Shaggy

Thanks for sharing these - great pics. If I may - these indeed look to be a mix of photos from different years. The years of these pictures are 1987 - 1990. The indicators are: Vortex, Screamin Demon, The Ferris Wheel, Amazon Falls and Flight Commander.

I'm personally hoping the banners, flags and signage will return reminiscent of the original theme in the area. That's what used to make that area fun - it felt festive walking through it.

Thanks - its all trapped in my head from 40 years of visiting the park. I, like many KI old-timers, consider myself lucky to have enjoyed/seen so much of the history my very own eyes. KI enchanted me as a young kid - and that has never gone away. ;-)

Not really gutted - but all the sets were removed and additional walls were removed/added. The "Theater Stage" itself (The section half-way through the ride that featured the Disney-eque Pepper's Ghost effect) received the most notable change. The floor was raised and the huge panes of glass were destroyed. (BTW, the huge panes of glass on which the "effects" were achieved were among the most expensive parts of the ride.) The ride uses the same conveyance device and vehicles (with every other car having been removed.) but many don't realize some of the directional turns of the cars were altered in parts when "Scooby Doo and the Haunted Castle" was installed. For instance, in Boo Blasters there's a section where you pass a bed with the ghost that pops up from under the covers. When the attraction was Phantom Theater the car faced the opposite way. (This is where guests saw the "Usher" telling folks "Step right in - the shows just about to begin!... Move lively - no one will be seated once the show begins. The lights are dimmed for the final performance.") Also, as you exited the "Theater Stage" portion, the cars faced inward to circle around the "Maestro" and his swirling music and player piano. (This is where he said "Do you think you'll be allowed to leave now that you've heard my music? I dont think so!") Now, you turn outward to face the cloaked skeleton playing the giant pipe organ.

I certainly am not versed on formal requirements of space left around large power lines, but its obvious KI has had, or chosen, to leave ample. But even without the power line issue, they'd probably have to get creative with a large expansion. They definitely have room to expand, but in order to really add real estate and size, would likely need to once again re-route the employee entrance/drive. I would suspect they'd opt to replace some of the aging slides in the oldest section first though. Some of those slides have been there for over 30 years. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see the water park receive an upgrade or expansion in coming seasons.

I have always loved Schwarzkopf coasters. Shockwave at Six Flags Over Texas, and Mindbender at Six Flags Over Georgia are two HIGHLY underrated coasters (and personal favorites.) Also, Revolution (pre and post shoulder restraints), SuperDooperLooper, Montezoomas Revenge and Whizzer are dont misses at their respective parks.) As a kid growing up in Virginia, I was spoiled... I had BGW's Glissade and Wildkat coasters as well as Kings Dominion's King Cobra shuttle loop to enjoy year after year. I've wondered if KI officials (Dave Focke) might have visited the Mindbender at West Edmonton mall when it opened in 1985 as they courted proposals for the forthcoming new coaster. Chances are, they (he) might have. Unfortunately just a year later - June 1986 - the Mindbender suffered a HORRIFIC accident. Ultimately a design flaw by Schwarzkopf and poor maintenance were found as the cause. I expect, if KI had seriously considered a Schwarzkopf, they probably breathed a sigh of relief that they had not suffered such an incident. BTW - trivia - Wener Stengel was involved with the overall design of most of the Schwarzkopf coasters - including Mindbender. He ultimately worked with KI.... on Son of Beast. I've always "heard" he was/is an extremist - pushing for taller, faster, more extreme... yet I also have been told he would not ride coasters. LOL! (But in fairness, thats true of many coaster designers & engineers... Ron Toomer, Al Collins and, I believe, John Allen.)

I wondered the same thing. I have never seen any official blueprints or renderings of the "proposed" coaster. So I think this layout is just a fan-based conception - nothing more.

I've never seen it officially confirmed that KI was given any sort of a "discount" for Vortex. Its long been a rumor, and could be true, but I personally have never seen it substantiated. If anyone has printed material or quotes from park officials, I'd love to see it. I think the reason KI chose to go with Arrow was likely multi-tiered. - KI specifically wanted a high-thrill coaster with loops. Most of the other manufacturers proposals were deemed too tame. - Arrow had perfected the multi-inversion steel coaster by then. - I believe there had been a management change at Arrow since "The Bat" had been built, Ron Toomer was now in charge and he was well respected. - Arrow had a long-running, successful relationship with KI before The Bat. Many of the parks rides... Screamin Demon, KCKC, Enchanted Voyage boats (I believe) etc etc etc... were Arrow products. - The Arrow multi-loopers were things of beauty and awe. I would suspect park officials were sold on something that would look immense, be HIGHLY marketable, and be a noteworthy use of the land. Not to mention, IMO, it was the perfect "OOOOH AHHHHH replacement" following the embarrassing failure of The Bat. The installation of The Bat was, what I understand to be, a development agreement between Arrow and KI. Essentially, KI provided the land and funding for Arrow to flesh out their Suspended coaster concept. Both the park and Arrow knew it was a prototype, and would require "tweaking." However they obviously never expected the amount of issues and downtime it experienced. Finally, TMK, the relationship with Arrow never "soured." Again, I've heard that as a long-standing rumor, but never had it confirmed by anyone at the park. Did the park ever file lawsuit against Arrow? Essentially, "The Bat's" development was what I percieve to be the same situation that PGA entered with Vekoma to develop Stealth in the late 1990/early 2000's. Ultimately most of the operational consistency "kinks" were able to be worked out with Stealth... however it didn't suffer from as many severe engineering flaws that The Bat did. The Bat was ahead of its time, unfortunately. But ultimately the success of the suspended coasters and (IMO) inverted coasters that followed all have The Bat to thank.

AFAIK Kings Island's Flying Eagles, while located at at Coney (called Flying Skooters), had their their original tubs scrapped/overhauled/rebuilt and replaced. The KI attraction had already received a major alteration before it was ever transplanted. Heck, even Kings Island's Grand Carousel has horses that are not original to it. I was also once "told" (you know how that goes) that the Scrambler has had more than one major overhaul - including seat/car replacement. It could be (and has been) argued that the Post article didn't exactly describe the ride in question here. Sounds like it, but also not. An Octopus and Monster are two entirely different rides, and neither IMO have gondolas "suspended" from the arms. The other oddity is that it ran in a paper at the end of the season... and just a few weeks later the park announced the HB overhaul for '82. None of it really "adds" up. That's why I've never particularly given it much merit - because it doesn't make sense. Maybe the writer asked why the ride was missing, and was given that info? Maybe the intention was to replace it? Maybe the intention was to add a similar ride in addition to it? Maybe the person(s) they spoke to were incorrect, or said something entirely different. Maybe the writer didn't pay attention, or got information confused. Who knows? Hence my earlier response - couldn't tell ya. I appreciate Ty's clarification of the timeline of events regarding Fury - very thorough. I personally always appreciate Ty's posts. My particular sentiments about the blog were stated because I very much appreciate that the Park - in this case, Chad - is taking the time to invest in the history. They are doing a great job of it. Prior Administration at the park actually strove to ignore, hide and destroy that history. I'm always personally very happy that they are taking the time to care.

I can only speak for myself, but here is where my through process stands. Whenever I have purchased something in advance - or taken part in an installment plan - I viewed it as a "contract" between buyer and seller. I am paying for goods, or for a "product", that is forthcoming. If I do not pay, or complete my payments that would break the contract. Same is true if the product is not supplied as promised - it negates the contract. In this case, the "product" is essentially a fluctuating license to enter and use the park's facilities for a time period. For now, said time period is indefinitely on hold for reasons beyond anyone's control. So that leaves the "contract" in limbo. There are a lot of unseen challenges that can greatly affect a business' timeline - how and when they do things. I work in a business that is pretty similar to KI in terms of product. The impact of the virus has sent us reeling, and essentially scrambling to uphold our end of the "contract" with our buyers without collapsing the financial stability of the company. At this point, I am not sure we will survive this... and how we "react" to the situation will greatly affect the company's longevity. I have no doubt that Kings Island has every intention to uphold their end of the contract - after all, they are a guest driven business. However until a firm calendar can be set, their hands are likely tied as to the options they may offer ALL buyers simultaneously. Unless they can offer those same options to everyone, then they cannot move forward with a solution. I certainly understand this virus has sent many previously financially stable households into a tailspin - including mine. (Yes, I have personally taken a large hit.) However, I still intend to hold up my end of the "contract" that I made with Kings Island and will adjust to whatever options they offer me in due time. I view it in terms of my paying towards my future enjoyment. That gives me something to look forward to in these horrific times. Fact is, whenever this nightmare ends, and things are once again (knock wood) safe, I hope to immediately go to Kings Island and celebrate life, fun and the outdoors like I never have been before. In the meantime, I'm primarily focused on the health and safety of those I love and cherish - as well as my own. I am man enough to admit that I am as scared as I've ever been - and I have seen A LOT in my nearly 50 years. I am devastated that this is happening to our world, and crushed at the thought of all those affected. I pray very hard every day, multiple times a day, that this will be lifted. I encourage others to do the same - pray, encourage, and find something to lift your spirit and keep you moving forward. And for God's sake, stay home. Shaggy

Didn't write it. Couldn't tell ya. Again, kudos to Chad for the great piece of KI history and clarification. Keep 'em coming KI!

I agree. I love that the long-floating false claim that the original was replaced has been cleared up. Kudos to Chad - great job!

Windjammer spent more time closed than open. If someone farted while riding, it would valley. I didn't find the New York New York coaster unbearable, but I just rode once and said "check!"

When I was there, there was literally no physical seat in the rear row of the last car - it was roped off! And I dont recall the first drop being that "Big" LOL!

The 2 specific types of coasters (that the park has ever publicly discussed) "proposed" for Vortex's site prior to KI choosing Arrow were:. A Mack bobsled - that ended up being installed at Kings Dominion as Avalanche. A Togo "looping mouse" that has always been rumored to have become the infamous Windjammer at Knotts. I've never had the other "types" officially confirmed. But I know most of the proposals were deemed too "tame." One could deduce from that article that the other proposals may have come from firms including Intamin (Switzerland) or Schwarkopf. FYI - guests were surveyed at the front of the park back around 1983-84 on what they wanted the park to add. I actually recall being asked my feelings about water rides by someone with a clipboard at the front gate when I went with my family in those years. Ultimately, White Water Canyon must have surveyed high - so it took precedence over the coaster. I've always wondered what *could* have taken "The Bat's" place had WWC not been "bumped up." I think it goes without saying that by the mid 1980s, the park saw the writing on the wall with the "Screamin' Demon." Couple that with the loss of "The Bat" and the fact that looping coasters were very much in vogue and it was pretty clear what the park needed at the time - and "voila" Vortex was born.

Liberty University = Jerry Falwell. He only wants them back for the revenue. He's a money gobbler, not concerned about actual welfare of people, like every other Televangelist. He's nothing more than a snake oil salesmen in a tailored suit - a faith healer that tricks people into thinking they are safe by praying alone.

I think that is pretty much what everyone is wondering right now.

Riding Mean Streak didn't bother me as much as it did some, but it wasn't one I ever felt the need to ride when I was at CP. I definitely can see where people hated it. I always avoided a wheel seat, so that helped. That having been said... Once while riding MS - I got the bottom side of my upper arm pinched between the wood on the side of the car and the metal trim they had on the edges. See the picture below - I circled what I am talking about.) Good Lord that hurt, and left me with a horrible pinch bruise. I thought I was going to bleed all over the place.

Even if we see a miraculous downturn in infection rates before June - I’d now be surprised to see the park open then. There are many other factors that will affect how this plays out. First, this will instill a fear of congregation in many people for a while. I know that even if you told me it were safe tomorrow, I’d probably still continue to isolate and avoid crowds until I formed my own peace of mind. Second, there’s an entire hire/rehire/training period to think about. This is costing the park precious time to be prepping staff. If given a green light to open by June - they still have to beef up personnel. That could take weeks. Granted they’ll probably have a larger volume to pull from for hires if the terrible projections of unemployment come true. Third, there’s going to be a large change in spending of discretionary income. Mark my words, going forward after things (knock wood) Improve, people will be much more selective as to where they spend their money. Typically entertainment is first non-essential to bite the dust. Fourth, the park - like any other business - has an extremely large overhead. To circumvent losses, they will cut spending in as many places as possible. Ordering merchandise, food supplies, prizes, equipment, uniforms are the tip of the iceberg and I’m willing to bet have been placed on hold. Even things like office supplies or cutting electrical use in non essential spaces come into play. If those things come to a screeching halt, then it delays preparing the park to open at any given time. Theres more, and I could go on and on. But the bottom line is (as much as it pains me to say this) I’d advise most here to emotionally prepare to not see the inside of our beloved park for quite some time. I hope that I am completely wrong, but my personal experience (and current work situation) dictates that this will be a lengthy delay. What I specifically hope is that everyone on these boards shows some decorum should there be an extended delay in opening, even after the virus has subsided. If it takes weeks, months, a year before the park opens then everyone should understand it’s due to the ramifications of a situation that is completely out of our hands - and theirs. My heart breaks for everyone this touches. Especially those whose personal welfare and income depend on it. I am a praying daily for an end to this - it’s truly a nightmare on all sides.

To be positive for a moment - I have already seen some good come of this... I am a member of my community's Facebook group. It covers neighborhoods spanning about a 2-mile radius. Typically, it's used as a sort of Neighborhood watch system - like "Beware, package theif" or "Someone's dog got loose" or "Beware a kid threw eggs at our car" etc etc etc. But the board has turned so that neighbors are binding together and helping those that may need assistance. Offering free childcare, offering to run pick up necessities for those shut in etc. They are going as far as to check in/account for elderly neighbors that live alone - just to make sure they are ok. As Mr Rogers always said in times of crisis "Look for the helpers."

At this point, I would not be surprised to see parks like KI cut spring weekend-only operations, and push back opening until the typical time period when they normally begin full time operations. There’s no way this thing is going to settle down by early April. We’re still at surface level of the iceberg. That having been said - they will do what’s right. Don’t get upset, or angry or frustrated. Any decisions they make will be done for our welfare, and the welfare of their employees.

Agreed - but remember that its highly contagious and although it may not have affected them much, it may fatally affect someone of questionable health. I am glad to know people are getting checked, and I hope that stay confined if tested positive for the sake of others.

Broadway shows are now closed in NYC for the next month. That's mind boggling. Most of them will not survive.

Good God ... was going by the one news article I read which specifically said "inside."

No INSIDE gatherings over 100 in Ohio now.