sccard01 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Kentucky Kingdom is backk! but the court issues still live on:( Ed Hart Has Kentucky Kingdom BACK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast1979 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 *happy dance* Go Hart! It looks like all of rcfreak339's senseless optimism has paid off! In all seriousness, I can't wait for 2011. It'll be great to see what they do with the park in the next year, and all of the things to come in future years. Go Kentucky Kingdom! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dbfan Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Like Like Like Like Like. Maybe we can see KK be returned to its former glory. Any verdict on Chang yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 NO. Kentucky Kingdom is NOT back. ALL that has happened so far is the Fair Board has "approved a proposal to reach a deal with Hart and his KK Redevelopment Co. by late July." From the article you posted. So...the Fair Board has approved a proposal to reach a deal. Development could cost up to $20 million. Of that, Mr. Hart MAY contribute $3 million. Maybe. I smell posturing. This is not a park being reopened. At least not yet. And the whole issue of rides that may well belong to Six Flags remains to be addressed. The article acts like this is a push-over issue, easily resolved. It probably is, too. But not in the Commonwealth of Kentucky's favor. Moral: DO NOT COUNT YOUR RE-OPENED PARKS BEFORE THEY HAPPEN. This may never happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DropZone99 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 So excited, I'm just wandering on what attractions it'll have still, or if any new ones. I'd like to get a season pass so I could visit alot and help out the park, but at the same time if it's over $70, thats too much since I'll be getting a SF/CF/HW/IB season pass next year. And about Chang, no it's 99% likely to be going to SFGAm after last nights meeting which approved it being built and a blue print photo was leaked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Again...I can't see this park opening this year, and I'd lay 70 percent odds on this particular proposal never happening.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveStroem Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 But IF it does re-open, lets hope they get Stella and Lola open again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Given that those two coasters are almost certainly the two wooden coasters I have ridden more than any other, I'd completely and totally agree. Terp, huge fan of Lola...especially in the front right seat (and yes, he was a HUGE fan, gigglesnort!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 More details on this, with more background: http://louisville.bizjournals.com/louisville/stories/2010/05/24/daily41.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyMan98 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 I need to go to KK, it seems like a good place, since all of you are so happy! I doubt it would open this year, because it's already into the season for amusement parks and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark6495 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 so I may be confused about the ownership of the rides..... 1. part of me says that hey if the park was being run by SF then the rides belong with them. They have every right to claim each and every ride, and if they wanted to they could just burn the rides on site (obviously not burn but you get the point) 2. the other part of me says if the land is being leased from Kentucky then they can claim some broken lease and use the rides as collateral.... 3. SHouldnt the owner of the rides be clear cut? usually its who ever owns the park..... I guess what I dont understand and someone point it out to me.... Was KK owned by kentucky and the land, rides and park just leased to SF, or did SF own KK and just lease the land? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mini_Cooper Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 While we may be counting our chickens before they hatched, I have to say (as a college student) that it is exciting to see that the park will be re-opening. Think about it 1,000 seasonal jobs lost as well as 55-60 full time. Seeing this first hand by being a college student in Louisville, the closing of the park has had a huge impact on Louisville's economy especially on that end of town. I am looking forward to the reopening of Kentucky Kingdom. Keep in mind though that this is pretty much going to be a park in its baby stages all over again. So, it is going to have to attract a substantial amount of visitors in order to finance things for the future to bring in more ride (and hopefully coaster) offerings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KI Kevin Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Uh, I think that the people in Louisville would flock back to KK if it reopened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Was KK owned by kentucky and the land, rides and park just leased to SF, or did SF own KK and just lease the land? Yes and yes. (a new variation) Some rides were on lands owned by the Commonwealth of Kentucky and leased to Six Flags. Others were on land wholly owned by Six Flags, Inc, and in which the state had no interest. Six Flags continues to own that latter mentioned land...and may or may not be all that willing to sell it to the Fair Board and/or the Commonwealth, given some of the "tales" those in high places have told about the company, few of which have the added benefit of being true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark6495 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 I now agree with you terp... the odds of this being hammered out this year are bleak... maybe even next year.... How would this work... You have part of the park reopen under the lease terms etc, and the other half of the park remains closed while SF mulls what to do with it..... Sine you seem to be the man in the know.... did SF put the rides on the leased land? if they did wouldnt that make them the rightful owners? I mean I put my futon in my apartment but its still my futon.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 Under the common law, if an item is "firmly attached to the realty and cannot be removed without substantial damage," it becomes part of the real estate. If it can easily be removed without damage, it does not. The intentions of the parties also can govern in close cases. If the lease specifies what is what and what belongs to who, it would govern. In this case, it apparently does not, which doesn't say much good about the drafter of the lease (who, I presume, was an attorney for the Commonwealth of Kentucky and/or Fair Board, since it was the ultimate landlord). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shark6495 Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 so thats like if I put in a basketball hoop in the back parking lot, which required pouring of new cement, etc. Then when I move out since I can not remove it with out destroying the land then its officially my landlords? I think I understand.... But what constitutes substantial damage? Parks leave footers behind on rides all the time.... (Terp I know that you may not know and if you do you may not be allowed to say).... Plus if SF would repave the whole place after removing the rides.... yup I can see this sitting in court for a few weeks.... lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KI Kevin Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 But what constitutes substantial damage? Such is a variation of the eternal question of the US Court System. What constitutes "commerce"? It's the court's decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 27, 2010 Share Posted May 27, 2010 What is and is not substantial damage is a legal issue, and normally legal issues are decided by the judge. Some would say what is and is not substantial damage is a factual issue, and factual issues are decided by juries, when there is one. In any event, this is far from an open and shut case for the Commonwealth/Fair Board. And with Mr. Hart only putting up $3 million of a proposed $20 million project (IF negotiations go well), one must wonder where the $17 million is really going to come from: a. That figure seems VERY low to me, and not realistic. b. Who would want to fund a project like this with all the legal issues still undecided? c. With the Commonwealth in the precarious financial shape it is in, who would want to risk their political career on funding this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyGuy4KI Posted May 28, 2010 Share Posted May 28, 2010 What is and is not substantial damage is a legal issue, and normally legal issues are decided by the judge. Some would say what is and is not substantial damage is a factual issue, and factual issues are decided by juries, when there is one. In any event, this is far from an open and shut case for the Commonwealth/Fair Board. And with Mr. Hart only putting up $3 million of a proposed $20 million project (IF negotiations go well), one must wonder where the $17 million is really going to come from: a. That figure seems VERY low to me, and not realistic. b. Who would want to fund a project like this with all the legal issues still undecided? c. With the Commonwealth in the precarious financial shape it is in, who would want to risk their political career on funding this? How many KK people are going to visit Holiday World this year and fall in love with that park and loose interest in this one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sccard01 Posted May 28, 2010 Author Share Posted May 28, 2010 many people in louisville like holiday world more then kentucky kingdom since holiday world adds rides every year and Six Flags kentucky kingdom rides were rusted and dirty, and no rides were added but 2 or 3 water slides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 28, 2010 Share Posted May 28, 2010 Holiday World draws many visitors from Nashville, believe it or not. It is a MAJOR market for them. Once Louisville people make the trek to Santa Claus, it will be hard to get them to go to Crittenden Drive again.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purplehaze Posted May 28, 2010 Share Posted May 28, 2010 But your futon is not attached to the leased land. A ride is considered a structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Interpreter Posted May 28, 2010 Share Posted May 28, 2010 Some are, some are not. Many rides are in fact easily moved...even if they are attached to the realty. Then again, so are houses. Cases like this often make very bad law. To complicate matters even further, this matter will be decided by a bankruptcy court, whose duty it normally is to maximize recovery for the creditors...this will not make things easy for someone who claims they, and the the bankrupt, owned property the bankrupt claims. I should add the state taxed the rides as personal property, and happily collected the personal property tax on them.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sethdawg17 Posted May 28, 2010 Share Posted May 28, 2010 But IF it does re-open, lets hope they get Stella and Lola open again. If I remember correctly the current state of Twisted Twins is not a good one. I remember seeing a photo of how Mile High Falls and Twisted Twins were very run down since they were closed and sectioned off. Of course I am not saying it may never open again, but at its state now its probably not rideable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sccard01 Posted May 28, 2010 Author Share Posted May 28, 2010 maybe, but more people here in louisville rather go to Holiday World then kentucky Kingdom, its only 45 min away. Everytime you say something about Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom they always say it Sucks, it doddie, its weak... Holiday World is much better. I wonder since Kentucky Kingdom is no longer Six Flags, will Kentucky Kingdom and Holiday World have like a deal were you buy a season pass to either parks and get unlimited visit to each park? just a thought! WHen I worked at Kentucky Kingdom last year, you could go to Holiday world howmany times you wanted!You just needed to show your work i.d. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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