Outdoor Man

I don't think it really became clear until about 2 weeks ago. As someone who had a booth number assigned, Orange County had been pressing IAAPA to continue with the Expo and I think up until the 2nd or 3rd week of August had their canons aimed to have the event. Then one-by-one, prominent exhibitors began to back out. ITPS backed out for the first time since it's inception, Intamin, GCI, etc... Then operators like, Quassy (not a large park, but a regular fixture at IAAPA events) pulled their support. By the third week of August I think it was crystal clear- I'm sort of surprised they waited until today. They turned the Asia conference into a "virtual" event. I logged in and it was.... an OK lemons into lemonade effort. At the moment, though, it doesn't appear that the November marketplace event will even be a virtual event.

Not saying they are racing to remove The Bat. But like all "assets"- when the cost of maintenance exceeds the perceived ROI... it becomes a liability. See Firehawk ("only" 18 years old at its demise) SOB (last ride at 9 years) and Vortex. The Bat is a maintenance issue from extinction.

I wouldn't be surprised if The Bat took it's final flight very soon. rarely a line, I can't imagine replacement parts are plentiful at this point, the paint-job looks shoddy (again)... I don't think they've used Timberwolf on any consistent basis in years. So... removal of those two wouldn't be a stretch. That said, I have to side with infrastructure and utilities. I can't imagine the park doing a large project in the front when they likely knew that some prime real estate in the back was going to be vacant. You can seal those two areas off from the park and let nature reclaim without losing much- or even a small entrance created for GWL guests (I think there was a plan for that years ago... maybe... I've slept a few nights since then).

Would like to see park change hours to be open later. People wishing to come after work wouldn't get there until >6p. Not much incentive to come out at that point.

We went for the first time on Thursday. Wish they would change times to 1-10 instead of 11-7. If there is any time of the day that is bearable to wear masks outdoors it was at 7:05 as we were walking out. As for the climbing infection rates... Infections aren't happening largely at outdoor venues, it's mostly from tight indoor spaces that feature lots of recirculated air. A doctor acquaintance of mine said that most agree that if we were doing unlimited testing from February-April, there were likely days that there would have been in excess of 150,000 daily cases tallied. I think ki is safe. We'll be back this week. Just be smart, protect the vulnerable, and live life. I know someone that was in excellent health, a certified germophobe, wore a mask since March, stayed away from crowds, and lived as sterile as he could have been. Was killed in an auto accident late June. We're not guaranteed tomorrow; don't live stupidly, but live life and not cowered into a corner. I mean, let's be honest, when ever again will we see lines for a new roller coaster be near walk on. Reserve your spot and enjoy the park!

Had a much longer post before trying to upload to a now-deleted thread. PRE-COVID: my guess is that CF had plans already in motion when the decision was made to bring Vortex down as a 2021 attraction(s). It's too marquee a location to not have an equally marquee attraction inhabit the spot. Just like SOB stood SBNO for a few years even though there was no intention to reopen- it stood until Banshee was ready to build. It would have been easy to leave Vortex standing until something new was ready. CONTEXT: prospect to first ride can take 3+ years to do; so, at a minimum, Vortex's demise has been in the making since at least 2018, maybe sooner- well after the decision of Orion's location was made. COVID has likely drastically changed the timeline. PRESENT DAY: had they known the future, Vortex would probably still be standing. But, now that it's down, you have to do something there while you figure out time- it really depends on where they were in the design process. My guess is that the internal conversations within CF have been punted to after Opening Day 2021- and this may end up being an attraction(s) for 2023. It may be after that, but I'm assuming CF has already invested a chunk of change for this and whatever it is will be done sooner or later. WHAT I THINK: First, doesn't matter. Second- will give anyway. I think that the location where the loading station across from WindSeeker will become a larger pedestrian area- possibly extending back to SRR. My guess is that when KMAA was built they knew that "soon" the walkway would be widened. The footprint of Vortex itself will become a small handful of attractions with an eventual coaster installed to bookend the back of the park once again- possibly built in phases.

When ride ops do that, it just comes off as poor training. Maybe park supervisors encourage it.... I highly doubt it though; it's more of a blind eye and trying to be the "cool" supervisor. If they want to make effective use of the PA system, then help theme up their ride- stop the idiotic telling people to enjoy your ride on The Beast- when they are on Diamondback. Use the mic to reinforce the ride and theme. Haven't been yet this year but Orion looks to be about as well themed as anything they've installed in a while. There's a story there- i hope the ride ops use creativity to "theme" it.

he did. State was served a lawsuit... Dewine relented.

maybe sooner than July... Ohio HB665 submitted to Dewine with bipartisan support to all for immediate reopening of amusements parks, zoos, and waterparks. He could veto it.... but i doubt he will.

Not a conspiracy theory person at all... but Georgia mostly reopened 3-4 weeks ago. MANY were saying it was stupid; they'll be the next New York, just wait- it'll be just like Italy. Result- daily infection and death rate have been flat since March 30. Florida reopened... infection rate scaling down- death rates flat. We've been trained to hear that places reopening equals a huge spike in the virus. I think that parks (KI, CF, Six, etc...) need to get open. Lobby the states to push the start of school to Labor day to give 'that much longer" and restore 4 weeks to the summer operations (which, by the way, employ a ton of people). Politically I don't think I agree with five things Bill Maher says. I respect what he says because he's incredibly consistent and doesn't usually flip between popular views- even if I do disagree with it. He is spot on in the video he had on May 1. It doesn't contain "family friendly" language so I won't post the link here- but I agree 100%.

agreed.

If Ohio follows the same trajectory as Georgia has- which despite opening back up 2-3 weeks ago has had an infection curve that's been basically flat since March 31- opening sooner than July could be possible. With any virus or infectious bacteria- being outdoors is the best place one can be rather than being cooped up breathing the same air over and over. Regardless, when they do open- we're looking at what will be the most sanitary environment EVER at the park. My guess is that disinfectant was NEVER used on line queues throughout the year, even when the random patron blew chunks in the lines.... Now, maybe several times daily for a while after opening.

parks will probably opt to play "small ball" for a few years to freshen the parks and add cost-effective experience-driven attractions and addons.

I'm in agreement with most of your post. But the context of my post wasn't to compare the death rates of COVID-19 to Cardio Vascular Disease. It was to say that the way that policy makers have addressed the current situation is going to have a fairly significant unintended consequence in the coming few years.

this can go back and forth. I'm more concerned of the 8-12% uptick in cardio vascular disease that will be brought on from shelter in place, lack of mobility, no exercise that comes from just not being out. 640,000 die from cardio vascular disease every year. a 10% increase is an additional 64,000 in that tally. That's my demographic. Disney, Universal, and apparently Six are looking to open on or around June 1. My guess is that Cedar Fair properties won't be too far behind. I, for one, cannot wait to get out and begin to resume some semblance of a routine. Really, I just want a haircut.

I'll reply since I've posted death rate stats. Over the last 6 weeks many people (myself included) have stored an extra pound or two... or three on our frame that otherwise wouldn't have been there had this not come up. I am of the age and demographic that will be staring down the barrel of a spike in cardio vascular disease brought on by these policy moves. Don't get me wrong, I like to get out and live in a place where we can get out and move around... but lets be honest- the weather has been terrible. People have lost jobs and are entering despair, depression, etc... and there has already been an uptick in the suicide rate. close to 650,000 people per year in the US die of Cardio Vascular disease. One of the studies they're not publishing from the CDC is the projected 8-12% rise in cardio vascular disease over the next 18-24 months. That is an annual increase of 52,000-78,000. Again, they're just projections- but it will be substantial either way. I am in that demographic. I don't want to toss around numbers frivolously- but which is the bigger risk? The longer the shelter in place restrictions go on... the more suicide rates will go up. Just the low-end increase projections for Cardio Vascular and Suicide over one year top the current total projections for COVID. These numbers don't even touch unrelated deaths due to the temporary pause in elective surgeries that would otherwise be necessary. This is, unfortunately, the dilemma facing policy makers, and it's not one I would want to make. Not trying to throw darts at the comment- Just giving throwing another opinion into the basket. MOD's, don't delete respectful exchange of ideas. As best I see there's no "ALL CAPS" going on...

A frustrating, yet nice, thing is that the news literally changes every day. Most times- several. I think the antibody tests are the most significant news items to come out. If the results remain consistent with what's happening in California and Chicago (ie- infection rates being 85 times what's reported)- meaning CA would have a total infection tally of 2.5M with total deaths of 1,100. Still a very contagious disease, but that calculation gives a death rate of 0.04%. I look to see what the antibody tests reveal. it's the first set of data that is useful going forward. The infection rate is going to continue going up as more and more testing come online. There was a chart put out by the CDC, dated 4/1, I think when the total deaths numbered 13,130 in the US. Total deaths of everyone in the US under the age of 34 was 129 (or less than 1% of COVID deaths). Add in age 35-44 the total was 3%. Even add in <55 group and it was still 8%. These aren't my numbers, this is the CDC. What does this mean? Everyone from Government to Businesses are still making decisions in the fog with little (but beginning to emerge) data.

Hershey Park (PA) planning to open early June. 2020 Season Passes good through June 29, 2021 (I thought KI would do that). https://www.pennlive.com/entertainment/2020/04/hersheypark-announces-when-they-hope-to-open-for-2020-summer-season-and-news-for-season-pass-holders.html

Wow. That will buy a ton of goodwill for the parks. - little shy on the revenue side though. I would have been happy with a proportional extension and a prorated buy for 2021.

NEVER Mind- it is "through"

so... help me here: "extended into 2021." Leaves some room for interpretation here: is that extended into... as in equivalent to time deducted in 2020- ie- park opens June 1, 2020- so the 2020 Season Pass is good through June 1, 2021? Or is it, season passes are extended "through" 2021?

First, politics is a no-no on the site. Secondly, this is unprecedented in the history of the US and likely the modern world. There is no manual on this. The President can only act on information given and in the absence of data, guess. There is NO evidence that any previous or future administration would handle this differently, better or worse. Dr. Fauci served in the Clinton, Bush, and Obama Adm. He's a smart/intelligent person- and the President and other leaders appear to listen to him (as well as Dr. Birx). So, honestly, don't care what side of the political aisle you sit on- your comment above... (I've deleted several versions of the end of this sentence and will just leave blank).

it is. The projection was between 5-6 million infections. In the end, though, that is up to 36,000+ deaths- mostly of older parent and grandparent age... Let's pray for strong results with the recent treatment options coming out.

I think this one will be different. If multiple waves keep occurring and a vaccine has been showing positive results they may fast track. I'm not medical or in Govt. so is purely my own opinion.