketed thrill ride to their most marketed pass clientele. With WindSeeker chosen, Vortex is the only sensical companion.

The thing I don't get is... Diamondback and The Beast top out at a 15 minute wait on weekdays anyway... So why is this even an issue? It's pretty much ERT all day, every day considering the tremendous capacities of each ride. Those of us used to Cedar Point would kill for a 45 minute wait on Millennium or Maverick, so perhaps you don't know how good you have it? Secondly, you note that you've been to ERT eight times this year. Given that your pass paid for itself after two trips and that you've had at least six gratis, I don't know that complaints about an additional hour are justified. Especially since you seem unexcited by the notion of ERT on Vortex and WindSeeker so... Why wake up so early to go?

[Bennett]

WindSeeker wuold be fine...PROVIDED it is running...a little proofreading of my post would tell you that.

Been to two ERT's in an effort to ride WindSeeker...to no avail.

Again, as I stated earlier, if KI is going to make WindSeeker one of the ERT rides, do it next year, when the kinks are worked out.

Quite a simple answer.

I would rather them do any two other rides for the rest of this year, even The Racer instead of WindSeeker, simply because the WindSeeker has, at best, a 50/50 shot of being open.

It is also no business of yours how many times I choose to go early, it is a perk I paid for. If I go and do ERT every day, so be it. If WindSeeker is listed as the ERT ride, and I show up at 9:30am to ride it, I expect to be able to ride said ride.

Funny you can pick that out, and not the root of my post...that the ERT rides need to be operational rides, not open half the days at best.

That is where KI is being obtuse.

[bkroz]

It is also no business of yours how many times I choose to go early, it is a perk I paid for. If I go and do ERT every day, so be it. If WindSeeker is listed as the ERT ride, and I show up at 9:30am to ride it, I expect to be able to ride said ride.

When WindSeeker is not running, a replacement is provided.

You paid for access to Kings Island throughout the 2011 season. The perks are exactly that - additional opportunities that the park offers. At some point, you certainly put your name to something that says they have the right to edit or amend those perks however they choose. As I said, your pass has more than paid for itself, and the park is no longer making money off of you as an individual unless you choose to eat / shop inside the park. I'd argue that such is the case with most people who take advantage of ERT. While the park does all that it reasonably can to get the advertised rides up and running, it can't always happen.

Again, perhaps making WindSeeker the ERT was not the wisest decision. But regardless, it is the ERT ride. When it doesn't work, they do what they can with the operations zones they have. Understand that there are many, many forces at work here and that the park does what they can.

[Bennett]

Again, perhaps making WindSeeker the ERT was not the wisest decision.

Tis all I am saying...

Not making money off of me as an individual? What does that have to do with anything? I have no right to want something changed because I am a pass holder?

That is patently absurd.

Bottom line is, management is being obtuse, stubborn, ignorant, whatever you want to call it. It was not a wise decision, and, they have ample time to change it to ANYTHING else, does not have to be DB/Beast.

When folks travel, and arrive early to do the advertised, agreed upon ERT rides, and both times within a week the main attraction for said ERT is not operating, does not take a rocket scientist to see that something needs to be tweaked.

[CedarPointer]

I just know people would complain if the brand new ride wasn't part of ERT...

[Avatar]

For what it is worth I understand what you are saying Bennett and respect your opinion on the matter. I really appreciate that you have done so in a thoughtful way which is always good for discussions on these type of issues.

[MarketingExpress]

Bottom line is, management is being obtuse, stubborn, ignorant, whatever you want to call it. It was not a wise decision, and, they have ample time to change it to ANYTHING else, does not have to be DB/Beast.

When folks travel, and arrive early to do the advertised, agreed upon ERT rides, and both times within a week the main attraction for said ERT is not operating, does not take a rocket scientist to see that something needs to be tweaked.

When it comes to ERT management is counting on WS opening every morning when they come into work just like you when you arrive at the park. I would imagine that most of the closures are made at the last minute and thus sends those same managers into a frenzy trying too find a second ride to open for those showing up. I can tell you its difficult because at the time ERT is to start, employees are just arriving to work.

The park is doing the best they can given the situation and despite what you might think, they want WS to be open more than anyone else.

[McSalsa]

Just a thought that popped in my head- WindSeeker is this year's "big new ride", and thus why it got the ERT. So, what if the rumored brand-spanking new coaster or Son of Beast revamp happens next year? If they use the same concept as this year, it will be the "new" ride and something close by...(if it is a SOB revamp, or something in that same area, there are a LOT of choices!). WindSeeker ERT may only last 1 year if this is the case.

Now, if there is NO new coaster/ride next year, the ERT question becomes much more complicated...would it carry over from this season, change back to Beast & DB, go to some other ride, or...dare I say it...go away forever (that would tick a LOT of people off though)? Did Diamondback/Beast ERT carry over in 2010 simply because there were no new rides (Planet Snoopy was just a revamp, nothing new was added)?

Just some random thoughts I had while reading through this...

[TombRaiderFTW]

I am amazed at the constant whining about ERT.

WS is a new ride, of course it will have ERT for 2011 & probably 2012.

But, it's RARELY open for ERT! it's not reliable enough for it. Yesterday, it was replaced by Shake Rattle N Roll and they were assigning seats! Really? Go back to the 2 most reliable rides in the park, Beast and Diamondback!

So that explains why, every time I went to ERT last year, Beast was down till near opening... Thanks for clearing that up.

I don't like to grumble, but enough is enough. Everyone, the park's going to assign what rides it wants for ERT. You, having bought a pass, are entitled to that ERT. The park can, will, and does change what rides are open during ERT. They have every right to, much in the same way they have the right to rope off parts of the parking lot and charge extra for those spots. So either accept the fact that Kings Island uses its right to do such things and get over it, or stop showing your support with your money.

TL;DR? They could very well have not opened Shake, Rattle N Roll and given you EST... Extended standing time.

[standbyme]

The park is doing the best they can given the situation and despite what you might think, they want WS to be open more than anyone else.

I would think the Mondial people beat them!

[AZ Kinda Guy]

I wish the pay extra attractions were the only available rides for the gold pass ERT.

[mikejenkins1]

I just know people would complain if the brand new ride wasn't part of ERT...

I would not complain. They should have it in addition to Beast/Diamondback if they can.

The other 2 would be open. But agree they just need to get over the quirks and get it going.

Maybe I will try ERT and get on it....

[RaptorGuy]

Just a thought that popped in my head- WindSeeker is this year's "big new ride", and thus why it got the ERT. So, what if the rumored brand-spanking new coaster or Son of Beast revamp happens next year? If they use the same concept as this year, it will be the "new" ride and something close by...(if it is a SOB revamp, or something in that same area, there are a LOT of choices!). WindSeeker ERT may only last 1 year if this is the case.

Now, if there is NO new coaster/ride next year, the ERT question becomes much more complicated...would it carry over from this season, change back to Beast & DB, go to some other ride, or...dare I say it...go away forever (that would tick a LOT of people off though)? Did Diamondback/Beast ERT carry over in 2010 simply because there were no new rides (Planet Snoopy was just a revamp, nothing new was added)?

Just some random thoughts I had while reading through this...

No, IMO, ERT should be on Diamondback and Beast now and forever as long as those rides remain in the park! No matter what coaster or thrill ride comes in the future. Ruth Voss

started the ERT on Beast in 1979, and up until this year, that's how it's been. It should remain that way.

The only other option that might be kind of good is what Paramount used to do. Offer ERT on different rides on different days. If you went on a Friday, you might have ERT

in Coney Mall, or something like that. That might be something to try, too.

[Diamondback FOF]

Again, perhaps making WindSeeker the ERT was not the wisest decision.

...Bottom line is, management is being obtuse, stubborn, ignorant, whatever you want to call it. It was not a wise decision, and, they have ample time to change it to ANYTHING else, does not have to be DB/Beast.

When folks travel, and arrive early to do the advertised, agreed upon ERT rides, and both times within a week the main attraction for said ERT is not operating, does not take a rocket scientist to see that something needs to be tweaked.

You said: "I would rather them do any two other rides for the rest of this year, even The Racer instead of WindSeeker, simply because the WindSeeker has, at best, a 50/50 shot of being open." Well....when WindSeeker does not open for ERT, the park opens another ride in its place...so isn't that what you just asked for?

Just a thought that popped in my head- WindSeeker is this year's "big new ride", and thus why it got the ERT. So, what if the rumored brand-spanking new coaster or Son of Beast revamp happens next year? If they use the same concept as this year, it will be the "new" ride and something close by...(if it is a SOB revamp, or something in that same area, there are a LOT of choices!). WindSeeker ERT may only last 1 year if this is the case.

Now, if there is NO new coaster/ride next year, the ERT question becomes much more complicated...would it carry over from this season, change back to Beast & DB, go to some other ride, or...dare I say it...go away forever (that would tick a LOT of people off though)? Did Diamondback/Beast ERT carry over in 2010 simply because there were no new rides (Planet Snoopy was just a revamp, nothing new was added)?

Just some random thoughts I had while reading through this...

No, IMO, ERT should be on Diamondback and Beast now and forever as long as those rides remain in the park! No matter what coaster or thrill ride comes in the future. Ruth Voss

started the ERT on Beast in 1979, and up until this year, that's how it's been. It should remain that way...

I believe someone once said the "ERT" on The Beast was for ACE members...

[jcgoble3]

You can try to belittle people if you want....bottom line is, KI is being incredibly stubborn when it comes to ERT rides, which, is a big reason that some of us spring for the Gold passes.

If they want to make WindSeeker an ERT next season, when the kinks are worked out, fine. I would just think that it is in their best interest to have your ERT rides, which by definition are your "premier" rides, operational. With a closed WindSeeker, you are left with the 24 year old Vortex, which has seen better days, and the Backlot Stunt Coaster, which is a glorified kiddie coaster.

Frankly, it is not worth coming early anymore...and, I've been at the park for ERT rides 8 times so far...twice to watch them work on the WindSeeker and toil on the tired Vortex.

Stubborn? I agree wholeheartedly that Diamondback and The Beast are a good choice for ERT, and I think most of us were taken aback when WindSeeker and Vortex were announced. But logically, there are so many reasons for it that have nothing to do with the park wanting to ruin your experience.

WindSeeker, as has been said, is the new ride. It has a huge capacity, and is the park's new draw. Based on advertising alone, wouldn't you expect that the "big new ride" for any given year be the one that's attached to Gold Pass marketing as an early-availability ride? Or would you have them say, "New for 2011, WindSeeker! But you'll have to wait until everyone else can ride it before you get the chance." From a marketing point of view it's smart. Given that, WindSeeker will be the ERT ride this year.

From a payroll / staffing point of view, it's obvious. Even if my understanding of the zones is flawed, it still remains that the park would need twice as much staffing to open two pathways to two rides in two corners of the park. If you've used the ERT as you say, you know that there are security guards at each bend in the path where curious guests may "accidentally" wander off. If that was needed in two separate directions, and two areas of the park had to be cleared by maintenance, and two separate zones had to be staffed, then you've created a logistical, payroll nightmare. The logical decision is to open another ride that is in the same vicinity. And given WindSeeker's location, the only options are Backlot, Shake Rattle and Roll, or Vortex. From a capacity standpoint alone, Vortex is obvious. From an "impressive size" standpoint, Vortex is the only real candidate as well.

Believe it or not, Kings Island is not trying to take away your precious time on Diamondback and The Beast. Rather, they're trying to offer their newest, most marketed thrill ride to their most marketed pass clientele. With WindSeeker chosen, Vortex is the only sensical companion.

The thing I don't get is... Diamondback and The Beast top out at a 15 minute wait on weekdays anyway... So why is this even an issue? It's pretty much ERT all day, every day considering the tremendous capacities of each ride. Those of us used to Cedar Point would kill for a 45 minute wait on Millennium or Maverick, so perhaps you don't know how good you have it? Secondly, you note that you've been to ERT eight times this year. Given that your pass paid for itself after two trips and that you've had at least six gratis, I don't know that complaints about an additional hour are justified. Especially since you seem unexcited by the notion of ERT on Vortex and WindSeeker so... Why wake up so early to go?

Where's the like button for this post? Nicely said. I, for one, am not complaining about ERT; sure, given the choice, I'd rather have DB and The Beast, but I understand the park has a reason for doing what it did, and far be it from me to try to take them to the village stocks over it. That said, in reference to the part of your post I put in bold red, apparently I still don't know how good I have it even after five days at CP last week; not including ERT, breakdowns, or weather stoppages, my longest waits of the week were slightly under an hour for front seat on Millennium Force, 15–25 minutes for any other seat on MF, 15 minutes for front seat on Raptor, 30 minutes for front seat on Maverick, 70 minutes for front seat on TTD, and 20–30 minutes for any other seat on TTD. Crappy weather forecasts can do that. (Side note to self: I need to get to work on my trip report.)

[...] Backlot Stunt Coaster, which is a glorified kiddie coaster. [...]

Hey! Watch your language!

24-year-old jcgoble3, who loves BLSC

[Browntggrr]

WS is still new. You have to crawl before you walk. Anyone that believes anything different is simply

being obtuse, stubborn, ignorant, whatever you want to call it.

Comparing KI's ERT to CP's is apples and oranges. CP has 6 resorts to KI's zero- it is obvious a great many more (given the 1000+ rooms) are lining up at CP for ERT. Also, the example of reducing CP's ERT rides from 5 to 2 would cause issues. Where would it not? KI has not reduced the amount of ERT rides available; so the example is, at best, tainted.

KI is there for the majority, not the minority (an excellent example of this is the dislike for a "glorified kiddie coaster" and an "24 year old Vortex). Most people want an extra opportunity to enjoy the new ride (at any park) thus the ERT decision months ago. If WS is not available, another ride in that zone is chosen. This is not a difficult decision to grasp.

I happen to enjoy KI for almost everything it offers. I suggest to others that only want 2 rides for ERT that normally have minimal waits to remove the tunnel vision attitude & expand your KI horizons.

[Mexican Eric Bischoff]

I am amazed at the constant whining about ERT.

WS is a new ride, of course it will have ERT for 2011 & probably 2012.

I really don't see it as whining. As someone else has pointed out, imagine the outrage (or whining as you put it) if Cedar Point after 2 months of having Millenium Force, Raptor, Maverick, Iron Dragon, and Planet Snoopy, open for ERT just decided last tuesday to shut them all down and open just WS and Corkscrew.

Yeah, it is whining. You've managed to bring it up and complain in every topic. Maybe your fanny pack is too tight around you. You knew WS ERT was coming. They announced it in the offseason. It wasn't a big surprise when the ride finally opened that they stopped Beast and Diaondback ERT to do WS/Vortex (LIKE THEY HAD ANNOUNCED). I know you remembered it, cause you complained a lot then.

Get over it. Go to the park. Enjoy your time there. Move on.

[standbyme]

Isn't it ironic that if someone isn't happy with something at the park and they voice their opinion it is considered "whining/complaining" by some members...who then voice their opinion by "whining/complaining".

[Avatar]

I do not care if members whine about something at the park as long as they explain why they feel the way they do versus just saying something like "the music sucks". In addition I do not mind if members whine about others whining about something at the park as long as they do so respectfully and with thought, basically enlighten them and help them understand the other side of the issue. Otherwise I see no difference in those who whine about something at the park and those who whine about the whiners. I see them equally in my eyes.

Since this thread has turned into a bunch of whining post including this one from an Admin this topic is now closed.