Dealing In The Thrill Cedar Fair CEO Excited About Cedar Point's Futrue

[Creed Bratton]

http://www.toledoblade.com/business/2018/05/06/Dealing-in-the-thrill-Cedar-Fair-CEO-excited-about-Point-s-future.html?utm_source=ITPS+Amusement+INdustry+News&utm_campaign=00e9d648ae-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_05_07&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_51d9c64022-00e9d648ae-231732317

Interesting article. I was kind of taken back that Kings Island wasn't mentioned as one of the top players in the chain...also interested to see that they stated that the Peanuts Celebration was likely to happen at KI this year (even though it's already been announced and the article was released Yesterday May 6th)

[TheRickster]

I really think KI is going to just get the shaft because of it's proximity to CP.

 

I'm not hopeful for a giga at all either.

[Tera Ryzing]

That is how the brass feels.  At least Dick gave us Diamondback and Firehawk.

[goettablitz]

4 hours ago, Tera Ryzing said:

That is how the brass feels.  At least Dick gave us Diamondback and Firehawk.

Cedar Fair has been very kind to Kings Island.  Not only returning Firehawk to its original intended park but as you mentioned Diamondback and lets not forget Banshee and Mystic Timbers.  The only other Cedar Fair park to get that same kind of love in the same time period is Cedar Point.  Actions speak louder than words.

They say they would like to focus on growth opportunities at CP, Carowinds, Knott's and Great America.  Not that they will be ignoring other properties.  By the same turn they do not mention Canada's Wonderland either.  Cedar Point, Kings Island, Canada's Wonderland and Knott's are the top attended Cedar Fair parks.  That's just a fact.  So don't worry, I think they will continue to receive major investment as a result

[Tera Ryzing]

I am referencing the brass' statement about the 4 parks doing well.

[King Ding Dong]

You are misrepresenting what he said.   All parks are doing well, those 4 are driving the business. (Growth).  

[westcoaster]

To all of Cedair Fair Fun, growth, success..

 

[Creed Bratton]

5 hours ago, TheRickster said:

I really think KI is going to just get the shaft because of it's proximity to CP.

 

I'm not hopeful for a giga at all either.

We have yet to get the shaft because of the proximity to CP. Just because we didn't get a ride this year doesn't mean we got the shaft. 

[silver2005]

You guys saying KI is getting the shaft are completely delusional.   

[Tera Ryzing]

32 minutes ago, silver2005 said:

You guys saying KI is getting the shaft are completely delusional.   

It is an opinion like yours.

[TheRickster]

They aren't getting the shaft as far as CF is concerned... Our model is now going to be a family park vs. a thrill park. Other than GA, KI is the only park that hasn't seen much added to really get the thrillseekers going. Other than where we would have holes, like a true inverted coaster that was LONG OVERDUE, and even Diamondback really just filled a hole I think they knew was going to be left by Son of Beast for a big height coaster.

KI is a unique, more traditional amusement park crowd. It's for families, not 300ft rides. I'd love to be wrong, but even while Paramount owned the park this was still how business was carried out.

[jcgoble3]

Just now, TheRickster said:

Diamondback really just filled a hole I think they knew was going to be left by Son of Beast for a big height coaster.

Nope. Diamondback construction was underway by the start of the 2008 season, so it was planned out by 2007 at the latest, the year SOB reopened without the loop. They could not have guessed at that time that it would be permanently closed in 2009, nor that it would be demolished in 2012.

[TheRickster]

5 minutes ago, jcgoble3 said:

Nope. Diamondback construction was underway by the start of the 2008 season, so it was planned out by 2007 at the latest, the year SOB reopened without the loop. They could not have guessed at that time that it would be permanently closed in 2009, nor that it would be demolished in 2012.

They still would have known it was nearing end of life. Whether that would have been another couple of years, or a decade. The loop removal and train change was to try to lengthen it's lifespan.

[ethancoaster]

Lol at y'all thinking Kings Island is going to get the shaft. The four growth parks are exactly what they sound like: parks that have the opportunity to grow. The Kings parks, Wonderland, and the other CF parks that many believe to be "neglected" are perfectly sized for their markets. Therefore they don't need the aggressive investment that the growth parks need to properly position themselves in their markets. But no, Kings Island went a year without adding a coaster despite the fact that they received two in the last four years. Obviously the park is neglected.

 

Smh enthusiasts sometimes...

[jcgoble3]

1 hour ago, TheRickster said:

They still would have known it was nearing end of life. Whether that would have been another couple of years, or a decade. The loop removal and train change was to try to lengthen it's lifespan.

The train change (which caused the loop removal) was to fix the issue that led to the July 2006 accident (namely the heavier trains putting too much stress on the structure). They didn't just make a change because they felt it might make it last longer. The change was effectively forced on them.

[Maverick44]

Ki is still going to get love no matter what. They will add coasters / rides and other things. If you feel different I am sorry for you lol

[Tera Ryzing]

59 minutes ago, ethancoaster said:

Lol at y'all thinking Kings Island is going to get the shaft. The four growth parks are exactly what they sound like: parks that have the opportunity to grow. The Kings parks, Wonderland, and the other CF parks that many believe to be "neglected" are perfectly sized for their markets. Therefore they don't need the aggressive investment that the growth parks need to properly position themselves in their markets. But no, Kings Island went a year without adding a coaster despite the fact that they received two in the last four years. Obviously the park is neglected.

 

Smh enthusiasts sometimes...

Says the person whose home park just got fury and is getting a major expansion. ..

[Stitch]

As a company, wouldn't you want to diversify your properties? What good would it be to have Cedar Point and Kings Island be overly similar? They are not terribly far from one another, so visiting both isn't an unfeasible task for those in their respective markets. Look at Delirium and Max Air, having ridden Delirium, I have no real desire to go to CP for Max Air. Their other flat rides that Kings Island doesn't have are attractive to me though.

Why would Cedar Fair want to purposefully hinder or in some way limit one of it's own parks? Each park is unique and requires different management and additions. A small subset of guests may be clamoring for more record breaking coasters but they are likely the minority in the whole populous that is Kings Island's guests.

[silver2005]

1 hour ago, Tera Ryzing said:

Says the person whose home park just got fury and is getting a major expansion. ..

Where you're from and what your home park is doesn't mean that person doesn't have a valid point.  If you have to resort to discrediting people for stuff like that, it means you don't have a valid argument yourself. 

[jcgoble3]

Well, MY home park just got nothing but yet another overpriced restaurant with slow service, and I don't think for even an instant that said home park (otherwise known as Kings Island) is getting the shaft.

[silver2005]

Except KI isn't getting the shaft as evidenced by everything they've done since acquiring the park, not just the coasters.

You just sound ignorant of what's actually going on, but instead, you just sound like a whiny fanboy who isn't getting his way because the park might not get a giga, or an Intamin, or whatever you're fancying Kings Island getting, to the point where you're saying Kentucky Kingdom, a niche park at best, is going to take some sort of significant chunk from KI's attendance from a coaster they can't afford.  A vast majority of your posts have been just that despite a lot of members posting stuff about the contrary, none of which you actually make a great deal of effort to refute without resorting to your usual praise of Intamins and parks that have gigas.  Believe it or not, most people have the ability to be sympathetic and empathetic in their opinions by taking the knowledge they gain from other people and applying that to what they know.  Its how we grow and develop.  You act like people can't do that regardless of their circumstance.  That's a really crappy way to treat people and it shows you have no respect for those members (or anyone else here right now with the way you're trolling us right now).   

 

[Tera Ryzing]

1 hour ago, silver2005 said:

Where you're from and what your home park is doesn't mean that person doesn't have a valid point.  If you have to resort to discrediting people for stuff like that, it means you don't have a valid argument yourself. 

Your entitled to your opinion like myself and others in this thread. 

You act like I am attacking members for their opinions which is obviously false.

[silver2005]

54 minutes ago, Tera Ryzing said:

Your entitled to your opinion like myself and others in this thread.

You act like I am attacking members for their opinions which is obviously false.

Internet trolling doesn't always come in the form of an attack.  You post things that are wildly unpopular with the view points of a lot of members to get a rise out of people.  I've seen some posts that you've had to comb through the site to make a trolling post on, like my time at Coaster-Net and people liking LaRosa's outside the park.  I'm a former moderator myself with 6 years experience and know how to spot it.   You also make these posts with little to no context with a bit of randomness to them.

Your posts are textbook internet trolling. 

[malem]

 

14 hours ago, silver2005 said:

You guys saying KI is getting the shaft are completely delusional.   

 

13 hours ago, Tera Ryzing said:

It is an opinion like yours.

You're certainly welcome to your own opinion, but if you're going to argue it in a public forum, please keep it based on facts. Otherwise, threads get derailed pretty quickly. If you compare the level of recent investment at Kings Island to that of other US seasonal parks, it's crystal clear that we have not gotten the shaft.

Zimmerman's comment was about opportunities to dramatically grow the company. Cedar Point has the potential to transform into a multi-day resort destination, Carowinds has plenty of room to grow attendance from their market, and the California parks have big opportunities thanks to their locations.

Kings Island already does extremely well in its market, reflected in the high level of continued investment we get compared to the rest of the chain. The fact that Cedar Point might end up getting even bigger toys doesn't mean we're getting the shaft.

[TheRickster]

Kings Island makes the most money as it is. As long as they occasionally improve the park and add rides like they have been, they have no reason to put in a huge coaster. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that. But I think us getting a giga is a bit overstated around here.

[TheRickster]

4 hours ago, jcgoble3 said:

The train change (which caused the loop removal) was to fix the issue that led to the July 2006 accident (namely the heavier trains putting too much stress on the structure). They didn't just make a change because they felt it might make it last longer. The change was effectively forced on them.

Making the ride last longer is part of reducing wear and tear, and reducing the chances of the incidents.

[ethancoaster]

7 hours ago, Tera Ryzing said:

Says the person whose home park just got fury and is getting a major expansion. ..

I don’t see how that’s a valid argument at all. Obviously I’m overjoyed with the fact that Carowinds is receiving the investment it is, but my statement was based on observable facts. Cedar Fair believes they can grow Carowinds in the market that it’s in, and they’ve been seeing positive results so far. Ergo, it will continue to receive heavy investment.

I mean honestly, do you think the heads of a BILLION DOLLAR CORPORATION are playing favorites? That they’re doing this because they like Carowinds enthusiasts so much? No! We make up less than 1% of their annual attendance, maybe even less than half of that. They’re doing this because they see the opportunity to make more money in the short term at Carowinds than at Kings Island, and if a few coaster boys are upset with that, so be it. They’re going to target the parks that can grow the most so they can grow their bottom line.

At some point in the future, Carowinds will be exactly where Kings Island is today: a regional park with 3 Million+ annual attendance that properly serves it market. And when that day comes, they’ll be receiving the same amount of investment yearly. For now, Carowinds is playing catch-up.

[Imperial79]

And trying to put doubts in people's minds about the future of the park (when this site is mainly about KI),  and post about how Kentucky Kingdom can start just taking away attendance and money from KI, isn't going to be very well liked on here...  If we are honest,  the main park out of the 3 in the area (KI, KK, HW) that hasn't lived up to what was envisioned is KK,  I doubt it ever will.  Does Ed slowly keep building the park up and hope someone buy's it from him again?  Or long term plan to keep the park?  Who would take the risk and buy it with its history?  I don't think any of the parks are getting shafted, and they're all pretty well balanced.  

[teenageninja]

The demographics for Kings Island and Cedar Point are wildly different.  Kings Island is, and always will be, a family park first.  Cedar Point is a thrill park with some family friendly rides.

Cedar Point hasn't had a major children's area expansion since 2008 and hasn't added a major childrens ride since 1999.  Kings Island continues to win best Children's Area in the Golden Ticket awards every year.

Cedar Point has 3 kid friendly coasters, 2 of which require the child to be 48" tall.

Kings Island has 4 kid friendly coasters, none that require that child to be over 44" tall.

They also have a log flume that your child can ride at 36".

Also, Kings Island has invested heavily in the water park since The Beach reopened across the highway.

We will get a coaster in the next couple years, but that's not a priority for the park, because they continue to be successful without adding one.

 

[upstop]

Seeing campgrounds and resort hotels popping up at some of the parks gives me hope for KI. CF is grooming the park’s to be resort parks. KI should have always been a resort park in my opinion OR perhaps there will someday be a third gate park, maybe an adventure park of some kind. The future is bright! Enjoy the park for what it is today and see it for what it can become in the future! (I’d LOVE to see a resort hotel/ campground connected to the park in some way, perhaps with direct access.)