Shaggy

Um..Paramount didn't choose to "disown" it...they were purchased by Cedar Fair. OK then let me rephrase that. It just seems stupid to purchase Paramount, then let Paramount purchase back? To add to your point, I have read by many on here (not to say that it is the gospel) that Paramount was ready to get out of the Amusement Park business and was looking for a buyer for the parks. I don't think CF just came up to them one day and made them an offer they could not refuse. Correct me if I am wrong here Terpy! If that is truly the case, then why would they want it back? CBS/Viacom became the owners of Paramount... which included the parks division. They became disinterested in retaining ownership of the park division, so they sold them to Cedar Fair which was an interested party.

I'm curious... Did you visit KI prior to, say, 1988?

Diamondback was brought up when Paramount was in charge but would we of got it? I Don't know. I've heard that it was offered when Paramount was in charge but didn't want it, but when Cedar Fair took over the park they welcomed a star attraction with open arms. That's just what I've heard, so don't take that as fact unless someone can confirm it. I'll also add that the park is a lot cleaner with Cedar Fair. I remember the path being covered with Coke cups and paper towels, but I haven't seen a single piece of trash on the path since Cedar Fair took over. Diamondback is entirely a Cedar Fair install... from start to finish. In the Paramount days, B&M proposed a coaster for the same plot of land that Diamondback is on... by the railroad trestle. However so did Intamin. Nothing ever came of it. I agree with the Interpreter that the worst days of the park were the Linder days (specifically around 1989- 1992). Same is true of Kings Dominion. The main argument is that the parks were horribly dirty, and in KD's case, unsafe. Trash was always overflowing out of garbage cans, it smelled, rides were dirty, gum trees all over, and graffiti on the rides. KI was kept far better shape than KD, but overall the parks had a gritty feel to them. In addition, this is when it seemed ride after ride after ride began dissapearing from the parks. You'll have to realize that in those days, there was no internet. Fans literally waited until the parks opened to see how they had changed or what was new. Actually, back in the day the best way to get a sneak peek at what your favorite park was doing was to try and get your hands on a brand new park brochure. This was an annual trek my Father and I made in early spring... to places that had tourist brochures so I could pick up various park brochures and find out what was new! Sometimes those brochures would give you a preview of changes or additions to the park. However, most of the time you had to just wait until the parks were open again. I vivdly remember arriving at the park during those Linder years and being shocked when there was no Tumblebug, or Winnie Witches Cauldrons, or Der Spinner Keggers, or Ferris Wheel, or King Kobra (KD), or Flying Carpet, or Zodiac, or Wheel of Fortune, or... well, you get the idea. Paramount cleaned up a lot of the grittiness and uncleanliness of the parks, and they added some good (albeit short) rides. But they over-commercialized the parks and ignored themed areas. It's my opinion that they sacrificed some of the most ambiant rides/areas for the sake of way-too-technical or silly rides. (Examples: KI- killed Flying Eagles and 'tiques for IJST, KD - Killed the Old Dominion Train for... ick... Waynes World.) Cedar Fair IMO, is making good strides, but then I don't visit the park like I once did. As an outsider, they definitely seem to be keeping it clean and of course they installed the best ride in the park (Diamondback.) However, my personal opinion is that Snoopy Universe... or whatever the name is... is a HUGE mis-step. It doesn't suit KI, and has likely cost them the "Best Kids Area" title. (But that title was pretty much just a good favor vote by enthusiasts anyways...) The Nick characters (even though they were lost on me) were a huge draw with kids. Snoopy is, IMO, old school and lost on kids today over the age of 2. Shaggy

LOL, no.... but I do own an autographed copy of Greg's. ;-)

That's because it's a fable. Legend has it an low clearance/overhang knocked the camera off. But think about it, just how many low clearances do you recall on Racer? The actual truth is, the train returned and the camera mount had failed. The camera was still in place, but had fallen to the side. Saying it was "knocked off and could have killed a Brady" sounds much more dramatic. When in fact, they still used the same camera for the on-ride filming. The more difficult piece of that shot was how the cast had to remain "staggered" in their seats. Jan and Bobby had to sit far apart. Behind them, Mrs Brady and Alice had to sit closer together. Finally, Marcia and Greg had to crouch down and close together to be seen. Pay attention the next time you watch it. Neither Cindy or Mr Brady (Robert Reed) would ride it. In actuality, Robert Reed refused just because he was typically a bitter, stubborn, obstinate man. Shaggy

I personally consider it to be primarily a flume & but also a dark ride combo. The same holds true of Dudley Do-Rite at Universal IOA and Jurassic Park the ride. Shaggy

Take WDW's Magic Kingdom... wash it in hot water, then tuble dry on high heat. When done, you'll find it's shrunk to about 1/2 the size. That's Disneyland ;-) Disneyland is surreal to me. So much smaller, yet much more charming and historical. You can walk to the Haunted Mansion at Disneyland, and literally 20 feet away is Splash Mountain. BTW, another very special dark ride that holds a place in my heart is the now defunct "Snow White's Scary Adventures" at the Magic Kingdom. It was changed years ago after numerous complaints that it was simply too terrifying. Indeed the original was very, very scary! I recall my parents got the poo scared out of them when a surprise runaway mine-car came rolling at us. Both parents screamed, while I at the age of 10 just laughed hysterically. It was great! Here's the original:

It looks like it could easily rank as a favorite. My top 5 dark rides are as follows: 1. Spiderman 2. Tower Of Terror (WDW- Studios) 3. Haunted Mansion (Disney World) 4. Haunted Mansion (Disneyland) 5. Phantom Theatre Other notable favs include Knoebels, the old Enchanted Voyage, Pirates of The Carribean, Gobbler Getaway and the original Snow White's Scary Adventures. If you love great endings, Knoebels actually has the best I've ever seen. It's hysterical as a new rider, and as a spectator watching people as their cars exit. I'll not spoil the surprise ;-) (BTW, I don't scare easily at all... but Knoebels ranks as one of the very few that gave me a jolt... about half way through... HONK HONK. I nearly jumped out of the car and ran away!)

Fo those of you that loved Phantom Theatre... well, here's it's grandchild. Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk (an amazing historical park) has just opened their brand new "Haunted Castle." Here's a link to a pov of the ride. http://www.themepark...ic.php?p=903053 The ride is noteworthy to Phantom Theatre fans as the concept is extremely similar, and it actually uses the old Phantom Theatre Music. Sally designed the animation for this new attraction, but Phantom Theatre's animation was by AVG, Inc. The overall concept for PT was designed by R & R Animation. I actually love this sort of ride, and in typical Santa Cruz fashion, they did an amazing job with it! Shaggy

El Condor and T2 feature a final bunny hop prior to the brake run that subsequent models don't have. Ultimately, the final bunny hop prooved uncomfortable to riders and was eliminated. Adjustments were also made to make better articulating trains. T2 suffers(ed) from voilent/terrible jack-hammering and "bunching." BTW, other rides at KK were initial prototypes/concepts/1st editions. For example: Hellivator was a prototype and Twisted Twins was the first CCI to use Gerstlaur Trains Shaggy

You'd be surprised at how well they can squeeze it in. Actually, this is how it will be situated: The go-carts are being re-configured, and the coaster will remain a stand-up. The above picture is from this discussion: http://sfgamzone.com/index.php?showtopic=1819&st=0#entry5200202 If you go there, you'll see an actual photograph from the board meeting where SFGAm presented the layout.

Now that was funny!

Or this:

I've heard stories that Walt was consulted in the early days of KI. I know he tended to get involved in such projects largely for his own fact-gathering purposes. But also because he was interested in seeing these projects succeed. Does anyone know any stories of Walt's involvement in KI? Walt Disney was not involved with KI. Walt Disney passed away in 1966, 2 years prior to the Fess Parker park announcement that triggered the urgent interest in re-locating Cincinnati's Coney Island. (A large flood at CCI in 1964 began the initial interest in scouting possibilities of re-locating the park) Kings Island opened in 1972. His Brother, Roy Disney, was involved but only in an advisory way. The initial KI investors/creators reached out to him through their backers... Taft... for advice. Roy was spearheading the construction of Walt Disney World at the time, a project he overtook upon Walt's death.) His advice to them was to "figure out the amount of land needed and buy three times that amount." When Walt Disney was originally conceiving Disneyland in the early 1950's, Walt visited/consulted Cincinnati's Coney Island (Edward Schott was the owner at the time, I believe) and also (on a much lesser level) consulted Holiday World. For their insight, he wrote the owners of Coney a $1.00 check. Shaggy

Actually, I think the park has a greater chance of having sellout days this season. More people are opting to stay local rather than travel abroad. I've noticed both KI, HW, State Of Ohio, State of Kentucky and State of Tennessee commercials are airing over and over reminding folks there's lots of things to do locally. :-)

Not when I click it. It still shows the Antiques. The giveaway as to it's age (it is indeed very old) is actually the waterpark. Look closely and you'll see it was taken prior to the Crocodile Dundee Boomerang Bay conversion. That dates it to pre-2004. If you look even closer, you'll see Delirium's there. Given those indicators, I'd date the pic to 2003.

I'm surprised they've not yet installed a Wild Mouse/Mad Mouse coaster to be honest.

Perhaps you mean Carl Lindner, who I think has often gotten a pass for all the damage he did to Kings Island (especially in retaining multi-hundreds of acres of land when he finally sold the park to Paramount Studios...) Bingo... the dark days of KI were the late 1980's-1992 Linder days, NOT the Paramount Days. FYI... I can't recall the last time KI had a "sellout" day. They used to happen on significant holiday weekends back in the day. I believe the park maxes out at some astronomical cap of like 55,000 +. There's been definite times where the park has reached that and posted "Park sold out" on the billboard outside. However, I've not seen or heard of that in many, many moons. Shaggy

...with little fanfare. But still, a big step in the right direction. http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-451714?hpt=C2

Folks here sure are giving Mr Hart a lot of credit. Fact is, Hart and Workman are old buddies... cut from the same jib... Hart built KK on "time" and sold it to Premier complete with a huge amount of debt. I am sure I sound like a spoil sport... but trust me, Hart is simply Workman's bailout. Workman named him so that he can save face with the State. I guarantee you there were no other "interested operators." A great big key to all of this "good news" is SF's stake. They still own land partials on which some of the rides exist. It just depends on what the personal feelings are among the leaders now that Shapiro is gone. Shaggy

Posturing. He's full of $&*# Think about it... what reputable operator would even *think * of negotiating a lease on a property who's embroiled in the midst of what will be a lengthy lawsuit that could very well result in the removal of all physical assets by their (My opinion) rightful owner (SF)??? I'm no lawyer, that's for sure... but I guess I think in laymans terms. I wouldn't sign a lease on a "fully furnished" apartment if I knew the landlord was suing the current tenant that bought the furniture from the previous tenant.

I'd have to agree here. I think the Morgan trains are the second worst rolling stock in the business. (Gerstlauer being the worst) I rode the Texas Cyclone a number of times with the Morgan coffin trains. Easily one of the most uncomfortable wooden coaster experiences I ever had. (Worst experience being The Boss in it's inaugural year.) I have also ridden the Santa Cruz Boardwalk Dipper, which uses the Morgan trains. That was enjoyable, but still not a train I'd suggest over a PTC. Here's a pic of the old Texas Cyclone stock (now defunct)

I doubt the director/producers were THAT concerned about continuity for the park's sake. That's apparent by The Racer on-ride footage actually being a mirror image of reality. (When you watch it, you'll notice on the reverse pov that the image was flipped and the park... when it should be on the left, is on the right.)

I believe that to be correct...it's the way I remember it, anywho. Originally, there was one red and one blue on each side. The theory was to race a blue against a red, but that didnt' always happen. You can refer to the Brady Bunch episode for confirmation of this. In the episode, the red train is racing the other red train.

In addition, the last 2 or three years of operation KCKC only used one chute. What I'll never forget is the clinking sound of the conveyor carrying boats up the lift right next to Beast. That jingling sound coupled with the lift spheel "Sit down, please remain seated etc etc" is something I must have heard 20,000 times. If you want to take a nostalgic (virtual) ride on KCKC, then follow this link. Wait for the :30 mark and enjoy. (Old 35mm home movie, but terrific nostalgia!) Shaggy