Changes I think that PKI needs

[RevengeofTheSmurfs]

And what toxic vapors would those be? Lets see proof. Theres toxic vapors in everything, in the gas you pump, in the cleaning products you use. Those dont seem to be killing anyone indirectly. Once again, wheres the proof of your claims?

Whats up with you why do you always need proof? Helloooo for your info Cigarette smoke contains benzene, carbon monoxide, arsenic, hydrogen cyanide and polonium 210. Cigarette smoke also contains the radioactive isotope Polonium-210 now thats way more deadly than any cleaning product..Cigarette smoke contains 69 other deadly ''Toxic vapors'' that can cause cancer.

Theres your proof.

[Gordon Bombay]

^Great link WooferBear. 2nd Hand smoke presents a risk of lung cancer but as the site says, it is a very small and insignifigant risk with the EPA and WHO's numbers being inproportianate to the study.

As for you Revengeoftheidiots, why dont you go read around that site. Its more deadly to be around inhaling Pledge everyday than cigarette smoke. Why do I need proof? To show you idiots that your wrong. Thanks Wooferbear for the fantasic link!

[WooferBearATL]

Personally, I'm not excited about people walking around and smoking cigarettes at the park or out doors.

But honestly, it's out doors, and it's never been much of a problem.

Pleople just need to suck some things up and not be such wusses. <G>

[FOF/Z 4-ever]

I myself never understood why they made it "no smoking" in an outdoor place. I hate smoking and I am around it everday, but it's much much worse in lines (since you are close up on each other) or in a building. But if you are just walking around the park, I see no problem with that until you blow it on in my face. Then we have a problem.

Yes, when I worked at PKI, I made sure people were not smoking in lines. I also made sure they were not sitting on the handrails. My nickname used to be handrail nazi.

[Gordon Bombay]

There wouldnt be such a problem with smokers if most of them werent so rude and if most of them just threw their trash in the garbage.

[FOF/Z 4-ever]

Yea, I never understood that either. There are trash cans EVERYWHERE. Pick one! And the ground does not count as a trashcan. For those you who do not know what a trashcan looks like, its big, round, might have a lid on it, has a liner, and you know its a trash can IF there are trash in it.

[Captain Nemo]

I ran into many smokers while I worked. I politely asked them to please smoke in the designated areas and not in the line. They instead just put the cigarette out on the floor.

If anything, I don't want people smoking in line.

[WooferBearATL]

Yup, the only thing that I would agree on is not smoking in the que lines or the lines for food. It's too cramped and uncomfortable. Otherwise, I think that it really is a non issue.

[BoddaH1994]

Let's filter through some of this:

There wouldnt be such a problem with smokers if most of them werent so rude and if most of them just threw their trash in the garbage.

Saying most smokers are rude is on par with saying that most black people are gang members or most Jews are good with money. Over-classifying is just as bad as any prejudice. I think the problem with trash comes back to PKI's lagging in the responsibility to inform people that smoking is only in certain areas. If someone is (unknowingly) smoking outside of a designated area, where do they throw the buring remains? Would you rather have them throw it into a trash can?

Whats up with you why do you always need proof? Helloooo for your info Cigarette smoke contains benzene, carbon monoxide, arsenic, hydrogen cyanide and polonium 210. Cigarette smoke also contains the radioactive isotope Polonium-210 now thats way more deadly than any cleaning product..Cigarette smoke contains 69 other deadly ''Toxic vapors'' that can cause cancer.

...Benzene, carbon monoxide, arsenic.. boy does that sound bad! You know what sounds worse? Aspartame Potassium Benzoate, citrus pectin, potassium citrate, gum arabic, and erythorbic acid... I'm sure anyone with an internet connection can find links of these things to cancer, but do you know where I got them? Off of a Mountain Dew bottle. People assume that things that are hard to pronounce will give you caner... that's what the media feeds them, but it's not always true. Until you find evidence that shows that these things are linked to cancer, and that 2nd hand smoke (specifically outdoors) would be enough to cause it, you really have no evidence, just rhetoric.

On that same note, I'm kind of tired of hearing everyone's victum statement on here too. I do find it odd that a LOT of people who don't like the smell of smoke claim to have asthma (not that I'm accusing you of lying, Ronnie). I mean, if SO MANY people really have it, it would be all over the news.. the bird flu would be nothing in comparision to this epidemic.

I'm also tired of hearing how you don't want to take your '5 year old cousin' to the park because he/she would be around smoke? What? Are you afraid they'll get cancer by the age of 14? Let's be honest, unless there's a medical breakthrough, 90% of us will likely die of cancer or heart disease anyway, regardless of the smoking situation.

Lastly, if you're an employee and you have to tell someone they need to move to a smoking area, just be polite about it! Likely most of you think these people are rude because the delivery of your message is done in a forceful or impolite way. I find it HIGHLY unlikely that anyone who would generalize saying that all smokers are rude (as I have seen posted by several employees) be polite to people breaking the rules. You really get what you give, and if you're going to look down on somebody, they're not going to take very kindly to you.

[WooferBearATL]

WOW Boddah1994! Your response absolutely floored me!

That was well thought out and to the point. It addressed things and the subject fairly and objectively.

Are you running for office?

[Gordon Bombay]

Boddah always comes in and sets things straight, well said Ryan.

[CoastersRZ]

Yes, I feel the second hand smoke issues are overblown too. Like those commercials that liken it to being locked in a closed school building suffocating. I mean come on!

While PKI was trying to do a good thing, their biggest fault is lack of avdertisement for the policy. It is only mentioned int he fine print of the park map, and at the designated areas. Other than that there are no formal reminders to guests other than occasional reminders on the PA system. Unlike at Holiday World where they have several banners proclaiming the regulation. I don`t have a problem with people smoking on the midways at PKI. It is when I am stuck in line by a smoker that I have a problem. Simply because of the fact that can`t they wait until their out of line to smoke, when there not in close proximity to a bunch of people? Ryan, you stated it very well in your post!

[StXsteven]

http://standonline.org/about/facts.asp

Smoking kills more people than alcohol, AIDS, car crashes, illegal drugs, murders and suicides combined.

Second-hand smoke is the third leading cause of death behind active smoking and alcohol abuse.

Cigarette smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals, including ammonia (floor/toilet cleaner), arsenic (rat poison), formaldehyde (embalming fluid), and hydrogen cyanide (gas chamber poison).

Lets see you talk now...

[Gordon Bombay]

^I dont agree with smoking in anyway and its a dirty habbit. But go to this site and see that SECOND HAND SMOKE IS NOT THE THIRD LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH BEHIND ALCOHOL ABUSE AND REGULAR SMOKING. Your more likely to be killed inhaling pledge every day than second hand smoke. The TRUTH and STAND movements got their info from two poorly done EPA and WHO studies. Read this to get the truth. LINK!

Lets see you talk now...

[TheRickster]

Get better sources from a scientific webpage rather then a webpage that is extremley to the left or right of the smoking situation. Thats like going to a republican webpage to learn about John Kerry before the election.

[Gordon Bombay]

^How much did you spend on the site wooferbear provided? All it does is list scientific facts and give the sources, plus publish the results of two poorly done surveys. It doesnt lean to one side, it just publishes the facts.

[Scooby_Doo]

I dont know about all you saying cleaning products and such are worse than smoking as a weight lifter/body builder I stay away from FastFood,Pop,Smoking and anything that causes my body harm.While I do agree second hand smoke does kill outdoors and indoors and wish PKI would do a better job of enforcing there rules.

[Gordon Bombay]

Didnt you read through the topic or any of the FACTUAL info provide? Smoking kills...second hand smoke however does not.

[FOF/Z 4-ever]

Okay I live w/ my parents my entire life and they both are bad chain smokers. I mean, cig after cig. They've always been, even before i was around. I am now 22 and no signs of cancer or no signs of my dieing (i know its spelt wrong) anytime soon.

[Scooby_Doo]

Didnt you read through the topic or any of the FACTUAL info provide? Smoking kills...second hand smoke however does not.

Yes it does I dont care what people and what sites say 2nd Hand Smoke does kill like the smurfy one said c'mon people its friggin common sense!The FACTUAL info is that second hand smoke does kill I dont care what else you have to say that info is what cigarette comps want you to take as the truth! I'm done with this topic.

[Gordon Bombay]

Didnt you read through the topic or any of the FACTUAL info provide? Smoking kills...second hand smoke however does not.

Yes it does I dont care what people and what sites say 2nd Hand Smoke does kill like the smurfy one said c'mon people its friggin common sense!The FACTUAL info is that second hand smoke does kill I dont care what else you have to say that info is what cigarette comps want you to take as the truth! I'm done with this topic.

YOu are the biggest idiot, by far, you ignore the facts put together with good source by an independednt and neutral man and you ignored what Boddah said which made great sense. Second hand smoke wont kill you, your just too dumb and too proud to admit when your wrong.

SCOOBY DOO HAS BEEN PWNED.....AGAIN!

Get over yourself!

[BoddaH1994]

WOW Boddah1994!  Your response absolutely floored me!

That was well thought out and to the point.  It addressed things and the subject fairly and objectively.

Are you running for office?

Ha... didn't you vote for me for mayor of Cincinnati the other day?

Nah, I'm not running for office. I just have an odd backround that involves both marketing and sociology, so I can see through a lot of smoke and mirrors.

Let's calm this down, people. If you disagree with someone, that's fine, but be respectful to other community members.

[Mikewhy]

When I am around smoke, my lungs hurt and I get sick. That is a FACT. I do not listen to any web site to tell me that second hand smoke is not harmful. I know it IS harmful to me, and I am sure to many others as well. I have seen all those sites and people stating so called facts, and I have found them to be very dubious. I can also link to web sites with facts proving it is harmful.

I know from my personal experience that it is harmful to me. Therefore I should not be subjected to it. Thanks goodness PKI agrees.

[Browntggrr]

I am a smoker, and I don't have a problem with PKI's rules; it is their park, and they can run how they deem appropriate. I have no problem with taking a break at one of their smoking sections (especially if it is near a beer stand).

This constant battle between 2nd hand smoke being bad/ unhealthy/ causes death is as bad as Roe vs. Wade. ANYTHING in excess will harm you, even water (yes, if all you drink is water, it will EVENTUALLY kill you- there are even MSDS on how water could harm you.) There have been studies that a corroded penny will become shiny after "x" amount of time in Coca-Cola. Given these scenarios it is quite evident that; yes, second hand smoke can harm you, but so can many other things used/ abused in excess.

Now if someone is concerned enough that they will not go to PKI from 10:00am-10:pm because of second hand smoke, they are obviously over-concerned and over-protective, which is their choice. And if in those 12 hours, you think you could get sick enough from second hand smoke, please don't ruin your health because of one of those "rude" smokers that don't follow the law. Stay home and leave the lines shorter for me. And also don't speed, drink, get a suntain, use a refridgerator/ air conditioning, wear make-up, etc. etc.

[jzarley]

Wow! This is a polar issue, isn't it? As a casual reader of this topic, maybe it's important to point out the things that everyone who posted seems to agree on:

--Smoking is a bad habit

--Smoking is dangerous to the smoker

I really don't believe there is enough scientific evidence to prove that second-hand smoke kills... I think there is a common sense factor that says it must, but there's really no hard data that supports it. So, I'm kind of on the fence on that one. I will say that I find second hand smoke annoying...especially when it's getting blown in my face in cramped quarters. The city of Columbus (and now, most surrounding suburbs) banned smoking in all indoor public areas almost a year ago, and I think it's been great. You can actually go out to a bar on the weekend and not reek of smoke when you leave. (Also, it's amazing how clear things look inside without a constant haze...) However, outdoor smoking at PKI has never been an issue (unless it's someone right next to you in line, but that's another story...)

On a personal note, I grew up with a father who was a long time smoker (he eventually died of emphysema). I can honestly say that I have suffered no health problems (or has anyone else in my family) from growing up around second-hand smoke. However, I will say that the best deterent for never smoking yourself is to watch someone else die from it.

[RailRider]

Heres any easy way to slove everyones problem. Smoke in your designated area at PKI and then we can all get along and live happily ever after. Oh yeah PKI needs to enforce this policy too so the violence between smoker and non-smoker doesnt erupt out into the park.

[Captain Picard]

I will say that the best deterent for never smoking yourself is to watch someone else die from it.

Did that in April this year, took about 14 years. It starts with your lungs and congested heart failure then kidney failure and start dialysis and die.

I don't know if second-hand smoke kills but there is nothing you can do about it after it does.

The easy part is when you die, it's the long road getting there that's not.

[Mikewhy]

It is not really correct to lump smoking with other bad habits like junk food and drinking. Those things only hurt you, whereas when someone smokes, people around them inhale it whether they like it or not. Bottom line, whether or not there is a factual basis for saying it kills, it is common sense that it is not healthy, and in a way that affects people around you involuntarily. It DOES harm people with asthma, with servere allergies, and so on. I am sure there is no parent on this board who would want their children subjected to second hand smoke on a frequent basis.

Cigarette smoke even in small doses really hurts me, and that is a fact. Just being subjected to it for 10 seconds causes my eyes and throat to hurt. Therefore, I think my right to breathe fresh air trumps another person's right to engage in their addiction outside of designated areas.

I know many smokers who are polite. But to say that all you have to so is politely ask smokers to stop is simply not always true. Every time I have ever asked a smoker to stop, and I was always nice, I was always greeted with a huge **** you or at least a dirty look. This happens at tables in outdoor dining areas, que lines, and so on. I am sure there are considerate smokers who will stop. But there is a significant percentage who will not.

I just find it kind of sad that anyone would defend second hand smoke. The world would be better without it. It would also be better without junk food, but at least when someone next to me eats it, they do not hurt me against my will.

[WooferBearATL]

Cigarette smoke even in small doses really hurts me, and that is a fact. Just being subjected to it for 10 seconds causes my eyes and throat to hurt. Therefore, I think my right to breathe fresh air trumps another person's right to engage in their addiction outside of designated areas.

I don't think anyone is disputing that these may be irritants to you. I can certainly sympatise with you. But being someone that is so hyper-sensitive to allergens, how do you walk from the parking lot with the emitions?

I know many smokers who are polite. But to say that all you have to so is politely ask smokers to stop is simply not always true. Every time I have ever asked a smoker to stop, and I was always nice, I was always greeted with a huge **** you or at least a dirty look. This happens at tables in outdoor dining areas, que lines, and so on. I am sure there are considerate smokers who will stop. But there is a significant percentage who will not.

Never met one that had refused. And yes, I have asked someone to refrain from doing so.

I just find it kind of sad that anyone would defend second hand smoke. The world would be better without it. It would also be better without junk food, but at least when someone next to me eats it, they do not hurt me against my will.

No, I just find it to be a non issue. As I have said, yes, I think that it should not be allowed in que lines and such, but I do not see any logical reason to restrict it in the open.

[Gordon Bombay]

When I am around smoke, my lungs hurt and I get sick. That is a FACT. I do not listen to any web site to tell me that second hand smoke is not harmful. I know it IS harmful to me, and I am sure to many others as well. I have seen all those sites and people stating so called facts, and I have found them to be very dubious. I can also link to web sites with facts proving it is harmful.

I know from my personal experience that it is harmful to me. Therefore I should not be subjected to it. Thanks goodness PKI agrees.

Ever thought maybe you have asthma or an allergie to the smoke? Plus it hasnt been proven to cause any fatal pain to you. My best friend cant stand to be around smoke cause of his allergies, but its in no way killing him. 2nd hand smoke is in no way a mass murder device killing us off one by one.