Fast Lane

[The Interpreter]

And Cedar Point has said it is closely observing KI's test. In fact, Sandusky is....

PKIVortex, of course the Fast Lane users are getting special treatment. What did you think they were paying for?

[bkroz]

I had hoped this would happen... If you and five friends visit, you're looking at $25 per person. I think that's incredibly fair for unlimited front of the line access. And again, the best estimation I have is that this system is almost entirely profit, so they could charge $10 a pop and still make money... Of course, that would also cause madness to break out.

If this system were implemented at Kings Dominion this year, I'd absolutely get it next week when I visit. I have a Platinum Pass, after all, and I only get to Kings Dominion one day a year, so for a grand total of $35, I could park, get in, and get to the front of each line. I think people like me (traveling folks who only visit once or twice) are who this system is aimed at, so the staggered pricing for groups makes sense. And given the right group of first-timers or rare visitors, I'd do it at Cedar Point for $30 or so a person, too... But $50? I can't swing that...

[The Interpreter]

It's a test. The price may well be played with in numerous ways before all is said and done. During the last conference call, the ability to quickly tweak admissions pricing was touted, as was the Fast Lane testing.

[PKIVortex]

It was late when I typed my opinion to the whole Fast Lane. I understand they are paying to cut, and thus getting specail treatmeant! But it's BS that they get to choose wherever you want to sit while we waited in line for about and hour + get told where to go! Too me that isn't good Guest Service!

[jcgoble3]

OK, my report from yesterday, as promised. From the time I came back from lunch around 1:00 (I didn't start using the pass until then) until about 11:30 (with an hour break for dinner), in no particular order I got in about 8 rides on Diamondback, 7 on The Beast, 2 on the log flume, 2 on Drop Tower, 3 on Firehawk, 3 on BLSC, 1 on Boo Blasters, 2 on WindSeeker (including one during the fireworks), 3 on Flight of Fear, and 2 on Delirium. In total, I estimate that I saved roughly 16 to 18 hours of waiting. Sometimes, I was the only Fast Laner in sight at a ride; other times there were several other Fast Laners with me on the same cycle (the latter was especially noticeable at Delirium and Firehawk).

Two observations:

1. I think this system has value to more than just the traveling family that can only make one visit a year and can only do that on a Saturday and that wants to get everything in. Enthusiasts who want a "power-riding" day can get plenty of use out of it too.

2. Back on 7/24, afkifan reported that the Fast Lane system had a very minimal impact on wait times. I think that was because the system was still less than a week old and not many people knew about it. I (obviously) didn't actually wait in any regular lines when the Fast Lane was available for that ride, so I don't know what the impact of Fast Lane on wait times yesterday was, but based on the number of Fast Lane wristbands I saw and the number of Fast Laners with me on a cycle (as said before, especially on Delirium and Firehawk), there probably was a noticeable impact on wait times.

Quick question....are the fast pass bracelets plastic and red? With paw prints on them?

A bit of a late reply: no, those are something related to Great Wolf Lodge (probably their waterpark passes). The Fast Lane wristbands are waterproof paper with a Kings Island logo on one side and the date printed on the other.

[McSalsa]

Don't know if anyone already knew this, but this week Kings Island will be selling Fast Lane passes for $25. However, only on Monday-Friday. Aka the park might not be too crowded since it's just a weekday.

They are probably doing this to attempt to boost slow weekday sales- who's gonna pay $50 when it's not going to be all that crowded anyway?

Source: www.visitkingsisland.com

[KIfan73]

That's if you buy six or more....

[Tanna]

OK, my report from yesterday, as promised. From the time I came back from lunch around 1:00 (I didn't start using the pass until then) until about 11:30 (with an hour break for dinner), in no particular order I got in about 8 rides on Diamondback, 7 on The Beast, 2 on the log flume, 2 on Drop Tower, 3 on Firehawk, 3 on BLSC, 1 on Boo Blasters, 2 on WindSeeker (including one during the fireworks), 3 on Flight of Fear, and 2 on Delirium. In total, I estimate that I saved roughly 16 to 18 hours of waiting. Sometimes, I was the only Fast Laner in sight at a ride; other times there were several other Fast Laners with me on the same cycle (the latter was especially noticeable at Delirium and Firehawk).

Two observations:

1. I think this system has value to more than just the traveling family that can only make one visit a year and can only do that on a Saturday and that wants to get everything in. Enthusiasts who want a "power-riding" day can get plenty of use out of it too.

2. Back on 7/24, afkifan reported that the Fast Lane system had a very minimal impact on wait times. I think that was because the system was still less than a week old and not many people knew about it. I (obviously) didn't actually wait in any regular lines when the Fast Lane was available for that ride, so I don't know what the impact of Fast Lane on wait times yesterday was, but based on the number of Fast Lane wristbands I saw and the number of Fast Laners with me on a cycle (as said before, especially on Delirium and Firehawk), there probably was a noticeable impact on wait times.

Quick question....are the fast pass bracelets plastic and red? With paw prints on them?

A bit of a late reply: no, those are something related to Great Wolf Lodge (probably their waterpark passes). The Fast Lane wristbands are waterproof paper with a Kings Island logo on one side and the date printed on the other.

Thanks for biting the bullet and trying it out. That's a lot of riding. I'd say it was worth the money to, in essence, turn a Saturday park experience into a late August weekday, or as you said, to power ride.

In the lines with the most FLiers, was there enough seats left over from them boarding to allow regulars also to board? I'm asking because I wonder about the 'at the most' waiting for the next train, or disc in the case of Delirium. Basically, do regular riders get bumped that much? Or is it just waiting for the next cycle?

Did you choose your own seat? Or was it assigned? Did you see other patrons being assigned seats? Also, were the trains being completely filled before you left the station?

If you were seated in front, you probably didn't notice, so no biggie if you don't answer.

Thanks for answering my question about The Beast being down, and the info about an electronic device being taken away. (The FB poster was probably that rider, they seemed pretty sour when they posted.)

[jcgoble3]

Thanks for biting the bullet and trying it out. That's a lot of riding. I'd say it was worth the money to, in essence, turn a Saturday park experience into a late August weekday, or as you said, to power ride.

In the lines with the most FLiers, was there enough seats left over from them boarding to allow regulars also to board? I'm asking because I wonder about the 'at the most' waiting for the next train, or disc in the case of Delirium. Basically, do regular riders get bumped that much? Or is it just waiting for the next cycle?

The most FLers I saw on a single cycle was ten on Delirium (20% of the disc) and nine on Firehawk (3/8 of a train, though FLers were only placed on the red train, so the yellow train was always all "regular" guests). Definitely not so many that "regulars" couldn't get on the same cycle/train, but enough that it could add up over the course of a one-hour wait.

Did you choose your own seat? Or was it assigned? Did you see other patrons being assigned seats? Also, were the trains being completely filled before you left the station?

If you were seated in front, you probably didn't notice, so no biggie if you don't answer.

Yes, trains/cycles were being completely filled except for the occasional empty seat where they couldn't quickly find a single rider. On Beast and Flight of Fear, I was asked to go to an empty row just like the regulars, but was never turned down when I asked to wait for a particular seat. Diamondback let me choose, while Firehawk and BLSC assigned seats and I didn't attempt to request a specific seat on either of them.

[Tanna]

Thanks. I didn't know they were using specific trains (Red vs. Yellow). They are probably taking into a account the wait time of the regulars, to alternate like that. I can see where it would add to the waiting time, though I've personally not noticed.

It seems to me, that other than teleporting to the front, you were treated like everyone else, seatwise. Once in the coral, if I hadn't been asked to move forward, I could pick and choose, too.

[The Interpreter]

VERY interesting article from the Toledo Blade, with some dated comments, a different take from Robin Innes this time around and some interesting quotes from Mr. Helbig:

http://m.toledoblade.com/Economy/2011/08/06/Cedar-Fair-trying-out-1st-in-line-access-fees-2.html

[LongliveKingsCobra]

Well Don said it himself. This is not for everybody to utilize. People out of town are the target guests. Voila.

[CoastersRZ]

And Mr. Spiegel also hit it on the head. If this makes money for the park, it will stick around, and be rolled out to the other Cedar Fair parks.

When I was at the park yesterday until around 2:30, I didn`t notice much of an impact in wait times. I actually saw very few people using Fast Lane passes. Granted, I didn`t ride all the major rides that had Fast Lane, I saw no impact to ride lines. The bigger issue was slow dispatch times on several rides.

[spitfire]

For a weekday, today was fairly crowded and the only ride I saw FL being used on really was Diamondback, but not a ton of people. The line for the ride was already long as it was (ALL turnstiles were open and being used) but the line still seemed to move at the usual pace thanks to the high capacity. I didn't notice any real impact on the wait times.

As an aside, I noticed two girls going into the FL line without wristbands - not sure if they thought it was still the single rider line or they thought they were going to sneak on.

[standbyme]

As an aside, I noticed two girls going into the FL line without wristbands - not sure if they thought it was still the single rider line or they thought they were going to sneak on.

Well lets hope they weren't rude enough to attempt to cut in front of any of the Fast Laners!

Edit: This just gave me an idea...if Fast Lane DOES go over, maybe the park could develop FastER Lane next year where someone could pay an additional $25.00 to cut step ahead of the Fast Laners...it could be aimed at people who have traveled from out of the country.

[Diamondback96]

This just gave me an idea...if Fast Lane DOES go over, maybe the park could develop FastER Lane next year where someone could pay an additional $25.00 to cut step ahead of the Fast Laners...it could be aimed at people who have traveled from out of the country.

And if that goes over well, how about FastEST Lane? Pay another $25 to step in front of the Faster Laners with almost no wait time (almost because you need to wait for a train first! ). Aimed at people from other continents.

[BavarianBeatle]

Or just auction off the seats on every ride to the highest bidder, which is aimed at the true goal of the program. But seriously, what Mr. Helbig and the others at CF are not taking into accout are the people who spend hundreds of dollars at the park , spend their entire day getting line jumped , and then decide to "make the most of" their remaining free days by going fishing. This is an elitist program that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you." How many people will quietly not come back to KI after getting this impression?

[RingMaster]

4 Regular Tickets - 35.⁹⁹ Online ; 52.⁹⁹ Gate = 143.⁹⁶ ; 211.⁹⁶

4 Fast Passes - 50.⁰⁰ ; 35.⁰⁰ Mon-Fri this week = 200.⁰⁰ ; 140.⁰⁰

243.⁹⁶ = Online Tickets + Fast Pass

411.⁹⁶ = Gate Tickets + Fast Pass

280.⁹⁶ = Online Tickets + Mon-Fri Fast Pass

351.⁹⁶ = Gate Tickets + Mon-Fri Pass

4 Platinum Passes - 165.⁰⁰ Online = 660.⁰⁰

One Platinum Pass alone costs more than buying four tickets online for a family of four. Platinum Passholders pay a one-time fee to get access to the park every day its open to the public. Regular ticket buyers pay a one-time fee to get access to the park on the one day they can actually go. And even if it's only a single person with a single Fast Pass, the Platinum Passholder still paid more on a one-time fee.

Calling people out for shelling extra money towards something they actually need is extremely hypocritical when you yourself shelled out almost twice as much money simply because you want to go to the park more than they can actually do. Who's more elitist here - the ones with a special pass netting them unlimited access to an amusement park and expecting everything to be catered specifically towards them because they assume they are the most loyal customers, or the ones with an ordinary ticket netting them a single day at an amusement park and having everything catered specifically towards them because they are the most loyal customers?

[Gordon Bombay]

Or just auction off the seats on every ride to the highest bidder, which is aimed at the true goal of the program. But seriously, what Mr. Helbig and the others at CF are not taking into accout are the people who spend hundreds of dollars at the park , spend their entire day getting line jumped , and then decide to "make the most of" their remaining free days by going fishing. This is an elitist program that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you." How many people will quietly not come back to KI after getting this impression?

I pay $5.00 to sit in the top deck of Great American Ballpark, wait in a line and miss parts of the game for a crappy hot dog, use a bathroom that smells of beer and tobacco spit and watch ants play baseball when I occasionally can't see Jay Bruce make catches in Right Field due to the obstructed view.

Other people pay $250.00 to sit close enough to chat with Brandon Phillips, be waited on hand and foot, have beer and any food they want brought to them while they get to enjoy a bathroom with a restroom attendant.

This is an elitist program by the Reds that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you." How many people will quietly not come to Great American Ballpark after getting this impression?

[The Interpreter]

And the answer to that question is that is why pricing is an art and a science. The goal of the pricer is to not leave money on the table. The question is whether long term aspects of that are taken into account. At the Cedar Fair/Six Flags parks, the answer has frequently been no. Debt has a way of focusing executives on the short term, as do shareholders and Wall Street.

It is clear new management intends to extract more money from those more willing/able to pay. During the last conference call, concern was expressed about keeping the more price concious market, while also emphasizing revenue opportunities.

[MarketingExpress]

This is an elitist program that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you."

And the season pass with it's perks and benefits is not an "elitist" program in itself?

[Snowman]

This is an elitist program that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you."

And the season pass with it's perks and benefits is not an "elitist" program in itself?

When I go through the Gold/Platinum pass gate for ERT and see the looks of confusion and sadness on the people with day passes face as I push through the crowd of commoners and give them the pagent wave after I pass through the gate of excellence, I definately feel I'm a better and more important person than they are.

Seriously, whats the difference in paying for a gold/plat pass and paying for this? Neither one seems elitist. A true elitist would want the park only availabe to them, or their own reserved train. Heck, Elvis rented all of Libertyland when he wanted a flash pass, That's how an elitist rolls!

[gad198]

I don't believe the season pass perks vs. Fast Lane argument is entirely valid. The key difference between the two is that very few of the season pass perks affect anyone beyond the passholder, whereas the folks in the Fast Lane line do affect people who choose to wait in the standby line.

The only season pass perk that affects anyone beyond the passholder is early entry/ERT that the park offers. Even then, the only effect it potentially has is in the form of a wait at the beginning of the day for those first riders. At Kings Island that's not usually a big deal because the line at the end of the ERT session is usually minimal. It's a much bigger deal at Cedar Point (Millennium Force's wait at the end of ERT this past Sunday was close to an hour). The thing to remember here is the park isn't open to the general public during ERT. The park opens at the opening time and that's clearly stated on the operating schedules. A passholder (or resort guest at Cedar Point) that gets in early doesn't affect anyone in the general public. A general admission ticket gets you access to the park during normal hours. Those who are granted ERT don't change what my general admission ticket grants me. The GP shouldn't even care about ERT, more or less, because it doesn't affect them. The quantity of rides available during the normal operating hours doesn't change, nor do the way those seats are allocated change (without Fast Lane or the like) as it is first come first served. The other perks (usually discounts of some sort or free parking) clearly don't affect anyone beyond the passholder.

Repeat the above for a concert or sporting event. The person sitting in the $250 seat at a Reds game doesn't affect the person sitting in the $5 seat. The $250 customer and the $5 customer are operating on completely different wavelengths as far as their experiences go. They're at the same event and yet their experiences are completely different. The person who paid $250 for a seat isn't cutting in front of someone who purchased a $5 seat in the concession line. If the $250 customer wants to eat 10 hot dogs, that doesn't affect the ability for the $5 customer to eat any hot dogs. The $5 customer doesn't care about how many drinks the $250 customer has. The bottom line is that there is a close to zero correlation between their experiences because they don't interact with one another.

Fast Lane is, at its core, a way to steal a little time from everyone in a ride line and give it to Fast Lane users. The amount of time it takes me to get on to a ride is based on three things, assuming the ride is running:

* what the capacity of the ride is and how many people per hour it can roll through

* how good the crew is at moving people through the line

* how many people are in front of you

All Fast Lane is doing is changing the third variable. The wait for someone in the standby line is now potentially affected because of Fast Lane users. Any person who uses the Fast Lane pass while you're standing in line for that same ride will increase your wait time if they make it to the merge point before you do. Therefore, your wait time in the standby line is almost DIRECTLY correlated with how many people use (and how often they use) Fast Lane in front of you. We're at the same event (in this case, a ride), but the difference between this and a concert is that the person using Fast Lane directly affects my experience (in the form of a longer wait) if I'm standing in the standby line.

Having said all of that I really do think that the impact on most regular guests is probably pretty minimal unless you're visiting on a busy day. I can't tell you how many times we've been to Six Flags parks and seen people using the Flash Pass even when there are station waits (i.e., past the merge point for the Flash Pass) for everything. I'm just looking forward to the next two weeks starting this Monday when lines will be manageable again.

[CedarPointer]

Fast Lane =/= Line Jumping.

[KIfan73]

Just having an admission ticket to Kings Island (or the Reds) is something very extravagant to a large part of the population. I'm not seeing that as any more "wrong" than Fast Lane bracelets or box seat tickets.

[upstop]

“It’s all about earnings and how can parks make more money. If this makes money, they’ll keep it,” Mr. Speigel said.

Hmm. I thought Mr. O said it was about the guest experience.

[standbyme]

gad198...a very nice post!

[darque]

I'm not wanting to get into the debate here, or stir up controversy. I just want to ask a question about the Fast Lane.

I'm from Niagara Falls, I've got a big coaster road trip booked in just over a week and will be at Kings Island on the 23rd. I've got a Platinum Pass so I'm not worried about shelling out the extra $50 if it's going to be busy.

How does KI have the entrances set up? Do the lines merge? Is there an entrance from the exit.

...I'm already going to be getting some dirty looks from a few because I'm a single rider, how much worse is getting one of these passes?

[BavarianBeatle]

Or just auction off the seats on every ride to the highest bidder, which is aimed at the true goal of the program. But seriously, what Mr. Helbig and the others at CF are not taking into accout are the people who spend hundreds of dollars at the park , spend their entire day getting line jumped , and then decide to "make the most of" their remaining free days by going fishing. This is an elitist program that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you." How many people will quietly not come back to KI after getting this impression?

I pay $5.00 to sit in the top deck of Great American Ballpark, wait in a line and miss parts of the game for a crappy hot dog, use a bathroom that smells of beer and tobacco spit and watch ants play baseball when I occasionally can't see Jay Bruce make catches in Right Field due to the obstructed view.

Other people pay $250.00 to sit close enough to chat with Brandon Phillips, be waited on hand and foot, have beer and any food they want brought to them while they get to enjoy a bathroom with a restroom attendant.

This is an elitist program by the Reds that will send a message to many people that, "we treat them better because they are richer than you." How many people will quietly not come to Great American Ballpark after getting this impression?

Tonight about 20,000, judging from what I've seen on tv.

[DaveStroem]

gad, thank you for your clear and well thought out post. The only thing I will add to it is that if there are few people using FL, it will have minimal impact on the stand-by line but it will also have minimal impact on the bottom line of KI and would most likely go away. If on the other hand it becomes more widely used, it will stay and grow to other parks. The downside of that is to the regular plain ole ordinary guest it will cause additional waiting.

From what I have been told a group of coaster enthusiast will be in the park tomorrow and have purchased 55 Fast Lane wristbands. These are more then likely power riders that will not waste much time doing anything but riding coasters. Just think if they all decide to head to Diamondback at the same time. They will fill 1 1/2 trains then get off and go around in about the time they can load 1-2 trains of non-FL before they get back on. Repeat then rinse ad nauseum. If you see this group heading toward the ride your standing in line for, you might as well get out of line and head somewhere else.

While they may not stay in a pack, I am kind of hoping that they do to show the park how poorly conceived the current version of Fast Lane is.

I will say again that I am not opposed to a Fast Lane system. If they would limit it to 1 ride on each of the 10 attractions instead of unlimited usage 100% of my issues with it would go away. This would also allow the park to offer it at a lower price and even potentially offer more of them without significantly effecting the wait times of those not using Fast Lane.