WHO'S READY TO SEE A MIDGET BLEED?

[markr]

^^

The way Cedar Fair markets their parks almost entirely towards teenagers and young adults, restricting their entry would be oxymoronic. and would definitely cause record falls in attendance. Slowly easing the park back towards families would be the best bet towards eliminating the problem. But that's not how Cedar Fair runs their parks.

I wouldn't put the blame entirely on teenagers themselves... What is the park promoting in their commercials? What exactly are they saying to the people who visit? "No one and nothing is off limits." "WHO'S READY TO SEE A MIDGET BLEED!?" And, my favorite of them all, "Last Haunt was only a bad dream, compared to this year."

We shall see...

(A final note... You are correct that I have never been to a wrestling event. I'll make it my duty to watch the Half Pit Brawlers show as well as keep my eyes open around the rest of the park. That way, I can learn just how correct (or incorrect) I am. I'll be shutting up, until then.)

I have been going to the Holloween events at both KI and CP since they first started. The events at KI have always been dark and intense, what I would characterize as not "family friendly" way before Cedar Fair took over while the events at CP have always been more light hearted and fun, ie, more family friendly. I, therefore, don't think it is fair to characterize KI's events as not being family friendly solely because of Cedar Fair when they never really have been family friendly.

[Coney Islander]

Cedar Fair has, though inadvertently, promoted misbehavior at Halloween Haunt.

I myself see no problem with any of Kings Island's walk- through attractions and love Hot Blooded... Its just that having a bloody, violent fight show and serving alcohol at the same time doesn't sound much better than a game of Russian Roulette.

I suppose Kings Island has the ability to up security throughout the rest of the park, but what about inside the haunted attractions? After all, certain walk through haunts (like Trail of Terror) are quite a ways away from the rest of the park and don't have all too quick a way for security to arrive. Keep in mind that in a dangerous situation, every second counts.

Should a problem arise in one of the walk- through haunts, will the security guards be able to reach that area before any injury takes place? How will a scare actor protect himself if a drunken park guest verbally or physically abuses him or her? What about other park guests? How will the security find out, should a fight break out half way along Trail of Terror?

Lets hope Kings Island has got answers to all of these questions.

[Browntggrr]

The way Cedar Fair markets their parks almost entirely towards teenagers and young adults, restricting their entry would be oxymoronic. and would definitely cause record falls in attendance.

Oxymoronic? Intresting.... I always thought HH as a living dead event during a time that a dark sunshine covers the park.

So, if I am understanding your point (and please, correct me if I am wrong)- It is ok to allow teens into the park that have already been unruly to other guests given the marketing stratagies of CF and the fear of an attendance fallout.

-But-

KI should not try an event, for the first time, marketed for adults for fear of what kind of: attitude, guests, or attendance figures it will bring to the park.

Now please don't take my example the wrong way. I am in no way endorsing that teens are not allowed into the park, but simply bringing up issues that I have seen personally and have also been talked about at KIC for many years with no practical solution.

[KIfan1980]

My family & I have been disrespected numerous times at different parks by teenagers who insist on smoking, line jumping, running through the park, and being in off-limit areas.

I hate this stereotype almost as much as I hate this Half-Pint Brawlers idea. Adults often forget who raised these rowdy teens.

A reality in life is that the actions of a few often impact the perception of a group in a negative way. All you can do (which I know you do) is continue to act responsible when you are at a park and encourage your friends to do the same.

Also, some of us would probably criticize/complain today if we saw teenagers doing things we did as teenagers.

^^

The way Cedar Fair markets their parks almost entirely towards teenagers and young adults, restricting their entry would be oxymoronic. and would definitely cause record falls in attendance. Slowly easing the park back towards families would be the best bet towards eliminating the problem. But that's not how Cedar Fair runs their parks.

I wouldn't put the blame entirely on teenagers themselves... What is the park promoting in their commercials? What exactly are they saying to the people who visit? "No one and nothing is off limits." "WHO'S READY TO SEE A MIDGET BLEED!?" And, my favorite of them all, "Last Haunt was only a bad dream, compared to this year."

We shall see...

I have been going to the Holloween events at both KI and CP since they first started. The events at KI have always been dark and intense, what I would characterize as not "family friendly" way before Cedar Fair took over while the events at CP have always been more light hearted and fun, ie, more family friendly. I, therefore, don't think it is fair to characterize KI's events as not being family friendly solely because of Cedar Fair when they never really have been family friendly.

markr - I think you make a great point here. A big difference between Kings Island and Cedar Point is that KI separates out "Howl-O-Fest" and "Haunt" and general park operating hours, while CP celebrates "HalloWeekends" fully (although with some changes at night). This allows KI to push boundaries of darkness and intensity for Haunt, which in recent history seems to have invited the criticism and concerns raised in this thread and does impact (to what degree is unknown to us) their ability to advertise themselves as a family friendly amusement/theme park the rest of the year.

[Coney Islander]

My first point:

Its not all right for anyone to break Kings Island's rules. It just seems odd to be having bloody fighting in a park in which fighting is obviously not allowed... Keep in mind, this is the same park that has had problems with unruly guests in previous years. (Not entirely too different than Cedar Point's selling of clothes that break the dress code...)

And, for your question, teenagers are Cedar Fair's largest source of income. Most of Kings Island's advertising is aimed toward them. Designing the park toward being appealing to teenagers and then refusing their entry would be perplexing, to say the least. Thats not to say guests that have had problems before should be allowed in... They absolutely should not.

My second point:

Cedar Fair has the ability to do whatever it wants with Kings Island. Kings Island is a private property. They don't have to even consider anything KICentral members have to say about the park. That being said, Half Pint Brawlers will likely be a big hit at the park and cause big jumps in short term attendance.

BUT, in my opinion, the park seems to have incorrectly weighed the possibility of certain things the Half Pint Brawlers might cause. What affect would a big fight have on Kings Island's future? Both insurance rates and attendance figures have the chance of being drastically different by the end of the Haunt season...

In my final opinion, Kings Island is taking far too great a risk to be worth the result.

Edit: I sure hope I've clarified my thoughts on the topic. Sometimes my posting doesn't seem to make any sense.

Edited September 21, 2010 by Coney Islander

[RingMaster]

People seem to be forgetting the fact that this is less of what Cedar Fair, as a company, is doing with the Haunt and more on what the individual PARK (ie: Kings Island) is doing. Aside from the former Paramount Parks getting a Club Blood for their Haunt in 2007, they've more or less been left alone to do whatever the heck they want to do. Hence why you'll see one Haunt receive a Doll Factory but another gets a Slaughterhouse or a Camp Killuae (or h/e you spell it). If Cedar Fair had full control over Haunt, we'd have the exact same lineup of houses that either Knott's Berry Farm or Cedar Point has.

[markr]

^Exactly the point I was trying to make.

[Gordon Bombay]

Given your unexperienced criteria of what type of people attend these events, do you also suggest to not allow all teenagers into the park without parental supervision?

I wish.

[bkroz]

I would say "or maybe you should have to be 16 or older to get in without an adult," but isn't that pretty much already a policy? And even then, I visited when I was fifteen, and was absolutely respectful. So maybe instead, there should just be a test to get in... After all, maturity and age are not the same thing. Sometimes, they're not even related.

[The Interpreter]

I thought there was a test to get in. I seem to have failed it at Carowinds early this season...

[alluna]

My first point:

Its not all right for anyone to break Kings Island's rules. It just seems odd to be having bloody fighting in a park in which fighting is obviously not allowed... Keep in mind, this is the same park that has had problems with unruly guests in previous years. (Not entirely too different than Cedar Point's selling of clothes that break the dress code...)

There are people getting disemboweled in Urgent Scare. I don't think they allow that at Kings Island, either. Shut it down!

[Snowman]

My first point:

Its not all right for anyone to break Kings Island's rules. It just seems odd to be having bloody fighting in a park in which fighting is obviously not allowed... Keep in mind, this is the same park that has had problems with unruly guests in previous years. (Not entirely too different than Cedar Point's selling of clothes that break the dress code...)

There are people getting disemboweled in Urgent Scare. I don't think they allow that at Kings Island, either. Shut it down!

I sincerely hope people aren't REALLY getting disembowled at this thing! The midgets are REALLY BLEEDING, and using office equipment in ways that aren't recommended! Talk about a tough job interview:

"So... the job is you'll be dressing up in a Halloween costume and acting like a patient in a haunted maze... pays a little better than minimum wage....How does that sound?"... "Ok I guess".... "Great you can get started this weekend, we have some paperwork for you to fill out.....one other thing, How do you feel about REALLY being disembowled?".... "Changed your mind huh.... Ok, how 'bout letting a midget staplegun your forhead until you really bleed?..... No.... wait..... come back!!!"

[TombRaiderFTW]

^ I love humor in passionately serious threads. (No, really. That was probably one of the funniest things I've ever heard on KIC.)

I'm going to be very honest, and I hope my opinion can at least be respected. This event doesn't get under my skin nearly as much as the dead celebrities did last year. That's not to say that it couldn't be perceived as offensive; it really comes down to how KI handles it. And honestly, I'll be at Haunt this Friday.

First off, this is not something that is disrespectful to the families of the actors (which, realistically, is what the wrestlers are). This is their job. This is something they enjoy. If it wasn't, why would they do it professionally? There aren't "midget hunters" lurking about, trying to capture anyone under 4'6" so they can throw them in the ring until they fight to the death. They do this voluntarily, and if someone like Kings Island wants to hire them to do what they like, that's the wrestlers' own business.

The celebrity displays, on the contrary? Why didn't we see or hear of Greg Scheid or Dick Kinzel talking with Steve McNair's family to gain their permission for the display? Because it was offensive on a personal level to these people, and even trying to do so might have earned Cedar Fair a lawsuit. And because it was so personal, I was utterly disgusted and floored. To quote myself on KIE:

Without launching into a spiel, I'm leaving it at this:

KI has crossed a personal line that shouldn't be crossed.

My pass renewal now lies in question.

And I wondered to myself then: Where are the people who loved Cedar Fair because they're bringing the park back to the pre-Paramount, "classic" days? No one answered that call, because no one could justify that that was what Taft or KECO would do. Because Taft or KECO wouldn't have done it.

The "blood" will not be real; it will be just as much of a prop as every last office supply or other weapon they use. They will come out the other end of a show just fine. I do not buy this "they actually cut themselves" business, because you can't sincerely try to tell me that there's a legal business anywhere here in the good ol' health-precautioning US of A where it's required for the employees to do themselves physical harm. Come on.

Furthermore, I cannot comprehend why this activity is suddenly sending off the health alerts... Those worried about the sweat getting flung around best try taking a look at the crowd in the Festhaus on days like the humid, blazing 4th of July, 2010, when the Festhaus was packed and had absolutely no air conditioning. Or on the average day in Coney Mall, when too many rides on the Scrambler paints Coney Mall's asphault the colors of a five million dollar LaRosa's pizza. Or on any ride ever with OTSRs, where many times during the summer months I've gotten the fantastically piercing stink of sweat or B.O. You will not be in any more risk of getting sweat in your Sprite while wrestling midgets do their thing on a stage at least ten feet away from you than you will any other day at the park. The health "risk" will not be a risk in the least, because why would ¢edar Fair expose themselves to further lawsuits like that? SBNOSOB '09 and '10, anyone?

Now please understand this: I do not like the idea of this being at the park. Any wrestling at all is beyond uninteresting in my opinion, and adding midgets to it is just generally tasteless. (That's "tasteless," not "an attack at the personal level". At that, it does not have a strong effect on my attendance this year... but continue.) But like I said before, it really comes down to how KI handles it if they're going to add it. If this wrestling actually brings in rowdy "white trash" as the multitudes of you who haven't been to a single one of these events claim, then it's up to KI to ensure that these guests don't cause issues. What gets me is how much widespread doubt there is that KI will be able to handle these allegedly rowdy crowds. And I'm not going to condemn those of you who think so, because I honestly agree. I don't think they've perceived just how much of an issue this might be (at least, according to the people who've never experienced it firsthand).

And now I ask again: Where are the people who love how Cedar Fair is bringing the park back to its "classic" feel? Anyone?

Cedar Fair management does not and will not do things like the old times. Management-wide Blackberries aren't tools, they're toys to be disposed of. New rides aren't supposed to be small and have theme; just give it something that can have an adjective ending in "-est" for the advertisements. New Haunt attractions are to bring controversy. For all of this, Cedar Fair wants nickels in return.

And because of that, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, for one key point: they want nickels. If what I've read in this thread is understood correctly, Haunt attendance has hardly wavered in spite of the controversial additions it's had basically every year since at least '06. Because these controversies aren't dangerous... unlike so-called "drunken," "white trash" mobs ready to cause a fight at a second's notice. If KI doesn't control the fights, word will get out, just like it did with the dead celebrity displays. And if a sincere safety risk won't keep people away from KI, then I guess I've misunderstood a lot in my lifetime. If these guest fights are real, then how they're handled will be key to Haunt's survival. But none of us know the truth, and until someone can vouch for having been to one of these events (whether inside or outside KI) I'm still going to be there Friday.

Kings Island's Halloween Haunt: All you fear is here. Where else?

[Coney Islander]

TombRaiderFTW, I totally understand what you're saying and agree with a large part of it, but this show is very, very likely to have real blood... And quite a bit of it. See:

Like I said before, there's a difference between pro wrestling and the wrestling seen in Half-Pint Brawlers.

Pro wrestling is, as you just said, purely scripted, and if there is blood involved, it's usually stage blood.

Half-Pint Brawlers do what they call Backyard Wrestling, which is all real, with real blood. Backyarders also use real weapons in their arsenal, like baseball bats wrapped in barbed wire, fluorescent light tubes, and staple guns. Backyard Wrestling picked up momentum a couple years back when the infamous Insane Clown Posse got involved, as well as had two video games made for last-gen consoles (PS2 and Xbox).

The blood on televised wrestling is in fact real. The performers cut themselves above the hairline. It's called juicing and they've been doing it for years.

Here's a fuller explanation:

http://en.wikipedia....al_wrestling%29

Also, if you're referring to "pro wrestling" as in WWE, don't forget that they repackaged their product as a TVPG rating, which is more kid-friendly. The stuff they did in the late 90s was very similar to this, and is also what put them on the map (and was likely what saved their company from bankruptcy). They have more "hard core" style wrestling around the world, especially in Japan.

Wrestling, although scripted, is in many cases far more real than fake. You can fake stapling someone's head in front of a live crowd. This may not be the lifestyle that everyone chooses, but it's their chosen life.

Most of the people here seem not to be offended by the idea of "Half Pint Brawlers," rather worried how park visitors will behave as a result to this type of attraction... Blood or no blood, Kings Island is promoting fighting within the park grounds.

Also keep in mind that the park serves alcohol during Haunt... And we all know what alcohol can do to a person's reasoning.

Edited September 21, 2010 by Coney Islander

[The Interpreter]

...Kings Island's Halloween Haunt: All you fear is here. Where else?

In my case, I haven't totally decided yet, but one place is likely to be Knoebel's Amusement Resort.

I'm still upset at Brand X, where Al Weber and/or his minions has apparently decided to end Temple of the Tiger, at least for now.

Sigh.

[HTCO]

I'm going to HH on Friday. I will try to take pictures, if my camera will actually decide to take decent night photos.

[muppetfan1999]

^ I'm going for my first time ever on saturday.

[Colonel_SoB_fan]

BTW some of KI management do have Blackberrys. You can see them on them as they walk the park.

[The Interpreter]

Now. More than four years after Dick & Co. initially took them away...

[Browntggrr]

Blood or no blood, Kings Island is promoting fighting within the park grounds.

Kings Island is not promoting fighting on park grounds as this is a staged event. Did the park promote daredevil stunts when Robbie Knievel did his event? What would have happened if RK would have made a mistake and crashed? His event was much more real than this one will ever be- blood or no blood.

Also keep in mind that the park serves alcohol during Haunt... And we all know what alcohol can do to a person's reasoning.

Are you referring to one drink or multiple drinks as alcohol is being served in the park everyday.

[Kirk Sheppard]

The "blood" will not be real; it will be just as much of a prop as every last office supply or other weapon they use. They will come out the other end of a show just fine. I do not buy this "they actually cut themselves" business, because you can't sincerely try to tell me that there's a legal business anywhere here in the good ol' health-precautioning US of A where it's required for the employees to do themselves physical harm. Come on.

YES the blood is REAL. Watch "The Wrestler" with Mickey Rourke to see exactly how it is done. Its quite common. Look at photos of veteran wrestlers who have large scars on their foreheads from doing just what I explained earlier night after night:

Abdullah the Butcher

Dusty Rhodes

Now, this has been done in professional wrestling for over 60 years. Some states like Kentucky have Boxing and Wrestling Commissions who regulate how this can be done or ban it all together. Ohio's Commission does not regulate wrestling as closely as other states and "blading" as its commonly known is permitted. These guys are also probably not "employees" but independent contractors as is the case for all wrestling promotions including TNA and WWE.

[alluna]

My first point:

Its not all right for anyone to break Kings Island's rules. It just seems odd to be having bloody fighting in a park in which fighting is obviously not allowed... Keep in mind, this is the same park that has had problems with unruly guests in previous years. (Not entirely too different than Cedar Point's selling of clothes that break the dress code...)

There are people getting disemboweled in Urgent Scare. I don't think they allow that at Kings Island, either. Shut it down!

I sincerely hope people aren't REALLY getting disembowled at this thing! The midgets are REALLY BLEEDING, and using office equipment in ways that aren't recommended! Talk about a tough job interview:

"So... the job is you'll be dressing up in a Halloween costume and acting like a patient in a haunted maze... pays a little better than minimum wage....How does that sound?"... "Ok I guess".... "Great you can get started this weekend, we have some paperwork for you to fill out.....one other thing, How do you feel about REALLY being disembowled?".... "Changed your mind huh.... Ok, how 'bout letting a midget staplegun your forhead until you really bleed?..... No.... wait..... come back!!!"

So far I can't name one person who has brought a stapler with them to the park. I think we'll be okay.

I like the point made about Robbie Knievel. Since his arrival, I have been keeping an eye out in the KI parking lot, but I have yet to see anyone jump over my car on a motorcycle.

Edited to add:

First off, this is not something that is disrespectful to the families of the actors (which, realistically, is what the wrestlers are). This is their job. This is something they enjoy. If it wasn't, why would they do it professionally? There aren't "midget hunters" lurking about, trying to capture anyone under 4'6" so they can throw them in the ring until they fight to the death. They do this voluntarily, and if someone like Kings Island wants to hire them to do what they like, that's the wrestlers' own business.

I agree here. These people are professionals trying to make money.

The "blood" will not be real; it will be just as much of a prop as every last office supply or other weapon they use. They will come out the other end of a show just fine. I do not buy this "they actually cut themselves" business, because you can't sincerely try to tell me that there's a legal business anywhere here in the good ol' health-precautioning US of A where it's required for the employees to do themselves physical harm. Come on.

I bet a bit is real, but most is fake. Even wrestlers that cut themselves for effect also use blood packs!

Or on the average day in Coney Mall, when too many rides on the Scrambler paints Coney Mall's asphault the colors of a five million dollar LaRosa's pizza.

:lol:

Now please understand this: I do not like the idea of this being at the park. Any wrestling at all is beyond uninteresting in my opinion, and adding midgets to it is just generally tasteless. (That's "tasteless," not "an attack at the personal level". At that, it does not have a strong effect on my attendance this year... but continue.) But like I said before, it really comes down to how KI handles it if they're going to add it. If this wrestling actually brings in rowdy "white trash" as the multitudes of you who haven't been to a single one of these events claim, then it's up to KI to ensure that these guests don't cause issues. What gets me is how much widespread doubt there is that KI will be able to handle these allegedly rowdy crowds. And I'm not going to condemn those of you who think so, because I honestly agree. I don't think they've perceived just how much of an issue this might be (at least, according to the people who've never experienced it firsthand).

I totally agree. I'm not a wrestling fan, but I am still not comprehending the sheer level of disgruntled reaction to these wrestlers. Hopefully it doesn't become a problem, but I don't think it will be the fault of these performers, but how KI handles the situation.

[Snowman]

^ I love humor in passionately serious threads. (No, really. That was probably one of the funniest things I've ever heard on KIC.)

Thanks. I think a little levity is always important.

We're 3 days away from what should be for the most part a really good time. This is my first haunt and I can't wait to experience mostly everything. My wife is nervous about how intense the different haunts are going to be. We're both having coaster withdrawals, and we don't know how we're going to make it through 5 months of winter. So we're planning to make the most of our last few weekends of thrills ( and judging by the weather forecast, CHILLS!!)

Luckily this spectacle will be in the Festhaus and not in the front mall where the ring is set up, so we can choose to watch it or not, (we won't) and as far as any trouble makers lurking around between shows looking for some vertically challenged butts to kick; I hope there are more of us people who are looking to just have a good time than there are of them.

However, if anyone sees a PBR carrying, trashy (I didn't use the word "white".... 'cuz I ain't a racist) troublemaker carrying a staplegun, with the look of midget bloodlust in their beedy eyes, following anyone that is under 5 feet tall around, lets band together and protect our bretheren. ( and all those innocent office supplies!)

Or at least let security know!

Are ya'll ready?........BOO!!!

[Kirk Sheppard]

I bet a bit is real, but most is fake. Even wrestlers that cut themselves for effect also use blood packs!

URGH! I love how people who have absolutely no first hand knowledge of this continue to weigh in with bad information. Please see my above post for the correction on this statement.

[Snowman]

I bet a bit is real, but most is fake. Even wrestlers that cut themselves for effect also use blood packs!

URGH! I love how people who have absolutely no first hand knowledge of this continue to weigh in with bad information. Please see my above post for the correction on this statement.

Kirk, will you clear this up for me:

When wrestling midgets want to hit each other with a chair, do they use regular chairs or high chairs?

[Coney Islander]

Blood or no blood, Kings Island is promoting fighting within the park grounds.

Kings Island is not promoting fighting on park grounds as this is a staged event. Did the park promote daredevil stunts when Robbie Knievel did his event? What would have happened if RK would have made a mistake and crashed? His event was much more real than this one will ever be- blood or no blood.

Also keep in mind that the park serves alcohol during Haunt... And we all know what alcohol can do to a person's reasoning.

Are you referring to one drink or multiple drinks as alcohol is being served in the park everyday.

Let me rephrase this in cause and effect format... Kings Island is promoting the Half Pint Brawlers. The Half Pint Brawlers are characterized by their bar- styled fighting. Any competition, wether its football, soccer, backyard wrestling or any other kind of sport, can and will get spectators riled up. Alcohol is served at Kings Island. Most bar fights that occur, the participants are both riled up and under the influence.

I myself have never intentionally tasted alcohol, so I have no idea to how Kings Island regulates alcohol consumption, if at all. An absence of alcohol regulation paired with show- fighting, in my eyes, is a recipe for disaster.

[The Interpreter]

Pricing is part of the way Kings Island regulates alcohol consumption. Realistically, given the several places where alcohol can be purchased in the park, it is nearly impossible to do much more than not purposely sell to those underage or the already inebriated.

[Browntggrr]

Most bar fights that occur, the participants are both riled up and under the influence.

So, given the information in your profile that you are 15, how many bar fights have you experienced?

[Coney Islander]

Yeah, you've got me there. Browsing, I've found an article that partially supports my theory.

Try to avoid a fight at all costs. Chances are, if you're just hanging out with friends, nothing will happen. The two main causes of bar fights are jealousy and misunderstandings. Do not read anything into your companions actions, as it might not be anything out of the ordinary. Your hypersensitivity could be due to intoxication. Also ask yourself... "How will I feel about this in the morning?" If you know that a potential fight is not due to a misunderstanding, then prepare to defend yourself.

http://www.wikihow.c...ive-a-Bar-Fight

Over the years, I've heard many stories of sporting event brawls all over the world... Here's but one.

"All team sports will be suspended... until 13 April," a government spokesman said after a cabinet meeting called to discuss the violence.

The pitched battle took place between fans of Olympiakos Piraeus and Panathinaikos near Athens.Witnesses say about 300 fans fought using clubs, knives and stones.

Police detained 18 people during the violence, which Greek media reports suggested had been arranged by fans ahead of the match.

The 25-year-old man who died had head injuries and stab wounds, doctors said. Several other people were injured in the brawl in the Peania area outside Athens.

http://news.bbc.co.u...ope/6510735.stm

[TylerRider]

I would say "or maybe you should have to be 16 or older to get in without an adult," but isn't that pretty much already a policy? And even then, I visited when I was fifteen, and was absolutely respectful. So maybe instead, there should just be a test to get in... After all, maturity and age are not the same thing. Sometimes, they're not even related.

Or how about a policy to keep the drunk people out. That seems like the biggest problem. Why throw out the kids? Do you think my mom would buy a ticket and go into Kings Island to be hassled by scareators? Yeah, looks like my season is over.