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And what if the "riff raff" has more money than the majority of the park's target market? Hoodlums, by definition, have ways of getting the money they need to do what they want. Meth labs have been found at the Marriott, not just Motel 6...

If your worried about germs from that you don't even wanna know what kinds of things are on the trains or ride cars.

Wow..... This is sad. Prayers going out to the family and friends of the victims.

Six Flags America isn't the only place having problems. http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/26/man-dies-after-double-stabbing-at-canadas-wonderland

At the end of the season, parks might want to carefully consider to whom and how they are marketing their BooFests. If these events become associated with gangs, parking lot fights, and hoodlums, the October cash cow dries up.

So my wife and I got back from our week-long Florida vacation yesterday. While we were down in Florida, we visited the Magic Kingdom and also Hollywood Studios. This trip report will just be for the Magic Kingdom. If I feel like it, I might add another one for Hollywood Studios...we will see. Ok, so we bought our tickets a few weeks ago so we could go ahead and link them with our MagicBands and schedule our FastPasses. We pretty much were able to get everything we wanted, which I figured would be the case for a Monday in October. On that day were were going, they were not doing Mickey's Halloween Party (Thank God), so the park was open from 9 til 11. Unfortunately, the night before we were supposed to go, I could not get to sleep. We had planned on getting up at 8 and getting to the park around 10 and enjoying a good, solid 13 hours in the park. Well...since I couldn't get to sleep, we decided to sleep in just a little bit more. We ended up getting to the park around noon (with me getting 3 hours of sleep, fun stuff!). So yeah, we get to the park around noon and while on our way to the park, I'm going on and on about how light the crowds should be and how we should be able to ride anything we want and heck, we may not even need to use our FastPasses. Why was I so confident? Well, a couple of reasons. First, I actually visited the park before in October with 2 of my friends. Guess what we did? We rode everything we wanted...multiple times. Second, I did my research. There were numerous articles written by park goers on which times of the year were the best times to go. Third, I downloaded the My Disney Experience app a couple of weeks before we left and monitored the wait times every day for the various theme parks. The average wait times - even on the weekends - were around 20-30 minutes. Not too bad really for Disney. So yeah, I was feeling pretty confident in my knowledge of crowds and wait times in October. Then we actually got the park. Just 3 words: Oh - my - gosh! I had never, ever, ever, ever seen the park so crowded in all of my visits. I have been there in March during spring break, and in the summer time in August and even those times were not as crowded as the day we arrived at the park. It was so packed you couldn't move. It looked as if every child in the United States was there on that day. I just kept repeating to myself, "It's a Monday...in October." It's like I couldn't comprehend the crowds. I immediately got on my Disney app and checked the times. The waits were averaging 50-70 minutes. I couldn't believe it! Thank God for FastPass was all I was thinking. Well, we just had to make the best of the day. I told my wife that we were probably going to have to choose the rides carefully, only waiting for the ones we really wanted to ride. Then if we had time, we'd ride the others. I'm not going to go into complete detail about every ride we rode or when we rode them, but I will give you a rundown of the rides we did ride. We had FastPassed Journey of the Little Mermaid dark ride, Splash Mountain, and Peter Pan's Flight and thank God for that too because those rides had ridiculous wait times that day. Other attractions we managed to get in were Pirates of the Carribean, Small World, Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin, People Mover, Tiki Room, Mickey's Philharmagic, and yes, we even managed to squeeze a ride in on the new Seven Dwarf's Mine Train. We chose to pass up some of the other rides like Jungle Cruise, The Haunted Mansion, Big Thunder Mountain Railroad, and Space Mountain. We like those rides, but we like the other more and we had just ridden those last year. Now let me tell you a story about how we managed to squeeze in a ride on the new Mine Train ride. First, the ride has a lot of down time - for real! I know at least once or twice a day when I was checking my Disney app before our trip, the ride was listed as "Closed." So when we went to check it out, it was closed again. Really? No one knew when or if it would open, so most people had gotten out of line. They had the entrance blocked off and there were just a handful of people willing to spend their time at a $100 per day theme park waiting for this ride to open. I convinced my wife that this would be a good opportunity should they re-open the ride. Since the average wait time that day was around 70-80 minutes, if we could be so lucky to be there when they re-opened the ride, it would essentially be a walk on! So, I talked her into it with the promise that we'd only wait for 15 minutes and move on. Well wouldn't you know it. That was our lucky day! Right at the end of our 15 minutes, the ride started back up and they opened the entrance. We walked right on that ride! So my thoughts about the ride? It was nice, but way too short. There is no way I'd wait 2 hours for that ride. And I was a little disappointed that there was only one indoor scene with animatronics. I feel like there needed to be at least one more indoor section that your rolled through. All in all it was a fun ride, but too short and lacking the story that the old dark ride had. It's a nice addition, but there are other rides at the park that are better. We happened to get lucky one more time before the night was over. We had just ridden Buzz Lightyear's Space Ranger Spin, and took a ride on the People Mover and were getting ready to experience the Stitch attraction when I decided to check the wait times on my app one last time. I noticed that Splash Mountain had only a 10 minute wait. How was this possible? Just then I heard a parade running. Oh yeah, everyone was watching the parade. My wife and I decided to bypass Stitch and make a mad dash around the park to get to Splash Mountain. Since Main Street was closed, we had to go around the entire park loop. Through Fantasy Land, over through Libery Square and up around by the Tom Sawyer's Island attraction. We ran, and ducked, and squeezed through crazy crowds and finally, at last, we arrived at Splash Mountain. A walk on! What a great ride to finish out the day. After that we headed towards the exit as people were literally funneled through a teeny, tiny path - the only path they had opened for people to exit. Everything else was roped off for the fireworks. Once we got through the bulk of the crowed we ducked into the shops and used those as a walkway to the exit. A quick glimpse at a few of the fireworks, and it was onto the monorail to start our journery to our car. All in all we spent around 11 hours in the park, and didn't manage to do everything. It was the most crowded I had ever seen it. I'm wondering if perhaps there was some kind of event going on that week? Heck, it wasn't even a Mickey's Halloween Party night. Maybe people are getting wise to the off season months and choosing to go then? Who knows. Next time though, I think I'll try December again. That, by far, has been the best time I've ever visited there. The first week of December - Nice weather, and short waits. Hopefully it's still like that! Our day in the park was hot, crowded, and crazy, but we still had a good time. We always have a good time at Disney!

Put another way, the parking lot is a no man's land where you are on your own? Really? And they charge, too?

Not at KI but seen and heard at Carowinds today... - On Nighthawk, the ride op asking people if they want to die when they went to touch their lap bar restraints. On the mic, from the operator's booth. -On Carolina Cyclone, the ride op repeating instructions to the team member at the back of the train to "let go, now press" a few times with the train jerking forward and stopping once. Then he says "Are you stupid?". All on mic, from the operator's booth. - Not checking seatbelt restraints for Carolina Goldrushers once the lap bar was push down for the train. - The cherry on the top? The Carrousel operator starting the ride as we are trying to step up onto the platform. I know I have high standards for customer service but this was disappointing. I did notice that the person who had the mic was the operator in the booth, not a person out with the guests.

^^^ According to canadaswonderland.com, platinum passes are not valid for admission or parking for Halloween Haunt.

Oh, my. This is much, much more serious.

Thank you Merthecat! That is helpful. I've been there a few times so the picture is great and makes sense. We are still going tomorrow (whether her husband and teenage son join us is TBD) for some rides and then off to the airport for my flight home. Weather looks great - sun and high of 79. I'll take it!

Or the tables you are eating on, utensils you are using, the screen of your phone, etc etc etc

Just found some photos from a trip in October 1994. A photo from the front: For those of you not familiar with the Resort, you can get an idea, from this angle, how many rooms are in just one of the front buildings (that I have circled in pink in the photo below): A shot of the old sign, along with the bus waiting to take guests CLOSE to the front gate, back in those days: A shot inside:

An overhead current shot of KII/R: It's always amazed me at what a sprawling complex the Inn/Resort is. When you look at an overhead shot of it, you can see it really quickly (and every section visible has two stories, I believe!). When it was the only show in town, it's size would have made sense. I've wondered how, for the last few decades, it has been able to support its footprint. I don't know how hotels rotate which rooms they rent, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's entire sections that haven't been used in years.

To an extent, this is already happening at CW, moreso than at Kings Island at least. They do not have a gold level pass, so for locals, unless they invest in a Platinum, they'll be paying for an individual admission - and individual parking - to attend Haunt. Based on the confused looks I got from employees when I tried to use my platinum pass for the 20% discount on food and merchandise, I'd reckon that they aren't particularly common, and that most passholders at that park use a regular pass.

While walking through Freak Street on Friday night, I found this one-liner from a female Scareactor amusing: "Are you alone? You know you die when you're alone". Also, when I went through Cornstalkers that same night, some of the Scareactors were targeting this little kid that was behind me and the kid was like "don't scare me, scare him" and the Scareactor was like "I'm going to scare you" (or something like that, don't remember the exact dialogue).

Just last weekend, my friend and I were walking past the Reds restaurant. I saw something moving in the bushes. It was completely camouflaged. I knew there would be a scare actor there, but when he popped out I still jumped a mile in the air and screamed. It turns out, it was an eight year old kid who was actually wearing a camouflage jacket just messing around. He got a kick out of my reaction.

Call me cold hearted.....I've been called worse. Or call me....realistic.

If they remove "great" and "to have fun," then yeah, I totally agree.

If you end at midnight, 11, 1 or 3, you will have the same problem. Lots of people leaving hopped up on adrenaline.

Haunts have been going on for many many years. Is this the first year there have been multiple incidents? I say keep the hours the same, and make it a hard ticket event with more expensive tickets.

It would not at all shock me to see some cut back on haunt hours next year. It seems like the majority of these stories contain the phrase "just after the event ended" or something similar. Maybe having thousands of teens and young adults all hopped up on adrenaline running around a parking lot at 1am isn't the best idea in the world.

And at a Cedar Fair park. I have zero sympathy for those involved.....unless it's proven these two guys were just minding there own business when -bam- they were stabbed for no apparent reason. Highly unlikely. This type of douchbaggery just angers me and could possibly put an end to these type of events, or at least have adverse affects in the future. Way to ruin it for those that enjoy it and capable of acting in a civil manner.....

Not one descriptive word about Cedar Fair's offerings and a very misleading tidbit about SeaWorld's (Rick at one time was a careful, thorough writer...) http://www.dailyfinance.com/2014/10/23/halloween-is-raking-in-scary-profits-for-theme-parks/

Don't forget this!

Sorry to double post but.... I just got to play with an interactive map. Those things are awesome! Not only does it give you directions from your location to your destination, but it gives you approximate walking time. Not only that - the right side of the map, powered by FUNtv, gives you ride and Haunt wait times and features user-interactive images from Instagram and Twitter. Next time you're at the park, you gotta play with it!!! I did a quick walk through: http://youtu.be/2_IOfUtBQLQ"]http://youtu.be/2_IOfUtBQLQ

Whether the good old Kings Island Inn/Resort gets demolished or not, it probably deserves its own photo thread. Here's what I've got: These are from 1972, from a visit made by my mom, aunt, and uncle (before I was born!): From the parking lot (it really doesn't show much, except for just how much there wasn't across the street):

^ Unless, of course, it turns out that the alleged attacker's life was in danger from these people and he or she was acting in self defense. We just don't have all the facts yet. There are so many different scenarios that all seem equally likely. I'm sure local law enforcement will do everything in their power to uncover the facts, but as it is right now, we know almost nothing for sure, and speculation isn't prudent. On a lighter note, I love the word "prudent" and like to find ways to inject it into conversation.

my wife last year said "No" to the gold pass. I bought mine in May of this year. cost about $120 bucks. My wife ended up going to KI a few times this summer so we bought her a pass that was the regular pass in June for about 130ish. I think I ended up going to KI about 15 times this year. Got food each time with my food season pass. Each meal ended up costing me about $6 not counting the drink. I even was able to share with my son without getting yelled at (he's 18 months). Not to mention the free Dinosaur's Alive (which to a 1 year old is about the greatest thing on Earth), the random doughnuts and juice celebrations for Gold Passes. This year, KI has made me a season pass holder for a good another couple of years.

The park was PACKED! I showed up at 5:30 to meet the family. I was planning on staying after their bedtime so I could ride some rides. The ride cues were HUGE! I waited 60 min for Banshee , It was worth it, but reports that lines for The Beast were over an hour, and Diamondback was close to 2 hours, led me to believe that I should get the $45 fast pass. I was shocked to learn that the fast pass for the evening would cost $70! I left and went to a local sports bar to watch the Ohio State v Penn State game. Go Bucks!

Uh... did he just insinuate that Canada's Wonderland can't control and isn't responsible for controlling what goes on in Canada's Wonderland's parking lot? Isn't the whole point of park security to prevent things that "could happen anywhere" from happening wherever they are? Does Wonderland not patrol their parking lots the way Kings Island does?

^ That's actually the most logical reasoning I've ever heard for why parks like Canada's Wonderland and Cedar Point don't offer a mid-level Gold pass. They're pricing pass holder access to Haunt sky-high to keep undesirables out. I'd never thought of it that way before. That's pretty effective, too, based on the crowds at Halloweekends last weekend. I wonder why Kings Island doesn't adopt a similar system.

Prices WILL go UP. There won't be a better offer.

Ten bucks says that was the unofficial "theme" for Urgent Scare this season, much like Swine Flu/H1N1 was the "theme" in 2009... All honesty, though, I can understand peoples' concerns with decorations and displays at haunt events...that are inside an amusement park. Most, if not a vast majority, of the controversies surround venues designed and built for family-friendly experiences. You can add all manner of displays and side attractions to fit whatever event/holiday is blank, but some people are still going to treat it as a family-friendly experience. I really can't bring up the argument involving separate admissions for these events, as even Busch Gardens and Halloween Horror Nights are getting flak from this.

http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/01/offended/. My feelings on the topic. Of course, this is probably why I would make a bad business owner. If I suffered trauma from a violent experience I would not go to a haunt. Haunts are well known for depicting violent, gory, terrifying events. Instead of demanding they be watered down to match mu sensitivities I would avoid them and do something I enjoy instead. Just my two cents...

I've lived here nearly two years now. I have a Six Flags Gold pass for 2015, and did for 2014 and 2013. I love Wild One. It's one of the best wooden coasters in the country. I live 17 miles away. I've been there once since I moved here. Late last season. I've not been back. That should tell you something.

I'm not worried, just asking that question. Believe me, I've had my hands in some nasty stuff before. Sent from a signal coming out of the Vega system.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like Kings Island, at least, has kind of backed off on the "nothing is off limits" marketing the last couple of seasons.

On any wooden coaster that has three rows per car, the middle sit is always the smoothest, along with the front seat. If you sit over a wheel you'll feel every bump. On Face/Off (Invertigo) I find that sitting towards the middle is the best, sitting on the ends is uncomfortable to me. Just like with any Inverted coaster the front is always the best, it gives you a sense of flying.

Or...did someone else make an offer the owner\operator couldn't refuse...for whatever reason?

I wonder if this is a direct result from the survey we all took earlier in the year...

So tonight I went to KI's Haunt very last minute and went threw the new Slaughter House (could, swear, I seen Don standing at the Fright Pass lane), Madame Fatale's Cavern of Terror, Delta Delta Die, Urgent Scare, CornStalkers, and Kill Mart. CornStalkers, and Delta Delta Die, left MUCH to be desired. Urgent Scare, was great especially since it was only me and my brother that went threw it! SH, MFCT, and Kill Mart were amazing in the level of theming! The actors in SH and MFCT felt a bit light, but still felt quite nice. Kill Mart was truly amazing! I really like what they did with that space! I kid you not, Kill Mart was quite a bit better than Universal Orlando's Walking Dead house in 2012 and 2013! Me and my Brother both agreed on this. (I am also a pretty big Walking Dead fan! can't say for 2014 as I haven't been this year...) Fun little "Easter egg": While in Delta Delta Die, They played a remixed version of the 2013, Doctor Who theme! Littery heard this version just 2 days ago. I really liked that lol, the house, not so much...

Geo-fencing... look at the park getting all techy on us. Good move and likely the start of some cool innovation.

Just got back from Haunt tonight and had a blast! I did 6 mazes tonight (yes, 6!) including 5 that I've never done before. The new ones were Carnevil (which wasn't too bad), Board to Death (which was actually really scary as some of the rooms were super dark), Killmart (which was cool), Cornstalkers (not too bad) and Club Blood (which I did twice- the first time was like a party, the 2nd time was a bit scarier). I also saw Blood Drums and Skeleton Crew and rode Firehawk, Banshee, Bat, Vortex and Boo Blasters. Before/during my second round of Club Blood, I learned the hard way about telling the greeters that you don't like to be scared (or even asking "How scary is it"), even in passing. As I mentioned before, the second time through Club Blood was a bit scarier than the first as I told the lady at the entrance, "I don't like being scared, but I do like to party". Oh well, you live and learn. But seriously, I had an amazing time tonight and it was great to see all the roamers, including two of my friends. EDIT: In addition to the 5 new mazes, I did Slaughter House to see Sam and afterwards gained the courage to do Killmart.

I think, for me, one of the main reasons BB is a poor ride is that the old PT ride is still there is parts. The cars are still there just slightly repainted. Where the cars were removed sits plywood that makes it look like something broke. The busts are still there just nailed over. Heck the ride still travels the same track. Most things either don't work or never did. Plus a ride that the effects don't work unless you shoot them always bothers me. PT was a ride that felt like a show. BB is a ride that feels like a chore for my son to enjoy all of the moving objects.

Indeed they were.

You would be correct. Also, half the capacity was lost, with half the Omnimovers being removed (every other one--alternating).

perhaps it was designed for guys who couldn't "throw it in the ocean"

Basketball court right next to a pond. No fence. Not great planning.

For comparison, here are pictures from 2013: