disco2000

And I suspect that the ride-ops don't like the new policy and don't want to be enforcers. Let's look at it from a different perspective - these teenage kids have their heart set to apply for rides and operate their favorite ride, not be a policy enforcer (other than like seat belts must be fastened but you get the idea). Unfortunately our society has changed and park operations have not adapted. Look at historic photos of amusement parks and people are showing up in suits and dresses and compare that to what we see today (I am making a point to that in a minute lol). Society of old generally respected rules and procedures and chain of command, etc. (always exceptions I know because we still had police and jails then too). Current society is me-centered and all about themselves and they are entitled to their opinion AND their opinion is always right, even if it isn't. We must have a selfie while driving and FaceTime our roller coaster ride and try to get a POV to go viral on YouTube. We are turning into a disrespectful society - look no further than all the negativity on social media. What ever happened to if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say anything at all and be respectful of those enforcing rules, laws, polices, etc. Look at the disrespectfulness parents have towards ride-ops doing their job and enforcing the height requirements. The people smoking in the queue and when asked to put it out by a ride op they are ignored... I would suspect if you ask anyone that has worked for a long time in customer service (or being a ride op) and they can probably confirm that their dealings with the public have become disrespectful and negative as time goes on. I think amusement parks need to consider ways to combat this other than more of the same. Adding more signs with no enforcement isn't going to cut it. One suggestion would be to increase security staff and have someone in a security outfit be the one doing the height measurements and enforcing the policies at the rides and not ride-ops. Most teenage kids that wanted to work rides does not want to be an enforcer, so decrease the ride staff and replace it with the policy enforcer security staff. That doesn't mean that some of the public will still not be disrespectful when their child doesn't meet the height requirement or security takes someone's phone, but it would probably have more teeth than a teenage ride-op that doesn't want the confrontation to begin with and is counting the minutes until they can get back into the ride station! Make the penalty severe too - kick them out of the park, take their phone away for the day and they can retrieve when they leave, revoke season pass, etc. But simply adding a sign and not enforcing it will just result in more knee-jerk responses and ruin it for those that know how to properly secure their items... For the ride-ops on this forum - if you are comfortable saying so, would you agree that you would rather not be the enforcer of these policies and let someone in security handle these? And get off my lawn

Well when you put it that way, everything in this forum is #FirstWorldProblems. Just off the top of my head with no searching I can think of the following complaints in this forum: ERT isn't long enough ERT doesn't include the right rides ERT should include more of the park Season pass holders should get more benefits KI should have a member's favorite soft drink Meal plan duration between meals is too long KI needs a giga Winterfest should be open longer and the list goes on...you see my point... For those that read the thread, BoddaH wasn't "complaining" - as a long term park goer and member of this forum and former moderator he was simply educating the forum on a problem he had experienced and wasn't aware of the 15 minute rule and obviously thought others should know about. That FAQ about 15 minutes could have been added after said plan was purchased - nobody knows for sure since they don't have revision date on when things are modified. And in all his years attending the park he never experienced that. When was the 15 minute gap implemented - I don't think it was during the first year - certainly it was in response to the abuse happening with the drink plan. BoddaH even mentioned he was fine with the 15 minute gap, and his issue was that from a communications standpoint it should be front and center on the purchase page just like the meal plan times are was the point he was trying to make and is being lost by everyone. I guess we should just shut down this #FirstWorldProblems forum

Yes, they removed the Winterfest 2018 calendar last week. They had a lot more days and an earlier opening time of 2pm on Saturdays. A few weeks prior to that they had started removing operating days off their calendar, including weekends between Haunt and Winterfest. No doubt they are taking a serious look at what days to open and hours. Is it a result of the poor quarter or simply coincidental? The question will be will we see KI Winterfest calendar removed as the revise it or will it stay as is. What about other parks having Winterfest new this year - will they already cut back on what they planned? Kings Dominion has not released their calendar yet. And of course as you mentioned, will anything be cut from KI Winterfest... Keep in mind CF operating calendars always have the "Dates and hours subject to change" disclaimer, but it is probably good from a communication standpoint to remove the calendar until they are sure it is good. Imagine people making plans to go to Carowinds Winterfest on December 31st and not come back and look at the calendar and find they eliminated it (if that is what they do)...

According to the official KI replier on the official KI FB page, yes your BAF guest gets in on ERT...your mileage may vary...

It seems that ticket price integrity is being compromised more and more... I would think this is the knee-jerk reaction to CF attendance and revenue declines this year and continuing during this third quarter. What if we see BAF during Haunt and Winterfest... I wouldn't be surprised if during the 2019 season pass sale coming up soon that they offer purchase a pass before September 30th and get in the rest of 2018 with a 2019 season pass. We know under CF they have usually offered a visit once offer, but I think we have to go back to Paramount days for get in the rest of the season offers. And I fully expect those that currently have a season pass will complain that they are getting nothing special from their renewal while those purchasing a new pass get additional benefits... I picked September 30th for a reason...to increase revenue during this present quarter and increase attendance during 4th quarter. Should those numbers be disappointing, then that deadline would be extended...just like gold pass...

Ask Universal about their dueling coaster...between that and the loose article issues at Steel Vengeance at Cedar Point, I don't see a dueling coaster in our future... Mean Streak at Cedar Point was remodeled to Steel Vengeance and Hurler at Kings Dominion was remodeled to Twisted Timbers...How is that working out for them in terms of operation and attendance... Many of the bathrooms have been updated...which one dates back to the 70s?

Even if they wash them before they enter the park (doubtful) I can't tell you how many people I see leave a bathroom stall with cup in hand and don't wash their hands after using the facilities... Be thankful that they got away from food workers making your food and touching those souvenir cups to refill and went to self dispensing...at least now the workers haven't touched an unsanitary cup and then made your food...unless the people in front of you had the hot chocolate refillable cups at Winterfest...

You and a couple hundred thousand people amongst the CF chain are apparently doing the same thing! I have mentioned to others and this certainly validates what I have said that Winterfest has caused KI fatigue. Now that the park is open for so much longer, folks are getting their "fix" more months of the year and without a long off-season, many are still burned out from the previous year and are feeling like your sentiment of visit later...The park is certainly counting on having a great Winterfest and CF is banking on a great Winterfest turnout in their parks that have it, but what if the weather is really bad and the crowds stay away or people feel oh we did that last year and stay away this year...CF could then be looking at 3 consecutive quarters of down results to start 2019...what impacts will that have short-term and long term?

Wow - am I surprised at the backlash this post has got from forum members - by many of which that are quick to cry foul for the tiniest of things. A member was simply presenting his experience and to educate those that may not know or have experienced the same thing. Let's point to some facts and inconsistencies: KI has demonstrated changing things after purchases - Haunt is included with season pass then it isn't then it back is; changes to meal plan (documented in my post above) and then changed back. Changes to meal plan locations and offerings even during the season (including this year). Now granted many of these were "corrected" probably in part to comments expressed in this forum, but some stick. You are not provided with a written contract stipulating what you are purchasing and agreeing to. Sure there is language on the back of the season pass and on-line. But it has a catch all that items are subject to change at any time and without any notice. Contrast that to many other items with terms and conditions - when there are changes to your credit card or bank account terms and conditions, you are presented with those usually in the mail. FAQ's can be developed and included at any time without notice. When was the 15 minute in-between FAQ added - was it before a single person purchased a drink plan...maybe but I doubt it? A competent attorney could argue that FAQs are not legally binding... Some people will fill their cup and drink half or all of it before leaving the drink dispenser and then proceed to top it off - I am sure that is not the program intent and could be argued as a way of circumventing the 15-minute rule. I see people do that ALL THE TIME. What about those with the souvenir cup - due to inconsistencies of people operating the register, many people never have their cup scanned so they are essentially exempt from the 15-minute rule - now that is not the pass holder problem it is a training issue. Some CF parks will not scan (or at least didn't on days I was there). What about those with the souvenir cup that circumvent the register and go straight to the drink dispenser at the food places - they have made a conscious choice to exempt themselves from the 15-minute rule. It is harder to do at the drink only refresh stations (partly because they are rarely open LOL), but it happens ALL THE TIME at the food places. Since they changed the Chicken Shack exit doors to be locked from outside and added the queue line it doesn't happen there as much anymore, but at Panda, Festhaus, International Skyline, and Hanks it happens way too frequently. Spend a little bit of time at Skyline and watch how many people come thru the back of the line and refill their souvenir cup without ever having their cup scanned. And yes, I have seen forum members do that... In short, basically I have noticed that those with the disposable cup option are the ones that the 15-minute rule seems to target the most as they have to go thru the line to get a new cup. Although I have seen some that keep the cup and do what those with a souvenir cup do...

No they changed after purchase... and thankfully the revised terms never went into effect at KI hopefully partly in response to feedback in this thread...but they could have...did it impact Knott's briefly? One of your quotes from that thread "I just wish that they had either finalized redemption rules when dining plans went on sale or refrained from mentioning them at all."

What about when they changed the meal plan window several years ago after people had purchased their plans...I guess the "subject to change" is the catch all phrase We may recall the healthy debate that change brought on this forum during the off-season.

What about no re-entry after 7pm during Haunt season...

We are a fan site and only the Banshee gift shop has been mentioned. I have counted 12 different types of "cuts" since the quarterly report was announced and that is lumping some things together or the list could be longer. Maybe some are purely coincidental... I suspect that collectively as a forum our attendance numbers are down as well. Let's get to the park and spend money. If we as fans haven't noticed the cuts, the cuts will continue until they are readily obvious to the once per decade visitor. By then it may be too late. I heard some funny they are doing "insert comment here" to save money anecdotes, so people are noticing. I watched a dude with a souvenir cup on Banshee walk up to line and was told he couldn't take it on and he chucked it into the garbage and mumbled he wasn't going to come back to this place anyway as he couldn't find places to refill the cup. He certainly didn't experience #KIBestDay and many aren't either. Droves of people certainly didn't on Friday. Attendance was low today. Walk-on for a night-time Beast front-row seat. Has the precedent now been set that the park may close if the guest count gets too low or it rains, so people will now only come when there is no chance or rain? It appears that way reading FB comments. Certainly not a way to increase attendance. I am not expecting the next quarterly report to be any more encouraging, which could really have an impact on Haunt and Winterfest...

Unfortunately lots of stuff coming out - basically anything in a back pocket is fair game to be tossed - phones/wallets/etc. Lots of wallets have been lost despite Velcro back pockets! Maybe this is baby steps in the big picture to address it and will get more stringent as time goes on. I think the ride ops are going to hear a lot of "I could have my phone with me last time I rode it"...(cross threading from the yelling at ride ops thread number one complaint with kids measurements)

^Oh the irony in that. That is classic! Love it! Thanks for posting LOL

iPod Touch can connect to park wifi to FB live your POV ride As for now your Pet Rock is allowed lol. Actually until they figure it out, similar to KD, unless you have your phone out going into the line or they see it out in the line it can probably be in your pocket. I guess we will need to see if anyone at CP reports back how they are actually enforcing. I believe right now it is self policing like most the other rules...

Too bad on the Twisted Timbers incident the dude got his cell phone back and walked away before anyone got his name, etc...hard for him to be held personally liable...

And the Big Red Machine was before cell phones so we don't have to worry about them on this ride Butterfly collars and bell bottoms optional, disco music required LOL Any who, in a little over a year, we will find out the day before National Roller Coaster day that Orion takes the place of Firehawk and will be marketed as a 300 foot drop (KI giga lol) and be 5,321 feet long with X-Base becoming Area 72

And an iPod touch would be allowed why? I know/hope your comment is being sarcastic because the SV sign specifically says no cell phones...so if you take your SIM card out of your mobile device is it no longer a phone?

Oh it will get there...give them time...they are also trying to enforce something similar at KD Twisted Timbers... Let's face it we all knew this was a possibility thanks to a few people not following the rules. And if violations still occur, metal detectors at rides will be next...

I also believe the "no loose article" policy is resulting in the unintended consequences phenomenon. In addition to the reasons above, there are numbers of people that based on comments they read on social media have decided to not visit the parks due to the locker rental policy... Here is a fun fact showing the phenomenon of unintended consequences of implementing something intended to fix a problem. In Ohio there have been more deaths/accidents attributed to texting while driving since the law went into effect banning driving while texting. Why is that - before the law, people would text with both arms on top of the steering wheel texting up there where they had peripheral vision around them - so they were still distracted driving but had some benefit of peripheral vision. Now that the law is in effect, people are now texting with the phone in their lap so other drivers and police cannot see their phone. Once they did that the peripheral vision is now no longer the road...Something to think about!

Well I was being a little sarcastic (I think), but not too far off. Earlier in the day while waiting for a break at the front of the line to ask questions I heard the security guard there at the time tell a group of teen girls "go hang your bags on the fence nobody will steal them while I'm here". When nobody was at the entrance I mentioned to the security guard and the ride op that their sister park KI would never allow that and in fact I have seen several times at KI where kids have tried to hide their bags and then watch security take them up to lost and found lol. They just shook their heads that KI would do that. Nobody I talked to saw the problem with that. One of them told me just their presence was a deterrent from someone stealing a bag. What ride does KI have a security guard at the entrance all day on a typical weekday? Granted I wasn't at the ride all day, but at the times I rode or went by, it was the guard telling people to hang them on the fence not the ride op. The poor kid working the lockers looked like the Maytag repair man lol (see if anyone gets that).

While at Kings Dominion to see friends thought I would share a big difference between KI and KD regarding bags. Take a look at this picture - although they have lockers, KD is encouraging folks to just put their bags on the entry fence and they are nice enough to provide a security guard to watch over the bags lol. Would never see this at KI...When I asked a security guard they were like its just simple southern hospitality. It has been that way all year with bags BTW... Since the cell phone incident they are watching more - if you go into line with one out they will generally stop you. If you are on the top platform past separator and pull phone out they will come to you and make you put it in a zippered pocket or leave line...not real consistent yet in enforcement but better than nothing and probably a sign of things to come...

I hate the "screaming that she rode it earlier part" every time I hear it. It never works.... Just because you were speeding on the I71 and didn't get caught doesn't mean you won't get caught next time lol. I bet that mindset works well when an officer pulls her over - well I sped here last time and didn't get a ticket...

But to be devil's advocate and to remain considerate of all guests...where is the line drawn...and at what point...would two people of same sex doing the same thing not bring out a complaint to a park employee nearby or guest services from someone thinking that was wrong? It has and has got heated. And please let's not let this get political because that is not my intent at all. I am just bringing up actual situations that have happened to try to justify employee response and park procedure. Now granted, which ones are enforced and which ones aren't are always a topic of debate on these forums...